Wages / Employee Benefits of Waiters and Cabin Stewards

[Sail Girl]

This issue is of great importance to the waiters and assistants.

 

On our recent Century cruise, our waiter had only 2 tables and our assistant had 3. When I commented that it seemed like very few tables, the waiter said it was - so few because he received one "fair" regarding food quality on a comment card. Only two tables means fewer tips.

 

To make things worse, our table of 8 became a table of 2 when the other 6 pax - a family - moved to a 6 top to be alone. Those seats were never occupied although pax were assigned on the MDR seating chart. Perhaps the waiter/assistant will get tips from those pax - perhaps not. The waiter seemed to think he would not.

 

We have encountered similar situations in the past. On a 14 day Med Cruise we were at a table for 8. Only 4 of us showed up during the entire cruise, although all of us were on board. Again - did the waiter/assistant receive gratuities from those pax?

 

I realize gratuities are added to pax accounts daily, but don't know if they can be taken off at pax request if they don't eat in the MDR for dinner, thus reducing the staff's gratuities.

 

Thanks to the OP for raising this issue.

[islandgirlejfan]

Some waiters and cabin stewards have sporadically shared personal stories about the long hours, and missing their loved ones back home. I truly have come to admire many that I have met (and sometimes cringe when some passengers treat them, in tone and impolite direction, like personal servants, an "Upstairs, Downstairs" syndrome.)

 

I was totally sickened by this sort of attitude on our last cruise. We were in a suite on NCL for our last cruise and we just happened to run into one group on a daily basis that were absolutely obnoxious with this sort of attitude. I knew the staff worked long and hard....but for another human to treat someone waiting on them with less than courtesy really bothered me. I think no matter what line you cruise that staff is treated with dignity and respect.

 

Huh? How is it trivializing them? The OP's intent was out of genuine concern for the hard working crew, not to mock them. Threads like this are important. If everybody realized they are only earning $50 per month in actual salary, working about 14 hours per day and only receiving about one day off per month then people would be less likely to skimp on their well deserved tips. About 98% of their pay comes from tips. People need to know that and reward them as appropriate.

 

I totally agree....we got very close to three staff members in Cagneys on our last cruise. We knew the pay scale was low but I really don't think we understood how much time they were actually working a day until this past cruise. I can't believe how many people want to get out of paying gratuities on a cruise....it just amazes me.:mad:

[lambcom]

Slightly off topic, but then we've covered compensation for the captain, photo staff and others as well as cabin and wait staff. So my question is: how much is a cruise director paid? It seems to be a thankless job and most of them don't last more than a couple of years.

 

George +

[Project_gal]

Slightly off topic, but then we've covered compensation for the captain, photo staff and others as well as cabin and wait staff. So my question is: how much is a cruise director paid? It seems to be a thankless job and most of them don't last more than a couple of years.

 

George +

 

If you click on the link posted by Derf5585 on post #20, you can navigate to all the salaries for different jobs including CD.

 

You can also consider purchasing a couple of cruise ships!

 

Sue

[dogsrule]

Actually lots of people know. :rolleyes:

 

 

Well said Gonzo...that pretty much covers it!;)

[derf5585]

So my question is: how much is a cruise director paid? It seems to be a thankless job and most of them don't last more than a couple of years.

 

George +

 

Cruise Director (The cruise director is in charge of all on-board entertainment, creates, coordinates, and implements all the daily activities, acting master of ceremonies at social activities and evening shows). Professional entertainment background preferred or 2-5 years on board working your way up from an entry-level cruise staff position. Public speaking, delegate responsibilities and strong organizational abilities required. Fluent English Language skills required. Salary range: $3800-7500 U.S. per month, depending on the cruise line.

from

http://www.cruiseshipjob.com/

[Esprit]

My DD is currently working onboard Constellation and I know what she is paid but it would be totally inappropriate for me to divuldge what it is?

 

What some may not know however is that for UK tax purposes she will have to declare her earnings and suffer UK tax unless she takes on another contract and then is able to claim the Seafarers' earnings deduction due to the length of time she would have then been working outside the UK. A fact that some cruise companies forget to mention!

