Smoking?

[skeeterotis]

New to this board and cruising. Looking at all the other boards I don't see nearly as much about smoking. Does Holland allow smoking in more places?

We don't mind it unless it's blown in our faces. We love Las Vegas and seems like everything there is smoking. I'm just curious why so many talking about it here.

[PathfinderEss]

Welcome to Cruise Critic.

 

Here you go from Hal's website. This should answer all your questions on smoking.

 

For the comfort of all of our guests, all staterooms (cabins), showrooms and most other indoor areas are designated non-smoking. While smoking is not permitted in staterooms, guests are allowed to smoke on stateroom verandahs. Smoking is also permitted on certain other designated, outside decks. The designated smoking areas for all ships are as follows unless otherwise noted.

• Stateroom verandahs
  
• Casino (Active players only)
  
• Seaview Bar
  
• Outside Decks
  
  • Sports Deck
    
  • Observation Deck (ms Prinsendam, ms Eurodam, ms Nieuw Amsterdam, ms Noordam, ms Oosterdam, ms Westerdam, and ms Zuiderdam only)
    

Cigar and pipe smoking is not allowed anywhere inside the ship; it is only permitted on the outside decks where smoking is otherwise allowed and on stateroom verandahs. Electronic cigarettes are permitted in staterooms but not in other public areas of the ship other than on outside decks designated as smoking areas.

Any guest who smokes inside staterooms in violation of our policy will be charged a US$250 cleaning fee per day of violation.

 

Now to the reason for all the smoking threads, its my belief that if you inundate the boards with smoking threads, that the anti smoking group can get Hal to change their smoking policy.

Sorry as a new poster to these boards you got yourself right in the middle of this issue, but you ask.

Edited July 18, 2014 by PathfinderEss

[runner15km]

As of now HAL allows smoking on balconies.

[Hlitner]

Here we go again :)

 

Hank

[Lizzie68]

New to this board and cruising. Looking at all the other boards I don't see nearly as much about smoking. Does Holland allow smoking in more places?

We don't mind it unless it's blown in our faces. We love Las Vegas and seems like everything there is smoking. I'm just curious why so many talking about it here.

 

Welcome to Cruise Critic. Hmm Seattle. I imagine you can see how many threads on smoking just on this page. If you read you will likely answer your own questions.

[cruisemom42]

I'm just curious why so many talking about it here.

 

Human nature?

[DeeniEncinitas]

Welcome Skeeterotis!!!:) yah you now can see all our smoking threads. Really glad your on CC, you will enjoy all of us. We are now the last cruise line that allows smoking as of right now.

[pms4104]

I could be wrong and I may have misunderstood the OP's post ... but it seems to me that the question isn't so much what is HAL's policy but why in the world are there so many current threads on the subject.

 

My feeling is that six smoking threads on page one of this board is way too many ...

[POA1]

If I didn't know better, I would begin to wonder if it's a concerted attempt to render CruiseCritic's HAL board unusable by making it it all smoking threads, all the time. :confused:

[pms4104]

If I didn't know better, I would begin to wonder if it's a concerted attempt to render CruiseCritic's HAL board unusable by making it it all smoking threads, all the time. :confused:

It is a bit of overkill, isn't it? It's no surprise that some members just don't stop in here so much anymore ...

[solocanadian]

If I didn't know better, I would begin to wonder if it's a concerted attempt to render CruiseCritic's HAL board unusable by making it it all smoking threads, all the time. :confused:

 

I'm finding it a colossal pain in the butt.:rolleyes::p

[PathfinderEss]

Here we go again :)

 

Hank

 

You got the one right.......

Welcome Skeeterotis!!!:) yah you now can see all our smoking threads. Really glad your on CC, you will enjoy all of us. We are now the last cruise line that allows smoking as of right now.

 

Maybe that's what your hoping for, but I think you probably meant smoking on balconies.

 

If I didn't know better, I would begin to wonder if it's a concerted attempt to render CruiseCritic's HAL board unusable by making it it all smoking threads, all the time. :confused:

ya think.......:rolleyes:

 

It is a bit of overkill, isn't it? It's no surprise that some members just don't stop in here so much anymore ...

