Kid bashing

[Kerry's Girls]

 

We will be cruising on Saphire 10/11/08 and will be taking 6 along. 17,15,12,9,6, and 2. We have been working with the 2yo to get him ready, but.............he's 2.

 

If any one has cruised with a toddler before I welcome POSITIVE suggestions.

And the next time you see a kid, be a positive influence, he may be running the country someday. :D

 

Check out the family boards here - there are many of us who cruise with toddlers and you'll find lots of tips and ideas. My twins sailed the Sapphire at 13 months and go again on the cruise before yours when they'll be 3-1/2 (and there have been three other cruises in between).

 

Have a great trip!

 

Best,

Mia

[Buddy604]

kids who may be disruptive and can be excused, adults on the other hand are adults and no excuse is tolerated.

Ok, I went all the way back to page four to quote this, because it brings up a key problem regarding kids and cruising.

 

No, disruptive behavoir by children cannot be excused. Just because they are under the age of 18, does not give them carte-blanche to behave poorly, and, if they do, it is the responsibility of the parent to address it.

 

If an adult threw a temper-tantrum in the dining room, they would be escorted out. I see no reason why such upstanding children who have "paid the same fare as everyone else" should not be subject to the same standards of behavior. If they are incapable of behaving in a non-disruptive manner, they should escorted to an area where they can regain their poise. Or perhaps they are not mature enough for a cruise.

 

My only objection to children is when they are given the leeway to behave inapproriately just because they are children. I won't tolerate intrusive and obnoxious behavior from their parents and I certainly won't from them.

 

That said, I'm delighted to meet and share a table with well behaved folks of all ages, and I've been lucky enough to run into more of those lately - usually children of Cruise Critic folks.

 

But for those who are certain their children are so well behaved, let me ask, have you accompanied them to the pool? At the pool do they disregard the sign re: jumping and diving? Tell me again why I should move to the colder, outdoor adult pool so that your kids can flaut the rules and jump and dive, when it would be great for both of us to just follow the rules and enjoy the only covered pool on a chilly day?

[Buddy604]

I meant in the Princess folder and now it's number 2 besides stickys. So I guess it made it by a long shot:D :p ;)

Sure, if you only look at threads active in the last week. :D

 

Go to the bottom of the page, select sort by views, since the beginning and you'll see it clock in around 120 - 130th most viewed since the database was last purged, and that only within the Princess board.

 

Sorry to burst your acomplishment bubble. :rolleyes:

[tequilasunrise]

Mia (Kerry's girls), the pic of your twins in the cabin is adorable!!!

 

My kids are grown now, but I did take them cruising when they were younger, back before it was popular. I found that there were a few grouches, but with that many people there will likely be a few. Most people either said positive things or nothing at all, it was not a problem. But, I followed the rules, and never permitted bad behavior from my children. They didn't run up and down the aisle at shows, jump in the pools, scream in the halls, throw public tanturms, crawl under tables at dinner, push all the elevator buttons---or they didn't do that stuff for very long! I took them to the buffet until they could sit still long enough at dinner (it's cruel and a little bit impossible to make a 3 year old sit still for 2 hours). Princess has always made that easy for you---take the little ones to the buffet early, drop them at the children's center, then DH and I went to the dining room--kidless---to enjoy adult conversation, which was a real treat back then :D

 

The kid's center is a good place for them to run off some of that natural energy they come with, safely and without bothering other people.

 

I think it's just like the smoking issue---it's not whether or not it exists but how people handle it. Some parents allow children to get out of hand---and THAT is the problem. My problem there is with the parents, not the kids. Kids naturally push until they are told where the line is. Children need love---and limits---from their parents to feel secure and happy.

[Twelvevman]

Excuse me.................Could someone get me popcorn? :p

 

 

Here you go...

[wizard-of-roz]

I've been flying in airplanes (since a little after the Wright Bros.)! ;)

On our last flight (thank God it was only 2 hours), there was a little boy (around 2-3 years old) and his mother, across the isle from us.

Initially, no problem, the take-off was great...about 10 minutes into the flight.....as I watched and heard this toddler become more and more "un-hinged", it was sad....the mother NEVER brought out a toy; a snack or any diversionary tactic of any kind......she simply held down his feet and attempted to cover his mouth as he SCREAMED!!! :eek: And, I don't mean small little screams....I mean life or death, blood curdling SCREAMS, whilest he was kicking the seat in front of them....The poor man in front never budged; turned around or even flinched!!!!!! (What a trooper!)

