How does NCL "nickel and dime" you to death?

[rgruenhaus]

If you lived in the "real world" with the rest of us, you would understand that the use of robots is more about consistent manufacturing and quality control than in effort "to keep from paying wages and benefits".

 

You clearly have been drinking from the "corporations are evil" Koolaide pitcher. :rolleyes:

 

That's sure a different way to look at it and might be a good thing, but when something like that could be done here with that same idea of precision that would be great, but American labor might cost more than the slave labor there in Brazil. None of us knows for sure why they are doing it when it comes to daily service charges and room service charges, but it is more than what I feel is fair price unless unless it was only four hours that would out of the ordinary.

[rgruenhaus]

As another poster pointed out on another thread if any of it were kept for the company's profit then the passengers would not have the ability to adjust it or remove it.

 

Yeah you might be right, but companies know when the staff are in the dark about revenue and can claim that less came in than is reality. I used to work for Sears and they gave bonuses based upon coming in under budget and when they did come in under they found ways to show they went over budget by saying that any company truck damage added to the costs. These trucks were insured there were no added costs. No bonuses were paid that year and for several years because we could not prove or disprove the cost added to the budget. Just one example of companies working the numbers in their interest.

[rgruenhaus]

Wherever a person lives a living wage has been determined. That's why the military pays more or less at each duty station based on what it cost to have the same standard of living. They even know that to live in the civilian towns we may need added money four quarters. I have experienced this in my 16 years of Navy service. Most of these crew members cone from outside America because they are not used to having the need for income like we used to get here until corporations decided to equalize the world income for their profits.

[sparks1093]

You say new room service fee is to increase profits and I say it's a great detriment to make people twice about using room service that even cost money. They either order big to make up for the cost and clean is on their dime not cruise line ~or~ the people can take themselves to any eatery on the ship and maybe even sitdown, there and eat food there. Either way, win-win for the cruise line when it comes to saving food money and time.

 

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Using it as a deterrent is even more insidious since they are then trying to control what I do instead of letting me choose, but since I don't believe that was the intent of the charge I don't worry about that particular interpretation;).

[rgruenhaus]

I would never pay extra for room service.

 

I would never pay extra to eat in a dining room when a dining room meal is already included in the cruise price.

 

I would never pay to bring a bottle of wine on the ship when every single other cruise line permits one bottle per passenger for no extra charge.

 

I would not pay extra for the gouge restaurants to get lobster when all the other cruise lines include it in the dining room that is included in the cruise fare.

 

I would never pay $45 per say for the spa so i can use an indoor hottub on a sailing out of the northeast when every other cruise line does not charge for this.

 

In other words, I would never ever ever let myself be ripped off by NCL when there are many other cruise lines that treat their guests with a lot more respect.

 

You can have your FEE STYLE CRUISING. I am out and enjoying more 40-something cruises giving my money to someone else.

 

I'm with you, I don't pay for what I think is more than it should be. I have no experience with other than NCL so I will see what value the dinning and extras are and on my next cruise I can nice to another cruise line to get those things that are included or not charged more for.

 

I got the specialty dinning for four days because I wanted to dine there for less and I was told that without this package the Cirque Dreams show with dinner was going to be over $100 per person. Cirque du Soleil shows in Disney World are $110 each for the best seats. Cirque Dreams I have seen in Palm Springs and they are like the minor league team of performers for Cirque du Soleil. Not that it's a bad show. The four dinner specialty pkg was around $100 each person.

 

If I go on a cruise line that has no extra fees for what I believe should be what a cruise should include then I say goodbye to NCL.

[maywell]

I'm with you, I don't pay for what I think is more than it should be. I have no experience with other than NCL so I will see what value the dinning and extras are and on my next cruise I can nice to another cruise line to get those things that are included or not charged more for.

