Are you kidding me Viking?!

[pbnjrockette]

How do the Vantage cruises work? Is everyone on the boat on the same tour, or is it a tour group chartering space.? Are all guests English speaking or mixed languages?

 

Haven't seen many reviews or information on them. Thanks for any assist..

 

Vantage has treated us well. We've traveled 10 times with them -- land and cruise tours. We have been on rivercruises where the entire ship was American and on others where there have been mixed language speaking groups on board. Usually the Vantage group had a set area to sit for evening meals. (China, Russia). These were chartered ships. They own a lot of their own ships for the European river cruises so the entire group is with Vantage.

[veryseasonedtraveler]

Could you clarify this first paragraph? Where did you find the food mediocre? Viking Elbe cruise?

Viking Elbe cruise did have great breakfast buffet. The dinners were hit or miss.

In China on the cruise portion, the same. On the excursions, we ate in numerous places with a lazy -susan type table. If you were lucky to be in the first thru third seats, you were OK. If not, not much remained. They allowed only one drink per person in China. I specifically remember very spicy food and I needed water. Was told I had my one beverage. We wanted wine on our last night and we were told it would be around $50 USD. The worse situation was a bus type restaurant that had no running water because of a problem. We ate there anyway after driving a very long time to get there. Viking did give us a future cruise credit, which was applied to the Elbe River cruise.

[dwkucera]

One thing to remember is that Viking, like many river cruise lines, is a private company. Being private they do not have the ability to raise money for expansion by issuing more stock to sell. They must use cash reserves, borrow, or use current cash flow. I'm sure they are probably using a combination of all these, so yes, when you pay in advance you are probably helping to fund their new longboat building activities. If someone is willing to pay that far in advance to secure a lower price for the cruise that is their business as far as I am concerned. But what would concern me is their financial condition. Being private, they do not have to supply information on their financials like publcally traded companies do. Many times people confuse sales, and the size of the company with financial stability which may not be the case at all. Many times seemingly strong companies are operating much closer to the "edge" than we would suspect, and unforeseen events can push them over that edge. With their requirement for payment up front Viking is in effect "robing Peter to pay Paul". Money they receive now and spend is money will not receive next year or the year after. I am not in any way saying Viking is going under, but the evidence would suggest they use current cash flow in a way that leaves very little reserve for unexpected future events. Periods of fast expansion requiring large outflows of money are dangerous periods for any company.

[Poulsbo Cruisers]

Vantage has treated us well. We've traveled 10 times with them -- land and cruise tours. We have been on rivercruises where the entire ship was American and on others where there have been mixed language speaking groups on board. Usually the Vantage group had a set area to sit for evening meals. (China, Russia). These were chartered ships. They own a lot of their own ships for the European river cruises so the entire group is with Vantage.

 

We took our first river cruise this year and chose Vantage. We were very pleased and plan to use them again. We did a lot of research and had a recommendation from friends to try GCT. However, Vantage is a similar company and, from what we could tell, has nicer and newer ships.

[Barrheadlass]

Vantage and Grand Circle are each owned by 2 brothers, who parted ways apparently some years ago...both market directly and don't go through travel agents...I'm about to take my third trip with GCT (Seine river cruise, this December) and have been happy with GCT. My first trip with GCT was booked 2 months in advance of the trip and was VERY well priced...Have also taken 2 river cruises with Uniworld...I'm looking forward to comparing the 2 lines. Uniworld is significantly more expensive...

[In Retirement]

Greetings!

 

Most of us find river cruising somewhat of a mystery, and it doesn't look like Cruise Critic is interesting in improving the way they organize/solicit participant information. For example, research just one common port to see almost no posts (just counting the name of the port in text, not necessarily any information of what can be done at a port). Indeed, a "Roll Call" just about makes no sense as its very unlikely that two CC members will even show up on the same boat and date! (I've participated in one forum based upon a future sailing of a ship not yet to sail anywhere and there have been just a couple of us writing to each other!)

 

Unlike most ocean cruise lines with very large volume, where you generally know what you get and can use a variety of websites to make decisions and ask questions about cabins etc. here. River cruises follow a different model in general that appears to be more passenger-oriented, but I'm yet to be convinced (currently waiting for a reply to an email and don't have much hope). Yes, we all like a certain amount of structure but also some flexibility for individual considerations. Not so interested in being in a group of 200 each morning (and we are definitely the "educate us" type with interest in history and culture). Perhaps tours are just a marketing ploy and actually not interested in attracted a certain clientele? Looking at this another way, perhaps river cruises are attractive to folks who are followers and don't want to plan and make their own decisions? My review of the Viking Ocean port tours for those locations I've previously visited suggest very superficial, limited tours.