 

Peter

[derf5585]

My DD is currently working onboard Constellation and I know what she is paid but it would be totally inappropriate for me to divuldge what it is?

 

Do you think she is paid fairly?

[MEcruzr]

derf... interesting link you provided!

 

I found it interesting that many do not have to pay taxes on their income.

 

FWIW, looking at the range of income for the different jobs on a cruise ship, they make more than I thought they did... especially considering the benefits (housing, food, transportation - airline to and from home, medical). Add up the cost of rent, food, etc... add that to their income... tax free.... and it's not ALL that BAD. Heck, waiters make more than starting teachers in my state. I always give the recommended tips. I'm not going to feel guilty anymore for not giving extra!

 

:::ducking for cover now:::

[retiredldo]

MECruzer I agree with you. I have also been on enough cruises where the wait staff and or housekeeping hit you with the story that tugs at your heart, but when in fact they realize the impact of the story. Let me explain, had a waiter, give me this song and dance, about his family at home final contract etc, need help with the kids etc. So we tipped over and above, next am he is putting out juice etc I asked thought you were leaving to go home, big smile nope still have 2 months left to go. Sort of shortened the story, I am not implying that they all do that, but they have been at this business long enough to know what will and will not get more money coming their way. Other than just the great service

 

So it goes

[CruisinNole]

I don't think it's appropriate to ask someone their salary or even question them about their personal life. I don't ask the wait staff at a land based restaurant how much they get paid or query the housekeeper at a hotel or resort about their salary or how their benefits are structured. In today's economy, you could hear a sad story from a lot of employees of any company. Tip appropriately for service rendered.

[Esprit]

"Do you think she is paid fairly?"

 

That's a hard question.

 

Compared to the UK the pay is poor but she was fed up in her retail part time job and just couldn't find a job that matched her skills set having obtained an excellent university degree over a year ago.

 

She decided that she needed to demonstate to future employers that she was flexible, willing to learn and have good people skills. Together with the prospect of travelling abroad, a job on a cruise ship seemed the best option under the circumstances.

 

5 months on and she's having a fabulous time. She has met some wonderful workmates and intends to travel across America inbetween contracts (providing she is offered another!)

 

Peter

[Bridge Maven]

One thing to consider is that what sounds like a meager wage where you live might be the norm where that crew member lives. To give an example, a few years ago when a quality furniture store that had been in business since the 1800's was closing a salesperson told me that they were paying $40 an hour to Americans who built furniture while many other furniture companies only paid less than a dollar an hour to people in other countries.

 

In any event, I think tips should be based on how well someone does their job, not on perceived need determined by a sad story told to a passenger.

[dogsrule]

I don't believe that this thread is about "sad stories" I believe it is about the reality of life for some of the crew whether or not we want to hear about it is another thing....Denial is a strong defense. I believe we need to look at the situation in a more realistic way and see the big picture. JMHO

[Bridge Maven]

I don't believe that this thread is about "sad stories" I believe it is about the reality of life for some of the crew whether or not we want to hear about it is another thing....Denial is a strong defense. I believe we need to look at the situation in a more realistic way and see the big picture. JMHO

 

Do you think a crew member who does a poor job should get a good tip just because he is needy?

[dogsrule]

No I do not but that is not the point here. The big picture is the point.

Please don't oversimplify something which is much more complex.

[brfan]

This issue is of great importance to the waiters and assistants.

 

On our recent Century cruise, our waiter had only 2 tables and our assistant had 3. When I commented that it seemed like very few tables, the waiter said it was - so few because he received one "fair" regarding food quality on a comment card. Only two tables means fewer tips.

 

To make things worse, our table of 8 became a table of 2 when the other 6 pax - a family - moved to a 6 top to be alone. Those seats were never occupied although pax were assigned on the MDR seating chart. Perhaps the waiter/assistant will get tips from those pax - perhaps not. The waiter seemed to think he would not.

 

We have encountered similar situations in the past. On a 14 day Med Cruise we were at a table for 8. Only 4 of us showed up during the entire cruise, although all of us were on board. Again - did the waiter/assistant receive gratuities from those pax?

