Breaking News !! RCCL to review Gratuities

[RetireeWannabee]

It isn't our culture that dictates tipping it is the corporation. Most restraunts pay their wait staff approx $2/hour which is supposed to cover payroll/income taxes on their tips. I would venture to guess that European wait staff are paid more than that and it is enough to live on which is why they don't need tips.

 

Our last Celebrity (Med/Europe) cruise our tips were automatically included on our seapass account. However, we were also able to "opt out" of the auto gratuity and hand out tips the old fashioned way. It was an all or nothing. I seem to remember that we paid the auto and supplemented those that went above and beyond. We had great service the entire trip.

Disagree.

 

wouldn't be the corporation if it weren't the culture. what restaurant have you been to lately that forbids tipping? That pays more than $10/hr to servers? It's not company by company, it's The Custom to make servers tipped employees.

 

might be state by state, but around here, a server is guaranteed to make minimum wage but has an hourly rate of, I dunno, under $3. if their tips + hourly rate don't make min, the restaurant makes up the difference. next time someone whines "I only make $2/hr" then point out to them that their employer will subsidize them until they are good enuf to make it on tips.

 

sorry, that was snarky. rough day

[luckyprincess]

Coming from someone that used to wait tables for tips, I have to say that the mandatory service charge won't make service go down. See, these folks have been working for tips for too long - they will always try to outdo themselves to get a bit more. I gave excellent service, usually straddled an average of 20% - 25% in tips each night. It was a great living in a really fun atomsphere with future doctors, lawyers, nurses, marketers, actors and artists. Such great conversations! There were times we could place an 'auto-grat' on the bill, for instance if the party was for 6 people or more - and EVERY server I know did a little dance in their head before applying it. You look at the people, where they may be from, how they are bossing you about, if they seem happy, and a million other little things before you decide to apply it. Often times it was exciting, like gambling. I remember putting an autograt on a table that was clearly visiting from elsewhere and although myself and my assistant gave really good service (very demanding peeps) they still looked postively SHOCKED at the auto gratiuty. They asked for it to be taken off and when the manager asked if the service was not up to par they said it was great but that they weren't accustomed to tipping:eek:. Luckily, he told them he could not remove it for that reason and it stood.

I know that I, and most every other server I've ever worked with (all nationalities, many cities) just want to be compensated. We will work just as hard (most all) with a table whether gratuity is included or not. Because, after all, there is always a line for extra tip! :) And who doesn't want to make the most money they can at work?:confused:

[dbowe5]

I've also read, not experienced first hand, that many Europeans can be very demanding for exceptional service and will start deducting from the hotel bill or other statements where service is involved for any perceived shortcomings or problems. I don't know many Americans who would do that.

 

Isn't that a bit of a sweeping statement, when you have admitted that you haven't experienced it first hand. :confused:

 

Anyone, wherever they come from has a right to expect good service. I for one will tip handsomely when it's deserved but will still give the minimum tip even if the service isn't up to scratch.

 

I feel the problem with tipping for anyone outside of america is that it's a relatively alien concept to us (albeit it is becoming more common in the UK and europe now), so maybe it's a culture thing rather than being tightwads!! Personally, I tend to overtip - I've been on 5 cruises and countless holidays in the US and still get confused over tipping - so I usually leave 20%:)

[coxswain]

I've also read, not experienced first hand, that many Europeans can be very demanding for exceptional service and will start deducting from the hotel bill or other statements where service is involved for any perceived shortcomings or problems. I don't know many Americans who would do that.

 

 

 

Well if you're happy to pay for poor service good on ya lol

 

 

 

 

 

jj.....

[Happy_Traveler02]

Disagree.

 

wouldn't be the corporation if it weren't the culture. what restaurant have you been to lately that forbids tipping? That pays more than $10/hr to servers? It's not company by company, it's The Custom to make servers tipped employees.

 

might be state by state, but around here, a server is guaranteed to make minimum wage but has an hourly rate of, I dunno, under $3. if their tips + hourly rate don't make min, the restaurant makes up the difference. next time someone whines "I only make $2/hr" then point out to them that their employer will subsidize them until they are good enuf to make it on tips.

 

sorry, that was snarky. rough day

 

Actually it is not state by state as the Federal Minimum Wage law is nationwide, but you are right the corporation makes up the difference. That being said, if the corporation has to make up the difference too much the wait staff simply gets fired. The food service industry have very small margins and this is one of the ways they make up for it by having the customer pay for service directly.

