Off the Chain while Price-Checking!

[CruisingNole]

Prices for 3 nights out of PC are absurd. $750+ for interior GTY in 2023. Not worth  it IMO but apparently it is to some. 🤷‍♀️

[neverlaysup]

On 12/30/2022 at 2:09 PM, orville99 said:

We always book as soon as the itineraries become available, and book cruises for as far out as the itineraries will allow (we are currently fully booked through April 2025). Other than a rare price drop on a specific cruise, every cruise we have booked in the last five years has gone up in price (some substantially) after we booked. It is simple supply and demand. If demand exceeds supply, prices rise, and with ships now sailing at 100%+ capacity, we don't expect prices to go anywhere but up for the foreseeable future.

We are just the opposite, we tend to book last minute deals within 60 days of sailings. I have never once felt that I overpaid or got price gouged on a cruise. Typically, we get some screaming deals last minute and with "Royal Up" bidding, we normally find ourselves in a much better cabin for a nominal fee. 

[neverlaysup]

2 hours ago, CruisingNole said:

Prices for 3 nights out of PC are absurd. $750+ for interior GTY in 2023. Not worth  it IMO but apparently it is to some. 🤷‍♀️

For that much money on RCCL, it should include drinks and tips at a minimum.

[firefly333]

1 hour ago, neverlaysup said:

We are just the opposite, we tend to book last minute deals within 60 days of sailings. I have never once felt that I overpaid or got price gouged on a cruise. Typically, we get some screaming deals last minute and with "Royal Up" bidding, we normally find ourselves in a much better cabin for a nominal fee. 

If only going going gone sale wasnt gty and solo cant book I'd agree with you. I see a great price and then put 1 pax and the rate zooms. 

[twangster]

7 hours ago, CruisingNole said:

Prices for 3 nights out of PC are absurd. $750+ for interior GTY in 2023. Not worth  it IMO but apparently it is to some. 🤷‍♀️

 

That is exactly why I've been booking MSC out of PCN.

 

I was close to booking a 3 nighter in January for a traditionally low fare period when overnight the interior went from just over $400 to $650 and eventually to over $700.  Those are normally July peak prices.  

 

I think it's great that Royal is experiencing such high demand that they can fetch summer peak rates during what has historically been the annual off peak or slow season.  

 

Any discussion of pricing inevitably involves understanding what the cruise market in general is doing so that entails reviewing the competition.  Has the entire short Florida cruise market become so much popular or is it limited to one cruise line for example. 

 

So when I discovered rates around $346 solo with drinks and 2 device basic wifi on MSC for several weekends in 2023 naturally I booked some.  It seems the entire short FL cruise industry has not all doubled or tripled in price.  Looking a few months into the future this includes Seaside and Seashore some of their newer ships so it's interesting to see how the competition is approaching the short FL cruise market since Royal brought all of their recently amped ships into the short FL market.  All Freedom class for example and some Voyager class amped ships vs. newer ships from MSC.

 

Royal seems to be taking the approach that having brought newly updated older hardware and establishing that as the baseline for the short FL market they now own the market so they can now set the rates and so a competitor has responded by applying their newer and larger ships while maintaining the normal price trends for this short FL market.

 

Despite the would be internet police on this board who would seek to banish the mention of other cruise lines you can't discuss pricing trends without involving other cruise lines.  

[firefly333]

2 hours ago, twangster said:

 

That is exactly why I've been booking MSC out of PCN.

 

I was close to booking a 3 nighter in January for a traditionally low fare period when overnight the interior went from just over $400 to $650 and eventually to over $700.  Those are normally July peak prices.  

 

I think it's great that Royal is experiencing such high demand that they can fetch summer peak rates during what has historically been the annual off peak or slow season.  

 

Any discussion of pricing inevitably involves understanding what the cruise market in general is doing so that entails reviewing the competition.  Has the entire short Florida cruise market become so much popular or is it limited to one cruise line for example. 