 

really over kill..........maybe just a little.:eek:

[Sam.Seattle]

New to this board and cruising. Looking at all the other boards I don't see nearly as much about smoking. Does Holland allow smoking in more places?

We don't mind it unless it's blown in our faces. We love Las Vegas and seems like everything there is smoking. I'm just curious why so many talking about it here.

Very interesting observation!

 

Yes Holland does allow (in most cases) smoking in more places.

 

Balcony, Decks, Casino and ??

 

But.... the reason you see more smoking conversation here is maybe because there really isn't anything new with HAL to talk about.

 

I also think older people get more set in their way and it does not take much to start an over blown debate.

Edited July 18, 2014 by Sam.Seattle

[Hlitner]

Very interesting observation!

 

Yes Holland does allow (in most cases) smoking in more places.

 

Balcony, Decks, Casino and ??

 

But.... the reason you see more smoking conversation here is maybe because there really isn't anything new with HAL to talk about.

 

I also think older people get more set in their way and it does not take much to start an over blown debate.

 

Interesting observation. So lets talk about some positive news regarding HAL. ahhhh. ahhhhh. Am thinking hard. ahhhhhh, ahhhhh. Guess we could start some new threads on the improved cuisine, improved entertainment, great wine list, lower drink prices, etc. But then the Pinocchio syndrome might take hold.

 

Hank

Edited July 18, 2014 by Hlitner

[Sam.Seattle]

Interesting observation. So lets talk about some positive news regarding HAL. ahhhh. ahhhhh. Am thinking hard. ahhhhhh, ahhhhh. Guess we could start some new threads on the improved cuisine, improved entertainment, great wine list, lower drink prices, etc. But then the Pinocchio syndrome might take hold.

 

Hank

HA! It might be a while...

 

Or, we can speculate as to the cause of ship board fires.

 

We choose HAL when DW and I travel alone and just want to cruise and do nothing except relax by the pool, spa or on the smokey balcony.

 

When we travel with Adult kids or friends, you will find us on Royal.

 

Maybe... a change is in the wind?

[nb125]

If I didn't know better, I would begin to wonder if it's a concerted attempt to render CruiseCritic's HAL board unusable by making it it all smoking threads, all the time. :confused:

 

Or an attempt to influence HAL's policy.

[meterman2]

Welcome to Cruise Critic.

 

Now to the reason for all the smoking threads, its my belief that if you inundate the boards with smoking threads, that the anti smoking group can get Hal to change their smoking policy.

 

 

Bingo!

[DeeniEncinitas]

Go to the other smoking thread, it is really heating up!

[Fontana]

 

Now to the reason for all the smoking threads, its my belief that if you inundate the boards with smoking threads, that the anti smoking group can get Hal to change their smoking policy.

Sorry as a new poster to these boards you got yourself right in the middle of this issue, but you ask.

 

I know if I was a smoker and a new visitor to this forum, after viewing the many threads mentioning HAL's current smoking on the balcony policy, I would be very happy and looking at HAL for our next cruise.

Who knows, maybe HAL sees the $$ value in welcoming smokers and being known as the preferred cruise line for smokers (passengers and staff alike) :)

[Hlitner]

There are many factors that find their way into executive suites. In the case of HAL you should not underestimate that their HQ is in Seattle where they have very tough anti-smoking laws which impact on all the workers at the corporate headquarters. And now there are subtle legal issues which are certainly discussed at the highest levels. When most lines allowed balcony smoking, HAL was among the "crowd." But when you are the last one standing there is no longer any group protection. So lets take a plausible situation (and lawyers think this way). Assume a HAL passenger, with Asthma, has a major asthma attack while on their HAL balcony which results in a major bout or even death. They then sue HAL who certainly has some excellent legal defenses...or do they? This potential liability not only impacts HAL thinking, but it is an issue for HAL's liability Insurer. Imagine an attorney, before a Jury, pointing out that every other major cruise line banned balcony smoking because of its inherent risk to other passengers, but HAL saw fit to risk the life and limb of every other passenger to satisfy a few. And the Attorney would also argue that the parent company "CCL" most have knowledge of the risk since all their other companies had already banned balcony smoking.

 

Not sure that HAL pays a lot of attention to what CC posters think, but when you run a large corporation the legal risk is a constant irritant which can only be ignored at great risk to the CEO's future.

