Cancelling prepaid gratuities

[MicCanberra]

everybody is entitled to their own opinion, but what gets me is that it seems everyone on here feels that the room stewards ect are paid very little. well who told you that the ceo of the cruiselines or just the general sensus on here ?

i was in hospitality in scotland and tipping is so not the norm here, just do your job and if you get tips then thats fab. how do we ever know if the people we are tipping actually get it anyway. just a thought:p

 

I agree with everyone has and is entitled to an opinion, I also agree no one really knows if the stewards get paid well or not. However, the gratuities are used to supplement their income and as such why would anyone want to remove them automatically before any service has been provided.

[MicCanberra]

i feel the same, when my kids were younger and at the kids club, the staff there were deserving of a tip but you never knew if they ever got it. so i would give them one myself. tipping is a very personal subject as you can tell from the people who get on their high horse regarding it. some people agree on tipping and some do not. its a choice.;)

 

The website for various cruise lines all state that the auto gratuities go to the room stewards, the dining staff and housekeeping. Other crew members would be on a salary and therefore not in that tipping pool.

BTW, Bar staff get the tips from drinks sold so these are pooled separately.

 

The kids club staff would not be reliant on tips but I am sure they would be welcome.:D

[Sitzmark]

I agree with everyone has and is entitled to an opinion, I also agree no one really knows if the stewards get paid well or not. However, the gratuities are used to supplement their income and as such why would anyone want to remove them automatically before any service has been provided.

 

Because Gratuities are by definition a voluntary amount given above and beyond what one is obligated to pay. It is given after service has been received. It can be reduced if service is not as expected or no longer warrants it.

 

With the Pre-Paid gratuities it has been stated that they cannot be removed once you are on the boat, it is therefore no longer voluntary and it is obligatory at that point. Since the company gives you the ability to remove them in advance, but not once you are there, what other option is there?

 

I cannot think of another situation where gratuities are collected in advance. To answer your question with a question, Why would you want to reward service that has not even been provided yet?

[grandgeezer]

On another tip thread, someone mentioned if the Gratuities were included in the fare, we'd have to pay taxes on them. As they are a separate (voluntary) line item, passengers don't pay taxes on them.

 

The saying that floats around is "If you can't afford the _ _ _ _ _ _ you can't afford to cruise. I think the taxes on the tips fits in there.

[Nick77mc]

So what are your thoughts on tipping for the dinning room waiters if you do not use the dinning room. So do you guys suggest tipping when a service is not provided, how do you handle that situation.

[Clarea]

So what are your thoughts on tipping for the dinning room waiters if you do not use the dinning room. So do you guys suggest tipping when a service is not provided, how do you handle that situation.

The tips that are collected for dining staff are pooled and shared with staff in Windjammer.

[knittinggirl]

The tips that are collected for dining staff are pooled and shared with staff in Windjammer.

Many Windjammer staff also work the MDR.

[goodycruising]

I can tell you that the staff do not understand why people are taking the gratuities off on the first day of the cruise. They feel like they haven't been given a chance to give good service. This is what we were told by one of the guest relations people that we spoke to at another area. I do think it is making a difference on Voyager and Explorer to the atmosphere on board between passengers and staff.

 

I would like to know, but never actually will as we never really know: how many people are like us, and pay either prepaid or daily on the account, and then tip a bit more for extras done?

 

We leave the grats all on at the standard rate, even though we prefer a bigger lunch and often don't go to the MDR or the Jammer in the evening, but we figure with all the meals over the whole day we have received good service from the WHOLE TEAM.

 

We always give the room service a couple of dollars for breaky as they have walked to bring it to us. As time goes on they seem more surprised that they are getting something. Not that it seemed to help much, our last suite experience was not great in the room service department, and yes, we did have conversations with several in management about it.

 

We wanted to give our room attendant a bit extra for bringing ice every day, as we usually do on any cruise. We came back at about 8pm to finish packing and we could not find him anywhere. We have never come across the situation where we couldn't even say thanks to the room attendant. We had seen him regularly all of the 14 night cruise and we were not keen to just leave an envelope for anyone to pocket. We wanted to say thank you. We even rang the number on the card but the person was vague like they didn't understand.

