MUTS being implementing on a forth cruise line!

[CruiseFever]

Reading books....

 

To DW, that's the best part. She'll sit on the balcony or a deck chair and read at least a book a day. That, to her, is a big part of a great cruise.

 

She could care less if they had Movies Under The Stars, it's just not what she finds enjoyable about a cruise.

 

For that matter, either do I. But I'm not going on a crusade against that or any other attraction.

 

I'm sure not going to prance around bad mouthing a feature of the ship that others do find to their liking. It's one thing to cast an opinion about something but quite another to be so dead set and close-minded about it that you rally like-minded others to cast it as a negative to those who have never even had the chance to see it.

 

Cruise News Daily, just last night, reported of numerous negative comments from readers regarding Royal Caribbean's addition of "surfing" to the new Freedom of the Seas. Upon personal inspection however, it was reported "my perception changed, however, when I actually saw it".

 

All I'm saying or have ever wanted to say on this topic is give people a chance to make up their own minds . As noted above, if you don't like it, go read a book or go to a different part of the ship. I really don't think I am the only person who enjoyed sailing on the Caribbean Princess, a ship that features Movies Under The Stars.

 

If there is one person out there that might be influenced to the point of NOT booking passage on this ship because of such negative comments that would be a real shame.

 

Unfortunately the loudest voices on such topics get heard over those quieter, more reasonable and mainstream.....where the market is.

 

Light 'er up boys

[CruiseFever]

Let's just say I notice the differences, in both the passengers and the service. And, of course, the price. Yin always balances yan.

 

Bad differences all? Any good ones?

[GOLDENBONNY]

Exactly. If you don't like it, visit one of the many other pools or common areas of the ship. It only effects that one pool.

 

I don't want to watch Finding Nemo in the daytime, (have seen it WAY too many times!) so I hang out at another pool. There were always people there, so many do enjoy it. I did like watching a movie at night. Very relaxing!

THAT'S WOULD BE TO SIMPLE :D THEY WANNA STAY IN THAT ONE POOL TO COMPLAIN:cool:

[eroller]

 

Cruise News Daily, just last night, reported of numerous negative comments from readers regarding Royal Caribbean's addition of "surfing" to the new Freedom of the Seas. Upon personal inspection however, it was reported "my perception changed, however, when I actually saw it".

 

 

 

Oh please, when has CND said anything negative about the cruise industry? They are hardly objective as they are basically in bed with the cruise lines and report whatever the cruise lines see fit to tell them. They are the cruise lines reporting advocate. CND may start off an article sounding objective ... but by the end you can be sure they are singing the praises of whatever they are reporting on. CND doesn't want to piss off the cruise lines, as they may find themselves outside the cruise industry loop ... heaven forbid.

 

Also, did you not mention in previous posts you have no interest in the gimmicks on Royal Caribbean? I don't know why, but I somewhat recall this although it's been quite a ways back. I believe you are/were all about Princess and Carnival?? Of course now that you are a travel agent selling cruises maybe you have also become a bit more "objective", and Royal Caribbean doesn't seem so bad anymore???

 

 

Ernie

[OnTheRocks]

Ernie, I completely agree. CND gets some great stuff, but I think has to sacrifice some objectivity to gain access. There is no problem liking the non-traditional features being added to ships today; there is also no problem with NOT liking them.

 

Personally, I'd like to see Royal Caribbean distinguish themselves in the way they are most capable, with innovative ideas and design, and Princess/Cunard use their traditions and history to provide a different type of experience. If all lines become the same, where is the choice?

 

Every "main" stream has many channels.

[eroller]

OnTheRocks wrote:

 

Personally, I'd like to see Royal Caribbean distinguish themselves in the way they are most capable, with innovative ideas and design, and Princess/Cunard use their traditions and history to provide a different type of experience. If all lines become the same, where is the choice?

 

Every "main" stream has many channels.