 

So when I discovered rates around $346 solo with drinks and 2 device basic wifi on MSC for several weekends in 2023 naturally I booked some.  It seems the entire short FL cruise industry has not all doubled or tripled in price.  Looking a few months into the future this includes Seaside and Seashore some of their newer ships so it's interesting to see how the competition is approaching the short FL cruise market since Royal brought all of their recently amped ships into the short FL market.  All Freedom class for example and some Voyager class amped ships vs. newer ships from MSC.

 

Royal seems to be taking the approach that having brought newly updated older hardware and establishing that as the baseline for the short FL market they now own the market so they can now set the rates and so a competitor has responded by applying their newer and larger ships while maintaining the normal price trends for this short FL market.

 

Despite the would be internet police on this board who would seek to banish the mention of other cruise lines you can't discuss pricing trends without involving other cruise lines.  

Rcl came out with dec 2024 on harmony more than $200 more than what you can book dec 2023 for same weeks before xmas. I took it because friends booked who fly out from calif. Used to be when rates  first came out they were lower than closer in. I guess we are adding to the problem by booking but the week before xmas is when they like to be home for xmas. 

 

Inside dec 2023 $460 vs dec 2024 $580 pp

 

Balcony dec 2023 $602 vs dec 2024 $723 pp

 

X 2 since I'm solo. It came out higher than what they themselves offer the previous year. 

 

Just seems odd to be higher than the year before, same ship, same iternary.  MSC is building a new terminal in Galveston and might give them some competition. 

 

 

[AtSeaAlways]

On 12/30/2022 at 2:10 PM, jencruzin said:

Our upcoming cruise next year was $5645.42.

 

Now, the same cruise is....$7050.42.

 

That's a $1405 price hike.

 

 

I think we can credit RCI with idea of a "Cruise Vacation" - where you put more and more features and services on the ship (and private islands) and customers are willing to pay extra for those.  The product is less of a cruise and more of a vacation.  And the whole newer and bigger ships thing.   I was digging in some old issues of Cruise Travel Magazine  -prices for basic cruises have not gone up much (counting inflation) since -pick a date- 1997.   You can today get a shorter trip on RCI out of San Pedro for $65 a day.  But the idea of a full on "Cruise Vacation" was not really a thing back then - and a full package in 2023 on a shiny new ship is a whole new price point.  If cruising is a competitive market, (multiple suppliers, similar products), and they fill the ships - I'm not sure you can call it gouging.  It is what customers are demanding.  It is like pickup trucks - I last bought a very basic full sized pickup truck for $24,000- now a proper pickup truck is maybe $50,000 or more.  

[AtSeaAlways]

8 hours ago, neverlaysup said:

We are just the opposite, we tend to book last minute deals within 60 days of sailings. I have never once felt that I overpaid or got price gouged on a cruise. Typically, we get some screaming deals last minute and with "Royal Up" bidding, we normally find ourselves in a much better cabin for a nominal fee. 

The same here.  Any cabin any sailing.  Three meals a day, sea air- I'm good.   We are slightly better for the line financially than an empty cabin- but we do pay into the tip pool 🙂

[sgmn]

On 12/31/2022 at 1:47 PM, orville99 said:

Bottom line is this is an RCL board. I can't do anything about those who co opt a discussion to tout their other cruise line preferences. I couldn't care less what pricing schemes are on other lines. But interlope away if that's what floats your boat.🤪

Though Royal Caribbean is our main cruise company that we use, I'm interested in people's experiences on other lines. 

[orville99]

59 minutes ago, sgmn said:

Though Royal Caribbean is our main cruise company that we use, I'm interested in people's experiences on other lines. 

Just a guess, but that probably is why all of the other cruise lines have their own Cruise Critic Forums😉

[orville99]

1 hour ago, firefly333 said:

Inside dec 2023 $460 vs dec 2024 $580 pp

 

Balcony dec 2023 $602 vs dec 2024 $723 pp

 

X 2 since I'm solo. It came out higher than what they themselves offer the previous year. 

 

Just seems odd to be higher than the year before, same ship, same iternary. 

Comes out to a 12.6% increase in both cases. Historically (we've only been sailing RCL since 2010 so YMMV) YOY increases have averaged about 8-10%. With the cost of borrowing (prime rate) expected to be in the mid 5% range in 2023, and inflation not expected to be back to the 2% target for several years, this 2-4% price bump over historical averages actually seems to be quite restrained.