 

It would not hurt for the management to tell cruise staff that some passengers are still tipping, and with good service there is an opportunity to earn more in tips. The whole thing is being driven by the negativity on places like social media and here. Really, before the prepaid grats or the daily charging of grats, how many people were not paying as much as recommended? Maybe the whole idea of the staff getting it paid up front has not worked.

 

That is my 2 cents worth from an Australian perspective.

Edited February 20, 2016 by goodycruising

[MicCanberra]

Because Gratuities are by definition a voluntary amount given above and beyond what one is obligated to pay. It is given after service has been received. It can be reduced if service is not as expected or no longer warrants it.

 

With the Pre-Paid gratuities it has been stated that they cannot be removed once you are on the boat, it is therefore no longer voluntary and it is obligatory at that point. Since the company gives you the ability to remove them in advance, but not once you are there, what other option is there?

 

I cannot think of another situation where gratuities are collected in advance. To answer your question with a question, Why would you want to reward service that has not even been provided yet?

 

Because it is only gratuities by name to dodge tax, we all know it is provided as a surcharge otherwise why have prescribed amounts. Just like the drinks, prepaid and automatically 18% whether you want to pay that or not.

[MicCanberra]

So what are your thoughts on tipping for the dinning room waiters if you do not use the dinning room. So do you guys suggest tipping when a service is not provided, how do you handle that situation.

 

Dining staff covers all areas where food is served.:D

[Sitzmark]

Because it is only gratuities by name to dodge tax, we all know it is provided as a surcharge otherwise why have prescribed amounts. Just like the drinks, prepaid and automatically 18% whether you want to pay that or not.

 

I am not interested in helping people dodge their tax obligations.

[caribbean sailor]

Of course, they could pay the staff more and eliminate tips. This is what the "premium " lines do. Tips are built into the high cruise fare. Perhaps one of these lines would suit you better.

 

PERHAPS YOU SHOULD CHECK YOUR TOOTHBRUSH.:p Have a great next cruise.

[oldguysandgalls]

Pre-paid gratuities is what is: "Pre-Paid".

Simply put, when you post a letter you "pre-pay" (postage) but that is no guarantee your letter will arrive at its destination.

[KevinKruzer]

Auto Tipping rant

 

Fwiw, to date, I have never had my prepaid tips removed.....and have always given extra tip$ to MDR waiter/asst waiter & room steward (except for 1 room steward for good reason), but, I do understand those who insist on tipping the old fashioned way and would like prepaid tips to be removed.

 

There is no denying that the overall level of service has been dropping ever so slowly over the years. Cruising RCCL (or others) today is not the value it was 3, 5 or 10 years ago, imho.

 

Like I stated above, I have always gone along with the prepaid gratuities, and again, except with 1 individual on 1 cruise, ended up forking out more dollars (old habits die hard), I really don't agree with the PRINCIPLE of it.... "Tipping" to me is something that I choose to give to those who give my family good service, *personally*. In no other areas of trade do I know of where you pay your gratuity based on good service up front.

 

Imagine walking into a stadium for a sporting event, for example (where you will presumably get seated by usher, buy food, drinks, etc.... and have to pay the ticket taker $50 that will be "distributed" to all staff) really?

 

Human nature tells me that many workers will NOT work as hard knowing that the auto tipping "scheme" assures a certain virtually guaranteed revenue stream. The top "professionals" will still work as hard as ever, but not the "average" worker (ie majority). They will be content with what the auto-tipping scheme will filter down to them.... And there is evidence to support that- most people report that service has been slowly trending down over the last 3+ years...... while the discussion on this topic has trended from "hey, cool, we can simply prepay everything for convenience" to "you are cheap if you don't give more to these poor workers".... So its beginning to simply look like a win-win revenue enhancement for the cruise & its employees.

