Would you take a cruise that calls in Cuba if the travel embargo is lifted?

[cruznjan]

Yes I would.

[fann1sh]

Montel, thank you for posting. I posted earlier, noting I'd been to the former Soviet Union as a teen when it was largely closed to foreigners. It was life changing to see a society that was not free.

 

I don't know when things will change in Cuba. It seems the U.S. embargo has done little or nothing. On the other hand, tourism and trade from countries other than the U.S. hasn't helped, either. Some posters who hope U.S. tourism might change the hearts and minds of the Cuban people don't seem to understand the level of tourism which already exists.

 

If the U.S. embargo ends, I hope having more U.S. citizens experience Cuba first hand will mean more give this issue room in their own hearts and minds. And, by analogy, to the fate all peoples who also do not live free.

[CruisingAmazona]

Montel, thank you for posting. I posted earlier, noting I'd been to the former Soviet Union as a teen when it was largely closed to foreigners. It was life changing to see a society that was not free.

 

I don't know when things will change in Cuba. It seems the U.S. embargo has done little or nothing. On the other hand, tourism and trade from countries other than the U.S. hasn't helped, either. Some posters who hope U.S. tourism might change the hearts and minds of the Cuban people don't seem to understand the level of tourism which already exists.

 

If the U.S. embargo ends, I hope having more U.S. citizens experience Cuba first hand will mean more give this issue room in their own hearts and minds. And, by analogy, to the fate all peoples who also do not live free.

By the way, for the record, I am a Cuban-American who believes the Embargo has been a failure and must be lifted....should've been lifted years ago. My theory is that if something hasn't worked for 30, 40, 50 years, it simply ain't gonna work ever! We must try something different.

[Aquahound]

By the way, for the record, I am a Cuban-American who believes the Embargo has been a failure and must be lifted....should've been lifted years ago. My theory is that if something hasn't worked for 30, 40, 50 years, it simply ain't gonna work ever! We must try something different.

 

You may get your wish soon, at least somewhat. There has been a lot of activity, meetings, etc here in the Keys ref the opening of travel to Cuba. Right now it is receiving quite a bit of protest from exiles for various reasons, but I think the current administration is looking to change things up a little. Only time will tell. I just hope it is well thought out and not a short-sighted decision.

[CruisingAmazona]

You may get your wish soon, at least somewhat. There has been a lot of activity, meetings, etc here in the Keys ref the opening of travel to Cuba. Right now it is receiving quite a bit of protest from exiles for various reasons, but I think the current administration is looking to change things up a little. Only time will tell. I just hope it is well thought out and not a short-sighted decision.

"Somewhat!" Lifting travel restrictions will not necessarily mean "lifting embargo." Lifting travel restrictions that are being contemplated means allowing family members to visit once a year and for an unlimited period of time, instead of once every three years for a week or two as in the GWBush years! Lifting the embargo is a horse of a different color! Although, again, I believe it should be lifted PRONTO!

[Aquahound]

Although, again, I believe it should be lifted PRONTO!

 

Well you and I both know that is not going to happen.

 

For the record, I am not a fan of travel restrictions. I am very opposed to the new proposal. It sounds very unconstitutional to me.

[PaulMedik]

............... It was especially sad to read the fellow/lady who said they could "care less" who the money went to.......! No empathy for human-kind, that one!

 

 

Montel,

 

I am the fellow who stated I could 'care less' who the money went to. If you will consider those words in the context of the rest of my post about wearing Nike tennis shoes and other articles of clothing made in sweat shops, then you will understand the 'care less' statement is not one of a lack of empathy for human kind, but one of the cold reality that one cannot avoid financial support for governments or corporations that they do not approve of.

 

I agree the comment is 'sad,' but not sad for lack of empathy; sad for lack of consistent policy by our own government. I guarantee that if I cruise to Cuba, I will be placing US currency directly in to the hands of Cuban citizens. I don't have that option when I purchase Nike shoes or name brand apparel do I? Cruise tourism to Cuba and US tourism via land resorts will result in improving the conditions there for the average person. Granted the Cuban government will also benefit, but how can that be avoided?

[Cruzaholic41]

I guarantee that if I cruise to Cuba, I will be placing US currency directly in to the hands of Cuban citizens.

 

And the reality of Cuba is that the Government will literally take it right back out of their hands. They are limited as to how much money they can make.

 

This is not a joke.

[AlinaMaria]

I guarantee that if I cruise to Cuba, I will be placing US currency directly in to the hands of Cuban citizens. I don't have that option when I purchase Nike shoes or name brand apparel do I? Cruise tourism to Cuba and US tourism via land resorts will result in improving the conditions there for the average person. Granted the Cuban government will also benefit, but how can that be avoided?

