Missed port - what is the OBC?

[itf]

6 minutes ago, KeithJenner said:

In that case, I don't think that I was going down a meaningless rabbit hole. I believe that the insurance companies terms are that they will pay up to £100, but they see the $15, even if it was return of port fees, as compensation, and I agree with them.

But if that's the case, it's impossible for any NCL cruiser (or any other line maybe?) to ever actually successfully claim on the insurance, right? Because all lines will refund you those taxes to your shipboard account.

So the product is useless - it can never be claimed. They have stated they will pay if I can provide

"Confirmation from the cruise company that the $15 per person credit was indeed a refund of port taxes, please note the letter from the cruise liner states that it is refund able onboard credit which we would consider a form of compensation."

I was not 100% confident that the $15 is just port taxes which is what I wanted to clarify here before chasing NCL for a letter.

 

 

Edited February 14, 2020 by itf

[nomad098]

42 minutes ago, itf said:

But if that's the case, it's impossible for any NCL cruiser (or any other line maybe?) to ever actually successfully claim on the insurance, right? Because all lines will refund you those taxes to your shipboard account.

So the product is useless - it can never be claimed. They have stated they will pay if I can provide

"Confirmation from the cruise company that the $15 per person credit was indeed a refund of port taxes, please note the letter from the cruise liner states that it is refund able onboard credit which we would consider a form of compensation."

I was not 100% confident that the $15 is just port taxes which is what I wanted to clarify here before chasing NCL for a letter.

 

 

 

Allianz are either clueless or deliberately trying to avoid paying a legitimate claim

 

Allinaz need to learn how cruiselines refund passengers.

 

The $15 port taxes is money paid by you and returned to you because of the missed stop in the form of refundable OBC. This means at the end of the cruise if this money was in your onboard account it would be paid back to you.

 

What you have published on here is quite clear for Diamond cover it is:

 

£100 per missed port multiplied by the number of people covered on the insurance up to a maximum of £1000 per person.

 

If the cruiseline or port had paid you any money on top of giving you your own money back then you would not have a claim.

 

You paid  NCL port fees, NCL paid the port it's fees. You did not stop at the port so they gave NCL the fees back, NCL in turn paid you the port fees back. In this case NCL are just middle men facilitating your payment of port fees. You did not stop at the port the money was returned at no point was you compensated by either NCL or the port.

 

Even NCL's own travel insurance would pay upto £300 per person for missed ports and itinerary changes.

 

I would explain this to Allianz.

If they still do not want to pay up I would make a formal complaint.

If they still will not honour you policy I would refer the matter to the Financial Ombudsman Service.

 

As long as what you have posted on here is accurate and true you will get paid your compensation.

 

Here is a link outlying the Allianz complaints procedure 

https://www.allianz.co.uk/about-allianz/help-and-contact/complaints.html#expectations

 

 

 

 

 

[April42749]

Can you read the contract?  Maybe it lists "what happens if a port is canceled" and what you get refunded.

I'd definitely go the "complaint route" on this one.......

Good luck

[zqvol]

2 hours ago, itf said:

 

No it's £100 per port *up to £1000* if we'd missed 10 ports. It isn't up to £100 per port, or there would be no reason to ever purchase the higher level of cover.

They've confirmed all this - the only argument we have is whether that $15 was a refund or compensation. If I can prove it's a refund of port tax, they pay. If I can't, they class it as "compensation" and don't.

 

You will never prove that it is a refund of port fees specific to that port. Port fees are much more complicated than cruisers imagine.

[zqvol]

2 hours ago, itf said:

But if that's the case, it's impossible for any NCL cruiser (or any other line maybe?) to ever actually successfully claim on the insurance, right? Because all lines will refund you those taxes to your shipboard account.

So the product is useless - it can never be claimed. They have stated they will pay if I can provide

"Confirmation from the cruise company that the $15 per person credit was indeed a refund of port taxes, please note the letter from the cruise liner states that it is refund able onboard credit which we would consider a form of compensation."

I was not 100% confident that the $15 is just port taxes which is what I wanted to clarify here before chasing NCL for a letter.