 

Of course, money is always important (at least to those of us who would even take the time to post on CC!). I notice that Viking is a constant presentation of 2-for-1 with each month having a new deadline. Of interest, when we researched Rhine for June 2014 it was difficult to find a voyage on a new ship with cabins available in different classes (yes, the two "royal" cabins were usually vacant) so apparently during high demand times Viking has no difficulty capturing money many months before a cruise. Perhaps the difference between 200 or less on a cruise than 1200 to 2500 on a cruise? Several of the high-end ocean cruise lines run 2-for-1 promotions all of the time, but even those prices are 2 to 6 times the price of most commercial companies (Holland America, Princess, Celebrity, Royal Caribbean, etc.). It looks like a company such as Viking had to cope with the definite stress of European river floods in 2013 (anyone have any idea of what we should look for in say January/February to predict June 2014?). I have no idea how they decided on demand potential that led to their major expansion (another corporate stress) and then they have jumped into the ocean cruise business (without having a public issue of stock?)! I know this is a very competitive activity with plenty of availability to date (who knows what Congress has planned that can plunge our economy back into a recession?).

 

Honestly, our annual cruise activities over the last five summers (post retirement) use a cruise as an efficient way to get to a European port where usually we assist in organizing a private day (unlike many winter Caribbean cruises where an island tour is more of a curiosity than anything else and where most people head for the beach and drink?). Its great to be able to select a month and a departure port and see what is offered. We have committed to a week (not two or more weeks) on Viking that ends in Amsterdam (a city we know fairly well) and have snagged a great balcony cabin on Celebrity's annual Norway cruise and have lucked into a great travel adviser in Belgium through TravelAdvisor and are almost done planning the 6-night interim between Rhine and Norway with evenings in Ghent, Brugge, and Amsterdam using Europe's extensive train options. (If you think this is my way of planning defensively to adapt to a potential 2014 river flood or a fumbled/disappointing Viking experience, you'd be right on!).

DJ:)

[Hydrokitty]

I noticed you did the Columbia and snake river on american steamboat...tell me more...did you love it? Ages of passengers? Cabins, food,etc etc. pls and thank you for your comments.

 

Hi Remydiva: yes, I loved the Columbia and Snake River trip. the scenery and excursions were wonderful. However, I cannot in good conscience recommend American Cruise Lines (not to be confused with the American Queen Steamboat Company which has the same trip). Our cabin had a balcony and was one level below a suite so it was quite spacious and comfortable. The average age on board was 65 and up. The crew members were all American college students, most majoring in hotel and tourism, and worked very hard. The bad part comes with the dining room. the food was terrible and the service was worse, which was NOT the fault of the servers. The dining room servers also serve as housekeeping staff so breakfast can be a little rushed. I did a review of the trip on CC member reviews: American Cruise Lines: Queen of the West. If you want additionall info e-mail me directly at chydro564@yahoo.com.

[remydiva]

Hi Remydiva: yes, I loved the Columbia and Snake River trip. the scenery and excursions were wonderful. However, I cannot in good conscience recommend American Cruise Lines (not to be confused with the American Queen Steamboat Company which has the same trip). Our cabin had a balcony and was one level below a suite so it was quite spacious and comfortable. The average age on board was 65 and up. The crew members were all American college students, most majoring in hotel and tourism, and worked very hard. The bad part comes with the dining room. the food was terrible and the service was worse, which was NOT the fault of the servers. The dining room servers also serve as housekeeping staff so breakfast can be a little rushed. I did a review of the trip on CC member reviews: American Cruise Lines: Queen of the West. If you want additionall info e-mail me directly at chydro564@yahoo.com.

 

thank you for the mini review and also for clarifying the two companies. Yes I had been looking into the other company American Queen Steamboat Company and didn't realize both companies did both itineraries. Since we live on the west coast, the Snake and Columbia is a good choice to try out a completely new way of river travel.

 

If I have any more questions I will contact you so thank you for the offer.

 

*the best cruise is the next cruise * :)

Edited October 19, 2013 by remydiva

[marco]

And back to the original post" Are you kidding me, Viking?" We've just booked an identical river cruise through someone else for more than $2500 less per person. OK...we won't have a fridge in our cabin and we won't get beer/wine included with dinner, but the ports, excursions and sites are the same! For a two week trip, I can buy a LOT of beer and wine for $2500!!!!!!

