Royal increases gratuities...will HAL follow?

RCL has announced gratuities from June 1 will rise to $12.95 per day, per guest in standard accommodations and $15.95 per day, per guest in suites.

Think HAL will follow?

RCL has announced gratuities from June 1 will rise to $12.95 per day, per guest in standard accommodations and $15.95 per day, per guest in suites.

 

Think HAL will follow?

I'm sure that eventually HAL will also increase the HSC..

I just wish they'd stop calling them gratuities and call them wage supplements.

I also wish they'd at least show them somewhere in the price quote. I remember seeing a post here where a new cruiser scrimped to surprise his DW with a cruise and only realized he was being dinged several hundred more when he went to check-in online.

I just wish they'd stop calling them gratuities and call them wage supplements.

 

I also wish they'd at least show them somewhere in the price quote. I remember seeing a post here where a new cruiser scrimped to surprise his DW with a cruise and only realized he was being dinged several hundred more when he went to check-in online.

I'm with you 110% on this one! I'm all in favor of HAL increasing the pay level for all onboard ship personnel, but would much rather see an across-the-board price (fare) increase or an up front add-on for the HSC ... sure would make planning a lot easier IMO ...

Rod

Right. Even experienced cruisers know it's there but can forget in the rush of watching cruise and airfares.

... I generally check my OBCs shortly before departure day to make sure I have enough "freebies" to at least cover the HSC ... not a perfect solution but it works for me ...

Rod

How long before someone uses increased gratuities as a reason for not packing formal wear :confused: Every other reason has been used up :rolleyes:

How long before someone uses increased gratuities as a reason for not packing formal wear :confused: Every other reason has been used up :rolleyes:

There will also be some who will use it as an excuse to smoke (the stress).

Hank

RCL has announced gratuities from June 1 will rise to $12.95 per day, per guest in standard accommodations and $15.95 per day, per guest in suites.

 

Think HAL will follow?

We can only speculate but my vote is 'sooner rather than later' and I'm okay with that as long as the additional revenue goes directly and totally to the crew.

Should be interesting to watch as HAL did not increase gratuities the previous time RCI increased theirs. Isn't HAL one of the cheaper hotel charges for cruise lines??

How long before someone uses increased gratuities as a reason for not packing formal wear :confused: Every other reason has been used up :rolleyes:

Or they will use the increase in the HSC as their reason for not paying the HSC. :mad:

HAL can't even get up their fall 2016 itineraries up at this time. What makes anyone think they will be thinking about increasing their employee's wages? Too busy running false sales (raising the lower priced cat. )and claiming to upgrade you for the same price!

Gratuities should have been added into the cruise fare long ago.

I think the higher the daily HSC goes, the stronger the case for increasing the cruise fare to include it.

Eventually HAL will raise their "Hotel Service Charge".

RCL has announced gratuities from June 1 will rise to $12.95 per day, per guest in standard accommodations and $15.95 per day, per guest in suites.

 

Think HAL will follow?

Why compare two totally different lines with very different products? I seriously doubt that HAL follows much of what RCL does at all.

What I think is that HAL will do what is in HAL's best interest. To provide a product that sells well to their target demographic. Fact: prices go up. Fact: We cruise, in 2015, for less than we did on our first cruise in 2003. (Facts are confusing)

As for rolling the gratuities into the cruise price...You are asking for HAL to commit suicide.

Case in point: Last year about this time Princess decided to try something different...their cruise pricing would include all taxes and port fees....not added on at the end. They tried it for about three months...and then it disappeared, not to return.

Cruise passengers are used to the way it is and do not manage change very well.

hmm this is interesting - up to $15 +/-? (for a suite)

Now the Signature Suites do not have the benefits of the Neptune Suites so I have long been baffled why they get charged the same as the Neptunes or Pinnacle Suite.

If it goes up to that price - that's a lot for a mass media line IMO (mind you we normally top up).

check out what Oceania charges for their HSC - not much more if you are in a PS (which is the equivalent to just a bit bigger than a Signature Suite) and that gives you a butler who takes care of your reservations, serves dinner, arranges meet and greets if you want, etc.

I am not saying that the staff are not worth it but......

I'll have a better chance to do a fair comparison in the fall and comment more accurately.

But right now, it seems hard to visualize this for a mass market line.

And sadly, I can see more people removing the HSC from their accounts since it will be even costlier for them.

We have not been fortunate enough to be on the "cheap" cruises, but based on what I have seen and what has been reported here, I can see the hsc costing more money than the cabins those sell off scenarios.

The only way gratuities will get rolled into the fare is if all the cruise lines do it at the same time, because any who don't will look cheaper at first glance, and benefit from the perception of being less expensive. It's a prisoner's dilemma, and probably only solvable by something similar to what happened in the airline industry in the US, with the government stepping in and making them roll all that stuff into the fare.

The only way gratuities will get rolled into the fare is if all the cruise lines do it at the same time, because any who don't will look cheaper at first glance, and benefit from the perception of being less expensive. It's a prisoner's dilemma, and probably only solvable by something similar to what happened in the airline industry in the US, with the government stepping in and making them roll all that stuff into the fare.

exactly - and, I don't know if I understood this correctly or not, but apparently if it is rolled into the fare the crew don't get the same amount as tax has to be involved? I probably have not said that right but it's something along those lines.

What the cruise lines need to do is to not make it so easy to remove them. It should be for a legitimate reason and not a nod and sure.

It's so unfair to the crew that have taken care of them for the entire cruise.

