Are Azamara ships sailing full?

[Jade13]

I must first preface I am a TA. First off bad economy globally , issues politically globally, environmental disasters these all effect decisions to travel.

 

I was on Costa in Asia this March - April picked the trip not for Costa / cruising experience but the itinerary was awesome only cruise line that made 4 stops in Japan on a 14 day Asia cruise. I got a heck of a deal non agent rate was awesome 2 cabin up grade and single $1,200.00. It was hardly a luxury product / cruise more of a basic European Tourist Class Experience like staying at tourist class hotels in Europe but the outcome was a wonderful trip saw things I wanted to see met some great people on board the ship.

 

The glass / ship is half full look at the positive way :) Happy cruising to all

 

HSB248 / Hugh / aka MSU

 

Right, but new pricing on Azamara (after April 2011) is $4,449.00pp for least expensive Verandah on a 12 night itinerary (Europe not Caribbean), not $1,200.00.

 

I know for a fact some TA's still have group pricing despite a TA I have used telling me they are no more and Azamara will only hold the group prices for 150 days. Two separate people emailed me to join them in Asia next March at $2,000.00pp Azamara Verandah and one persons TA had this same cruise for $3,200.00pp including all taxes AND Airfare from the US AND $1,000.00 OBC. How is this possible?

 

I guess as a TA you have access to how full the ships are? I am actually concerned this line will not stay in business if they do not make a profit soon.

[RANTHEMAN]

MSU...I don't think that there are very many on CC who have a negative view of the AZ experience and certainly not me. We did the 14 day Best of Italy in 2008 and had a wonderful experience. The controversy here is the fact that AZ in essence has doubled the cost of that experience.

Is it worth that price or is it not? A couple here say yea,yea,yea while it seems to me many,including me,say nay.

 

Perhaps I have a bit different perspective since we don't cruise multiple times each year nor even every year. I am a discerning consumer and despite our wonderful cruise in 2008, I do not believe it is worth double that price.

 

I think it was the abrupt and large increase in fares that is troubling. You know the old proverb...If you drop a frog in a pan of boiling water he will immediately jump out..However if you put him into a pan of cool water and bring it slowly to a boil,he will stay there and cook,

 

Perhaps AZ should have used a more gradual tactic.

 

Cheers:)

[sawsea27]

Rantheman I love your analogy...I was one of the posters here deemed negative...yet I never degraded the azamara experience...on the contrary I had said numerous times that we loved the experience and wish for some easing of the rates so we could continue to enjoy it...

 

and I believe there will be some easing...just wonder if there will be enough....for example we have the carib booked for a winter cruise...it has come down somewhat...and a very good OBC...the ship is still all open for reservations..at the same time we have the celebrity equinox booked...yes all things taken into account it is half the price...all things taken into account, I repeat..

 

so as you said...is the azamara experience worth twice the price?

 

it will be very difficult to say yes, when the date of final payment comes...unless that gap lessens...

[lonestarsteve]

MSU...I don't think that there are very many on CC who have a negative view of the AZ experience and certainly not me. We did the 14 day Best of Italy in 2008 and had a wonderful experience. The controversy here is the fact that AZ in essence has doubled the cost of that experience.

Is it worth that price or is it not? A couple here say yea,yea,yea while it seems to me many,including me,say nay.

 

Perhaps I have a bit different perspective since we don't cruise multiple times each year nor even every year. I am a discerning consumer and despite our wonderful cruise in 2008, I do not believe it is worth double that price.

 

I think it was the abrupt and large increase in fares that is troubling. You know the old proverb...If you drop a frog in a pan of boiling water he will immediately jump out..However if you put him into a pan of cool water and bring it slowly to a boil,he will stay there and cook,

 

Perhaps AZ should have used a more gradual tactic.

 

Cheers:)

 

Ratheman...Very well put. We have traveled with Az many times in the last two years and have now found ourselves in the position of looking at other small ship opportunities even though we love both the ships and the itineraries. We have also noted less communication rather than more from Azamara corporate for past passenger opportunities:rolleyes:

[blackfoot]

RANTHEMAN, perhaps you should move on and get your 50% discount on a much better cruise value somewhere else!

