China Visitors to Australia/NZ Warning?? Style/Manners??

[MrsWaldo]

I am finding your replies somewhat offensive! I suggest you reread the word NOT!

 

You still didn't get that it doesn't offend me. Nor is it what I believe.

 

You need to take a step back and take a look at the Australian Psyche.

 

We are often tongue in cheek. (Did you not see the winky)

[StLouisCruisers]

I am finding your replies somewhat offensive! I suggest you reread the word NOT!

 

You still didn't get that it doesn't offend me. Nor is it what I believe.

 

You need to take a step back and take a look at the Australian Psyche.

 

We are often tongue in cheek. (Did you not see the winky)

 

 

 

Really? I read the NOT, but found it didn't fit with your other comments.

 

My Aussie friends on CC have advised me on your typical posts. I am done chatting with you. G'day!

[MrsWaldo]

What a nasty person!

 

You took an excerpt from this, posted it on one other board and had one Australian reply.

 

Unfortunately I couldn't give a toss what you wear, who you are, what religion (if any), your colour, your gun beliefs etc. If I saw you in Sydney struggling with a map or directions irrespective of the colour of your shoes, I would help you, as I have many times before for other visitors.

 

As Karenella said earlier in this thread big groups can get bad names, and often the identifying factor in Aus is the shoes if you are American.

[The_Big_M]

I guess I must also "look American" when I travel - according to that link - since I often wear sneakers when walking around. :rolleyes:

 

Go figure.

 

It sounded like satire, but with an opening pointer like that, it's just ridiculous.

[celle]

I guess I must also "look American" when I travel - according to that link - since I often wear sneakers when walking around. :rolleyes:

 

 

Me too! And I'm from NZ.

 

That article is ridiculous.

[MrsWaldo]

Me too! And I'm from NZ.

 

That article is ridiculous.

 

Yep and that was my point about the trainers.... treating people in a certain way or making assumptions because of their race, colour or shoes is ridiculous

[Kiwi Kruzer]

White sneakers...NO...NO...NO

so 1960's:eek:

When I cruise I like to take a selection.....

 

 

When going ashore in Australia I wear gold on one foot and green on the other.

Goes down a treat:D:D

 

[MrsWaldo]

Well you can't wear "All Black" ;)

[Pushka]

I was thinking it had something to do with the "don't wear white after Labor day" cultural more in parts of the USA.

 

I think all nationalities (or people for that matter) don't travel well when they are travelling as part of a group. I have certainly had less than pleasant experiences with groups of Aussies, Americans, Chinese, Indians, and Russians. When you travel as a large group you forget how dominating you actually are when compared with smaller traveller groups or couples.

 

And this also applies to each group's cultural habits also.

 

It is very common in Asian communities in Asia to see people who have respiratory infections, wear a mask so as not to infect others. That never happens here in Australia, which would be a good thing to emulate.

[Mercruiser]

It's a local attitude which is just as prevalent as the anti-chinese etc. It is NOT my view but it is certainly the view of a minority. it's like saying all French are rude.

 

In Aus we tend to wear more coloured variety and hence those who behave badly while wearing them (esp on cruise days) add to a stereotypical viewpoint.

 

 

If you read the post and what is in response to you will understand that the trash the papers write is the worst offence.

 

http://www.wikihow.com/Avoid-Looking-Like-an-American-Tourist ;)

 

This wiki is kind of funny. I'm an American businessman that travels extensively (18 countries in the last year). I've been surprised how many local youth I see on the subways, dressed like the stereotype American in blue jeans, T-shirt, and often a NY Yankees baseball cap. I first noticed this in Milan - the fashion capital of Europe. I've also seen this in Delhi and Bangkok.

 

I didn't really notice what kind of shoes people wear in Perth. After being in the places previously mentioned, Australia feels by comparison like I'm still in the USA.

 

P.S. You will never see me in a Speedo. My 25 year old son says no one over 40 should be allowed to wear them. I agree with him. :)

[theldaken]

White Dunlop Volleys are an Australian National icon!!!!!