 

That is exactly one of the issues: the money will stay in the hands of the communist government. Today, those that work in the hotels and resorts open to the European and Canadian tourism (as well as those American that cheat our government by visiting through a third country), do not see the money. As I stated earlier, the large corporation owners of the hotels pay the Cuban government thousands of dollars for "staff services", then the government pays the cuban employees minimum cuban wages in cuban pesos, a total rip-off!!

 

As to the embargo, obviously it has not worked. But the answer is not in providing the government more money to enlarge their european bank accounts while the people are lacking the most basic rights to a decent job with fair wages, a clean roof over their heads, right to free speech and religion/worship, a nutritious diet, etc.

 

Did anyone of you know that milk is only given (per rationing book) when available only to very young children? Did you know that parents do not have a choice to the education their children receive? Did you know that if you want to purchase a refrigerator, you must have worked "voluntarily" for the government, no wages, every weekend of your life in order to earn a certificate giving you the "right" to purchase the appliance in USD only?

 

I am a Registered Nurse and I have witnessed young women bring their "medical records" indicating a history of multiple abortions (as many as 20!) by the time they reach the age of 30! I have also witnessed young pregnant woman who has never taken a prenatal vitamin because even though it has been ordered by the OB/GYN, it is not available in Cuba!

 

I'm sure that you have never watched the shows of today's Cuba when the people's home have not been painted in over 30 yrs, the appliances are from the 50s, electricity and water is only available for a few hours a day, certain days of the week.... I have witnessed women and men cry when they have seen a bath soap and warm water coming out of the shower!

 

My neighbor's mother-in-law came from Cuba last November. Her husband (a graduated attorney from Univ of Havana) worked as a bus boy in a well known hotel in Havana. This woman had never taken a shower in her life, she had to carry water in a bucket (when available) in order to shower....

 

Believe, my fellow cruising friends, these people willl not see the port charges, will not get your tips, will not get your money.

 

This new "free travel" to Cuba will only be another sad sabotage to human feelings: take advantage of those with parents, children, etc. in Cuba that will do anything to attempt to ease their suffering lives. And lets not forget, the money that goes to Cuba does not stimulate USA economy either....

 

To those that feel that "opening up" will encourage the people to fight for change, trust me, it will not work. Does it work in China? Does it work in Venezuela? Does it work in Viet Nam? Of course not, because the people live with such fear that they will never attempt been "marked" as a disident...

 

Eventually, laws/regulations/embargos will change, be lifted...The Castro family will have more money... The change has to come from within because those now living in Cuba haver never known anything else but communism and all of us outside of the island are "the evil maffia". They only reason they smile at Europeans and Canadians is because they can take their money in the resorts and in prostitution of the beautiful Cuban young women and young men.

 

Lord knows nothing will make me happier that to witness the communist system fail...but Cuba is surrounded by water not a wall....Cuba does not have oil, sugar and tobacco can be purchases elsewhere...

 

This will be the last posting on this subject I will be contributing. This subject will never be agreed upon because unless you have suffered communism in your own skin, you will never understand.....

 

AlinaMaria

[VillaHappy]

I'd love to go. There are only a few places in the world where, as an American, I'm not permitted to go. That just makes me want to experience it firsthand all the more.

[Liz54]

With the greatest respect to our Cuban American neighbours, Canadians who have spent extended periods in Cuba - not in all inclusives, bring back very different reports. The embargos have hurt the Cuban people and have had no effect on the Government.

[PaulMedik]

That is exactly one of the issues: the money will stay in the hands of the communist government. Today, those that work in the hotels and resorts open to the European and Canadian tourism (as well as those American that cheat our government by visiting through a third country), do not see the money. As I stated earlier, the large corporation owners of the hotels pay the Cuban government thousands of dollars for "staff services", then the government pays the cuban employees minimum cuban wages in cuban pesos, a total rip-off!!

 

As to the embargo, obviously it has not worked. But the answer is not in providing the government more money to enlarge their european bank accounts while the people are lacking the most basic rights to a decent job with fair wages, a clean roof over their heads, right to free speech and religion/worship, a nutritious diet, etc.

 

Did anyone of you know that milk is only given (per rationing book) when available only to very young children? Did you know that parents do not have a choice to the education their children receive? Did you know that if you want to purchase a refrigerator, you must have worked "voluntarily" for the government, no wages, every weekend of your life in order to earn a certificate giving you the "right" to purchase the appliance in USD only?

 

I am a Registered Nurse and I have witnessed young women bring their "medical records" indicating a history of multiple abortions (as many as 20!) by the time they reach the age of 30! I have also witnessed young pregnant woman who has never taken a prenatal vitamin because even though it has been ordered by the OB/GYN, it is not available in Cuba!