Finally, until I and the entire plane, could stand no more.....I motioned to the mother, with my outstretched arms, "may I please try something?"

She handed him over to me....where was I going to go? He was still crying, screaming and kicking!!! I reached up, while he was on my lap and turned on the overhead light...."on" and "off" it went...."on" and "off"...."on" and "off"....until he was so mezmerized by the thing he actually stopped all "noise" and starting staring and reaching for the light!!!! You know...."Go to the light, go to the light!"

Diversion....it works everytime....he calmed down, until the light and the air jets no longer entranced him....I then took out the magazine that is always in the "holder", in the back of the seat in front of you and I began to tear each page into tiny strips....allowing him to do the same.....(they say you can keep these magazines, well, this magazine was worth nothing by the time we were through!!!!) :rolleyes: THE ENTIRE ROW OF PASSENGERS IN BACK AND THE DARLING MAN IN FRONT OF THEM, CHEERED AND CLAPPED!!!!!!!

I've raised three very successful adult children. We never had meltdowns that lasted more than a few seconds......Use your imagination....think like a child....get down to their level.....And, have some fun!!!!!:) We did!!!!!

[wizard-of-roz]

Oh! And, thanks for the popcorn......:D

[gertz]

 

I've raised three very successful adult children. We never had meltdowns that lasted more than a few seconds......Use your imagination....think like a child....get down to their level.....And, have some fun!!!!!:) We did!!!!!

 

 

Sorry to add to this post but that's a great story, and it works.

 

 

GERTZ

Princess Elite

Next Tahitian 9/18 Vancouver to Honolulu

Coral 4/12 FLL to LA

Island 8/17 Back to Alaska 4th time w/grandson:D

[Ula]

Roz,

Great story. As an adult even I get bored on the airplane and bring amusments for diversion. Usually a book or if I can find one a cheap hand held video game.

We cruised Princess over Thanksgiving in 06, over 900 children on the ship. Never had one problem. The youth security and activities kept them busy.

[G'ma]

The behavior of kids on a cruise I believe directly relates to how much there is for kids to do on a ship.

 

Wrong!! The behavior of kids anywhere directly relates to how their parents are raising them. Bad parenting makes for rotten kids.

 

It's not the ships fault that Mr. and Mrs. Boobus has raised a bunch of rude, smart-alec, loud-mouthed brats who have never been taught manners or respect. The parents turn these untrained, unmannered social misfits loose onboard and hope they stay away.

 

Mannered behavior is a "learned" skill. If the parents are riff-raff, the children will also be.

[cruisemom42]

I'm a firm supporter of traveling with your children. Those who read my posts know I've traveled a lot with DS starting with his first cruise 11 years ago at age 5 and including spring break trips to Rome and London, a Baltics cruise, Alaska cruise, etc.

 

I have never run across bad behavior by kids on a cruise, but perhaps that is partly because we do not cruise during spring break or at Christmas. Most of our cruises are very late May into early June, when I suppose there are many kids still in school.

 

I do agree that how kids' behaviors are handled by their parents makes such a difference. I was at lunch Tuesday with colleagues at a restaurant that was definitely NOT geared for children. A family came in (mom, dad, 4-5 year old girl and 2-3 year old boy). They were seated very near us and it was clear right away that the boy was not going to be a happy camper. Mom left to use the restroom and he immediately slithered out of his booster seat and began running round the table next to us. I looked over at dad -- he was on the cell phone and paying not a bit of attention.

 

Okay, I thought, I'll give him a break -- perhaps he's tying up something important at the office. But when the mom arrived back, she also did nothing to stop him. Pretty soon thereafter, the girl joined him in running around the table (why not?) and this went on until the server bringing our coffee and dessert asked the parents not to let the kids run, presumably out of fear that they'd trip up the waitstaff carrying out heavy trays of food.

 

The girl sat down, but the boy had to be wodged back into his booster and started kicking and yelling. I waited for mom to bring out some crayons or maybe a toy, but no attempt was made. The parents conversed together while the boy continued to escalate his tantrum and the girl would intermittently kick him (oh the joys of siblings) or tug on the dad's sleeve trying to get his attention.