The only way gratuities will get rolled into the fare is if all the cruise lines do it at the same time, because any who don't will look cheaper at first glance, and benefit from the perception of being less expensive. It's a prisoner's dilemma, and probably only solvable by something similar to what happened in the airline industry in the US, with the government stepping in and making them roll all that stuff into the fare.

exactly - and, I don't know if I understood this correctly or not, but apparently if it is rolled into the fare the crew don't get the same amount as tax has to be involved? I probably have not said that right but it's something along those lines.

 

What the cruise lines need to do is to not make it so easy to remove them. It should be for a legitimate reason and not a nod and sure.

 

It's so unfair to the crew that have taken care of them for the entire cruise.

On May 26, 2008 Phillip217, who I believe is a Cruise Line Officer, discussed the History of Tipping & why the Cruise Lines cannot incorporate tips in your Cruise cost.. This is what he said..

"For all of those who whine and moan about just adding extra money to the price of the cruise and omitting tipping altogether, you may be surprised to learn that the cruise lines have actually considered that idea a few times over the past 100 years. If we did it, that money would be taxable and commissionable, reducing the net earnings of our crew rather substantially.Phillip answers several more questions throughout this thread ...His posts are very informative...I downloaded a couple of his posts into WORD, (4 pages)

Phillip goes on to explain what waiters make on most cruise lines.. He claims that all Crew are guaranteed a minimum wage in their contract: $1.00 per day plus tips with a minimum guarantee.. This is part of what he said:

"Most cruise line waiters are promised a MINIMUM GUARANTEED SALARY of around US$1600 - US$2200 PER MONTH."

Phillip says that when ships go into dry dock, if the & waiters have not made their guaranteed minimum the cruise line must put $$$ into the tipping pool..

This is the correct URL for one of Phillips posts, but I can't seem to pull up the entire thread..

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showpost.php?p=14792811&postcount=11

OK I was able to pull up the entire thread..Phillip's post was No. 11..

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=781623

I am sure they will ...

We too wish they would just add the price of gratuities into the cruise fare. That way it would be paid for BEFORE the cruise and it would also make it so everyone pays for them...verses opting out, as some do, because they supposedly pay all their tips in person. It would be better for all concerned to be paid upfront before the cruise. If there ends up being an issue that needs special attention...then so be it. :rolleyes:

Cruise lines usually follow one another. It shouldn't be long for HAL.

On May 26, 2008 Phillip217, who I believe is a Cruise Line Officer, discussed the History of Tipping & why the Cruise Lines cannot incorporate tips in your Cruise cost.. This is what he said..

 

"For all of those who whine and moan about just adding extra money to the price of the cruise and omitting tipping altogether, you may be surprised to learn that the cruise lines have actually considered that idea a few times over the past 100 years. If we did it, that money would be taxable and commissionable, reducing the net earnings of our crew rather substantially.Phillip answers several more questions throughout this thread ...His posts are very informative...I downloaded a couple of his posts into WORD, (4 pages)

 

... you may also want to read Eclecticist's response (Post #18 on the referenced Thread) to Phillip217's post. Eclecticist (correctly) points out:

"As far as commissions and taxes are concerned: Cruise lines have already proven they know how to add non-commissionable fees to cruises. (Anyone here heard of fuel surcharges?) And calling someone's income a tip doesn't exempt it from income tax in any country I know of; it just makes it easier to evade the tax if an employee is so inclined. So that last point doesn't really hold water."

Try as I might I cannot think of any legal impediment that constrains HAL and other cruise lines from adding a separate charge to the fare in lieu of the (non-mandatory) HSC. I believe it is purely a marketing consideration and has nothing to do with legalities, taxes or commissions.

I would like to see HAL increase the wages and salaries of its onboard ship personnel BUT cover the increased costs by means of a fare add-on the same as the fuel supplement ...

JMO,

Rod

I would imagine that the first cruise line to do it would be at a significant competitive disadvantage. Marketers know what works and what buttons to push to make a sale. It seems that "apparently" cheaper prices are a large factor for a significant percentage of their customers to the point that I expect that they are here to stay.

Hotels do this with Resort Fees, which in some places are |$30-$40 night on top of room charges ( and which certainly don't go towards staff tips etc). Airlines, as somebody pointed out already, did it until regulations forced a change but it still continues in the multiple ancillary fees that are associated with flying today and which contribute significantly to the bottom lines of most airlines ( baggage fees, charges for in flight entertainment, meals, seat selection etc., all of which were previously in the "quoted price")

And calling someone's income a tip doesn't exempt it from income tax in any country I know of; it just makes it easier to evade the tax if an employee is so inclined. So that last point doesn't really hold water.

Doesn't necessarily mean income taxes. There can be taxes on the fare price itself, whereas separating it out as a "service charge" might not be taxable. Mandatory charges might be taxed, but charges that are at the customer's discretion might not be.

IIRC, HAL is headquartered in Washington state, which has a B&O tax on gross business receipts, and I happen to know that the Washington state law which applies to restaurants is, "Tips or gratuities representing donations or gifts by customers under circumstances which are clearly voluntary are not part of the selling price and not subject to tax. However, mandatory additions to the price by the seller, whether labeled service charges, tips, gratuities or otherwise must be included in the selling price and are subject to both the retailing B&O and retail sales taxes." I'm not in a position to know what applies to cruise ships or hotels, but it's very possible that if HAL makes the HSC mandatory, it ends up becoming subject to more taxes.