[greeneg]

MSU...I don't think that there are very many on CC who have a negative view of the AZ experience and certainly not me. We did the 14 day Best of Italy in 2008 and had a wonderful experience. The controversy here is the fact that AZ in essence has doubled the cost of that experience.

Is it worth that price or is it not? A couple here say yea,yea,yea while it seems to me many,including me,say nay.

 

Perhaps I have a bit different perspective since we don't cruise multiple times each year nor even every year. I am a discerning consumer and despite our wonderful cruise in 2008, I do not believe it is worth double that price.

 

I think it was the abrupt and large increase in fares that is troubling. You know the old proverb...If you drop a frog in a pan of boiling water he will immediately jump out..However if you put him into a pan of cool water and bring it slowly to a boil,he will stay there and cook,

 

Perhaps AZ should have used a more gradual tactic.

 

Cheers:)

 

I have to agree. I hardly think, if you look through my previous posts, that I really could be anything other than an Azamara Advocate; our three best cruises have been on Azamara. But, when I look at booking a cruise, the first thing that I do is to break out the costs on a per person per night basis and then double it ( my wife and I go together. Period). When the basic cost is $740/cabin/night, and then you tell me that it is really supposed to be $1480/per cabin/night, I have ( I think ) a reason to think that someone, somewheres here is being disingenuous. These sort of fares are not far from Crystal's Fares and I would have to question that, as much as I do like and have enjoyed the Azamara Experience, it is not a fair comparison with Crystal. The two are apples and oranges for sure.

 

We want very much to continue our relationship with Azamara, but right now, I have serious doubts for the future, and I strongly suspect that I am not the only one in this position.

[RANTHEMAN]

blackfoot I am sorry that my opinions bother you. If you are content to pay the current fares,wonderful. I am not and I am entitled to express my opinions as are you.So why don't you make your reservations,pay your money and stop reading these boards.

 

Nevertheless,the myriad special deals that AZ is constantly offering would indicate that you are in a small minority.

 

Just returned from the mailbox where (surprise) I got another AZ 8x10 glossy. It offers for all cruises Apr. 2011 trru May 2012:

 

2 for 1 fares

50% savings on pre-booked excursions

Gratuities included

$2000 Early Booking Savings on reservations made by Dec.31,2010.

 

Hmmmm,blackfoot!!

[blackfoot]

Rathman,you now have your deal!

[Paulchili]

Ratheman...Very well put. We have traveled with Az many times in the last two years and have now found ourselves in the position of looking at other small ship opportunities even though we love both the ships and the itineraries.:rolleyes:

 

We all know the pain of recent price increases on Azamara; we all would love to have kept them at the level they were.

Wasn't it wonderfull to have essentially the same cruise experience as the one on Oceania but for half the price? What is wrong with that picture?

If you cannot guess the answer - it is that Azamara was not making any/enough money to remain afloat. It was their way to introduce a new product and gain recognition and loyalty; but that level of pricing could not be sustained (unless much else was compromised).

If you are looking at smaller ships (and I will exclude Silversea and Seabourn for obvious reasons) than you are essentially left wit R ships on Oceania and Princess. Prices between O & A are very competitive; you can probably get a lower fare on Princess, but that would be a different experience from Azamara.

What other choices do you see (other than large ship mass market cruise lines)?

[greeneg]

I agree, Paulchili, that the former R class ships are ideal in size and compliment for my preferences in cruising. Having said that, I think that it is only fair to point out that the two Crystal Ships, are only approximately 30% larger in both size and passenger capacity, which makes them far from the Megaship Category.

 

I just think that Azamara cannot expect to charge rates in comparison with Crystal. I cannot help but wishing that Celebrity had simply created a role within that line for the smaller ships with Celebrity standards of food, service, amentities, and hopefully, pricing. I think that that would have made a lot of Celebrity cruisers who do not care for the "boom-boom" megaship experience more than happy.

 

Just me musing I guess. We just may have to pay more and cruise less......BUT, it will not necessarily be spent with Azamara, they are certainly not the only game in this particular category.

 

And that does still leave me saddened and a little frustrated.

[California Native]

If you are looking at smaller ships (and I will exclude Silversea and Seabourn for obvious reasons) than you are essentially left wit R ships on Oceania and Princess. Prices between O & A are very competitive; you can probably get a lower fare on Princess, but that would be a different experience from Azamara.