[firefly333]

5 minutes ago, orville99 said:

Comes out to a 12.6% increase in both cases. Historically (we've only been sailing RCL since 2010 so YMMV) YOY increases have averaged about 8-10%. With the cost of borrowing (prime rate) expected to be in the mid 5% range in 2023, and inflation not expected to be back to the 2% target for several years, this 2-4% price bump over historical averages actually seems to be quite restrained.

Further out should be cheaper to me. ..when it first comes out. Not restrained to me.

 

Everyone says book early.

[orville99]

22 minutes ago, firefly333 said:

Further out should be cheaper to me. ..when it first comes out. Not restrained to me.

 

Everyone says book early.

Every company makes adjustments to its pricing based on how it believes inflation will impact its cost of capital and cost of goods sold, so these levels of YOY increase are not surprising. With no baseline to know what the 2023 cruise you referenced was priced at when the itineraries were first released back in 2021 it is difficult to determine whether the price you quoted was an increase, decrease, or equal to the day 1 price.

 

 

[firefly333]

15 minutes ago, orville99 said:

Every company makes adjustments to its pricing based on how it believes inflation will impact its cost of capital and cost of goods sold, so these levels of YOY increase are not surprising. With no baseline to know what the 2023 cruise you referenced was priced at when the itineraries were first released back in 2021 it is difficult to determine whether the price you quoted was an increase, decrease, or equal to the day 1 price.

 

 

It's very close to what it came out at. And I grabbed oct 12 on harmony for 8 days and was surprised to see dec was higher for 7 days. I did pay more for allure dec 2021 but not apples to apples, did a higher category. Harmony is doing 6/8 once a month thru nov 2024, then it stopped, and then a few days later finally released dec 2024 .. higher. I've booked as soon as they came out all 3 years. I booked 3 dates in nov and dec 2023 and think that's too much but vs 2024 a good deal and I'm a sucker for deals. 

 

Not much change since they came out. Dec 2023 and dec 2024. My friends always want the same week so I track that week only. We book as soon as our TA can. You can see starting inside and balcony prices below. My 8 day oct 2024 only about $20 less but 1 more day. So yes I was surprised when dec came out and took a decided jump. Some of us just want to cruise then. 

 

[orville99]

1 hour ago, firefly333 said:

It's very close to what it came out at.

One significant thing that has to be factored into any pricing differences that we all are seeing is the stark reality that when the Fall/Winter 2023 sailings were released in December 2021, the cruise line was just starting to get its fleet sailing again, people in most of the world were still locked down or limited to travel within their own countries, people who were in country were very afraid of being around anyone, let alone being on a ship with a few thousand strangers, and the cruise lines had not generated any revenue in more than 17 months, but were consuming large amounts of overhead costs.

 

The reality is that any decisions that happened during that period are the classical definition of an anomaly. Trying to compare what any company was doing to maximize their ability to survive to what they would do once there was a light at the end of the tunnel that was not yet another oncoming freight train is folly. 2021-2022 was more of a "get passengers on board our ships no matter what it costs us in the short term" survival of the fittest strategy than a rational stable market pricing model.

[Blauelini]

Apparently some of you do not listen in to Royal Caribbean Group earnings calls. CEO Jason Liberty, in the Q3 earnings call, stated in part, “demand for our experiences was very strong, and we achieved 96% load factors overall with the Caribbean at close to 105% at record pricing and high satisfaction scores”.
 

Further stated, “The value proposition of cruise remains incredibly attractive, I would say too attractive…..we received twice as many bookings for 2023 sailings in Q3, as we did in Q2, resulting in considerably higher booking volumes than during the same period for 2019 sailings…..as a result, all four quarters of 2023 are booked well within historical ranges at record prices, with bookings accelerating every week."

 

So, fully expect prices to climb regardless of inflation ir anything else well into 2023 and 2024 at least. At some point prices will cause demand softening and if continued, demand destruction. We are definitely not at these points.