 

If they were really honest about it initially- they would have said "thank you dear customers for your generosity in prepaying gratuities for our hard workers (nevermind the interest RCCL will earn off tens of thousands who prepay gratuities each month & also allows them to boost their "revenue projections" for stockholders..) we no longer need to distribute those tip envelopes since you prepaid" ... Oh but they still do distribute those...... And most of us feel guilty and stuff even MORE money in them (above & beyond those "recommended" amounts that we paid month(s) ago).... And perhaps those who bucked the system and insisted on NOT prepaying feel like they have to put more $ in their envelope because they were on the "list"of bad customers distributed and/or posted by RCCL lol....Maybe that WAS the plan- win/win for them (RCCL) and them (employees).

 

Like politicians, RCCL (and others) have gone overboard (no pun intended) on extracting revenue from our wallets without returning anything in trade.

 

End of rant.

Edited February 20, 2016 by KevinKruzer

[KevinKruzer]

I am not interested in helping people dodge their tax obligations.

 

Me neither....

 

Do people really think low salary/high tip earners are reporting ALL of their cash tips to the IRS? :D

Edited February 20, 2016 by KevinKruzer

[KevinKruzer]

I can tell you that the staff do not understand why people are taking the gratuities off on the first day of the cruise. They feel like they haven't been given a chance to give good service. This is what we were told by one of the guest relations people that we spoke to at another area. I do think it is making a difference on Voyager and Explorer to the atmosphere on board between passengers and staff..

 

Whoever said that was wrong and sounds entitled. And if its going to "make a difference to the atmosphere btw passengers and staff" then it proves that point.... They need a better attitude.

 

Why assume that removing tips means someone DOESNT want to tip? It could, sure, but it could also mean they want to have control and tip MORE than the standard. Wait till you are stiffed by a person and get mad at that person. Assuming guilt on someone that has already paid their fair share of the overhead to get on board is not a good attitude.

 

I am willing to bet that for every cheapskate that takes his tips off and doesnt tip- there are 10 people who make up for it by tipping above and beyond the prepaid gratuities and/or recommended tip levels.

[KevinKruzer]

The tips that are collected for dining staff are pooled and shared with staff in Windjammer.

 

PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENT :D

 

Although I only have a few dozen posts, I have lurked around here for YEARS!

 

While I am here, I just want to acknowledge this poster (clarea / Bob).

 

I have read tons of useful stuff from you over the years.

 

If there was a CC Top Poster Award or Most Helpful- you would win it hands down....

 

Thank you.

 

Back to regular scheduled programming..... arguments about tipping, dress codes, drink packages, etc.

[Sars81]

Thanks everyone for your opinions,

 

FWIW I have no problem tipping and understand that the staff on these ships work bloody hard for little money.

 

I just am not feeling comfortable prepaying $500 BEFORE I recieve good service. And then once again personally tipping staff I believe have given me great service ( Which I enjoy doing as some people deserve to be rewarded for their work).

 

Also in no way am I expecting 5* service and to be waited on like a queen. But I also would like to be acknowledged when I make eye contact with a staff member to ask a question or in need of something.

 

Whilst on our last cruise I literally waited 30 mins in Johnny rockets to ask for some take away and had to ask 4 staffbers for some help before one begrudgingly took my order. So 'No' I do not believe servoce like that should be rewarded.

 

Also in most of the bars onboard the staff were very disinterested in serving with any type of enthusiasm.

 

My room attendant also came into my room on the last night behind me, shut the door and asked me not to forget about her (Luckily she was female or I would have felt extremely worried.)

Once again we were model guests, not expecting much and only calling on her once for some ice besides the usual room tidy once a day.

 

I have since heard this can be the norm for small cruises (3 nights)

[MicCanberra]

I am not interested in helping people dodge their tax obligations.

 

I was referring to RCI for the company tax and payroll tax although the crews' personal income tax would also apply. So like it or not you are helping them with dodging tax.

Edited February 20, 2016 by MicCanberra

[BekkaW]

Thanks everyone for your opinions,

 

FWIW I have no problem tipping and understand that the staff on these ships work bloody hard for little money.

