Woman missing on the Pearl

[Lionesss]

Time will tell, as more and more informations is obtained.

It is looking really suspicous though.

My prayers to her family.

[Grandpaul]

I don't know if this has been mentioned but the victim's family announced they think the woman jumped off the ship. Sad story.

[CruisnGram]

As far as I know, the cameras on the ship capture only the outer edge of the balconies- there are no cameras that can show what actually happened on 95% of the balcony. So even if they have her jumping off w/ what seemed to be her own free will...who knows who was with her or what was going on on the rest of the balcony to cause/force/help her to do so...

 

They know because there are other cameras all over the ship. Key cards also record every time someone enters or leaves a cabin. So if hubby's keycard hadn't been used in a while, and he is on camera gambling in the casino when she goes overboard, then he didn't do it.

 

I think its horrible that Norwegian didn't tell the other passengers about this. Who knows what someone else could have added to the story?? And what if there really is a murderer (speculating, obviously) on the boat?? Id like to think I have a right to know to be on the extra alert, even if the chance is slim.

 

I completely disagree. NCL had no obligation, nor should they, have told the other passengers. They did a search of the ship and couldn't find her. Asking other passengers if they had seen her would have been moot. They checked security camera's and saw her go overboard and took appropriate action in notifying those that could DO something to help the poor lady if possible. Any passengers who had any information to provide did so I'm sure, so again, no need to notify or inform anyone else.

In addition, you are comparing apples and oranges when you talk about a case like this and a murder on board. In this case, no need for you to know as you would be in no danger....if it were a murder, I'm sure you would be told if your safety was in question.

 

On ABC News they just said that this is the 5th person to fall of of a cruise ship this year and not be found... I know about the woman on the Norwegian Dawn, but who were the other 3???

 

It happens all the time. There's a website somewhere that has all of them listed. People drink too much and get stupid, are depressed and decide to end it all etc. Thousands of people are on every cruise ship and if you consider the number of passengers transported in a years time, the actual numbers of those that go overboard (I wouldn't use the word "fall") are really very low.

My thoughts and prayers are with this poor lady and her family...I wish them peace.

CG

[CanadianTwosome]

Ah, Cruise Critic... I see now why there's always so much information here; everyone is an expert. Gosh, I sure wish that some of the people on this thread or quoted in the various linked articles were in charge of the Pearl. I would feel so much safer with them in control than the experienced officers and crew that have so seriously botched this incident. :rolleyes: OBVIOUSLY they should have gone cabin to cabin and informed every single other passenger individually because goodness knows, nothing negative could ever come out of such an action - and it's not as if cruiselines have ever considered the possibilities and planned a course of action for such an incident, so clearly they were just making snap decisions and acting blindly. :eek:

 

I don't want to offend anyone, but come on. Anyone who honestly thinks that informing all the passengers of the situation would actually have helped and not hindered the investigation is, in my opinion, completely unrealistic. There would have been even more speculation than there already was, there would have been panic among some of the passengers, there would have been multitudes of false information (both due to mistaken identity and people who just thought it funny to screw with investigators), there would have been people constantly interrupting investigators because they were convinced that their 'information' was vital, there would have been people all over the ship thinking they were helping by performing their own investigation - not to mention those that would have been badmouthing the investigators (like on this thread, etc.) and causing even more issues. We're talking about THOUSANDS of humans, including hundreds of children (if someone goes overboard while we're on the Pearl in two weeks, I do NOT want my child informed, thank you). I rarely say 'never', but it would take an incredibly convincing argument for me to believe that informing all the passengers would have been a good idea.

 

I also think that the linked articles that have quoted internet posts are really irresponsible. Those posts could have been made by people who weren't even on board the ship.

[5waldos]

Parents also say that there had been other episodes of distress- I would have to guess that this may be bipolar disorder, very very sad. The parents sounded somewhat resigned to it.