What other choices do you see (other than large ship mass market cruise lines)?

 

Hi Paul...

Just thought you might find this interesting....

You probably remember that I'm a Princess Cheerleader

so my 1st inclination would be to book Princess over

Azamara. I've already spent several months on the Pacific Princess and feel very at home on her.

The Princess HolyLand Cruises on a R ship this year are pricing out HIGHER than Azamara current rates on my Nov 3rd Azamara Holy Land.

AND the Princess rates don't include gratuities, wine and speciality coffees

Also Princess has very inferior port times for almost the same itinerary.

Ive always raved about my Princess Elite benefits, but my Azamara Discoverer benefits are giving them a run for the money.

So based on my extensive research and my 24 day booking

we our getting a much better deal with AZ than we would with Princess....and that is comparing them Apples to Apples at current Azamara pricing structure

I should also note that Princess prices were significantly higher PRIOR to AZ doing the across the board price increase.

[Paulchili]

Ed,

I admit that I have not done price comparisons between Azamara and Crystal and thus cannot comment on that aspect. However, I have never even considered Crystal for other reasons (don't wish to start a "new war" here) and thus even if the prices were the same, I would choose Azamara over Crystal - just my opinion. I think Celebrity (the ship size notwithstanding) is a different cruise experience from Azamara/Oceania and not to my liking (formal nights, etc)

where2next,

I too am a big fan of Princess (though I am only a Platinum), but if the prices were the same (and other things such as itinerary, etc being equal) I would choose Azamara (Oceania) over Princess; though Princess is close second, especially the R ships (excluding luxury lines from this discussion)

The bottom line is that we know what the choices are and we choose accordingly. There are no right or wrong choices, only choices that suit our preferences and thus are right for each of us individually.

Cheers :).

[Paulchili]

PS

Ed,

I am with you on the 2for1 nonsense. In fact, when I first joined CC, I started WW III on Oceania board over this same issue (you could probably do a search, but don't bother)

[California Native]

PS

Ed,

I am with you on the 2for1 nonsense. In fact, when I first joined CC, I started WW III on Oceania board over this same issue (you could probably do a search, but don't bother)

 

Whoa...you started a WAR????

never really thought of you in that manner!

So, paulchili got a chilly reception!! hahahahahahahahhaahahhahahaha

Anyway, I agree about Azamara over Princess.

The decor and soft goods on AZ look wonderful!

The pictures I've seen of Oceania cabins are the same soft goods that I had in my Princess cabins.

So, you can imagine my happy dance at being able to try Azamara

the pricing we have, the itinerary with super long port times and overnights and then the additional benefits included with the cruise fare

and of course my Discoverer benefits!!!!

I'm smiling as I type this!!!

But what make me really happy is knowing that even after the price increase. Azamara will still be an option for us..based on the competitive pricing I consistently see between Princess R ships and Azamara

The small ship experience that I would love to do again is Prinsendam

as I sailed on her once Holland America and many times when she was

with Royal Viking...sadly, she has a following that will pay top dollar

which is out of our budget for her exotic itineraries and still sell the ship out !!!!

[Paulchili]

It's a great itinerary and I know you'll have a wonderful time (the good price, new amenities are all an extra bonus).

Tell us about the trip when you return - I will post my impressions (not a review) of my Sept Quest cruise.

[msu]

All I meant was you have choices based on a lot of personal criteria as who one decides to cruise with.

 

We have no real idea only little hints or thoughts as to why Azamara pricing has increased.

 

They hired a truly professional highly respected knowledgeable managment team to run the Azamara Brand. They know what they are doing they are some of the most respected people in the industry based on experience and generating profits / profitability and that is the bottom line to it all for the owners.

 

The travel industry as a whole came out of a very bad year financially and the economy is still rocky at best. Imagen trying to relaunch or launch a new brand in these times?

 

If you cruise on Azamara you are excepting the pricing. If you decide to go else were due to pricing will Azamara survive? Time will tell. Remember things are always in constant change and one needs to adapt and respond to these changes hopefully in a pro active verses re active way. Look at the Big 3 Automotive Manufactures as an example of this.