 

I realize gratuities are added to pax accounts daily, but don't know if they can be taken off at pax request if they don't eat in the MDR for dinner, thus reducing the staff's gratuities.

 

Thanks to the OP for raising this issue.

 

That is sad if the waiter is being punished because someone thought the food quality was only fair. Last I heard the waiter doesn't cook the food so quality is out of his control.

[brfan]

Since the salary is peanuts compared to what they get in tips, those crew members who have more rooms or more diners to service, hence more tips. So yes they are working harder w/ crew cutbacks, but they theoretically should be getting more in the way of compensation. I know I had a friend who was a waiter and got really bummed if he was given fewer tables, or if he had tables w/o diners. Fewer passengers at his table equated to less in the way of tips.

 

While in theory that may be true more tables or rooms equalling more tips. However, from comments I've read on CC that may not actually be the case. I had a conversation with someone on one of the other boards and he said he would reduce/remove tips if the service wasn't as he expected even if it was because his wait staff wasn't able to provide this good service due to them having more tables. There are some people who remember what the service was like when the crew could provide great service because they had fewer rooms or tables and expect the same service now and will reduce/remove tips if they don't get the service they've come to expect even though it is totally out of the control of the crew members.

[TravelerThom]

MECruzer I agree with you. I have also been on enough cruises where the wait staff and or housekeeping hit you with the story that tugs at your heart, but when in fact they realize the impact of the story. Let me explain, had a waiter, give me this song and dance, about his family at home final contract etc, need help with the kids etc. So we tipped over and above, next am he is putting out juice etc I asked thought you were leaving to go home, big smile nope still have 2 months left to go. Sort of shortened the story, I am not implying that they all do that, but they have been at this business long enough to know what will and will not get more money coming their way. Other than just the great service

 

So it goes

I'm a little confused about your story. Nowhere do you say you were told he was departing immediately [or is that what "final contract" means to you?]. Many [indeed, I'd say most] do have family at home for whom they are the primary support. And of course service personnel become adept at maximizing their tips; anything short of outright lies seems within bounds to me [i certainly not under the allusion that cocktail waitresses wear low cut blouses because of their personnel affection for me:rolleyes:].

 

Thom

[Bridge Maven]

When I decide how much to tip a waiter I consider what is in his control and what is out of it. For example, on most Celebrity cruises we have been on the wait staff has only had one or two other tables while on Holland America the wait staff had a lot more. So if I am sitting with an empty coffee cup that was never refilled while the waiter is chatting with someone at a nearby table I consider that to be poor service. Yet on our Holland America cruise every time I looked at our waiter he was very busy and I was not going to penalize him because the cruise line gave him too many people to serve.

[2SeaWithMe]

I am very wary of people who hear horribly sad stories from crew members.

 

I have conversations with staff, but they rarely get that detailed. As some say, there is a sucker born every minute. Americans, compared to most other countries in the world, are RICH. Not just middle class, filthy rich. One person sleeps in a bedroom? So much food in your fridge that not only can you choose what to eat, but a good percentage of it spoils before you get around to it? A car for every person in your household? I could go on, but the fact that you can afford to take a vacation is a major point.

 

There are people in every country that will take advantage of tourists, and they know it. It wouldn't surprise me in the least that there would be some of the same mindset on a cruise ship.

 

I tip based on service. Period. I don't understand why someone would expect a pax to tip a waiter he has not used.

[TravelerThom]

I don't think it's appropriate to ask someone their salary or even question them about their personal life. I don't ask the wait staff at a land based restaurant how much they get paid or query the housekeeper at a hotel or resort about their salary or how their benefits are structured. In today's economy, you could hear a sad story from a lot of employees of any company. Tip appropriately for service rendered

BUT the only way to tip appropriately is to comprehend what their compensation structure is, and it varies enormously around the world. In much of the Pacific service personnel are paid a decent wage and tips are not expected; indeed in Polynesia tipping can be a social faux pas, as it is considered a gift that must be reciprocated. In France "service" is a separately listed but integral part of the bill, and gratuities on top of that tend to be small. In the US servers are typically paid half of minimum wage, and depend on tips to live on. In China many guides actually have to PAY their "employer" in order to get access to tipping clients [i was told this by a guide who was reporting how good the company he worked for (and I was utilizing) treated him - reporting that he was reasonably well paid didn't sound like a sob story to me]. Many places in the Middle East the only pay of service personnel is tips.