 

I got the specialty dinning for four days because I wanted to dine there for less and I was told that without this package the Cirque Dreams show with dinner was going to be over $100 per person. Cirque du Soleil shows in Disney World are $110 each for the best seats. Cirque Dreams I have seen in Palm Springs and they are like the minor league team of performers for Cirque du Soleil. Not that it's a bad show. The four dinner specialty pkg was around $100 each person.

 

If I go on a cruise line that has no extra fees for what I believe should be what a cruise should include then I say goodbye to NCL.

 

Wait, what? The cirque dream show on the Breakaway is $39.99 per person without the package, not $100 per person. I know because I went last year at the last minute and didn't have a dining package; it's still the same price this year on Myncl.com....

 

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[NLH Arizona]

I'm with you, I don't pay for what I think is more than it should be. I have no experience with other than NCL so I will see what value the dinning and extras are and on my next cruise I can nice to another cruise line to get those things that are included or not charged more for.

 

I got the specialty dinning for four days because I wanted to dine there for less and I was told that without this package the Cirque Dreams show with dinner was going to be over $100 per person. Cirque du Soleil shows in Disney World are $110 each for the best seats. Cirque Dreams I have seen in Palm Springs and they are like the minor league team of performers for Cirque du Soleil. Not that it's a bad show. The four dinner specialty pkg was around $100 each person.

 

If I go on a cruise line that has no extra fees for what I believe should be what a cruise should include then I say goodbye to NCL.

Don't forget to look at the cruise fare. My January cruise on Celebrity cost $470 per night for the 5 day cruise, while my December NCL cruise, if in a comparable cabin category, would only be $299 a day for a 7 day cruise.

 

I would rather NCL keep the cruise fares lower and give me a choice what additional items I would like to pay for.

 

I also cruise on Crystal and they went almost all-inclusive. Drinks are now included, along with gratuities and 1 specialty dining in each restaurant. Before the change, they use to offer OBC, my was always $1,000, but with the change that stopped and now to cruise them I pay $1,000 more (BTW, I drink very little, so free drinks is not an incentive for me). Add to this, my TA would pay for my gratuities. So sometimes, some lines don't charge for things individually, but you pay for them upfront in your fare and you have no choices whether you want to pay for them or not. I, for one, would rather have a choice!

Edited October 12, 2015 by NLH Arizona

[sloopsailor]

So you have never delivered food in your life. Pizza delivery drivers have to report all tips as income! It is taxed! Another indication that a person is not living in the workers world.

 

 

Obviously you haven't figured this out by yourself, but the vast majority of the crew are not US Citizens, but live in countries that have entirely different taxation systems. What the US does is not indicative of what all countries in the world do. It is YOU who is not living in those "worker's worlds". :rolleyes:

Edited October 12, 2015 by sloopsailor

[CPT Trips]

I'm with you, I don't pay for what I think is more than it should be. I have no experience with other than NCL so I will see what value the dinning and extras are and on my next cruise I can nice to another cruise line to get those things that are included or not charged more for.

 

I got the specialty dinning for four days because I wanted to dine there for less and I was told that without this package the Cirque Dreams show with dinner was going to be over $100 per person. Cirque du Soleil shows in Disney World are $110 each for the best seats. Cirque Dreams I have seen in Palm Springs and they are like the minor league team of performers for Cirque du Soleil. Not that it's a bad show. The four dinner specialty pkg was around $100 each person.

 

If I go on a cruise line that has no extra fees for what I believe should be what a cruise should include then I say goodbye to NCL.

 

Call me nosy.

 

If you have so many things you dislike about NCL before you have experienced their product, why did you choose them for your first cruise?

 

And as long as I'm asking questions, why the heck are you coming to NYC from FL to cruise to the Bahamas?

Edited October 12, 2015 by CPT Trips

[Aquahound]

So you have never delivered food in your life. Pizza delivery drivers have to report all tips as income! It is taxed! Another indication that a person is not living in the workers world.

 

So what you're saying is, you know how the crew's contracts work, along with the way their agents do business in the country of India? You know how it works in the Philippines? You know how works in Jamaica? Ukraine? Trinidad and Tobago? Czech Republic?

