This Thread Is To Be Used For All Discussions About HAL's On Board Smoking Policies

It reflects real life in the state where I live. In MA, there is no smoking permitted at anyone's workplace. Just about anywhere you go is someone's workplace. It varies by city and town but some do not allow smoking in parts, on the beach, on outdoor patio dining...... It is very inconvenient being a smoker in many states. There are hospitals that will not hire smokers and no smoking permitted on their property including parking lot.

 

Yes, but your country is one of many countries in the world. :) and most countries I have been in, it is not that restrictive. :)

At least you have a choice which suits you if you want a non-smoking balcony. We don't have a choice, or lets say we are limited to the extreme now. :)

But our choice has been taken away from us. Our choice was to sail HAL and now we are told frequently these days to cruise on another line because smokers want to come from those other cruise lines.

As Sail noted above, the restrictions on land are many, and where I live that includes no smoking on outdoor platforms at the train station or anywhere near public transit. Smokers here have adapted.

But our choice has been taken away from us. Our choice was to sail HAL and now we are told frequently these days to cruise on another line because smokers want to come from those other cruise lines.

 

As Sail noted above, the restrictions on land are many, and where I live that includes no smoking on outdoor platforms at the train station or anywhere near public transit. Smokers here have adapted.

Yes, I know in your country it is super restrictive but again there are tons of other countries where it is not so restrictive, lol. Just because it is restrictive in your country does not mean it has to be restrictive everywhere else. Especially with cruise ships who have many many nationalities on board.

My first choice was Princess and after the balcony ban, I chose HAL. This does not mean I love HAL. But I don't whine about it. :)

Just to avoid confusions, Lizzie and I live in two different countries. ;)

Just to avoid confusions, Lizzie and I live in two different countries. ;)

 

Shall we call it USA and Canada then. ;)

How many other countries in the world are there again? ;):D

I think it is 196.

Shall we call it USA and Canada then. ;)

 

How many other countries in the world are there again? ;):D

Indeed. We are two countries. :confused:

Yes, I know in your country it is super restrictive but again there are tons of other countries where it is not so restrictive, lol. Just because it is restrictive in your country does not mean it has to be restrictive everywhere else. Especially with cruise ships who have many many nationalities on board.

 

My first choice was Princess and after the balcony ban, I chose HAL. This does not mean I love HAL. But I don't whine about it. :)

Well, I never said you were whining but seeing as you mention it....... yes you are.

Not very reasonable when smokers tell us non-smoking verandah cruisers to go sail a different cruise line. That is a little too dismissive for my taste.

Yes there are extreme's on both sides of this issue.

I'm not sure it's true that many non-smokers want a totally smoke free ship. I don't. I think it reasonable that smokers should be provided an outdoor space where smoking is permitted that is sheltered from weather. They should also be able to smoke inside at a designated, well-ventilated location that can be easily avoided by non-smokers who do not wish to be exposed. I have no goal for a fully smoke free ship. I eagerly hope for smoker free verandahs.

 

I totally agree with you, despite having been called "vociferous" and "violenty opposed" by others on this thread. Nowhere did I say I want a smokeless ship. I just want a smokeless balcony. Others seem to translate that to such extreme metaphors. :rolleyes:

None of the bars at my home state switched to be non smoking because of the demand. Government forced them to do so. If government will lift the ban tomorrow they'll all switch back to allow smoke inside. I personally know few people that drive to casino that are located outside state line , because they allow you to smoke inside.

Well, I never said you were whining but seeing as you mention it....... yes you are.

Of course, lol :rolleyes:

Indeed. We are two countries. :confused:

 

yes, i realised afterwards, that's why I said USA and Canada which makes it 2 then in that case....ummm, it still leaves around 194 other countries where the smoking policy is not taken to such an extreme ;)

But convenient to non-smokers they never mention other issues which damage human mankind much more :rolleyes:

Sort of double standard and all this crying out for outdoor smoking ban should be weighed against other harmful substances, it puts it much more into perspective then.

I totally agree with you, despite having been called "vociferous" and "violenty opposed" by others on this thread. Nowhere did I say I want a smokeless ship. I just want a smokeless balcony. Others seem to translate that to such extreme metaphors. :rolleyes:

Of course. You say that you don't want smoking on balconies. The smokers see that as not wanting smoking anywhere. Then you get told to vacation elsewhere or that you are an over the top nut case. Meanwhile the smokers are a gentle bunch that are as sweet as pie..

None of the bars at my home state switched to be non smoking because of the demand. Government forced them to do so. If government will lift the ban tomorrow they'll all switch back to allow smoke inside. I personally know few people that drive to casino that are located outside state line , because they allow you to smoke inside.

They drive across the state line to smoke? Is that something to be proud of?

yes, i realised afterwards, that's why I said USA and Canada which makes it 2 then in that case....ummm, it still leaves around 194 other countries where the smoking policy is not taken to such an extreme ;)

 

But convenient to non-smokers they never mention other issues which damage human mankind much more :rolleyes:

 

Sort of double standard and all this crying out for outdoor smoking ban should be weighed against other harmful substances, it puts it much more into perspective then.