[remydiva]

And back to the original post" Are you kidding me, Viking?" We've just booked an identical river cruise through someone else for more than $2500 less per person. OK...we won't have a fridge in our cabin and we won't get beer/wine included with dinner, but the ports, excursions and sites are the same! For a two week trip, I can buy a LOT of beer and wine for $2500!!!!!!

 

Does the 'someone else' start with an 'A' or a 'V'?:cool:

[Host Jazzbeau]

Viking Elbe cruise did have great breakfast buffet. The dinners were hit or miss.

In China on the cruise portion, the same. On the excursions, we ate in numerous places with a lazy -susan type table. If you were lucky to be in the first thru third seats, you were OK. If not, not much remained. They allowed only one drink per person in China. I specifically remember very spicy food and I needed water. Was told I had my one beverage. We wanted wine on our last night and we were told it would be around $50 USD. The worse situation was a bus type restaurant that had no running water because of a problem. We ate there anyway after driving a very long time to get there. Viking did give us a future cruise credit, which was applied to the Elbe River cruise.

 

Thanks! Sorry your experiences were disappointing.

[Cruzer1001]

This thread has wandered a bit, but the original topic still stands out for most new people. Isn't it fraud when someone comes up with a fake price to give you 50% discount? Is there no authority who goes to these companies, such as Viking, and asks "How many of your customers paid $21,000 per person for that cruise?". I remember Sears got fined for offering huge discounts off mattresses that never sold for the "full" price. I really doubt if many if any people are paying Viking almost $45,000 for a cabin without a balcony on a Bucharest to Amsterdam cruise when their competitors such as Avalon are quoting just over $20,000 for the same trip without any discounts.

As for paying 1 or 2 years in advance, if you think that is a good idea, I am sure there are car dealers who would like to sell you a 2017 right away.

[Talisker92]

Vantage does not cruise the Elbe river. The only companies cruising the Elbe would be Viking and Grand Circle. GCT only allows bookings from the US (btw I think so does Vantage?), so this really narrows it down.

 

Dear ingo,

I am sorry to disagree with you, but we are booked on an Elbe River cruise with Vantage in 2014. Here is the title of the cruise:

Cruising the Elbe River: Berlin, Dresden & Prague

[In Retirement]

This thread has wandered a bit, but the original topic still stands out for most new people. Isn't it fraud when someone comes up with a fake price to give you 50% discount? Is there no authority who goes to these companies, such as Viking, and asks "How many of your customers paid $21,000 per person for that cruise?". I remember Sears got fined for offering huge discounts off mattresses that never sold for the "full" price. I really doubt if many if any people are paying Viking almost $45,000 for a cabin without a balcony on a Bucharest to Amsterdam cruise when their competitors such as Avalon are quoting just over $20,000 for the same trip without any discounts.

As for paying 1 or 2 years in advance, if you think that is a good idea, I am sure there are car dealers who would like to sell you a 2017 right away.

 

Two general observations: Although I haven't yet gone on a truly upscale cruise (I don't know, maybe like Crystal?) I do regularly get their brochures and they all have 2-for-1 or better pricing (free air, free excursions, etc.). My basic problem, however, is that I take an ocean itinerary mainly for the ports and pay attention to time available for each day and day of the week (are museums open, is it a local/national holiday, etc.). We are plenty happy being served dinner and are appreciative, but snobs only to the point that we are pretty addicted to a balcony cabin and really prefer aft!

 

Considering Viking because of new vessels and Amsterdam/Basel because I decided something relatively short (maybe we wouldn't like?) and added land and sea experiences out of Amsterdam. My exploration was last August for next June -- and I had a very hard time finding a cabin! Money upfront certainly isn't an industry standard, but when you pay TAs, have under 200 passengers (90+ cabins) and have expanded rapidly 2012/2014, as well as building two ocean vessels, there is obviously a demand for this product? Now only if next spring doesn't duplicate 2013, all may go well?

 

At any rate, wish Cruise Critic would consider minor modifications of river cruise forums to allow previous passengers to provide truly useful information!

DJ:)

[notamermaid]

Hello talisker,

 

Dear ingo,

I am sorry to disagree with you, but we are booked on an Elbe River cruise with Vantage in 2014. Here is the title of the cruise:

Cruising the Elbe River: Berlin, Dresden & Prague

 

I found your cruise on the Vantage website. Is the itinerary new perhaps? Things are changing every new year in river cruising. Arosa getting into the American market, TUI expanding with hopes of getting onto the French rivers in 2015, for example. And that is just the German companies / crusie lines.