 

I just am not feeling comfortable prepaying $500 BEFORE I recieve good service. And then once again personally tipping staff I believe have given me great service ( Which I enjoy doing as some people deserve to be rewarded for their work). You don't have to pre-pay, as I mentio no before. You can have it added to your onboard account.

 

Also in no way am I expecting 5* service and to be waited on like a queen. But I also would like to be acknowledged when I make eye contact with a staff member to ask a question or in need of something.

 

Whilst on our last cruise I literally waited 30 mins in Johnny rockets to ask for some take away and had to ask 4 staffbers for some help before one begrudgingly took my order. So 'No' I do not believe servoce like that should be rewarded. There is no way I would have waited half an hour or allowed 4 staff members to get away with doing nothing, after the first one fails you speak with a manager. Trust me on this. We have had the occasional incident of bad service while cruising in and speaking with a manager has always resolved the situation. Of course being polite is fine, but allowing yourself to get walked all over is foolish.

 

Also in most of the bars onboard the staff were very disinterested in serving with any type of enthusiasm. Irrelevant to this as their tips are separate. But again, speak to a supervisor.

My room attendant also came into my room on the last night behind me, shut the door and asked me not to forget about her (Luckily she was female or I would have felt extremely worried.)

Once again we were model guests, not expecting much and only calling on her once for some ice besides the usual room tidy once a day.

 

I have since heard this can be the norm for small cruises (3 nights)

 

Some advice in red above. I would not have been happy with some of these things but you could have addressed them, in a way more likely to resolve it. You shouldn't assume you will have bad service on your upcoming cruise. I always assume I will have good service and on the rare occasion that I don't, I address it immediately. For example, we had a terrible waiter in Chops on the Oasis. Took way to long to get our drinks and then another delay before he took our order. By this time my husbands drink was empty and no refill in sight. We flagged down the head waiter who took over and made sure our needs were met! I hope you have a wonderful trip.

[Sitzmark]

Auto Tipping rant

 

Fwiw, to date, I have never had my prepaid tips removed.....and have always given extra tip$ to MDR waiter/asst waiter & room steward (except for 1 room steward for good reason), but, I do understand those who insist on tipping the old fashioned way and would like prepaid tips to be removed.

 

 

 

you do realize that removing the prepaid tips doesn't stop the daily tip from being added to your account, right? You seem to be using different terms interchangeably.

Edited February 20, 2016 by Sitzmark

[goodycruising]

Whoever said that was wrong and sounds entitled. And if its going to "make a difference to the atmosphere btw passengers and staff" then it proves that point.... They need a better attitude.

 

Why assume that removing tips means someone DOESNT want to tip? It could, sure, but it could also mean they want to have control and tip MORE than the standard. Wait till you are stiffed by a person and get mad at that person. Assuming guilt on someone that has already paid their fair share of the overhead to get on board is not a good attitude.

 

I am willing to bet that for every cheapskate that takes his tips off and doesnt tip- there are 10 people who make up for it by tipping above and beyond the prepaid gratuities and/or recommended tip levels.

 

Yep, they do need a better attitude. They are profiling us. They are doing themselves a disservice and wasting opportunities to earn money.

[orville99]

(not that I want to make this more controversial, just a procedure question)

 

Bob

Do you think it matters if the gratuities were pre-paid for the sake of pre-paying OR if they were pre-paid because of MTD?

 

(FWIW, I'm not planning on doing it, just curious if it matters)

 

It doesn't matter any more. About a year ago RCL removed the mandatory pre-pay for MTD, and we've removed the PPG on several MTD cruises since with no problem. We'd just as soon use OBC to pay the grats than pre-paying.

[Biker19]

It doesn't matter any more. About a year ago RCL removed the mandatory pre-pay for MTD......

 

.....for US bookings and perhaps some others, but in some markets RCI still asks folks to pre-pay grats.

[grandgeezer]

I was referring to RCI for the company tax and payroll tax although the crews' personal income tax would also apply. So like it or not you are helping them with dodging tax.

 

How exactly are they dodging taxes? The cruise line takes it in as income then takes it right back off as a deduction just like regular payroll. Because it is now documented income, the crew would have to claim all their tips except maybe extras given to them in cash.