There is no double standard. We are dealing with smoking on a cruise ship here. We can't deal with issues that are not cruise-related. That happens in another part of our lives. I am sure many posters are into health and wellness and safety in all other aspects.;)

Farting is also legal, but just like smoking, it is socially unacceptable.

I would not think of farting on my balcony because no one should be subjected to it. Why should I be subjected to the second hand smoke of others? No one has the right to pollute the air that I breathe.

This is another reminder about the topic of this thread. Please note, in particular, the paragraph in red.

We have established this thread to be the "go to" thread for all discussions pertaining to Holland America's on board smoking policies. This thread is intended to make it easier for all Cruise Critic members to discuss these policies and any future changes thereto.

 

Here's a link to HAL's policy summary Shipboard Life: Is smoking allowed on board? - Click on "Shipboard Life" and a drop down menu will appear. Click on "On Board Policies" in that menu and you'll see the last question is "Is smoking allowed on board?"

 

Here's the currently posted policy (as of August 9, 2014):

 

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Is Smoking Allowed On Board?

For the comfort of all of our guests, all staterooms (cabins), showrooms and most other indoor areas are designated non-smoking. While smoking is not permitted in staterooms, guests are allowed to smoke on stateroom verandahs. Smoking is also permitted on certain other designated, outside decks. The designated smoking areas for all ships are as follows unless otherwise noted.

 

 

• Stateroom verandahs
  
• Casino (Active players only)
  
• Seaview Bar
  
• Outside Decks
  
  • Sports Deck
    
  • Observation Deck (ms Prinsendam, ms Eurodam, ms Nieuw Amsterdam, ms Noordam, ms Oosterdam, ms Westerdam, and ms Zuiderdam only)
    

   

 

Cigar and pipe smoking is not allowed anywhere inside the ship; it is only permitted on the outside decks where smoking is otherwise allowed and on stateroom verandahs. Electronic cigarettes are permitted in staterooms but not in other public areas of the ship other than on outside decks designated as smoking areas.

 

 

Any guest who smokes inside staterooms in violation of our policy will be charged a US$250 cleaning fee per day of violation.

 

----

 

Reminders.

 

1. Our community guidelines continue to apply to this thread.

 

2. This is a forum for discussions of cruising and associated topics. It is not a forum for discussing the health, economics and public policy aspects of smoking, whether associated with cigarettes, pipes, cigars or controlled substances (marijuana).

 

3. Discussions of this approach to smoking posts and other board policies are off topic and will be removed. Please post discussions of this approach for smoking posts to this thread: Single Smoking Thread on the HAL Board - a Sticky

 

Thanks for your understanding and continued participation on the Cruise Critic forums.

PLEASE stay on topic and not on the health, economic or public policy aspects of smoking.

Good point. In all our many smoking threads, I don't recall anyone saying just this. Thanks for pointing it out.

HAL most certainly can ban verandah smoking at any time they wish.

This would be a really good time. :)

...HAL most certainly can ban verandah smoking at any time they wish....

Thanks.

Maybe the shrinking client base is caused by the nonsmokers leaving for a smoke free balcony on another cruise line.

Plenty of smokers have also left since indoor smoking was banned.

It's not that many years since smoking was permitted in staterooms and one of the bars.

There is NO provision if outside decks are closed due to bad weather.

HAL most certainly can ban verandah smoking at any time they wish.

That's what this thread is intended to discuss.

 

Thanks.

Walt, do you really mean to be limiting this thread to veranda smoking only, which is what your statement says?

I understood this thread was for a full discussion of smoking on board the ships, which would include all places where it is currently allowed, where else it should be eliminated, and where else on board it should be allowed.

Walt, do you really mean to be limiting this thread to veranda smoking only, which is what your statement says?

 

I understood this thread was for a full discussion of smoking on board the ships, which would include all places where it is currently allowed, where else it should be eliminated, and where else on board it should be allowed.

You are right, of course, but the thread keeps drifting (like cigarette smoke) off topic to a discussion of smoking in general and not about HAL's smoking policies.

HAL's management has only one goal- to make money for Carnival shareholders. If they thought being one of the only cruise lines to allow balcony smoking was resulting in loss of $$$ they would have already banned it. At this point they must think it is helping, not hurting, their bottom line. Maybe in the future that will change, but it's not HAL's responsibility to make policy for any reason but to make a profit. Pax move to other cruise lines for many reason. Many of the vehement anti-smoking pax here on CC are still sailing HAL anyway. All HAL management is meant to care about is selling balconies at good rates, not which pax are leaving if they are have a net gain in balcony bookings with their smoking allowed policy. It's a business.

What constitutes a vehement anti smoker? I'm definitely against balcony smoking and I have no cruises booked with hal right now. I keep hearing this from smokers but is it really true? I recall when hal banned cabin smoking and smokers said they would leave. I bet very few did. The loudest poster is still puffing away on a hal ship. I fully expect hal to announce an end to balcony smoking sometime after the world cruise leaves. Time will tell.