 

Originally Celebrity when they purchased the 2 ships we in the industry were under the impression they were going to replace the Expedition ships. Then it turned out they were trying develop a small ship experience then it ended up it was to become it's own brand Azamara Cruises now the new name. I think they are now getting on track give the product time...... Once your a separate entity operating company your product must support it self financially.

 

HSB 248 / Hugh / aka MSU

[Jade13]

A

 

Originally Celebrity when they purchased the 2 ships we in the industry were under the impression they were going to replace the Expedition ships.

 

HSB 248 / Hugh / aka MSU

 

Which are the expedition ship (s)? I know there is one in Galapagos but isn't it fairly recent to Celebrity? I was in the Galapagos in 2005 and never heard of the Celebrity Expedition and did not hear of any mass market lines having a ship there.

[Jade13]

 

We have no real idea only little hints or thoughts as to why Azamara pricing has increased.

 

HSB 248 / Hugh / aka MSU

 

They told us while we were onboard that they had not turned any profit.

[Susan-M]

Which are the expedition ship (s)? I know there is one in Galapagos but isn't it fairly recent to Celebrity? I was in the Galapagos in 2005 and never heard of the Celebrity Expedition and did not hear of any mass market lines having a ship there.

 

Celebrity Xpedition (their only expedition ship) has been operating in the Galapagos for at least six years ('04). We were on it in '06. Here's a link to a a very long thread that has been running from April '05 through to the present: Xpedition

[sawsea27]

hey guys, I am just glad that now there are others who love azamara but reject their scam of 2 for 1...

 

I keep checking the same cruises for sailing...the winter ones for 2011...and no inventory is budging...very few bookings are being made..

 

hope they also read our views here and know that in order to get all of us back they will have to do some things differently...

 

a much more up front way to sell their product would go a long way....

 

more informed operators...they are clueless when you call them...

 

and yes make it more affordable for the under 300Gs group to fill their ships...of course the 300 and up group does not care that rates have doubled...but they alone wont fill the ships...

 

just nice again to be able to voice an opinion here....

[cindilouwho]

Let me try to be clear without being silly or sounding like a cheerleader -

 

Azamara has a wonderful product...ignore the website and the difficulties at the call centre - the onboard product is excellent. We are all mostly agreed on that. They will fix those issues and I have already noticed a change for the better, not perfect, but better.

 

The prices have gone up drastically over the past year - perhaps too quickly - but the fact remains they would like to make some money on their superior product. They NEED to to stay in business. Perhaps they waited too long to up the prices gradually and found themselves behind the 8 ball, but this is a marketing issue. We all know that markets correct themselves.

 

We would all love a bargain! I would be happy to see my price for Asia go down but if it does not I have booked the cabin and am satisfied to get good value because I made that decision already.

 

Let us not belabour the points - we know that discounting is going to happen. The 2 for 1 is a marketing gimmick and we know it so point made, point taken. Agreed. Maybe next year when the new pricing comes out AZ will take note - until then - it is water under the bridge.

 

My issue is not with points made...they are all most certainly valuable and correct. I take issue with a certain poster who continually brings the same points to the table to the point of exhaustion! We are here to exchange ideas and comments and share knowledge - which happens in a wonderful way ..... this thread was dying it's natural death until ...well....you know :rolleyes:

 

I question the motivation of this poster - not because they are trying to raise valid concerns - they have done that - but after having beaten the horse to death they still persist. This poster has stated that they are booked on a B2B, a Celebrity cruise and are holding another caribbean cruise and have stated in a previous post that the cruise they were looking at had come down and they we happy about it. Yet the FACT is that they are not posting to ANY roll calls, nor contributing to any other cruise line thread - they are only posting on this site and are, IMHO, only trying to stir the pot ad nauseum.

 

My feeling - and this is only my musing - is that I question the authenticity of this poster and wonder if this person is motivated to post for nefarious reasons. Could it be that the competition has had a hand in this? Don't know.

 

What I do know is that AZ deserves to have a shot at success in their chosen marketplace and their own actions will determine their ability to survive in the marketplace. They are experienced in their field and will, as all businesses, flourish or die under their own steam.

 

My rant....

 

Have a wonderful day to all......

[California Native]

[quote=sawsea27;24927660]hey guys, I am just glad that now there are others who love azamara but reject their scam of 2 for 1...

 

I keep checking the same cruises for sailing...the winter ones for 2011...and no inventory is budging...very few bookings are being made..