[Arizona Laura]

On Fox this morning they had a passenger on live who reported that a couple across from their cabin heard screaming then silence but did not think anything of it. You know how rumors are though. To wait 8 hrs to report her missing is suspicious in itself. I guess that gives enough time to make sure her being recovered alive is impossible.

Very sad indeed.

I just feel horrible knowing what she went through.

Laura

[flipflops84]

^ Sooooo they should collect as little information as possible b/c then that would be much easier to handle?? Im sorry but when Im cruising, I bump into more people than just the people at my table and the cruisers next door. Id like to think that if I mysteriously fell overboard the cruise line would at least give these other people the option of coming forward with info, whether it would turn out to be relevant or not.

[*Wink*]

Thanks for the link, Sid.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081229/ap_on_re_us/missing_cruise_passenger

 

"Jennifer was in a very happy and uplifted mood both before and during the cruise," the Ellis family said in the statement. "She was excited about starting a new job and her future career with a local newspaper. She and her husband had been talking about starting their family. The family suspects that Jennifer chose an unfortunate ending to her life. She was a beautiful and caring person and will be truly missed by all who love her."

 

This certainly seems an odd statement. Saying that she was happy and hopeful, but that she chose an unfortunate ending to her life. Why would they jump to that conclusion? People can be on depression medicine and therefore deemed to have "emotional problems." It's too broad a brush.

 

"Raymond Seitz was arrested in April on a charge of domestic violence-battery after being accused of head-butting his wife. The charge was dropped after he entered a pretrial diversion program. Records show that she asked the prosecutor not to pursue the case."

 

I'm not even going to comment on this statement.

[derf5585]

In a statement released by the family of Jennifer Ellis Seitz, the 36-year-old freelance writer who vanished from a Caribbean cruise last week, Seitz's family indicated that Seitz had "has had previous emotional issues." While admitting Seitz's past emotional problems, her family also stated that "there were no outward signs or indication of anything being wrong or unusual" while Jennifer was on the cruise with her husband, Raymond Seitz, and mother, Donna Ellis. Jennifer did, however, have a habit of walking the decks of the cruise ship during the trip, saying she had difficulty sleeping. This was apparently a long-term problem for the writer, who frequently mentioned trouble with sleeping in the diaries she kept to track her progress before and after lap band surgery to combat obesity.

 

The FBI is working to determine whether or not Jennifer Seitz's disappearance was a suicide or a homicide. While no one has officially referred to husband Raymond Seitz as a suspect in any way, MSNBC has reported that Raymond was arrested last April for domestic violence. While Florida law does not permit revealing the name of the victim of the alleged abuse, it appears as though it took place in the couple's residence. Questions have been raised in multiple reports about Ray Seitz's behavior on the Norwegian Pearl, as well -- there is the apparent hours-long gap between video of a white-clad woman going overboard and Ray's reporting of the disappearance and some allegedly inappropriate comments he made following Jennifer's vanishing; the latter seems like it might be open to interpretation.

The Coast Guard has officially called off the ocean search for Jennifer Seitz. The USCG and the Mexican Navy have searched 4200 nautical square miles. They believe there is no chance that Seitz was able to survive for this length of time.

from

http://www.truecrimereport.com/2008/12/update_on_missing_writer_jenni.php

[cruisinMike]

Let's just shoot him now. We can ask questions later.

[Moondawgie]

Family of missing cruise woman believes she jumped

Cruise ship disappearance Reuters MIAMI – The family of a missing cruise ship passenger said Monday that they suspect the woman "chose an unfortunate ending to her life" and jumped from a cruise ship balcony into the waters off Mexico's coast on Christmas night. The U.S. Coast Guard suspended its search Monday for Jennifer Ellis Seitz, a Florida journalist, after combing more than 4,200 square miles off the coast of the popular resort area of Cancun, where the ship had just visited. Mexican authorities said they would continue their search for another 48 hours.