 

 

 

You do not automatically get port fees refunded if you miss a port. It all depends on the total port fees that the ship pays for the voyage. If they haven't collected enough you don't get a refund. I have been on  a number of NCL cruises where ports were missed and we got nothing, the last being last fall when we missed a port due to a "bomb cyclone".

[Cruiser_1977]

Wouldn't the cruise line have put a letter in your cabin or a notice in the daily about the refund? Something like this that you could send to the insurance company?

 

Edited February 14, 2020 by JennyB1977
ncl attachment

[nomad098]

47 minutes ago, nomad098 said:

"Confirmation from the cruise company that the $15 per person credit was indeed a refund of port taxes, please note the letter from the cruise liner states that it is refund able onboard credit which we would consider a form of compensation."

 

NCL stated and Allianz have accepted that the $15 is a refund for port taxes.

However Allianz seem to confused about how NCL refund port taxes 

If NCL had just stated that they had returned the port taxes to the customers method of payment we would not be having this thread

 

1 minute ago, zqvol said:

 

You do not automatically get port fees refunded if you miss a port. It all depends on the total port fees that the ship pays for the voyage. If they haven't collected enough you don't get a refund. I have been on  a number of NCL cruises where ports were missed and we got nothing, the last being last fall when we missed a port due to a "bomb cyclone".

 

This is true as port taxes are an estimate.

 

 

[sverigecruiser]

7 hours ago, itf said:

Well you're out the experience of visiting the port! I am specifically insured for £100 per person for each missed port. It was a feature of the cruise insurance.

If I'm covered for it - and paid the highest possible premium for that cover - then they should pay.

 

 

When you choosed to post this you gave people reasons to say that you may not get any money.

 

What you postad really say "Sum insured up to" so that can mean nothing.

 

I don't say that's what you should get, maybe you just made a mistake when you decided what information you should give us. 

[_Rick_]

5 hours ago, nomad098 said:

 

Allianz are either clueless or deliberately trying to avoid paying a legitimate claim

 

Allinaz need to learn how cruiselines refund passengers.

 

The $15 port taxes is money paid by you and returned to you because of the missed stop in the form of refundable OBC. This means at the end of the cruise if this money was in your onboard account it would be paid back to you.

 

What you have published on here is quite clear for Diamond cover it is:

 

£100 per missed port multiplied by the number of people covered on the insurance up to a maximum of £1000 per person.

 

If the cruiseline or port had paid you any money on top of giving you your own money back then you would not have a claim.

 

You paid  NCL port fees, NCL paid the port it's fees. You did not stop at the port so they gave NCL the fees back, NCL in turn paid you the port fees back. In this case NCL are just middle men facilitating your payment of port fees. You did not stop at the port the money was returned at no point was you compensated by either NCL or the port.

 

Even NCL's own travel insurance would pay upto £300 per person for missed ports and itinerary changes.

 

I would explain this to Allianz.

If they still do not want to pay up I would make a formal complaint.

If they still will not honour you policy I would refer the matter to the Financial Ombudsman Service.

 

As long as what you have posted on here is accurate and true you will get paid your compensation.

 

Here is a link outlying the Allianz complaints procedure 

https://www.allianz.co.uk/about-allianz/help-and-contact/complaints.html#expectations

 

 

 

 

 

 

EXACTLY this.

[itf]

19 hours ago, JennyB1977 said:

Wouldn't the cruise line have put a letter in your cabin or a notice in the daily about the refund? Something like this that you could send to the insurance company?

 

 

No - we got nothing and front desk didn't provide us anything when we asked onboard.

[esm54687]

On 2/14/2020 at 10:27 AM, KeithJenner said:

In that case, I don't think that I was going down a meaningless rabbit hole. I believe that the insurance companies terms are that they will pay up to £100, but they see the $15, even if it was return of port fees, as compensation, and I agree with them.

I think there is a disconnect here because you are essentially advocating that insurance companies can receive premiums, make false marketing claims, and then not pay the consumer..... 

 

ALL missed ports will receive refunds concerning prepaid taxes, port fees, etc....... so following your logic to label something prepaid as "compensation" then insurance claims will never be paid 

 

I believe the OP has an excellent complaint as the 15 is something prepaid and you cannot label your own money as compensation. 