By the way there are some companies that serve but pay their wait staff by the hour and not in tips. McAlister's, Pizza Hut and Newks are good examples of this. But they are also a hybrid - you order your meal then go to your table and the wait staff brings your food, refills your drink etc. There still is a good deal of service involved and they aren't tipped for it. So I still say it's the company and not the culture.

 

I do have a question though to all the non Americans - Are there any American chains (sit down, not fast food) where you are? If so, do they pay thier wait staff a salary or do y'all tip at those estabilishments? Just curious.

[lovemylab]

I would like to see the tips included in the price of the cruise (or at the very least automatically added to the seapass account once onboard) and then if we wish to tip extra we can.

 

I don't feel it will result in a lower level of service. The suggested tip amount is very small and I would think staff would want to offer great service so they can earn additional tips.

 

As for the head waiter, he/she absolutely deserves to be tipped. Just because you don't see them doesn't mean they aren't doing their job. When you ask your waiter for a special request (i.e. food item that is not on the menu) it is normally the head waiter that is communicating this with the kitchen. If you are receiving great service from your wait team then this is a reflection of the head waiter. On our first cruise we couldn't find our head waiter on the last night. We asked where he was and someone pointed us towards his direction. He was in a private dining area putting out a small fire in a chafing dish :eek:

[temple1]

Isn't that a bit of a sweeping statement, when you have admitted that you haven't experienced it first hand. :confused:

 

Anyone, wherever they come from has a right to expect good service. I for one will tip handsomely when it's deserved but will still give the minimum tip even if the service isn't up to scratch.

 

I feel the problem with tipping for anyone outside of america is that it's a relatively alien concept to us (albeit it is becoming more common in the UK and europe now), so maybe it's a culture thing rather than being tightwads!! Personally, I tend to overtip - I've been on 5 cruises and countless holidays in the US and still get confused over tipping - so I usually leave 20%:)

 

You are correct - I should have written some. I don't mean tipping - this is on the actual charges for hotel rooms, meals, etc. There are more and more reports about a certain nationality and their spending habits as tourists.

 

 

Well if you're happy to pay for poor service good on ya lol

 

 

 

 

 

jj.....

 

 

Didn't say tips - I'm talking about the charge for the hotel room or dinner - not the tip. How often do you keep a list of every little item you are unhappy with in a hotel room and take it to the front desk asking for an adjustment on the bill?

[carhirer]

Disagree.

 

wouldn't be the corporation if it weren't the culture. what restaurant have you been to lately that forbids tipping? That pays more than $10/hr to servers? It's not company by company, it's The Custom to make servers tipped employees.

 

might be state by state, but around here, a server is guaranteed to make minimum wage but has an hourly rate of, I dunno, under $3. if their tips + hourly rate don't make min, the restaurant makes up the difference. next time someone whines "I only make $2/hr" then point out to them that their employer will subsidize them until they are good enuf to make it on tips.

 

sorry, that was snarky. rough day

 

So that means that tipping benefits the employer. One of the reasons why this ridiculous system should be removed

[carhirer]

It might be true that mandatory tipping will reduce the quality of service but currently we have waiters grovelling and constantly hovering over us in a bid to secure tips. Their behaviour (particularly the head waiter's) is OTT. And don't forget, if one server "goes that extra mile" for a big tipper, he is spending less time on others. If a bartender pours an extra large drink for a big tipper, is that honest or healthy?

 

They should do what other businesses do. Pay the required wage, quote a proper price and require their managers, not the customers, to manage the staff.

 

Ultimately the only losers will be the "Lady Bountifuls" (of both sexes) who like to hand out largesse.

[carhirer]

I do have a question though to all the non Americans - Are there any American chains (sit down, not fast food) where you are? If so, do they pay thier wait staff a salary or do y'all tip at those estabilishments? Just curious.

 

We have lots of American chains like TGIF, PizzaHut, and a number of smaller franchises. Restaurants tend to follow the local custom.

 

The understanding in the UK is that staff get a lowish wage and expect/hope for a 10% tip if the service is good. I suspect that on average they get less. In some expensive restaurants they add an automatic 12.5% or 15% service charge. In some cases they add a suggested gratuity which you can remove if you wish.