 

Seitz had "previous emotional issues," yet there were no outward signs of distress while on the seven-night cruise from Miami, her family said in a statement given to one of her former employers, The News Chief in Winter Haven. Seitz's mother joined her daughter and son-in-law on the cruise.

 

"Jennifer was in a very happy and uplifted mood both before and during the cruise," the Ellis family said in the statement. "She was excited about starting a new job and her future career with a local newspaper. She and her husband had been talking about starting their family. The family suspects that Jennifer chose an unfortunate ending to her life. She was a beautiful and caring person and will be truly missed by all who love her."

 

Seitz and her husband, Raymond, were celebrating their one-year anniversary on the Norwegian Pearl cruise ship.

 

A surveillance camera showed someone falling overboard at 8 p.m. Christmas night, authorities said. About eight hours later, Raymond Seitz reported his wife missing.

 

FBI spokesman Mike Leverock says agents met the ship at the dock in Miami on Sunday, collected materials and "are still trying to determine if a crime occurred."

 

Norwegian Cruise Line said it is "cooperating fully" with the FBI.

 

"Our thoughts and prayers are with the family and friends of the guest during this difficult time," the company said in a news release.

 

Raymond Seitz has not been charged with any crime, authorities said Monday.

 

The couple met in a weight loss support group; both had undergone bariatric surgery. She chronicled her weight loss journey for an Orlando TV station.

 

She was also a freelance writer, having written articles for The Tampa Tribune, The Ledger in Lakeland, and an online article titled, "Battling the Bulge Onboard," about how not to gain weight while aboard a ship.

 

On her Web site, Seitz described herself as an "avid traveler and an amateur chef." She was previously a reporter for Florida Today, a newspaper in Melbourne.

 

Raymond Seitz was arrested in April on a charge of domestic violence-battery after being accused of head-butting his wife. The charge was dropped after he entered a pretrial diversion program. Records show that she asked the prosecutor not to pursue the case.

 

A fellow passenger on the ship, Jim Nestor, told NBC's Today show that Seitz and her new husband stood out on the ship with "large and raw personalities."

 

Many of the passengers saw them as contestants on an on-board game called "The Not-So-Newlywed Game," modeled after a 1960s TV quiz show. The game was also carried on the ship's closed-circuit TV channel.

 

"They stood out a lot more than other people," Nestor, a retired police officer, told NBC.

 

Nestor, who appeared on the game show with his own wife, said he ran into Raymond Seitz day after his wife was reported missing.

 

"I had given him my condolences, and he had a plastic bag filled with quarters, and he said to me that he was going to the casino to see if he could change his luck," Nestor said.

 

(This version CORRECTS the names of the The News Chief and The Ledger newspapers.)

[lovesublime]

Sorry if this has already been posted. I didn't have time to go through the entire thread.

 

 

http://www.galvnews.com/wire.lasso?report=/dynamic/stories/M/MISSING_CRUISE_PASSENGER

[soccermommy]

Sorry, I have to side with the "don't tell the passengers" argument....unless someone was in the room, he or she probably doesn't have real information to impart at the time of the search. The first priority is to find the person overboard, the second is to determine the "how" and "why". That's what the FBI is doing now, and that's where any information from other passengers may have value.

Otherwise, the ship is just pandering to the "need to know" we all have ( and I admit to avid curiosity!) and possibly, as other posters have said, upsetting people to no purpose. If I were on that cruise, I know I would be wanting to have information, but, really, it isn't my business. It's a tragedy for that family and they can't even mourn in private. Horrible for all concerned, and my prayers are with the family.

[Cruise Cat]

^ Sooooo they should collect as little information as possible b/c then that would be much easier to handle?? Im sorry but when Im cruising, I bump into more people than just the people at my table and the cruisers next door. Id like to think that if I mysteriously fell overboard the cruise line would at least give these other people the option of coming forward with info, whether it would turn out to be relevant or not.