[CruisingNole]

1 hour ago, Blauelini said:

Apparently some of you do not listen in to Royal Caribbean Group earnings calls.

Because that’s totally something the average consumer does with their free time. 🙄

[ONECRUISER]

2 hours ago, orville99 said:

One significant thing that has to be factored into any pricing differences that we all are seeing is the stark reality that when the Fall/Winter 2023 sailings were released in December 2021, the cruise line was just starting to get its fleet sailing again, people in most of the world were still locked down or limited to travel within their own countries, people who were in country were very afraid of being around anyone, let alone being on a ship with a few thousand strangers, and the cruise lines had not generated any revenue in more than 17 months, but were consuming large amounts of overhead costs.

 

The reality is that any decisions that happened during that period are the classical definition of an anomaly. Trying to compare what any company was doing to maximize their ability to survive to what they would do once there was a light at the end of the tunnel that was not yet another oncoming freight train is folly. 2021-2022 was more of a "get passengers on board our ships no matter what it costs us in the short term" survival of the fittest strategy than a rational stable market pricing model.

Agree well said, I'd be surprised if prices were not Higher next yr. Inflation and when last yrs were released were in middle of CV spike, highest yet here and Ships were either shutdown of partially filled

[pcur]

I checked all my booked cruise prices yesterday, and every one was higher, with one being 78% higher for my solo rate. However, after totally humiliating themselves and getting into trouble with the Feds, Southwest Airlines is quietly lowering prices.  I checked all my booked flights today and ended up with a $165 credit.

[sgmn]

20 hours ago, orville99 said:

Just a guess, but that probably is why all of the other cruise lines have their own Cruise Critic Forums😉

Yeah, I'm aware. Soooo if something seems interesting I may pop over to other forums and check it out. 

Several people who post regularly on this RC board have posted reports of their experiences on other lines they have tried. I for one find it interesting and judging by responses so do others. It's one way of shining a light on the differences, good or bad, between Royal Caribbean and other lines

[Engineroom Snipe]

I have booked three RCI cruises this year. One was a 9-day cruise in November 2023 with different start and stop ports. I liked the itinerary and wanted a very specific spacious balcony for an anniversary. The cruise was booked in September 2022 onboard. $2,010 with a$100 balcony OBC. Transferred to TA and got another $50 OBC booking credit. I keep checking websites every day and found a three-day window to attain another $200 off for military discount in November 2022.  The original $2,010 price is effectively $1660. I need to add gratuities and flights but will avoid parking fees.

 

As I see cabins in my class disappear, the asking price is now (January 2023) $2,400 and I do not see it going down (always a hope that I can get an adjustment if it does).

 

This cabin and cruise would be considered "off-season" and not family friendly which should decrease demand. I am traveling in possibly bad weather (November in the Caribbean), not a family friendly schedule (older children in school during both weeks of the cruise), not work vacation friendly (not a weekend-to-weekend, requiring vacation work scheduling over multiple weekends), and not travel friendly (final port will require one-way airfare ticket home). All that said, I did not think the prices would be going up at eleven months out on such an "unfriendly" cruise.

 

Demand is definitely high for the cruise to be at the current price 11 months out. 

[Vibe]

On 1/2/2023 at 11:15 AM, orville99 said:

Just a guess, but that probably is why all of the other cruise lines have their own Cruise Critic Forums😉

Yeah there are other cruise line forums but it is informative to hear comparisons about them from cruisers whom mainly cruise with Royal Caribbean.  

[orville99]

While we were on Jewel in December we booked a B3B in a GS on Adventure for July 2024 the day that the new itineraries opened up (12/15). We even surprised the Next Cruise person who had not received a heads up from shoreside that the itineraries were open.

 

I just went out and mock bookings on those three cruises to see whether the prices had changed in the last two weeks since we booked. All prices include insurance:

 

First leg (8-night) - 12/15 - $3,584    1/3 - $7,030

Second leg (6-night) - 12/15 - $3,275   1/3 - $5,853

Third leg (8-night) - 12/15 - $3,642    1/3 - $6,884

 

At some point between now and those sail dates, it is reasonable to presume that there will be a "sale" on GS, and the prices will come down. Someone looking at those sail dates during that "sale" may see the prices significantly lower than the last time they looked (maybe even $1,000 less), and think they are getting a great deal. The reality is that all cruise lines "mark em up so they can mark em down". In more than 12 years sailing on RCL, and 10 years sailing on other lines before we switched, I can count on one hand (and have fingers left over) the number of times that any of our cruises cost less than they did if we booked opening day.