 

So although we Brits complain about the US custom, it is simply a question of degree. We have exactly the same system but not as extreme.

 

Interestingly, UK employers have been taking account of tips when paying minimum wage but a recent court case ruled that that is illegal. Employers will now have to pay minimum wage and any tips will be extra. So unless their lawyers come up with some devious solution, staff wages will have to go up, and so will prices. It remains to be seen whether all this becomes transparent such that customers will not be expected to pay the higher price and continue to tip.

 

In Europe things are much more civilised but also confusing. The local advice is that tipping is not expected as wages are adequate. You then get contradictory advice about leaving small change which is clearly an insult in anybody's book. Also, if you read a guidebook by a Brit or American author you can see contradictory advice creeping in. However, in certain tourist areas, ie precisely the areas where cruisers will go on a day trip, waiters will be only too happy to encourage tipping! So it seems that the American custom is adopted where there are American tourists! This is in addition to the practice of bringing out a different price list when the cruise ship is in town!

[dmndlil]

I just have to get his off my chest - The one person I usually hate tipping is the Matre D. In almost all of my cruises no matter what line it is - we don't see the Matre D at all - never comes to the table - except for the very last night when - yes when we are handing out tips. Perhaps I don't understand what that job entails. We still tip him, but not sure what it is for. He should be on salary instead. My 2 cents.

 

You tip the Maitre' D? We have always tipped the waiter, assistant waiter and the head waiter, but never the Maitre'D. Only once did we not tip the head waiter, as we never saw him, even on the last night! :rolleyes:

[temple1]

So it seems that the American custom is adopted where there are American tourists! This is in addition to the practice of bringing out a different price list when the cruise ship is in town!

 

LOL - I have to agree with your last statement. I live in a resort area and you can tell without looking at the calendar that it is tourist season once again the grocery prices and gas goes up!

[RenieRaider]

I really wish they would just include the tips in the price, like they do the port charges, then if people wanted to give more they could, but everyone would get the suggested amount, lots less confusion

 

I agree! Just put it into the Cruise Fare price...

[link99]

I'am 100% for prepaying the tips.

[Happy_Traveler02]

We have lots of American chains like TGIF, PizzaHut, and a number of smaller franchises. Restaurants tend to follow the local custom.

 

The understanding in the UK is that staff get a lowish wage and expect/hope for a 10% tip if the service is good. I suspect that on average they get less. In some expensive restaurants they add an automatic 12.5% or 15% service charge. In some cases they add a suggested gratuity which you can remove if you wish.

 

So although we Brits complain about the US custom, it is simply a question of degree. We have exactly the same system but not as extreme.

 

Interestingly, UK employers have been taking account of tips when paying minimum wage but a recent court case ruled that that is illegal. Employers will now have to pay minimum wage and any tips will be extra. So unless their lawyers come up with some devious solution, staff wages will have to go up, and so will prices. It remains to be seen whether all this becomes transparent such that customers will not be expected to pay the higher price and continue to tip.

 

In Europe things are much more civilised but also confusing. The local advice is that tipping is not expected as wages are adequate. You then get contradictory advice about leaving small change which is clearly an insult in anybody's book. Also, if you read a guidebook by a Brit or American author you can see contradictory advice creeping in. However, in certain tourist areas, ie precisely the areas where cruisers will go on a day trip, waiters will be only too happy to encourage tipping! So it seems that the American custom is adopted where there are American tourists! This is in addition to the practice of bringing out a different price list when the cruise ship is in town!

 

Thank you for explaining that. I appreciate the information.

[drarill]

This is the full text if you have problems with the original link

 

 

A major US cruise line is considering an overhaul of its on board tipping arrangements due to the reluctance of British passengers to pay gratuities to staff.

Royal Caribbean International vice president and UK managing director Robin Shaw disclosed that the payment of gratuities to renumerate cruise ship employees had become a “significant issue”.

Speaking at the first Cruise Forum as part of the ABTA Travel Convention in Barcelona, Shaw said the company was experiencing a “huge cultural difference” between US passengers who are used to tipping for service and those from the UK who are not.

He admitted that cruise ship staff received far less tips when British passengers are on board.

This comes at a time when the company is committing one of its largest ships, Independence of the Seas, to year-round ex-UK sailings from the end of next year and introducing the first summer season of Celebrity Cruises' departures from Southampton on new ship Celebrity Eclipse in 2010.