 

My goodness!

 

Luckily we left shortly thereafter. I realized upon leaving that there was a mom and a boy (about the same age; 2-3 years) sitting behind us. They'd been so quiet the entire time -- looked like they were looking at a book together -- that no one noticed they were there. I felt like complimenting them, but perhaps she would've taken it amiss based on this thread. :eek:

 

I recall one time I was dining out with DS in an equally non-kid-friendly restaurant while traveling. He ate politely and conversed with me the entire time (I think he was about 7). As we were leaving, someone at the table next to us complimented him on his good manners. We both left feeling very good, and he still remembers it. So I can't say that I really understand why someone would be offended. Isn't a pat on the back something that makes us feel better? Isn't positive reinforcement the best way to teach kids? ("Catch them doing something good and compliment them on it.")

[gambit57]

I've been flying in airplanes (since a little after the Wright Bros.)! ;)

 

On our last flight (thank God it was only 2 hours), there was a little boy (around 2-3 years old) and his mother, across the isle from us.

 

Initially, no problem, the take-off was great...about 10 minutes into the flight.....as I watched and heard this toddler become more and more "un-hinged", it was sad....the mother NEVER brought out a toy; a snack or any diversionary tactic of any kind......she simply held down his feet and attempted to cover his mouth as he SCREAMED!!! :eek: And, I don't mean small little screams....I mean life or death, blood curdling SCREAMS, whilest he was kicking the seat in front of them....The poor man in front never budged; turned around or even flinched!!!!!! (What a trooper!)

 

Finally, until I and the entire plane, could stand no more.....I motioned to the mother, with my outstretched arms, "may I please try something?"

 

She handed him over to me....where was I going to go? He was still crying, screaming and kicking!!! I reached up, while he was on my lap and turned on the overhead light...."on" and "off" it went...."on" and "off"...."on" and "off"....until he was so mezmerized by the thing he actually stopped all "noise" and starting staring and reaching for the light!!!! You know...."Go to the light, go to the light!"

 

Diversion....it works everytime....he calmed down, until the light and the air jets no longer entranced him....I then took out the magazine that is always in the "holder", in the back of the seat in front of you and I began to tear each page into tiny strips....allowing him to do the same.....(they say you can keep these magazines, well, this magazine was worth nothing by the time we were through!!!!) :rolleyes: THE ENTIRE ROW OF PASSENGERS IN BACK AND THE DARLING MAN IN FRONT OF THEM, CHEERED AND CLAPPED!!!!!!!

 

I've raised three very successful adult children. We never had meltdowns that lasted more than a few seconds......Use your imagination....think like a child....get down to their level.....And, have some fun!!!!!:) We did!!!!!

 

Ma'am, I applaud you. This is a perfect example of how the behavior of children is directly related to how well the parents raised them. Unfortunately, it seems like you should be required to get a license before you're allowed to have a child (like a driver's license, requiring you to practice before taking the test and then testing you on some basic child caring skills). It's not rocket science. We've been having children for thousands of years.

[jpg1747]

Another non-cruise story ...

 

I was at the American Idols concert last night. Yes, I knew the majority of the audience was going to be pre-teen and I was prepared for it. Or so I thought. I guess I don't understand the mentality of going to a concert ostensibly to hear performers sing and then screaming at the top of your lungs during the entire performance, so loud that you almost drown out the music. I'm sure they had adult chaperones, but I didn't see anything being done to stop them. I wish I could say I found a way to quiet them down, but I didn't. I've been going to concerts for over 40 years and I've never screamed like that. I go to enjoy the performance.

[wizard-of-roz]

Hugs and sloppy wet "Brenda" kisses to anyone who ever had the courage to intervene (in a positive way), between a "poor lost parent, with no skills" and an "out of control" rug monkey or teen; to help and assist in bringing everyone to a calm and assertive manner!!!!! ;)

Just think what a better world we'd have, in general, if EVERYONE helped each other....instead of "tsk, tsking" each other and walking away; slamming a door; giving dirty looks or just plain "bad mouthing" each other!!!!!!