[CPT Trips]

So what you're saying is, you know how the crew's contracts work, along with the way their agents do business in the country of India? You know how it works in the Philippines? You know how works in Jamaica? Ukraine? Trinidad and Tobago? Czech Republic?

 

I've wondered for awhile now, do those countries handle taxation of income . . . specifically, do they differentiate between tips and other wages?

[sloopsailor]

I've wondered for awhile now, do those countries handle taxation of income . . . specifically, do they differentiate between tips and other wages?

 

It depends on the country. As the cruise insiders who occasionally post here have reported, many of the home countries of their crew do not tax gratuities, but do tax contracted salary. And, the employment agencies that act as the employee's agents also take a cut of the contracted salaries, but not the gratuities. According to what these insiders have reported, the smaller their actual salary is, the lesser the taxes and fees that they pay, and the more they can send home to their families. Paying them all their income in salary would have them deduct a larger amount of their income for taxes and fees. In other words, they would be worse off if the cruise lines paid them a "living wage" instead of base salary and their tips.

 

That the cruise lines do it the way they do must be for a very good reason. The accounting necessary to track all gratuities to each employee, then parcel out those gratuities in appropriate amounts to everyone in the tip pool, must be a real nightmare for the cruise lines. Yet, they do it instead of a much simpler system of paying a set salary alone.

Edited October 12, 2015 by sloopsailor

[Aquahound]

I've wondered for awhile now, do those countries handle taxation of income . . . specifically, do they differentiate between tips and other wages?

 

That's a good question and I don't think anyone other than the folks at the head offices who deal with crew contracts would know. I do know that 2 people doing the exact same job can have different guaranteed minimum salaries based on where they're from, but how wage vs tipped income is reported at home is waaaaay beyond me.

[CPT Trips]

Sloopsailor . . . regardless of how the tax authorities handle it, cruise lines already account for tip distribution. After all, they collect the daily "tip" from pax and then distribute it to the crew. From what we hear from the insiders, the cruise line also collects and distributes the cash tips, if any, gifted by those that opt out of paying on their shipboard accounts. The only amounts that they might not track are the extra cash tips on top of the daily charge.

[sloopsailor]

Sloopsailor . . . regardless of how the tax authorities handle it, cruise lines already account for tip distribution. After all, they collect the daily "tip" from pax and then distribute it to the crew. From what we hear from the insiders, the cruise line also collects and distributes the cash tips, if any, gifted by those that opt out of paying on their shipboard accounts. The only amounts that they might not track are the extra cash tips on top of the daily charge.

 

Yep, that is saying what I said, but using different words. Glad we both agree that the cruise lines know what they are doing, and know why they are doing it. :D

[nyscilla]

It is getting so convoluted that it confirms my decision to give up on NCL for the near future. Frankly, I cannot be bothered to try to keep track of all of their shenanigans with their various up-charges.

 

When they settle down from their constantly changing charges then we might consider them again. JMHO.

 

Exactly the decision I came to - I just want to know what I am getting when I book - I can consider all the charges and make my decision but NCL is just changing too much too fast....

[swedish weave]

Sloopsailor . . . regardless of how the tax authorities handle it, cruise lines already account for tip distribution. After all, they collect the daily "tip" from pax and then distribute it to the crew. From what we hear from the insiders, the cruise line also collects and distributes the cash tips, if any, gifted by those that opt out of paying on their shipboard accounts. The only amounts that they might not track are the extra cash tips on top of the daily charge.

 

None of the cruise lines have a valid method of tracking cash tips whether the DSC is removed or not.

[sail7seas]

None of the cruise lines have a valid method of tracking cash tips whether the DSC is removed or not.

 

Can't speak for anyone else but I don't see it as any of my business or concern. Once I give a tip, it is no longer my money and I have no need to know anything about it.

 

[rgruenhaus]

Like paying taxes to the government and they send it for foreign aid and can't provide health-care for Americans. Yeah who cares. Arguing between ourselves solves nothing though. Have great future cruises.