Addressing the issue of paying gratuities – seen by UK consumers as a negative to taking a cruise – Shaw said: “We are evaluating what our options can be in the UK. This is certainly a challenge for us and one we have to address.”

His comments came as part of a wider discussion on add-ons cruise companies charge on top of the holiday price for items such as speciality restaurant meals and other extras.

Shaw said it was almost impossible to cost everything into the up front price, but it was a “commercial reality” that on board revenue was a key component for cruise lines to recover their return on investment .

Journalist Jane Archer, cruise writer for the Daily Telegraph, had pinpointed gratuities and on board add-ons as among the “turn-offs” for cruise passengers, saying that there was a perception that people were paying for more things as lines added optional extras to new ships.

She described cruise line tipping polices as “antiquated” and something that can lead to resentment and upset amongst travellers

 

We were on the IOS in June and many crew members complain to us about the tips. Our suite attendant, waiter, and many others are moving to the Oasis. Although they like the IOS they were not happy with the idea of sailing out of Southampton during the winter, next year.

We used MTD and had to prepay our gratuities, they gave us some bouchers and we added cash on the envelopes that we gave to our suite attendant, waiter and ass. waiter. The head waiter didn't get any extra cash.

At the end of the cruise I emailed RCCL and suggested a change in the gratuities policy in European cruises. If they know that there is an "issue" with the payment of tips by the british passangers, RCCL should do something about it.

When we go to Spain, we have the opposite problem, our friends don't let us tip a 15-20%. In London we paid over $85 for three personal pizzas, one pasta and four cokes in Pizza Hut, I didn't feel like leaving a $15 tip.

[sidari]

Of the 2 RCI cruises we have taken we have pre paid tips due to having MTD which is a good idea plus it also gives you an option as we did if you so desire to also Add to what is being given in vouchers to the people concerned.

 

We did have an issue on the last cruise on the Vision in sofar as that we didnt feel the Head waiter should have got his! .... our reasons were that he was never around hardly and while people in some cases waited upto 45 minutes for a table despite empty uncleared tables it appeared more important to have the waiters polishing cutlery! ... surely part of his job is to make sure the tables are cleared and ready for people? and to organise waiters and assistants to get that particular job done.

 

With regard to the Independance of the seas RCI should maybe just Add the tips to the Stateroom account and that way the crew know they will get a set figure, what people have to remember who are not from the UK is that tipping is not the norm nor has it ever been and sometimes it takes a little while to educate people in the ways of cruising.

 

Though if the cruise lines paid a decent wage there would not be this issue.

[ikirumata]

You tip the Maitre' D? We have always tipped the waiter, assistant waiter and the head waiter, but never the Maitre'D. Only once did we not tip the head waiter, as we never saw him, even on the last night! :rolleyes:

 

Wait...I must have been mistaken. I think I tipped the head waiter (the one responsible for training the waitstaff and the one who was so cordial to us as we were leaving). Now I think of it, I don't remember any time where I interacted with the Maitre' D other than him telling us that we couldnt switch dining times. I also do think that there was a tipping envelope for him. I am all confused... Maybe there IS a need to revamp the system :p

[steerage]

We just returned from a Carnival cruise and were not happy to find that every receipt you signed had an automatic gratuity and your final bill had gratuities charged at $70 each for the 2 of us for the week covering all but the Matri'd (sp) We never saw or heard from him, so we didnt fill in the envelope. Our experience was that if the bar and wait staff get an automatic tip, it is SO TRUE that they do not try or go out of their way and some we found were rude. Now, you can stand in line a couple hours and protest some of the charges, but good luck on a friendly attitude. On our last Rccl trip our table mates were Britt's and they had absolutely no problem writing in the tips on bar tickets.

[luckyprincess]

We just returned from a Carnival cruise and were not happy to find that every receipt you signed had an automatic gratuity and your final bill had gratuities charged at $70 each for the 2 of us for the week covering all but the Matri'd (sp) We never saw or heard from him, so we didnt fill in the envelope. Our experience was that if the bar and wait staff get an automatic tip, it is SO TRUE that they do not try or go out of their way and some we found were rude. Now, you can stand in line a couple hours and protest some of the charges, but good luck on a friendly attitude. On our last Rccl trip our table mates were Britt's and they had absolutely no problem writing in the tips on bar tickets.