 

You may want to reach out to a 3rd party to adcocate for you as I believe you are owed th 100 (that is unless your policy requires a port / itinerary change be made by the cruise line prior to departure) 

 

[KeithJenner]

3 minutes ago, esm54687 said:

I think there is a disconnect here because you are essentially advocating that insurance companies can receive premiums, make false marketing claims, and then not pay the consumer..... 

 

ALL missed ports will receive refunds concerning prepaid taxes, port fees, etc....... so following your logic to label something prepaid as "compensation" then insurance claims will never be paid 

 

I haven't been following this thread for a while, but I'll just clarify my point in reply to this, as I think that you are missing what I was saying. I am, of course, saying this having not seen the specific terms of this insurance policy, so may not be correct regarding this one.

 

To just pay out £100 for missing a port, would be basically giving you that money as compensation for missed enjoyment. That's great, and may be what this particular policy offers, but not necessarily.

 

There are certainly potential losses that could be incurred with a missed port, that may not be reimbursed automatically. For example, non refundable payments for third party excursions. Therefore, my logic certainly would allow claims to be paid.

 

Regardless to that, my real point is that it wasn't clear to me that the terms were saying that the payment was a fixed £100 per port or "up to" £100 per port.

 

As I say, it may not be relevant to this case (I gave up trying to work out exactly what the OP and their insurance company were saying to each other), but I can certainly see many instances where valid claims could be paid under my scenario. It all boils down to whether the policy is protecting against financial loss, or missed enjoyment.

[cruiser147147]

What department at NCL do you contact --email/and/or phone number --to get a statement that a port was missed due to weather conditions ?  It was a caribbean cruise booked in the US.  Thanks for any information you may be able to provide.

 

 

[esm54687]

On 2/14/2020 at 12:38 PM, zqvol said:

 

You will never prove that it is a refund of port fees specific to that port. Port fees are much more complicated than cruisers imagine.

I'm super intrigued by the fact you missed a port and didn't receive back the port charges you pre paid because NCL didn't collect enough.  Do you have a link to help uncomplicate it because I compare it to pre paying for the SDP but all Specialty Restaurants were closed for renovation and nothing was refunded. 

 

 

[AFS1970]

On 2/14/2020 at 8:46 AM, itf said:

2. Any claim where a monetary amount, including but not limited to on board credit or other compensation, has been offered to you by the ship or tour operator.

 

I am jumping into this late, but I think this is the section the Insurance company is hanging it's hat on. The problem is the refund is a "monetary amount" even though I think most here agree that it was a refund and not compensation. The problem here is the wording. Refunds are not exclusive but are included in the list of monetary amounts.

 

That being said, I would think the terms and conditions would back up your claim, because that should list what you will and will not be refunded or compensated in this case.

[itf]

Well, just to update this, Norwegian confirmed that the $15 refund was indeed port taxes, I forwarded it to the insurer and today I got confirmation that I'll receive the full £300 (£100 each x 3 people). Just to give anyone who cared closure!

Edited March 8, 2020 by itf

[esm54687]

1 hour ago, itf said:

Well, just to update this, Norwegian confirmed that the $15 refund was indeed port taxes, I forwarded it to the insurer and today I got confirmation that I'll receive the full £300 (£100 each x 3 people). Just to give anyone who cared closure!

Thanks for the update and good for your persistance..... 

Edited March 8, 2020 by esm54687

[cruiser147147]

itf --  THANKS for taking the time to update us.

 

Could you please post the name of the NCL department you dealt with.

[hamrag]

On 2/14/2020 at 3:09 PM, KeithJenner said:

 

 

On 2/14/2020 at 3:27 PM, KeithJenner said:

 

Late edit: post deleted, I thought this was a current thread and my post was based in post #13

 

Edited March 8, 2020 by hamrag

[itf]

10 hours ago, cruiser147147 said:

itf --  THANKS for taking the time to update us.

 

Could you please post the name of the NCL department you dealt with.

 

Just the generic customer services email - they were perfectly good about it and responded in ~48 hours each time providing me the documents I needed for insurer.

[cruiser147147]

Just now, itf said:

 

Just the generic customer services email - they were perfectly good about it and responded in ~48 hours each time providing me the documents I needed for insurer.

 

Thanks for the reply

[joteacher]

We missed Bonaire on our cruise last week and got a whopping $4.00/person!!!

~Joanne