 

There is a difference between "evidence" and "information" that I'm not sure I'm getting across. I have done accident investigations before (not involving death; but some involving serious injury). Does someone seriously think that someone may have seen her go overboard and failed to report it? What many keep suggesting is like saying investigators should interview an entire metropolatin area every time there is a crime reported. Distracting the investigators with a bunch of irrelevant information is just that, a distraction. They have all the passengers names. They can contact them later with a targeted questionaire if need be. The secrurity force are not neccesarily trained investigators, so they would not be skilled at interviewing people anyway - that is the FBI's job.

[sweet angel]

How far was the ship from shore at 8pm? Could there have been someone waiting in the wings to pluck her out of the water and take her back to Cancun?

 

Just tossing in another scenario.

[runner26.2]

folks,

 

this is not a whodunnit. The cruise line cameras + the door card readers will clearly indicate whether the poor lady was alone in her room or not. The FBI will obviously have that information because NCL will cooperate in every way possible.

 

If the reports that the husband is NOT a suspect are correct the FBI have obviously satisfied themselves that he was elsewhere on the ship. His whereabouts will be easily established given the tremendous surveillance system that exists in every public portion of the ship.

 

Cameras will have recorded the time he entered and left the cabin and in all liklihood where he was at 8pm.

 

Statements from other passengers aren't really that helpful if the investigators already KNOW that she was alone in the cabin.

[lovesublime]

In a statement released by the family of Jennifer Ellis Seitz, the 36-year-old freelance writer who vanished from a Caribbean cruise last week, Seitz's family indicated that Seitz had "has had previous emotional issues." While admitting Seitz's past emotional problems, her family also stated that "there were no outward signs or indication of anything being wrong or unusual" while Jennifer was on the cruise with her husband, Raymond Seitz, and mother, Donna Ellis. Jennifer did, however, have a habit of walking the decks of the cruise ship during the trip, saying she had difficulty sleeping. This was apparently a long-term problem for the writer, who frequently mentioned trouble with sleeping in the diaries she kept to track her progress before and after lap band surgery to combat obesity.

 

The FBI is working to determine whether or not Jennifer Seitz's disappearance was a suicide or a homicide. While no one has officially referred to husband Raymond Seitz as a suspect in any way, MSNBC has reported that Raymond was arrested last April for domestic violence. While Florida law does not permit revealing the name of the victim of the alleged abuse, it appears as though it took place in the couple's residence. Questions have been raised in multiple reports about Ray Seitz's behavior on the Norwegian Pearl, as well -- there is the apparent hours-long gap between video of a white-clad woman going overboard and Ray's reporting of the disappearance and some allegedly inappropriate comments he made following Jennifer's vanishing; the latter seems like it might be open to interpretation.

The Coast Guard has officially called off the ocean search for Jennifer Seitz. The USCG and the Mexican Navy have searched 4200 nautical square miles. They believe there is no chance that Seitz was able to survive for this length of time.

from

http://www.truecrimereport.com/2008/12/update_on_missing_writer_jenni.php

 

 

In the article I posted above, it states (at the end of the story) that the day after she went missing he was headed to the casino with a plastic bag of quarters and told a fellow pax that he was "going to change his luck". Very strange behavior indeed.

[Arizona Laura]

Family of missing cruise woman believes she jumped

Cruise ship disappearance Reuters MIAMI – The family of a missing cruise ship passenger said Monday that they suspect the woman "chose an unfortunate ending to her life" and jumped from a cruise ship balcony into the waters off Mexico's coast on Christmas night. The U.S. Coast Guard suspended its search Monday for Jennifer Ellis Seitz, a Florida journalist, after combing more than 4,200 square miles off the coast of the popular resort area of Cancun, where the ship had just visited. Mexican authorities said they would continue their search for another 48 hours.

 

Seitz had "previous emotional issues," yet there were no outward signs of distress while on the seven-night cruise from Miami, her family said in a statement given to one of her former employers, The News Chief in Winter Haven. Seitz's mother joined her daughter and son-in-law on the cruise.