 

Pays to book early😇😉

[firefly333]

36 minutes ago, orville99 said:

While we were on Jewel in December we booked a B3B in a GS on Adventure for July 2024 the day that the new itineraries opened up (12/15). We even surprised the Next Cruise person who had not received a heads up from shoreside that the itineraries were open.

 

I just went out and mock bookings on those three cruises to see whether the prices had changed in the last two weeks since we booked. All prices include insurance:

 

First leg (8-night) - 12/15 - $3,584    1/3 - $7,030

Second leg (6-night) - 12/15 - $3,275   1/3 - $5,853

Third leg (8-night) - 12/15 - $3,642    1/3 - $6,884

 

At some point between now and those sail dates, it is reasonable to presume that there will be a "sale" on GS, and the prices will come down. Someone looking at those sail dates during that "sale" may see the prices significantly lower than the last time they looked (maybe even $1,000 less), and think they are getting a great deal. The reality is that all cruise lines "mark em up so they can mark em down". In more than 12 years sailing on RCL, and 10 years sailing on other lines before we switched, I can count on one hand (and have fingers left over) the number of times that any of our cruises cost less than they did if we booked opening day.

 

Pays to book early😇😉

I too looked the day they came out and booked as soon as my TA got the rates. Rates up with 30% or the same with the 550 off sale. But were already high imo for 2024.

 

I have seen some deals close in, so sometimes it pays to check close in. Ncl drops their extras and will be less. I posted a allure deal a couple of weeks ago and seeing deals in January. Princess bringing in a ship just for jan and rcl will have a 3rd ship in Galveston for a few months imo why close in prices are on sale. Princess had 20% solo supplement. If he can I just told my ta to rebook a cruise I cancelled and moved to march lol .. and cancelled my hotel room. Now it's on sale. Rcl wouldnt have 3 ships competing after this, was just because a ship didnt go down under and got delayed. 

[CruisingNole]

On 1/2/2023 at 7:11 AM, twangster said:

 

That is exactly why I've been booking MSC out of PCN.

 

I was close to booking a 3 nighter in January for a traditionally low fare period when overnight the interior went from just over $400 to $650 and eventually to over $700.  Those are normally July peak prices.  

 

I think it's great that Royal is experiencing such high demand that they can fetch summer peak rates during what has historically been the annual off peak or slow season.  

 

Any discussion of pricing inevitably involves understanding what the cruise market in general is doing so that entails reviewing the competition.  Has the entire short Florida cruise market become so much popular or is it limited to one cruise line for example. 

 

So when I discovered rates around $346 solo with drinks and 2 device basic wifi on MSC for several weekends in 2023 naturally I booked some.  It seems the entire short FL cruise industry has not all doubled or tripled in price.  Looking a few months into the future this includes Seaside and Seashore some of their newer ships so it's interesting to see how the competition is approaching the short FL cruise market since Royal brought all of their recently amped ships into the short FL market.  All Freedom class for example and some Voyager class amped ships vs. newer ships from MSC.

 

Royal seems to be taking the approach that having brought newly updated older hardware and establishing that as the baseline for the short FL market they now own the market so they can now set the rates and so a competitor has responded by applying their newer and larger ships while maintaining the normal price trends for this short FL market.

 

Despite the would be internet police on this board who would seek to banish the mention of other cruise lines you can't discuss pricing trends without involving other cruise lines.  

I’m taking a break from Royal and giving MSC a shot in February or March. I live near PC and those 3-night itineraries have always been a nice quick and cheap getaway. At the moment, the cheapest interior cabin on Independence for a 3-night in February/March is $861 with most weekends at $1,000+. I’m shocked people are willing to pay that. I guess inflation isn’t hurting people’s wallets as some like to portray.