Have a wonderful, peaceful weekend!!!!! :)

[nrdsb4]

I really don't notice the roudiness or maybe I'm not looking for it. My kids are 14 and 10. We purposly did not do these type of vacations while they were younger, instead waiting till they understood how to be good vacationers.. Princess really does a great job with the kids. My two really enjoy the teen and kid centers. On sea days the spend most all there time there. I know it's a compliment but it kind of irritates me when 10 or more people per cruise tell the wife and I how well mannered our kids are. I know it's a compliment but it still hits a nerve. How would it look if I went up to complete strangers and said how well mannered your husband is tonight:eek: I have never heard an announcement like the one you commented on, not even last year on the Diamond durring Easter when there were 900 kids on board. Actually it was a great cruise.

 

Wow, if numerous people complimenting your children's behavior "irritates" you, then perhaps you are just looking to be irritated. I cruise with my children (two daughters), and they absolutely beam when they receive genuine compliments from others; I'm always happy for them when their efforts are rewarded with good will.

 

Children are in the process of learning to behave well. This is something they have to be taught to do. Research has shown that children respond better to praise when they are doing well than to criticism when they make poor choices. It is called "positive reinforcement." Your effort to compare praising children as they successfully master social lessons with the absurdity of praising a grown man in a like manner simply doesn't fly. I say kudos to those folks who complimented your children-I hope that they didn't realize the sour attitude with which their kind words were received.

 

I often read "I'd rather be around obnoxious kids than obnoxious adults!" Why do we have to choose? I don't want to be around either of them!

[nrdsb4]

Another non-cruise story ...

 

I was at the American Idols concert last night. Yes, I knew the majority of the audience was going to be pre-teen and I was prepared for it. Or so I thought. I guess I don't understand the mentality of going to a concert ostensibly to hear performers sing and then screaming at the top of your lungs during the entire performance, so loud that you almost drown out the music. I'm sure they had adult chaperones, but I didn't see anything being done to stop them. I wish I could say I found a way to quiet them down, but I didn't. I've been going to concerts for over 40 years and I've never screamed like that. I go to enjoy the performance.

 

Have you ever seen the films of teens at the Beatles' performance on the Ed Sullivan show? Totally drowned out the fab four!:D And the crying, and FAINTING! Too funny.

[gambit57]

Another non-cruise story ...

 

I was at the American Idols concert last night. Yes, I knew the majority of the audience was going to be pre-teen and I was prepared for it. Or so I thought. I guess I don't understand the mentality of going to a concert ostensibly to hear performers sing and then screaming at the top of your lungs during the entire performance, so loud that you almost drown out the music. I'm sure they had adult chaperones, but I didn't see anything being done to stop them. I wish I could say I found a way to quiet them down, but I didn't. I've been going to concerts for over 40 years and I've never screamed like that. I go to enjoy the performance.

 

I'm sorry, but that's completely different. If it were an Eric Clapton or John Legend concert and you had a bunch of pre-teens screaming, then it would be reasonable for the adults to do something (altho in that case, the adults would likely be the ones screaming). That's like going to Chuck E Cheese and expecting parents to keep their kids from screaming and going wild in the ball pit.

 

There are certain places where you'd expect parents to keep their kids under control. Nice restaurants, airplanes, most public places, etc. However, there are gonna be places where the entertainment and atmosphere is designed for the kids to scream and go nuts. An American Idols concert, Jonas Brothers concert, Hannah Montana concert, Teen Choice Awards ceremony. Those are all places where it's unreasonable to expect any adult chaperones to keep the kids from screaming. Concerts, especially certain concerts, are very different from most other entertainment venues.

[jpg1747]

Have you ever seen the films of teens at the Beatles' performance on the Ed Sullivan show? Totally drowned out the fab four!:D And the crying, and FAINTING! Too funny.

 

As a matter of fact, I was at the last Beatles concert in San Francisco in 1966. So yes, I do remember all that. And my mother has told me about the same thing happened with Frank Sinatra.

[Ula]

I am trying to understand the offense when a parent is complimented on their childs good behavior. Might be the parents expect that behavior so it is not special.

The compliments occur because every adult who has ever encountered a child knows the hard work involved in teaching them manners and such. The path of least resistance is just to let them run and yell born free.

I had an incident with a teen on a Princess. Teen years are hard. Kid thought I was staring at him. Spoke to him as an adult, and explained since I was not wearing my glasses I could not even see him at that distance.