 

"Jennifer was in a very happy and uplifted mood both before and during the cruise," the Ellis family said in the statement. "She was excited about starting a new job and her future career with a local newspaper. She and her husband had been talking about starting their family. The family suspects that Jennifer chose an unfortunate ending to her life. She was a beautiful and caring person and will be truly missed by all who love her."

 

Seitz and her husband, Raymond, were celebrating their one-year anniversary on the Norwegian Pearl cruise ship.

 

A surveillance camera showed someone falling overboard at 8 p.m. Christmas night, authorities said. About eight hours later, Raymond Seitz reported his wife missing.

 

FBI spokesman Mike Leverock says agents met the ship at the dock in Miami on Sunday, collected materials and "are still trying to determine if a crime occurred."

 

Norwegian Cruise Line said it is "cooperating fully" with the FBI.

 

"Our thoughts and prayers are with the family and friends of the guest during this difficult time," the company said in a news release.

 

Raymond Seitz has not been charged with any crime, authorities said Monday.

 

The couple met in a weight loss support group; both had undergone bariatric surgery. She chronicled her weight loss journey for an Orlando TV station.

 

She was also a freelance writer, having written articles for The Tampa Tribune, The Ledger in Lakeland, and an online article titled, "Battling the Bulge Onboard," about how not to gain weight while aboard a ship.

 

On her Web site, Seitz described herself as an "avid traveler and an amateur chef." She was previously a reporter for Florida Today, a newspaper in Melbourne.

 

Raymond Seitz was arrested in April on a charge of domestic violence-battery after being accused of head-butting his wife. The charge was dropped after he entered a pretrial diversion program. Records show that she asked the prosecutor not to pursue the case.

 

A fellow passenger on the ship, Jim Nestor, told NBC's Today show that Seitz and her new husband stood out on the ship with "large and raw personalities."

 

Many of the passengers saw them as contestants on an on-board game called "The Not-So-Newlywed Game," modeled after a 1960s TV quiz show. The game was also carried on the ship's closed-circuit TV channel.

 

"They stood out a lot more than other people," Nestor, a retired police officer, told NBC.

 

Nestor, who appeared on the game show with his own wife, said he ran into Raymond Seitz day after his wife was reported missing.

 

"I had given him my condolences, and he had a plastic bag filled with quarters, and he said to me that he was going to the casino to see if he could change his luck," Nestor said.

 

(This version CORRECTS the names of the The News Chief and The Ledger newspapers.)

 

I'm sorry but why would the family make a statement they feel she jumped before an investigation was done..especially with his abuse history.

We don't have all the facts but I am still suspicious.

I'm not ready to shoot him but I still have my doubts.

Laura

[ur_calvin_klein_guy]

The glass surrounding all areas on the open decks are over 8 feet high. No one can "fall" off the Pearl.

 

Very, very sad for her family.

[MDSue]

The last time a woman went overboard, it seemed hard to believe she would have done such a thing and will be the first to admit that I thought foul play was involved. It turned out it was not, so this time I will let the investigators do their jobs and hope they find the answer.

[Mark_K]

I'm sorry but why would the family make a statement they feel she jumped before an investigation was done..especially with his abuse history.

We don't have all the facts but I am still suspicious.

I'm not ready to shoot him but I still have my doubts.

Laura

Maybe they have insight into her medical history and mental state.

[Suni99]

folks,

 

this is not a whodunnit. The cruise line cameras + the door card readers will clearly indicate whether the poor lady was alone in her room or not. The FBI will obviously have that information because NCL will cooperate in every way possible.

 

If the reports that the husband is NOT a suspect are correct the FBI have obviously satisfied themselves that he was elsewhere on the ship. His whereabouts will be easily established given the tremendous surveillance system that exists in every public portion of the ship.