 

Hank

[DeeniEncinitas]

There are many factors that find their way into executive suites. In the case of HAL you should not underestimate that their HQ is in Seattle where they have very tough anti-smoking laws which impact on all the workers at the corporate headquarters. And now there are subtle legal issues which are certainly discussed at the highest levels. When most lines allowed balcony smoking, HAL was among the "crowd." But when you are the last one standing there is no longer any group protection. So lets take a plausible situation (and lawyers think this way). Assume a HAL passenger, with Asthma, has a major asthma attack while on their HAL balcony which results in a major bout or even death. They then sue HAL who certainly has some excellent legal defenses...or do they? This potential liability not only impacts HAL thinking, but it is an issue for HAL's liability Insurer. Imagine an attorney, before a Jury, pointing out that every other major cruise line banned balcony smoking because of its inherent risk to other passengers, but HAL saw fit to risk the life and limb of every other passenger to satisfy a few. And the Attorney would also argue that the parent company "CCL" most have knowledge of the risk since all their other companies had already banned balcony smoking.

 

Not sure that HAL pays a lot of attention to what CC posters think, but when you run a large corporation the legal risk is a constant irritant which can only be ignored at great risk to the CEO's future.

 

Hank

 

Great point of view! Very analytical !!!! Makes sense to me!

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[Lizzie68]

There are many factors that find their way into executive suites. In the case of HAL you should not underestimate that their HQ is in Seattle where they have very tough anti-smoking laws which impact on all the workers at the corporate headquarters. And now there are subtle legal issues which are certainly discussed at the highest levels. When most lines allowed balcony smoking, HAL was among the "crowd." But when you are the last one standing there is no longer any group protection. So lets take a plausible situation (and lawyers think this way). Assume a HAL passenger, with Asthma, has a major asthma attack while on their HAL balcony which results in a major bout or even death. They then sue HAL who certainly has some excellent legal defenses...or do they? This potential liability not only impacts HAL thinking, but it is an issue for HAL's liability Insurer. Imagine an attorney, before a Jury, pointing out that every other major cruise line banned balcony smoking because of its inherent risk to other passengers, but HAL saw fit to risk the life and limb of every other passenger to satisfy a few. And the Attorney would also argue that the parent company "CCL" most have knowledge of the risk since all their other companies had already banned balcony smoking.

 

Not sure that HAL pays a lot of attention to what CC posters think, but when you run a large corporation the legal risk is a constant irritant which can only be ignored at great risk to the CEO's future.

 

Hank

 

The simple answer in law is that the passenger knew, or ought to have known, that balcony smoking was allowed on that ship.

[Hlitner]

The simple answer in law is that the passenger knew, or ought to have known, that balcony smoking was allowed on that ship.

 

Yep, that is certainly the age old defense. Sometimes it works and other times a jury totally ignores this defense. Most Corporations have learned (the hard way) not to rely on this type of thinking. One of my favorite examples is the lady that put a very hot cup of coffee (from McDonalds) between her legs and then burned herself in a very nasty way. The defense was essentially, "what kind of idiot puts a hot cup of coffee between their legs?" The Jury awarded the Plaintiff about $2.8 Million Dollars (later settled for an undisclosed amount). Advance knowledge of a risk is not often an effective defense for a Corporation with deep pockets.

 

In an era when the standard is to reduce everyone's exposure to secondary smoke, it is hard to argue otherwise. That is one reason why many hotel chains have now banned all smoking on their premises at the risk of losing many smoking customers.

 

Hank

Edited July 18, 2014 by Hlitner

[sail7seas]

I know if I was a smoker and a new visitor to this forum, after viewing the many threads mentioning HAL's current smoking on the balcony policy, I would be very happy and looking at HAL for our next cruise.

Who knows, maybe HAL sees the $$ value in welcoming smokers and being known as the preferred cruise line for smokers (passengers and staff alike) :)

 

Actually, crew smoking areas are very limited.

HAL has actively encouraged crew quit smoking and has provided positive reinforcement to aid them in doing so.

 

 

Edited July 18, 2014 by sail7seas

[frankc98376]

The simple answer in law is that the passenger knew, or ought to have known, that balcony smoking was allowed on that ship.

 

And read the lengthy cruise contract we all agree to. Not real easy to sue them