Cancellation of cruise in the Middle East

[GeezerCouple]

4 hours ago, 1 EastEnder said:

...

Disputed Oceania charges on my credit card has held that card up until the dispute is settled; up to ninety days.  I have automatic charges coming out of that card.  I have an 824 credit rating and I’m having to call vendors and explain the problem if their automatic charges are denied.
...

Very sorry about how this has affected everyone, including those with more difficult situations, etc.

 

But about your credit card being "held up"... are you sure?

I take it you are still in the UK, so it may be different there, or perhaps it's one type of card/issuer vs. another, but we've *never* had any interruption in ability to charge while a dispute was being "investigated".

However, we've only once had a "high value" dispute, and that was with a debit card (NEVER AGAIN! 😱) and at least that didn't take too long.

 

In case it's any help for the future (not that this nonsense should be recurring!), Amex tends to be incredibly helpful with any disputes.  The disputed amount is sort of "returned", until there is a resolution, so no worries about interest either, if it takes time.  And they've never sided with the seller or given us grief, which is also nice.

 

I hope you find something else for pleasant you and your daughter to do.

Hope all continues to go well.

 

GC

[MMarianne]

We are having the same issue and are so upset! Our 50th wedding anniversary celebration - BOO! We typically go with Viking and love their cruises and outstanding customer service. Did an Atlantic crossing recently with Oceania and were completely underwhelmed. We only booked this trip because of the original itinerary.
I called Oceania on Oct 23 and was offered an FCC if we cancelled. Told I could call back whenever we were ready; just needed to book next cruise by Nov 30. We made our decision to cancel based upon safety concerns, the revised itinerary of places we’ve been, and nine days at sea.  I called back and was told NO. “Upper management” decided they would not give any more credit! The rep wouldn’t give me anyone else to talk to. I wrote to the “resolutions” email the rep finally gave me, the Exec for Passenger Relations, and the Exec for Guest Relations. No one has responded. Filed a complaint w BBB who just forwarded me Oceania’s statement about their rude, unprofessional decision. They said the FCC was “open-ended” and then also said it was “first come, first served.” How can it be both? 
Now to hear the people in the USA Today article were taken care of plus people with a TA? I booked straight through Oceania because I’ve had problems in past w TA’s. 
I wrote to Elliot Advocacy who sent me the “no credit” responses other passengers have been getting and said he might write an article. But that doesn’t help me, unfortunately. I just wrote to another advocate someone posted here.
ANY OTHER IDEAS? 
Back to Viking once this $$$$$ fiasco is over. 

[Elless100]

10 hours ago, MarianneBD said:

We are having the same issue and are so upset! Our 50th wedding anniversary celebration - BOO! We typically go with Viking and love their cruises and outstanding customer service. Did an Atlantic crossing recently with Oceania and were completely underwhelmed. We only booked this trip because of the original itinerary.
I called Oceania on Oct 23 and was offered an FCC if we cancelled. Told I could call back whenever we were ready; just needed to book next cruise by Nov 30. We made our decision to cancel based upon safety concerns, the revised itinerary of places we’ve been, and nine days at sea.  I called back and was told NO. “Upper management” decided they would not give any more credit! The rep wouldn’t give me anyone else to talk to. I wrote to the “resolutions” email the rep finally gave me, the Exec for Passenger Relations, and the Exec for Guest Relations. No one has responded. Filed a complaint w BBB who just forwarded me Oceania’s statement about their rude, unprofessional decision. They said the FCC was “open-ended” and then also said it was “first come, first served.” How can it be both? 
Now to hear the people in the USA Today article were taken care of plus people with a TA? I booked straight through Oceania because I’ve had problems in past w TA’s. 
I wrote to Elliot Advocacy who sent me the “no credit” responses other passengers have been getting and said he might write an article. But that doesn’t help me, unfortunately. I just wrote to another advocate someone posted here.
ANY OTHER IDEAS? 
Back to Viking once this $$$$$ fiasco is over. 

The exact same thing happened with me, and I have gotten the same responses, or none at all. I also wrote to those same companies with no positive response. To make matters worse the letter I got back from Oceania reminded me I was in full penalty ! So rude. No level of customer  service!  Yesterday more missiles shot from Yemen ! Good luck to ships in the region.   I won’t ever book Oceania. Plenty of other ships out there when I am ready !