 

To me, tipping all of the above people based solely on service rendered with no consideration of local custom is being intentionally ignorant and culturally arrogant. I strongly support learning about local customs in order to do what is appropriate. To those who express an opinion that discussion of compensation is not appropriate on CruiseCritic, how do you propose to learn about what is expected and appropriate?

 

Thom

[Bridge Maven]

BUT the only way to tip appropriately is to comprehend what their compensation structure is, and it varies enormously around the world. In much of the Pacific service personnel are paid a decent wage and tips are not expected; indeed in Polynesia tipping can be a social faux pas, as it is considered a gift that must be reciprocated. In France "service" is a separately listed but integral part of the bill, and gratuities on top of that tend to be small. In the US servers are typically paid half of minimum wage, and depend on tips to live on. In China many guides actually have to PAY their "employer" in order to get access to tipping clients [i was told this by a guide who was reporting how good the company he worked for (and I was utilizing) treated him - reporting that he was reasonably well paid didn't sound like a sob story to me]. Many places in the Middle East the only pay of service personnel is tips.

 

To me, tipping all of the above people based solely on service rendered with no consideration of local custom is being intentionally ignorant and culturally arrogant. I strongly support learning about local customs in order to do what is appropriate. To those who express an opinion that discussion of compensation is not appropriate on CruiseCritic, how do you propose to learn about what is expected and appropriate?

 

Thom

 

Thom, this question wasn't addressed to me but I will answer it.

 

I start with the cruise guidelines and add more if I feel the service was very good.

 

At a land based restaurant I tip 15 percent for mediocre service and 20 percent for good service. For an inexpensive breakfast I will tip a minimum of a dollar even if the bill was only three dollars.

[AMTDGT]

Thom, this question wasn't addressed to me but I will answer it.

I start with the cruise guidelines and add more if I feel the service was very good.

At a land based restaurant I tip 15 percent for mediocre service and 20 percent for good service. For an inexpensive breakfast I will tip a minimum of a dollar even if the bill was only three dollars.

 

As do we. Most get $0 extra from us, we have yet to dispute the compulsory 15% and some get a lot more. On both our X cruises and I expect it will be the same in March, we pay cash tips for or to encourage exceptional service. (TIP - To Insure Promptness)

 

On the other hand after an NCL Hawaii cruise (Pride of Hawaii- wasn't our idea btw), I sent an email to NCL demanding they give us a 20% tip because the service was so bad (in fact we trained some of our waiters and bar tenders - lol)

 

With respect to Thom's comment:

 

"In China many guides actually have to PAY their "employer" in order to get access to tipping clients [i was told this by a guide who was reporting how good the company he worked for (and I was utilizing) treated him - reporting that he was reasonably well paid didn't sound like a sob story to me]"

 

Our experience in the PRC, albeit eating in Non Western restaurants and staying in Non Western Hotels, and primarily traveling in rural South Western China, and from a daughter who lived and travelled there extensively, is that TIPing was considered to be an insult. Again as we have no experience, staying in the Hilton ?? in Beijing and eating in one of their recommended establishment may be different.

[dudeagain]

I have to throw my 2 cents in here......this post is regarding employees from 3rd world countries only I.E. room attendants, bartenders, wait staff primarily....

 

fact....they work extremely hard and very long hours...

 

fact....90% of them make in the upper 10% of wage earners in their home countries...

 

while I do empathise with their condition, they for the most part are treated MUCH better and have MUCH better working conditions than they would be working at home and they are most likely supporting 10 or even more people back home which is a very honorable thing to do.....

 

there is NO REASON to feel sorry for them as they are doing what we all have to do.....earn a living in whatever way we can to support the ones we love.....we only need to be nice and to treat them as human beings, not charity cases or someone who needs our sympathy

 

Tip them as per the guidelines and fill out your comment cards appropriately and that will be that....

 

They will earn a great living and you will receive great service.....