[woodyren]

White Dunlop Volleys are an Australian National icon!!!!!

 

 

 

Yes they are. We change out our thongs, footy shorts and singlets and team them up with nice shorts or jeans and a Cold Chisel or surfwear tee shirt (depending on whether you live in the eastern or western suburbs) for summer formal nights in the MDR in Australia. Of course in winter they are replaced by Uggs and flanos.

 

You can spot us a mile off when we travel.

[Pushka]

No self respecting Aussie wears UGG boots in public. But they seem to be very popular with American people.

[woodyren]

Ok I'll put my serious hat on now and give my take on the Chinese tourist question. I live in Australia but I have spent a fair amount of time in China in the last four years so have some experience to comment.

 

I think others need to put this behavior into some perspective. It was only a few generations ago that all but the privileged few in China were living hand to mouth. My guess is it was a dog eat dog type of existence to even get by only a few years ago. There is also little personal space in most cities and so locals are almost oblivious to their surroundings. The manners that we find acceptable in our society were taught to us and constantly reinforced by our parents as youngsters (and still many of people from our cultures don't exhibit them very well). The current generation of well to do Chinese were probably brought up and influenced by their grand parents as is the norm and those grandparents most likely grew up in the tough times of the cultural revolution.

Concepts as simple to us as queuing, not spitting in the street, keeping ones mouth shut when chewing etc were almost certainly never taught to locals as it is not their cultural norm. these things are not genetic they must be learned. Add to this an education system that teaches about their 5000 years of glorious history and little about other cultures. With a little thought it is quite easy to understand how Chinese would not even question their behavior elsewhere. They are taught to listen and never even question what they are taught by either the education or their grandparents/parents. As an example most Chinese women I have met, even ones that are University educated still believe that it unhealthy to go out of the house or do anything for at least a month after giving berth.

Another aspect is that Chinese tour groups are very often tightly controlled by their tour guides and are herded to shopping etc as a group so they can be ripped off and the guide reap the commission. They do not get the chance to be immersed in any way in the local culture. It is what they expect because it is the same way that they tour in their own country.

 

What I have to also say is that their are other areas of their manners that are very formal. Where each guest sits at an invited dinner. That the host will pay the bill. How the host will still bring more dishes while you continue to eat. How all will toast each time a glass is raised. I find dinner with my Chinese friends a wonderful experience.

 

I also find that all of those I meet in China are interested in learning about my manners/culture etc and many have modified some of their ingrained behaviors as a result. I also adapt many of mine to fit in when in China but still always say please and thank you (in English and/or Mandarin) to others and refuse to cut into lines etc.

 

So in summary they have a different set of manners/norms and that's what makes the world interesting.

 

I also find that many who use the when in Rome reasoning only do so when they are the Romans.

[Rencruzr]

very well said. I think that there are pompous over politically correct people out their that bring out the racism card when any culture is spoken about which is ridiculous.

 

I notice here in Sydney that Chinese (fresh off the boat so to speak) will push into the train and not wait for you to get out, walk straight into you on the street expecting you to get out of the way, and think nothing of spitting on the street. This is as you put it the culture they are coming from where space is limited and you have to push through thousands of people just to get anywhere, it is the norm to their CULTURE, nothing to do with race.

 

I also find the chinese teenagers born and raised here to be curteous, with manners and good attitude further illustrating it is a cultural thing.

 

I think the chinese government is well within their rights to advise chinese tourists of their obligations regarding manners in foreign countries but there also needs to be etiquette lessons for those settling here in manners expected in their new country.

 

Ok I'll put my serious hat on now and give my take on the Chinese tourist question. I live in Australia but I have spent a fair amount of time in China in the last four years so have some experience to comment.