[mybagsarepacked]

21 hours ago, Elless100 said:

The exact same thing happened with me, and I have gotten the same responses, or none at all. I also wrote to those same companies with no positive response. To make matters worse the letter I got back from Oceania reminded me I was in full penalty ! So rude. No level of customer  service!  Yesterday more missiles shot from Yemen ! Good luck to ships in the region.   I won’t ever book Oceania. Plenty of other ships out there when I am ready !

After much back n forth with O as well as our TA, we are done with Oceania. We have decided to go on this one but I have cancelled our two future cruises with them, and also got a new TA. Her attitude over this has ruined our faith in her. 
 

I think the ripple effect of this for Oceania will be significant. We spend (or i should say we did spend) $100,000 a year with them - and so do many others of you. We have decided we would rather invest our travel budget with a company that actually cares about its clients.

[roninman]

Interesting the way some lines have responded.   According to multiple posters over in the Africa & Middle East  board, Celebrity passengers wishing to cancel received 100% of their deposit back from Near East cancellations.  Whereas self-proclaimed luxury lines that boast about how much they care about and pamper cruisers, such as Oceania and RSS, have a much different approach.

 

 

[Elless100]

3 hours ago, mybagsarepacked said:

After much back n forth with O as well as our TA, we are done with Oceania. We have decided to go on this one but I have cancelled our two future cruises with them, and also got a new TA. Her attitude over this has ruined our faith in her. 
 

I think the ripple effect of this for Oceania will be significant. We spend (or i should say we did spend) $100,000 a year with them - and so do many others of you. We have decided we would rather invest our travel budget with a company that actually cares about its clients.

 I am sure you will hear a lot of talk about this on the cruise 

by the way. We have done the around South America. Cruise on Holland America. It was wonderful.  !!  Enjoy it all !!

[susiesan]

7 hours ago, mybagsarepacked said:

After much back n forth with O as well as our TA, we are done with Oceania. We have decided to go on this one but I have cancelled our two future cruises with them, and also got a new TA. Her attitude over this has ruined our faith in her. 
 

I think the ripple effect of this for Oceania will be significant. We spend (or i should say we did spend) $100,000 a year with them - and so do many others of you. We have decided we would rather invest our travel budget with a company that actually cares about its clients.

Take a look at Azamara, very similar experience as Oceania. Also check out Windstar. I'm not a luxury line cruiser and was able to take 6 Oceania cruises since 2008 because of being able to book a cruise only cabin, outside, as those prices were very reasonable to be able to afford the Oceania cruises. With SM, that is not the case anymore. Although I am not impacted by O's policies regarding these ME cruises I have been reading all the comments for future reference. I am also likely done with Oceania. I might trust them again for a Caribbean cruise if the price was right, but not  an overseas cruise.

[PhD-iva]

6 hours ago, roninman said:

Interesting the way some lines have responded.   According to multiple posters over in the Africa & Middle East  board, Celebrity passengers wishing to cancel received 100% of their deposit back from Near East cancellations. 

A bit disingenuous. Anyone who has only paid a deposit is not past final payment date which is 6 to 8 weeks or more before the cruise.
This is an apples to Oranges comparison.

[roninman]

2 hours ago, PhD-iva said:

A bit disingenuous. Anyone who has only paid a deposit is not past final payment date which is 6 to 8 weeks or more before the cruise.
This is an apples to Oranges comparison.

I'm absolutely no expert for sure, but I haven't come across any cruise lines that offer 100% refund of deposit when pax cancelled- they usually keep some portion- so this was indeed nice of Celebrity.    Will luxury lines Oceania or RSS grant 100% refund of deposits on their highly changed Holy Land itineraries next spring?  No, per my travel agent.   Hence my post.

 

Beyond that, I clearly said it was refund of deposit, and even that according to people who posted and not on my own authority, so I don't believe I was being disingenuous at all.
 

Whether Celebrity offers 100% refund on full payment- we won't know either way until it is reported.

 

 

Edited November 10, 2023 by roninman

[Vallesan]

1 minute ago, roninman said:

I'm absolutely no expert for sure, but I haven't come across any cruise lines that offer 100% refund of deposit when pax cancelled- they usually keep some portion- so this was indeed nice of Celebrity.    Will luxury lines Oceania or RSS grant 100% refund of deposits on their highly changed Holy Land itineraries next spring?  No, per my travel agent.   