[Aquahound]

Can't speak for anyone else but I don't see it as any of my business or concern. Once I give a tip, it is no longer my money and I have no need to know anything about it.

 

 

That, I agree with 100%.

 

Like paying taxes to the government and they send it for foreign aid and can't provide health-care for Americans. Yeah who cares. Arguing between ourselves solves nothing though. Have great future cruises.

 

Huh? :confused:

[KARTI1955]

Wasn't this what started the low life statement? This person seems to have felt dis'd like someone was saying Carnival cruisers weren't tipping but the original point was that NCL was making the tipping mandatory and not about whether Carnival cruisers were not doing something. Am I right? Text messages can suck. They are not always as plain as we think.

 

Thank you, that's exactly what was inferred. Especially with the tone these boards have taken on lately. If that wasn't the respondents intent, my apologies.

[SantaFeFan]

Like paying taxes to the government and they send it for foreign aid and can't provide health-care for Americans. Yeah who cares. Arguing between ourselves solves nothing though. Have great future cruises.

 

Your comments are getting lees and less rational and relevant to the topic. Better quit while you are behind.

[SantaFeFan]

Can't speak for anyone else but I don't see it as any of my business or concern. Once I give a tip, it is no longer my money and I have no need to know anything about it.

 

 

Not only that, but he is wrong. He trots out this lame claim in every tipping thread. The cruise line certainly has knowledge of who gets what in cash and how much. It's due to employment rules and backed up by peer pressure. If people remove the auto tips, the staff involved is required to turn in all cash tips. They are subject to disciplinary action if they don't, up to and including termination. The purpose for the rule is to prevent cheating, which would prevent everyone in the tip pool their fare share.

 

Besides the rules, peer pressure will prevent anyone from hoarding and hiding tips without sharing. The crew lives in very close quarters. it is extremely difficult to keep secrets from fellow crew members. If someone was hiding cash tips and not reporting them, they eventually would get found out. And the end result could very well be termination - which in the cruise industry could be a blackball event, pretty much blocking that person from ever working for a cruise line ever again.

 

Again, this information has been well reported by cruise line insiders, people who work on the ships, and who know how the process works. I will believe them before I would ever believe the opinionated misinformation that swedish weave posts here.

Edited October 13, 2015 by SantaFeFan

[GUT2407]

 

Obviously you haven't figured this out by yourself, but the vast majority of the crew are not US Citizens, but live in countries that have entirely different taxation systems. What the US does is not indicative of what all countries in the world do. It is YOU who is not living in those "worker's worlds". :rolleyes:

 

Well why do so many insist they be tipped like in America.

[sparks1093]

Don't forget to look at the cruise fare. My January cruise on Celebrity cost $470 per night for the 5 day cruise, while my December NCL cruise, if in a comparable cabin category, would only be $299 a day for a 7 day cruise.

 

I would rather NCL keep the cruise fares lower and give me a choice what additional items I would like to pay for.

 

I also cruise on Crystal and they went almost all-inclusive. Drinks are now included, along with gratuities and 1 specialty dining in each restaurant. Before the change, they use to offer OBC, my was always $1,000, but with the change that stopped and now to cruise them I pay $1,000 more (BTW, I drink very little, so free drinks is not an incentive for me). Add to this, my TA would pay for my gratuities. So sometimes, some lines don't charge for things individually, but you pay for them upfront in your fare and you have no choices whether you want to pay for them or not. I, for one, would rather have a choice!

 

If NCL were keeping their fares lower I would agree but so far I haven't seen that. CCL was $800 less when we booked with them. I just looked at some Western Carib itineraries for 2/2017 and the Jade out of Tampa comes in at $2271 (mid-ship balcony) with a $25 shore excursion credit and the CCL Glory for a comparable cabin comes in at $1791 with $50 obc. That $500 difference may not matter to some but it is enough to sway my choice.