 

I'm sure that you have never watched the shows of today's Cuba when the people's home have not been painted in over 30 yrs, the appliances are from the 50s, electricity and water is only available for a few hours a day, certain days of the week.... I have witnessed women and men cry when they have seen a bath soap and warm water coming out of the shower!

 

My neighbor's mother-in-law came from Cuba last November. Her husband (a graduated attorney from Univ of Havana) worked as a bus boy in a well known hotel in Havana. This woman had never taken a shower in her life, she had to carry water in a bucket (when available) in order to shower....

 

Believe, my fellow cruising friends, these people willl not see the port charges, will not get your tips, will not get your money.

 

This new "free travel" to Cuba will only be another sad sabotage to human feelings: take advantage of those with parents, children, etc. in Cuba that will do anything to attempt to ease their suffering lives. And lets not forget, the money that goes to Cuba does not stimulate USA economy either....

 

To those that feel that "opening up" will encourage the people to fight for change, trust me, it will not work. Does it work in China? Does it work in Venezuela? Does it work in Viet Nam? Of course not, because the people live with such fear that they will never attempt been "marked" as a disident...

 

Eventually, laws/regulations/embargos will change, be lifted...The Castro family will have more money... The change has to come from within because those now living in Cuba haver never known anything else but communism and all of us outside of the island are "the evil maffia". They only reason they smile at Europeans and Canadians is because they can take their money in the resorts and in prostitution of the beautiful Cuban young women and young men.

 

Lord knows nothing will make me happier that to witness the communist system fail...but Cuba is surrounded by water not a wall....Cuba does not have oil, sugar and tobacco can be purchases elsewhere...

 

This will be the last posting on this subject I will be contributing. This subject will never be agreed upon because unless you have suffered communism in your own skin, you will never understand.....

 

AlinaMaria

 

 

AlinaMaria,

 

Cruise passengers are notorious for NOT spending all their time in resorts. If US citizens visit Cuba via cruise ship, we will be traveling the countryside and exploring the country, not sitting in a resort.

 

After fifty years of attempting to change Cuba via current methods, I think it's safe to say the effort is a dismal failure. Your own recollections and current knowledge of the situation in Cuba dramatically illustrates that the embargo has failed.

 

Why would anyone advocate continuing the present policy given all the evidence of it's failure? I admire your resolution, but it's time for a totally new direction.

[momofmeg]

With the greatest respect to our Cuban American neighbours, Canadians who have spent extended periods in Cuba - not in all inclusives, bring back very different reports. The embargos have hurt the Cuban people and have had no effect on the Government.

 

Funny you should say this.

 

My hubby has said for years he hopes Cuba will open up soon for us to cruises there. Our last cruise we met an extended Cuban family who resides in Miami from grandparents to grandchildren on our Roatan excursion. I mentioned to them that my hubby wanted to go to Cuba and they became very upset and said we did NOT want to go there. I am not sure quite why as the grandfather who was talking to us had become so upset that his accent became too thick for me to understand what he said-but it taught me to NEVER say that to a Cuban refugee. I imagine he had a nightmare story he could have told me IF he had not been so upset that I could not understand him. He calmed down later and I could easily understand him as we talked, but I did not DARE bring up that subject again!

[RaleighNC]

Absolutely not as long as Communists run the country. :mad:

[CruisingAmazona]

Funny you should say this.

 

My hubby has said for years he hopes Cuba will open up soon for us to cruises there. Our last cruise we met an extended Cuban family who resides in Miami from grandparents to grandchildren on our Roatan excursion. I mentioned to them that my hubby wanted to go to Cuba and they became very upset and said we did NOT want to go there. I am not sure quite why as the grandfather who was talking to us had become so upset that his accent became too thick for me to understand what he said-but it taught me to NEVER say that to a Cuban refugee. I imagine he had a nightmare story he could have told me IF he had not been so upset that I could not understand him. He calmed down later and I could easily understand him as we talked, but I did not DARE bring up that subject again!

First of all, if he was on a cruise, and in Roatan, he was not a "Cuban Refugee!" He was an American Citizen just like you from Georgia. And second and last, in his defense, and having had grandparents once......these are the really tough ones to speak to about this subject, very radical, very intransigent, but then again.....wouldn't you be too if all of a sudden you were removed by no choice of your own from your country?