 

Back on topic: German cruise lines do not tend to have these aggressive advertising styles, so far I have not heard of a 2-for-1 offer (perhaps someone else has?) here. We tend to get early booking reductions, or reductions or vouchers when you book at a tourism fair. Also full payment a year in advance is a no-go really. The small print in the catalogues gives a detailed breakdown of how much they expect you to pay in advance. I get the feeling customer protection laws are different from the US.

 

notamermaid

[donnatello]

I think you have to just ignore the hype and look at the bottom line of what it will cost"out the door". Kind of like advertising that you get a Mercedes "for free"...when you pay $60K for the tires.

Edited December 1, 2013 by donnatello

[remydiva]

Not a day goes by where i dont get an email from viking with one or another of their marketing schemes...ie 2/1 or $ xxx off air fare or even FREE air fare

( small print...if you live on the east coast).

 

I guess the old adage of " build it and they will come" is true in the river cruise world and in Viking's case, " build it, get THEM to pay for it a year in advance, and they still will come!"

 

To each their own and I have yet to NOT go on an itinerary I wanted by playing by MY rules...pay for a good product at a good price in a reasonable timely manner.

[jiminyC_fan]

I guess that's why there are options for everyone. Viking suits my needs and expectations.

[remydiva]

I guess that's why there are options for everyone. Viking suits my needs and expectations.

 

i dont disagree with you

 

.As you will note I have done two Viking cruises but both done with huge sales and incentives that checked off boxes on my list.

[markf]

I recd apromotion in Sept to book for 12 months out and they wanted full paymnet immediately--I find that to be concerning--I understand a deposit and full payment 6075 days prior--for t hat reason I did not book on Viking--hopefully they read these messages

[remydiva]

I recd apromotion in Sept to book for 12 months out and they wanted full paymnet immediately--I find that to be concerning--I understand a deposit and full payment 6075 days prior--for t hat reason I did not book on Viking--hopefully they read these messages

 

I know for a fact, as do others here, that Viking most certainly DOES read these threads...and this topic is not new but sadly , no change in Viking's policy. Dont hold your breath.:rolleyes:

 

If the deal or itinerary meets your needs , then book. if not, then don't book with a particular company and vote with your money...I know I do.

[WarEagle76]

How is having to pay for a cruise months in advance to secure the cabin and vessel you want any different than having to pay months in advance to get the air carrier, flight and seats you want to get to the cruise? Airlines have required immediate payment for their best fares at the time of booking for years.

[Host Jazzbeau]

How is having to pay for a cruise months in advance to secure the cabin and vessel you want any different than having to pay months in advance to get the air carrier, flight and seats you want to get to the cruise? Airlines have required immediate payment for their best fares at the time of booking for years.

 

I guess the difference is that the airlines have somehow managed to coordinate their fare increases and service cuts (despite supposed antitrust laws). Viking stands alone here, so we have choices.

[Got2Cruise]

How is having to pay for a cruise months in advance to secure the cabin and vessel you want any different than having to pay months in advance to get the air carrier, flight and seats you want to get to the cruise? Airlines have required immediate payment for their best fares at the time of booking for years.

 

But cruising does not require that. Cruising has a different pricing structure. Viking is the only one what requires you to pay in full, and it is widely held that their 2 for 1 sales are really not 2 for 1 at all. But, if you are comfortable paying in full more than a year in advance, that is fine. Some of us, are not comfortable doing that and will give our business to another company with comparable rates and amenities.

 

p.s. when you book your airfare and pay for it, you MIGHT have gotten the best fare, or you might not have. That is what you have to live with. Some airlines will give you a credit for the difference if the price goes down and others won't. But that is better debated on the Cruise Air board.

[Donray]

2015/2016 EARLY BOOKING DISCOUNT

2-FOR-1 CRUISES—OFFER EXPIRES OCTOBER 31, 2013

 

This was the heading of todays email from Viking that included the teaser of "$2000 per couple off airfare!"

 

I am NOT paying in full for a cruise that is 3 yrs off just to help Tor build another ship,

 

Just my two cents worth so pardon my venting...

 

I don't understand your problem. Why even look to book Viking? You do not have to pay fully in advance with Viking, don't take advantage of the offer that requires pay in advance.

 

Why are you so concerned with there marking approach? Either you think they offer a good product at a price you are willing to pay or they don't.