It's the same on RCCL. All bar chits have added grats. And I paid $68 for each person in prepaid grats. Sounds the same to me as the other. If you think about it for all of the service you got for every meal it was $10 a day. That's tiny - and I can't think of anyone that would want to stiff $3.33 per meal to any server....:confused:

[temple1]

It's the same on RCCL. All bar chits have added grats. And I paid $68 for each person in prepaid grats. Sounds the same to me as the other. If you think about it for all of the service you got for every meal it was $10 a day. That's tiny - and I can't think of anyone that would want to stiff $3.33 per meal to any server....:confused:

 

It is really less than that. The $10 includes your cabin attendent.

[kimberley]

I am a Brit and get fed up hearing that we dont tip yes we do tip. What annoys me so much is the fact that as a Brit I am discrimimated against. We get charged higher prices for our cruise. We can not receive residency discounts, cannnot receive law inforcement discount or military discount. Our deposits are NON REFUNDABLE why because Rccl say we are a different culture and market. So guys give us a break. You would all moan if Rccl took away ALL your discounts and then charged you $50 for your price reduction! Kimberley

[luckyprincess]

It is really less than that. The $10 includes your cabin attendent.

Oh yeah. Excellent point Temple.

[luckyprincess]

I am a Brit and get fed up hearing that we dont tip yes we do tip. What annoys me so much is the fact that as a Brit I am discrimimated against. We get charged higher prices for our cruise. We can not receive residency discounts, cannnot receive law inforcement discount or military discount. Our deposits are NON REFUNDABLE why because Rccl say we are a different culture and market. So guys give us a break. You would all moan if Rccl took away ALL your discounts and then charged you $50 for your price reduction! Kimberley

Kimberley, I agree it's not fair how you aren't treated the same in all of the ways you mentioned. I just don't understand it!

I will say, though, that if they are reporting a problem with servers staying because they aren't reciving gratuities on IOS then they should look into the problem. Regardless of who the culprits are (lots of people travel to cruise, it can't all be just British folks) they do need to deal with the issue before they are left with no staff at all!:eek:

[Hobiecat01]

Stepping up...

 

Tipping is one of those things that for most, there is no perfect answer. Some people see tipping as someone trying to get a dollar for nothing. Those of us who have worked in the food service industry understand working very hard to please some people who just cannot be pleased... those that find fault in the way a napkin is folded, a fork tine bent, and cut the tip to the wait staff to punish that person for the ills of the world.

 

DW and I do not mind tipping and in some situations tipping way over the norm for honest, good service... the crewperson who goes out of their way to do something for you and helps make your cruise that much more memorable. Lately we have even brought an inexpensive gift along to personally give to certain crew who's service was memorable. (a T-Shirt from your hometown, a phone card) You would be AMAZED at the response! We had one lady who broke down in tears she was so gratefull! Also we always try to fill out what we call "Aatta Boy/Girl" cards to turn into the cruiseline.

 

I guess we have to understand that to most of these crew, we are very rich in their eyes. Of course most of us are not, by any means, but to them we are. We also feel that the cost of being kind to those being kind to you is very, very low. We will continue to reward those that make our cruise more enjoyable.

 

Stepping down from the soapbox...

-----------------

Sea ya!

Ron and Lee

Canton, Ga

RCCL Platinum Member

"In wine there is wisdom, in beer there is freedom,

in water there is bacteria." – Ben Franklin

Previous Cruises – 59 Days at Sea!

Carnival Mardis Gras - 3 Day Bahamas - April 1982

Carnival Destiny - 7 Days Western Carib. - April 1998

Princess Grand Princess - 7 Days Eastern Carib. - April 1999

Princess Sea Princess - 7 Days Western Carib. - March 2000

Princess Grand Princess - 7 Days Western Carib. - March 2002

RCCL Navigator of the Seas - 7 Days Western Carib. - March 2003

RCCL Mariner of the Seas - 7 Days Western Carib. - April 2005

RCCL Freedom of the Seas - 7 Days Western Carib. - 6/18 - 6/25/2006

RCCL Liberty of the Seas - 7 Days Eastern Carib. - 7/19 - 7/26/08

Planned Cruises

RCCL Oasis of the Seas – Our Friends Cruise - April 17, 2010

RCCL Allure of the Seas – Our Neighborhood Cruise - 2011

The BIG One - Southeast Asia 14 day – 2012?

Princess Cruises - The Med – 14 day – 2013?