 

Beyond that, I clearly said it was refund of deposit, and even that according to people who posted and not on my own authority, so I don't believe I was being disingenuous at all.
 

Whether Celebrity offers 100% refund on full payment- we won't know either way until it is reported.

 

 

 
Oceania offer full refunds up to 181 days before sailing. After that there is scale of increasing forfeits. I think any bookings  from October 1st have an automatic $150 per person penalty for cancellation.

[roninman]

7 minutes ago, Vallesan said:

 
Oceania offer full refunds up to 181 days before sailing. After that there is scale of increasing forfeits. I think any bookings  from October 1st have an automatic $150 per person penalty for cancellation.

Thanks for that clarification!   🙂

 

The cited Celebrity cruise embarks March 4 as I recall, so within 180 days from today.

 

[Vallesan]

3 minutes ago, roninman said:

Thanks for that clarification!   🙂

 

The cited Celebrity cruise embarks March 4 as I recall, so within 180 days from today.

 

I have no idea about Celebrity terms and conditions!

[cruiserchuck]

1 minute ago, roninman said:

Thanks for that clarification!   🙂

 

The cited Celebrity cruise embarks March 4 as I recall, so within 180 days from today.

 

Celebrity offers fully refundable fares if you cancel more than 90 days before the cruise.  They also offer lower fares with nonrefundable deposits.

[oskidunker]

1 hour ago, cruiserchuck said:

Celebrity offers fully refundable fares if you cancel more than 90 days before the cruise.  They also offer lower fares with nonrefundable deposits.

Celebrity used to have a great Buffett. Friends that went recently said half was closed and limited. I don't like  their class system. The one cruise We took  was ok, although food choices in blue were limited not always to my liking  I found myself ordering from the main dining room menu. .after reading about all their cuts I doubt we try them again 

[Hlitner]

While I understand that different folks have differing opinions, everyone should take notice of the situation with these Middle Eastern cruises.   From the cruise line's point of view (and this is not just about O) when you have booked and paid for a cruise you are only entitled to X number of days on a ship. The itinerary the cruise ship provides does not need to be anything close to what you booked.  You could book an Alaskan cruise and the cruise line could send you to the Caribbean.  According to the cruise line's "terms and conditions" they have the right to send you anywhere on earth and you have no rights.  

 

While some of us think the cruise lines should act in a reasonable manner, they can do as O is doing and basically give the finger to their customers and completely change their cruise without offering any other recourse.  And even if you later decided to sue (or get involved in a class action) the cruise line will simply argue that they are in compliance with their terms and conditions (and other language in the passenger contract).  Because of the lack of government regulation of the cruise industry (in terms of protecting consumers) we (cruisers) are often at the mercy of the cruise line to do the right thing.  

 

Hank

[Harry Lake]

28 minutes ago, Hlitner said:

According to the cruise line's "terms and conditions" they have the right to send you anywhere on earth and you have no rights.  

Yep. And we have the right to either not cruise at all, look for a line that doesn't operate like this or to put ourselves at their mercy. I won't be choosing the last one. And am considering the one cruise (with O) that we do have booked. We're not 'hooked' on cruising. Plenty of other ways to see the world. And @Hlitnerthanks; good presentation. This has been an interesting few days.

[Elless100]

1 hour ago, Hlitner said:

While I understand that different folks have differing opinions, everyone should take notice of the situation with these Middle Eastern cruises.   From the cruise line's point of view (and this is not just about O) when you have booked and paid for a cruise you are only entitled to X number of days on a ship. The itinerary the cruise ship provides does not need to be anything close to what you booked.  You could book an Alaskan cruise and the cruise line could send you to the Caribbean.  According to the cruise line's "terms and conditions" they have the right to send you anywhere on earth and you have no rights.  

 

While some of us think the cruise lines should act in a reasonable manner, they can do as O is doing and basically give the finger to their customers and completely change their cruise without offering any other recourse.  And even if you later decided to sue (or get involved in a class action) the cruise line will simply argue that they are in compliance with their terms and conditions (and other language in the passenger contract).  Because of the lack of government regulation of the cruise industry (in terms of protecting consumers) we (cruisers) are often at the mercy of the cruise line to do the right thing.  