 

 

==========================================

 

 

I agree. I respect the people that really like MUTS, but I expect my feelings of not liking MUTS to be respected as well. I also don't think it's wrong that I don't want to see MUTS featured on every ship and every cruise line. It's fine for some ships and lines, but not all. It seems some people have a real problem with that just because they like the feature. MUTS is intrusive during the day (to me anyway), especially on ships like SEA PRINCESS which only have one main pool area.

 

I also don't want every major cruise line and ship to become a theme park at sea like the Vegas resorts. Again, fine for some ships and lines but no need to takeover the entire industry. It will get to the point where one line can't be distinguished from another ... and that is not good for consumers or the industry.

 

Cruising is all about choice these days, and those of us who don't like MUTS should have the choice not to deal with it. Likewise those that love it should have the option to sail with it as well. Our fear (those of us that don't like it) is that MUTS will take over too many ships and leave us without options.

 

Ernie

[CruiseFever]

I'm probably not the only one that has a favorite source of news and information. For example, I choose to like CNN and FoxNews, others may choose to MSNBC or no cable news at all.

 

Much like the Cruise Critic Newsletter I get in the mail, they offer unique information I can't elsewhere. I have no problem with them being upbeat and

"in bed" with the cruise lines. I like the insider information I often read there first, presented in a positive manner. I can come here and get all the negative angles on anything cruising I want.

 

But I don't.

 

I choose not to.

 

Just curious, why do you subscribe to CND if you have such strong feelings against how they report?

[eroller]

 

Just curious, why do you subscribe to CND if you have such strong feelings against how they report?

 

 

What makes you think I subscribe? I don't, but it doesn't mean I don't get the articles forwarded to me every day.

 

Ernie

[OnTheRocks]

My comments have nothing to do with "like" or "dislike". I merely agree with Eroller that the self-interest any source needs to included in any evaluation of their subjective comments and opinions.

 

The quote from CND you mentioned earlier is an opinion, not fact. That you attempted to use it as a proof statement in your argument is indicative of your own bias, and inspired the contrarian views expressed in this thread.

[Pam in CA]

I prefer a "traditional" cruise, i.e., on ships without the massive crowds, with aft decks that anyone can enjoy, and where people enjoy dressing up for formal night. That said, I've been on the Caribbean Princess and enjoyed MUTS. It was there and I enjoyed it. It's not something that would sell me on a cruise nor would I make an entertainment decision on whether or not it was available or what was playing. I walked by, saw the movie "Back to the Future," sat down and enjoyed it. Almost everyone else around me was doing something else. Very, very few were watching the movie -- it was more background noise to them than entertainment. And I think that's the key -- most people during the day don't pay any attention to MUTS. It's just noise. When we made a reservation for an evening movie, we gave up pretty quickly since it was windy and raining. No MUTS that night for anyone!

[LARGIN]

Let the masses enjoy the CB and the MUTS..

Movies blaring, shorts in the dining rooms.

Newbies climbing the walls and skating the ice...

More megaships for all, let 3100-5100 be the norm...

Lower prices will fill them all...

What a great cruise experience... :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

[calikak]

I find that Seatrade Insider has a lot of the same stories as CND but is better written. I think it's pithier (which I prefer) and it's free, which appeals to my stingy nature. :) For those who don't like CND, I'd recommend Seatrade Insider instead. For those who prefer CND, to each his own.

 

This thread has rapidly gotten very hostile. To paraphrase from Ainsley Hayes from The West wing, sometimes I feel like it's not so much that the traditionalists here don't like MUTS, it's that they don't like the people who do like MUTS. I hesitate even to post this here because, given the hostility on this thread already, I'm sure I'm about to get flamed. But I think it really isn't so much about whether MUTS is on a given ship, because it's fairly easily avoided (other than on the Sea Princess, where I think it shouldn't have been installed). What I think is really going on here is that when a ship is filled with traditional cruise passengers, who value the many touches of elegancy and refined living that came with traditional cruising, a certain atmosphere is created shipwide. When those people are outnumbered by "new cruisers" (not new in terms of first-time cruisers but new as in not traditionalists) who could care less about what people wear to dinner or whether there's a steel drum band or MUTS next to the pool, a different atmosphere is created on the ship, not just by the pool, but shipwide. I can see why people would be upset about the lack of the old-school atmosphere onboard (even if I don't feel the same way), but I don't think it's worth the snide, purely personal comments I've seen in a lot of threads lately, including this one.