[CruisingAmazona]

I will follow Alina's post and will post this one final time by offering a quick view for all those who think of Cuban-Americans as "refugees" or "immigrants" - think again! Cuban Americans form the third-largest Hispanic group in the United States and also the largest Spanish-speaking group of white descent in the US. Many communities throughout the United States have significant Cuban American populations. However Miami stands out as the most prominent Cuban American community, in part because of its proximity to Cuba, followed by NJ and NY. From 1960 to 1979, hundreds of thousands of Cubans left Cuba and began a new life in the United States, often forming the backbone of the anti-Castro movement. Most Cuban Americans that arrived in the United States came from Cuba's educated upper and middle classes. Most Cuban Americans have assimilated themselves into the American culture. 30% of Cuban Americans have a college education, about twice the average of all other Hispanic groups, and 40% of US-born Cuban Americans have a college degree or higher, as compared to only 25% of non-Hispanic whites, and 12% for all other Hispanic groups.

 

And finally.....my very own favorite......Cuban Americans have been extremely successful in establishing businesses and developing political clout by transforming Miami from a sleepy beach retirement community into a modern city with a distinct Caribbean flavor.

 

Enough said!

 

See you all one day on the beaches of Varadero!

[momofmeg]

First of all, if he was on a cruise, and in Roatan, he was not a "Cuban Refugee!" He was an American Citizen just like you from Georgia. And second and last, in his defense, and having had grandparents once......these are the really tough ones to speak to about this subject, very radical, very intransigent, but then again.....wouldn't you be too if all of a sudden you were removed by no choice of your own from your country?

 

He told me he was a Cuban refugee, HIS WORDS, and he said he was forced to leave. This man was in his late 70's, his wife looked a few years younger, early 70's. At first I thought him and his wife were the great grandparents of the small children, as there was another woman around my age, in her fifties with them. the other woman was their daughter-in-law's mother. They told me their son whom they were with, (around 35 or so in age) was their youngest child.

 

I do not appreciate your post to me. You know I am on your SIDE which is why I made the post. You are reading things in my post that were not there. After that poor man's reaction, I do not think I could enjoy Cuba and I have zero desire to go there. I know if I went, I would keep thinking of him and his obvious pain when I asked him about it, so no I will not be going to Cuba.

 

Things would have to radically change there for me to go. If Cuba became more like China, a Communist country whose people have a fairly good standard of living, perhaps I would feel differently, perhaps not.

[Aquahound]

30% of Cuban Americans have a college education, about twice the average of all other Hispanic groups, and 40% of US-born Cuban Americans have a college degree or higher, as compared to only 25% of non-Hispanic whites, and 12% for all other Hispanic groups.....

 

Enough said!

 

I understand you are proud of the acomplishments of those who have come to this country, but your post is borderline condescending.

[Aquahound]

He told me he was a Cuban refugee, HIS WORDS, and he said he was forced to leave.

 

And in truth, he probably was.

 

Cuban migrants still come to this country every day whether it be by illegal smuggling or rafts. It has become an organized crime in South Florida to smuggle them on go-fast boats.

[Krazy Kruizers]

I would really love to see Cuba.

My mother was there in the 20's and raved about it.

[momofmeg]

And in truth, he probably was.

 

Cuban migrants still come to this country every day whether it be by illegal smuggling or rafts. It has become an organized crime in South Florida to smuggle them on go-fast boats.

 

I don't remember much about the early 60's, I was too young. Although I remember a boy I went to school with, was from Cuba originally. He was there from first grade on, and I started first grade in 1960. In elementary school he went by Carlos, but by high school he preferred to be called Charles.

 

Now I do remember back in the late 70's/ early 80's Castro forcing people on boats and sending them here. Many he had pulled out of his prisons, but others he forced out because of their religious beliefs. They were better off in the US for sure, but what a way to send them.

 

The older man told me he was forced to the US in the early 60's when he was still a young man. Now, as Montel pointed out, his children and grandchildren would be US citizens, just like me, born in the USA. His wife, I don't know if she was a refugee or not, I only understood that he was. I was under the impression he had met and married her after fleeing Cuba, but as I said before, much of what he told me I could not understand as he was very agitated when he told me.

[Host Mick]

I'd go for nothing more than top see what 47 years of brutal oppression does to a once thriving country... and to see their collection of 1950s cars.

I hear that Cubans will be allowed to buy toasters and ovens in 2010. Someday perhaps microwaves will be available. One can hope.

[bqkali]

I've only cruised the Caribbean once so there are still a ton of ports I haven't visited yet, so I wouldn't automatically book a cruise just because Cuba was on the itinerary. There are still lots of places for me to explore! However, if the rest of the itinerary looked good to me and there was a decent excursion offered in Cuba and the price was right, I would book it. I would not avoid Cuba because of its government or history.

[sail7seas]

Fidel and his brother are old men. Fidel a sick, old man. For how many more years can they rule? One can hope when they go, so will their regimes.

 

I'd love to see Cuba.

 

[emjsea]

I'd go for nothing more than top see what 47 years of brutal oppression does to a once thriving country...

You could go to China and see that.