 

Hank

For many of us the bigger issue is that we were offered a full cruise credit with listed terms, and in 24 hours when you call back to take advantage, they basically say sorry we changed our minds, even though there was 5 weeks until offer had to be exercised.  Its  just not a good look for an industry that bases itself on high customer service. 

[Hlitner]

8 minutes ago, Elless100 said:

For many of us the bigger issue is that we were offered a full cruise credit with listed terms, and in 24 hours when you call back to take advantage, they basically say sorry we changed our minds, even though there was 5 weeks until offer had to be exercised.  Its  just not a good look for an industry that bases itself on high customer service. 

Absolutely agree with you.  But do not blame the industry as this is all about NCLH and O.  I have been watching this thread to see if the usual, O fans, would come to the defense of O.

 

Hank

 

[Harry Lake]

2 hours ago, Hlitner said:

we (cruisers) are often at the mercy of the cruise line to do the right thing.  

On the second line of my "Guest Statement"  underneath "balance due" is the language

"By using your credit card to make a payment you are agreeing to the terms and conditions and this shall constitute your written acknowledgment thereof."

[roninman]

10 hours ago, Harry Lake said:

On the second line of my "Guest Statement"  underneath "balance due" is the language

"By using your credit card to make a payment you are agreeing to the terms and conditions and this shall constitute your written acknowledgment thereof."

 

Sounds like they are well aware of and are attempting to come up with language to circumvent a credit card chargeback to confront the customer with.   But the congressional laws and credit card company by-laws that actually govern credit card transactions simply say if a good or service is not as agreed upon, you may dispute.    It doesn't go beyond that; I don't think a dispute will adjudicate a corporation/consumer contract- simply, did you get the purchased service as advertised, or not.

 

If you indeed did not receive the goods or service, and can win such a dispute, and get the disputed amount back, of course the corporation can still later sue you (pursue arbitration against you?) for the balance back again, citing their contract.  

 

Note that I've never been in this situation, nor have ever tried it, nor have heard the results of anyone pursuing such a course, nor am a lawyer, but a consumer's relationship with his credit card issuer is different from his relationship with a cruise company.

Edited November 11, 2023 by roninman

[MMarianne]

I would definitely try this “chargeback” route but I’m afraid it wouldn’t get adjudicated before the cruise date. At this point we are planning to reluctantly go on the cruise and not just donate our money to Oceania. We won’t spend a dime for any extras. I’m writing about Oceania’s  unethical practice for this cruise on every forum I can find. 

[jhigbie]

There'll be one huge elephant in the room at the Barcelona boarding.  600 grumpy passengers?  caught in the middle crew trying too hard to smile?  Missing in action officers pretending it's all normal?  What will it be?  The cruise from hell or waiting around for the next meal?  The Captain will set the tone, as will each one of us.

 

[Elless100]

5 minutes ago, jhigbie said:

There'll be one huge elephant in the room at the Barcelona boarding.  600 grumpy passengers?  caught in the middle crew trying too hard to smile?  Missing in action officers pretending it's all normal?  What will it be?  The cruise from hell or waiting around for the next meal?  The Captain will set the tone, as will each one of us.

 

 

5 minutes ago, jhigbie said:

There'll be one huge elephant in the room at the Barcelona boarding.  600 grumpy passengers?  caught in the middle crew trying too hard to smile?  Missing in action officers pretending it's all normal?  What will it be?  The cruise from hell or waiting around for the next meal?  The Captain will set the tone, as will each one of us.

 

I look forward to hearing about it

[Linda Deenen]

We will also be trying to make the best of this Nov 17 situation.  Once boarded, there is no point in ruining our own holiday. O will hopefully have some negative consequences because of this but I won’t let it affect the quality of my life.

[Harry Lake]

4 hours ago, jhigbie said:

There'll be one huge elephant in the room at the Barcelona boarding.  600 grumpy passengers?  caught in the middle crew trying too hard to smile?  Missing in action officers pretending it's all normal?  What will it be?  The cruise from hell or waiting around for the next meal?  The Captain will set the tone, as will each one of us.

 

Since they seem to play fast and loose with ethics I wonder if the staff - all of them - will be briefed on what's been going on.