 

Cameras will have recorded the time he entered and left the cabin and in all liklihood where he was at 8pm.

 

Statements from other passengers aren't really that helpful if the investigators already KNOW that she was alone in the cabin.

 

this is perfect Run, we will eventually learn the details. the timestamp on the husband will tell alot

[JanineM]

I really don't see ANY family even offering the hint of a suggestion that their family member would commit suicide unless they had real reason to do so. They knew her mental status better than any of us do.

 

And even those who are in the deepest, darkest depression will have moments, days or hours when they "seem" to be doing well. Like others, I'm not willing to let the husband completely off the hook. Could have been that he was inflicting some sort of mental cruelty that sent her over the edge.

 

But it is still a horrible thing to have happen ... not just to the family but to the crew who had to do deal with it and all of those who had their holiday ruined as well.

[terrymtex01]

To the people who think NCL made the wrong decision in not alerting all the PAX to this situation, I ask you, do you honestly think NCL doesn't have procedures in place that have been thoroughly researched in case this type of tragedy happens? It's not like the higher-ups are acting like the 3 stooges and making it up as they go along.

I don't think any of the posters here have said this, but I'm surprised at some of the responses of PAX from this sailing blaming NCL for their decisions.

 

I stopped being shocked about people blaming NCL for things when I read a posting yesterday, I think it was, where they blamed NCL for 7 days of rain during their cruise and NCL did not give them any OBC or any free drinks to compensate them for the weather.

 

Totally disagree... My friend was on that ship and those folks did interact with the couple... why would u discount what he is saying? Also, she said she felt something amiss about his behavior after the fact...Like there was no remorse/ cold and the mom acted weird after the fact.. and so did a few others report the same thing....

 

I really think there is more than this than just a straight forward suicide... but we'll have to wait for the FBI:)

 

I posted on another thread that on Christmas Eve night we had our beloved cat, Madelyn, put to sleep. This was quick and unexpected. She was my "child" for 16 years. If you have a problem with the fact that I loved her as I would love a child, I don't care. It is how I was with her. The point I am wanting to make here is, if you saw me, you would probably never know that I just went through one of the most horrible losses of my life. On the outside I look like I normally do, with the exception of maybe saying an odd thing here and there, getting up from the chair to go do something and get half way to some where and not remember what I got up for, etc. I have often thought of us going to a casino because if you are a gambler like me, sitting in front of a slot machine is a way of escape. Right now I feel like I would try anything to escape the pain I am in. Non stop gut wrenching pain. I have posted many many times that it is not unusual for me to go a year and have maybe two alcoholic drinks and since Christmas Eve I have almost gone through a whole bottle of Rum just to keep myself steady. When I am in front of a slot machine I think of nothing else but when will I hit the next jackpot, etc. On the outside, I seem fine. On the inside I feel like I'm looking through someone elses eyes. Every single little thing I do is a major effort and if it wasn't for my DDP I do not know what I would do. So don't be quick to judge her husband for whatever he may have been doing after she was missing. You never know until you are in that situtation what you would do. A week ago I would have never guessed I would feel like I do inside. I'm not posting this for sympathy. I appreaciate all the nice things people have said to me, I'm just posting this trying to say that we can't judge what the husbands actions have been since it happened.

 

As far as the "trooper" that has been on the news channels, I think all he is doing is enjoying his 15 minutes of fame and I honestly do not believe a word he is saying. I also do not believe half of what the news media reports on anything, let alone something as sensational as this. So until the FBI makes their statements, I'm going to continue to believe it was an act she did on her own.

[kaylorcc]

Maybe they have insight into her medical history and mental state.

 

I'm not a doctor, but it's been documented that some types of weight-loss surgery have been known to cause depression in some people.. it's peculiar. A family friend had the surgery a year or so ago. She looks lovely and is very happy with her appearance, but has suffered from minor bouts of depression ever since the surgery.

 

My condolences to the family. :(