 

 

just nice again to be able to voice an opinion here....[/quote]

 

 

This is the root of the problem and possibly your perception.

in addition to accepting marketing and yield management strategies.

You are checking the same Caribbean cruises over and over.

This is an itinerary that a small ship can't play on a even playing field with all of the HUMONGOUS size ships.

I thought we discussed this ad nauseum months ago.

It doesn't matter if it is Princess R ships, Holland America Prinsendam or someone else. It just can't compete.

The Caribbean itineraries are offered for people that want a small ship experience instead of monstrosity.

People who feel this is most important will pay top dollar for that.

You're ok sailing on Celebrity, but it's not the same small ship experience.

While you keep checking the Caribbean,

I'm checking the rest of the world.

and what I see in the rest of the world for a small ship experience is that Azamara is very competitive, in fact beating out pricing on Princess R ships and Holland America Prinsendam, even Oceania..

We all agree about the 2 for 1 marketing...

but I feel the same annoyance when

I go to Kohls at it's buy 1, get the other 50% off between the hours 7am-11am for door busters. I feel this way when I go into Macy's to use a coupon and when I get to the register to purchase my loot. The sales clerk points out the size 1 font that gives the exclusions.

That's what marketing does..it gets you in the door

whether it's a new product (Azamara) or an old one (Cunard)

The point is to develop interest where it hasn't been.

Companies will take a "hit" on the bottom line for this purpose, but at some point the "hit" has to end or

they will be out of business.

Another example...when you go to Costco they give away samples

this is marketing..they give away product, you taste something you never would think of buying, you buy it..

now you are hooked.

They are not going to give away product all the time. They just want to give a sample so they are now on your radar.

That's exactly what Azamara did ..you got a sample and now they are on your radar. They can't keep giving away the product or they will be out of business.

Regarding your comment about voicing an opinion..

all opinions are welcome...it's when posters are rude, make false statements, insult or accuse other posters of thier knowledge

or what they do for a living then it becomes a problem.

CruiseCritic is a wonderful forum to learn about cruiselines, ports, etc

It might be helpful to you if you put your frustration on the Caribbean pricing aside and enjoy and contribute to the other sectors of the CruiseCritic forum that will

help you have the best cruise possible on whatever line you sail on!!!

 

Buon Viaggio

[Jade13]

 

I keep checking the same cruises for sailing...the winter ones for 2011...and no inventory is budging...very few bookings are being made..

 

 

Are you only checking Caribbean sailings? Azamara can't compete in that market and only to those who will pay anything to get on this small ship. That may be why they will have few (if any) cruises from Miami in the future. I would never cruise them in the Caribbean as we are interested in every other world destination.

 

I am also confused as I thought you said you booked and were happy with the new price?

[Jade13]

[quote=sawsea27;24927660]hey guys, I am just glad that now there are others who love azamara but reject their scam of 2 for 1...

 

I keep checking the same cruises for sailing...the winter ones for 2011...and no inventory is budging...very few bookings are being made..

 

 

just nice again to be able to voice an opinion here....[/quote]

 

 

This is the root of the problem and possibly your perception.

in addition to accepting marketing and yield management strategies.

 

You are checking the same Caribbean cruises over and over.

 

This is an itinerary that a small ship can't play on a even playing field with all of the HUMONGOUS size ships.

I thought we discussed this ad nauseum months ago.

It doesn't matter if it is Princess R ships, Holland America Prinsendam or someone else. It just can't compete.

 

The Caribbean itineraries are offered for people that want a small ship experience instead of monstrosity.

People who feel this is most important will pay top dollar for that.

You're ok sailing on Celebrity, but it's not the same small ship experience.

. They can't keep giving away the product or they will be out of business.

 

Agree, as usual.

[Susan-M]

 

...hope they also read our views here and know that in order to get all of us back they will have to do some things differently...

 

 

I don't think Azamara expects to have all of their past clients continue to cruise with them.

 

Many people who cruised with Azamara when they offered exceptional introductory prices would not have cruised with them had Az's prices been what their product was worth. Now that they are charging what the product is worth, I think they must realize that some of those former cruisers will be making other choices. Those who see the value and are able to afford it, will choose Azamara ... whether it's former clients or new ones.