 

I think others need to put this behavior into some perspective. It was only a few generations ago that all but the privileged few in China were living hand to mouth. My guess is it was a dog eat dog type of existence to even get by only a few years ago. There is also little personal space in most cities and so locals are almost oblivious to their surroundings. The manners that we find acceptable in our society were taught to us and constantly reinforced by our parents as youngsters (and still many of people from our cultures don't exhibit them very well). The current generation of well to do Chinese were probably brought up and influenced by their grand parents as is the norm and those grandparents most likely grew up in the tough times of the cultural revolution.

Concepts as simple to us as queuing, not spitting in the street, keeping ones mouth shut when chewing etc were almost certainly never taught to locals as it is not their cultural norm. these things are not genetic they must be learned. Add to this an education system that teaches about their 5000 years of glorious history and little about other cultures. With a little thought it is quite easy to understand how Chinese would not even question their behavior elsewhere. They are taught to listen and never even question what they are taught by either the education or their grandparents/parents. As an example most Chinese women I have met, even ones that are University educated still believe that it unhealthy to go out of the house or do anything for at least a month after giving berth.

Another aspect is that Chinese tour groups are very often tightly controlled by their tour guides and are herded to shopping etc as a group so they can be ripped off and the guide reap the commission. They do not get the chance to be immersed in any way in the local culture. It is what they expect because it is the same way that they tour in their own country.

 

What I have to also say is that their are other areas of their manners that are very formal. Where each guest sits at an invited dinner. That the host will pay the bill. How the host will still bring more dishes while you continue to eat. How all will toast each time a glass is raised. I find dinner with my Chinese friends a wonderful experience.

 

I also find that all of those I meet in China are interested in learning about my manners/culture etc and many have modified some of their ingrained behaviors as a result. I also adapt many of mine to fit in when in China but still always say please and thank you (in English and/or Mandarin) to others and refuse to cut into lines etc.

 

So in summary they have a different set of manners/norms and that's what makes the world interesting.

 

I also find that many who use the when in Rome reasoning only do so when they are the Romans.

[Austcruiser84]

Just read that wiki how article on etiquette. What a load of nonsense!

 

If you're visiting somewhere like Sydney, you will find plenty of people wearing baseball caps, sneakers, carrying water bottles in their back packs. You will also see a lot of people carrying shopping bags in the CBD and cameras around their necks (although I always think that is a bad idea from a neck comfort perspective).

 

Most Aussies' idea of dressing up during the day involves a tee shirt/polo shirt and jeans. Most people who are dressed up are likely going to work.

 

As for the original comment on Chinese tourists, I have to say that the bad manners certainly come across as cultural rather than intentional. A Chinese neighbour of mine can be quite crass, but it isn't intentional.

 

That said, every culture has annoying habits. Australian tourists - mainly young people - have hurt our reputation abroad for loud, drunk shenanigans.

 

There is good and bad everywhere. The most polite people I ever came across in my travels were the Russian people (who'd have thought?!). They were very serious people, but friendly and helpful. When someone in our small group accidentally left something in a cafe (which we couldn't find after walking a few blocks), a group of youngish Russian people helped us find the place. When my carry on bag handle came unstitched in Paris (it was way too heavy - too much shopping), the bag room handler at my Moscow hotel had fixed it when I collected it on my last day. I tried to give him money but he smiled and kept refusing. It was such a kind act and not something I expected. The Paris bag handlers certainly didn't bother (not that I expected that).

 

It is natural for there to be greater issues with tourists from a particular country when more of their people start to travel abroad. Up until the 2000s it was very expensive for Australians to travel abroad. Today, it is very cheap and so more and more people (who previously would not have been able to) travel. Thus, the scope for problems grows wider.

 

In years to come, I'm sure we will see articles complaining about SE Asian tourists, Indian tourists and South America tourists as these economies grow into richer ones, thus enabling the people to travel overseas in greater numbers.

[deadzone1003]

The phrase "When in Rome, do as the Romans do" is more about following the customs and laws of the country you are visiting. This phrase was used to inform that those "Ugly Americans" visiting the world in the 50's and 60's were leaving a poor image of Americans because of their behavior in a foreign country. Visiting a foreign country is akin to visiting someone's home. Do you make yourself at home in another person's home without their permission?