I like to just sit in a giant fuzz when eating and there is a crowd around. Handed him my glasses after talking and told him they would make his vision as bad as what mine is without them. He was we are cool and we were always friendly when we met up after. Never saw his parents. He might have just been looking for some direction. He was at the age of defining himself. No big deal. Teens do that.

[nbsjcruiser]

I am a father of two, a 10 yr old girl and a 14 yr old boy. We have been cruising with our children for the last 6 yrs. I have noticed alot of kid bashing not only on this forum but on the ships themselves. Now we have taught our children how to act in public and on every cruise we have taken,we have had fellow passengers comment on how well behaved our kids are. However, people that think they are above, better, more deserving or thinking that children should be seen and not heard is rediculous. On the Diamond in March while in the elevator with my daughter a older man was going on about the children, he said out loud that he will rebook a cruise when there are no children on board. As I left the elevator I told him I would rebook when there were no old people on board and he seemed offended.

The fact is on my most recent Diamond 15 day there were only 163 kids and you rarely felt they were on board. Sure there were times at the pool you could hear them playing. However I feel the older folks as a group are far more troublesome, I don;t mean to offend anyone but the fact is more of the older croud were rude to servers, complaining and in general thought they should be waited on hand and foot. Last year durring Easter while on the Diamond there were a record 900 kids on board and too be quite honest was a far better atmosphere on ship. The bottom line is my kids pay the same fare, gratuities and other amenities as anyone else and deserve a little respect!

 

We've been on 5 cruises and I can honestly say the kids have never been an issue. Oh sure I've seen a couple things that made me shake my head but I could say that about some adults too. Look, a vacation is what you make of it and some people are never happy and you had the bang on response to that old fart.

[bplazo]

I heard on the news today (I was half napping so I may not have the whole story) but the cruiselines are considering have a kid-free section on the plane (of course this would be an extra charge). Also, charging parents extra if the kids were disruptive.

 

I would think that they would have to charge disruptive adults also.

 

I found this very interesting.

[G'ma]

As a matter of fact, I was at the last Beatles concert in San Francisco in 1966. So yes, I do remember all that. And my mother has told me about the same thing happened with Frank Sinatra.

 

And.......Elvis in the late 50's, early 60's.

 

I recall a Bill Haley and the Comets concert in 1956. (For those too young, we're talking Rock Around the Clock---the first real rock-n-roll song--from the movie The Blackboard Jungle). I was a 15 year old hotshot

who was taken to the concert by my mother (a very young 34 year old) and several of my girlfriends.

 

The screaming was almost nonstop....including my wonderful mother. It is a cherished memory of Mom who remained young, excited and interested all her life.

[gambit57]

I heard on the news today (I was half napping so I may not have the whole story) but the cruiselines are considering have a kid-free section on the plane (of course this would be an extra charge). Also, charging parents extra if the kids were disruptive.

 

I would think that they would have to charge disruptive adults also.

 

I found this very interesting.

 

I find it interesting too, I'm just not quite sure how that would work. Disruptive kids often have clueless/defiant parents who deny their little angels do anything wrong. And yeah, I don't see how it's fair to charge extra for disruptive kids if you don't do it for adults as well. Which still brings up the question of how do you define "disruptive"?

 

Considering the contentiousness of the "jeans in the dining room" issue (or chair hogs, diapers in pools, etc) and the inconsistent enforcement of those things, I doubt it's gonna happen.

[gambit57]

The screaming was almost nonstop....including my wonderful mother. It is a cherished memory of Mom who remained young' date=' excited and interested all her life.[/quote']

 

This is why guys wanna be rock stars. :D

 

Even grandmas will scream non-stop at the right concert. Heck, Wayne Newton still gets panties thrown at him. Some of them are granny panties, literally, but that's still way cool.

 

Concerts typically are just not a place to go if you want a peaceful evening. An classical music concert maybe, but nothing more modern than that.

[cruisedad63]

This has gotten way off subject but I can't hold it in. As a performer myself, I find it downright rude when people go to a music concert (any concert) and scream and yell during the performance. That performer has put in countless hours of rehersal to provide an entertaining show. It's aggrivating to try to "Be at your best" for paying customers and then to not even have them notice. Go ahead and throw yor panties,but at least listen.