[luv2cruz_74]

Let the masses enjoy the CB and the MUTS..

Movies blaring, shorts in the dining rooms.

Newbies climbing the walls and skating the ice...

More megaships for all, let 3100-5100 be the norm...

Lower prices will fill them all...

What a great cruise experience... :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

 

Now you're talking. This sounds like a great time to me. Remember, to each his own. I really don't want the elegance and old-fashioned cruise ships. Consider me a newbie if you'd like, but I'll have a great time wherever I go. As long as there is no ballroom dancing!! :eek:

[spongerob]

This thread has rapidly gotten very hostile.

 

What hostility? For a MUTS debate, this has been remarkably civil. Maybe because I've stayed out of it, LOL.

 

I'm going back into retirement now. I was just so impressed that I could get in today that I had to post.;)

[CruizenSuzen]

Let's just say I notice the differences, in both the passengers and the service. And, of course, the price. Yin always balances yan.

 

You are an angry person, aren't you? Or perhaps it's self-loathing. Either way, I hope you achieve some peace.

 

As a casual observer, I thought this comment was completely unwarranted. Perhaps, you should worry more about how you present yourself and less about others.

[bdjam]

I invite all of the "MASS MARKET SNOBS" to please move to HAL or stay on the smaller ships so that they won't have their cruises ruined by new features that they don't like or people not experienced enough to know not to like them.

Huh? If those of us who have cruising experience and aren’t enamored with MUTS are the ones being called snobs, then my response to this post would be to keep the new features to yourselves. I’m in agreement with Ernie – I have no issue with MUTS. What I have issue with is MUTS taking over and narrowing my choices for a cruise vacation. There is no reason to retro-fit and ruin ships (specifically Sea Princess) with MUTS. There are plenty of big-screen TVs attached to ships – either built or not – to satisfy the market that wants them – which is the entry level Caribbean market. So, y’all go your way, and all I ask is the chance to go mine. Princess has obviously found that MUTS isn’t the catch all they thought it would be or the Grand Class would have been all retro-fitted by now, so I’d be careful about being smug about one’s non-snob-ness. I have no problem staying on the smaller ships - I don't want to sail on a ship with public spaces for 2600 that has 3100 passengers shoved onto it, thank you.

If you dont like it there are plenty of other areas to escape to.

So if I prefer to sit by the pool on Sea Princess, but don’t want to have to look at a big screen TV, where on board do you suggest I go?

Maybe it's a good thing for those who choose only the week-long introductory cruises. People who cruise for more substantial reasons than just "getting away", not that there's anything wrong with that, have a different sent of wants that I think were well-expressed in response to your post about the RCI water park.

Thank you…

Unfortunately the loudest voices on such topics get heard over those quieter, more reasonable and mainstream.....where the market is.

Chris, I think you’ve been around these boards long enough to know that both sides of the MUTS debate are just as vocal. While those of you who have actually lived through the MUTS experience think you have the upper hand over those of us who haven’t been subjected to it, I’d like to think that I have cognitive abilities that will allow me to decide what I like and don’t like without having to experience it. Maybe I overestimate myself, but I’d still like to see some facts to back up the suggestion that the mainstream is 1 – more reasonable and 2 – in love with MUTS.

Cruising is all about choice these days, and those of us who don't like MUTS should have the choice not to deal with it. Likewise those that love it should have the option to sail with it as well. Our fear (those of us that don't like it) is that MUTS will take over too many ships and leave us without options.

Well said – next time we’re sitting around a non-MUTS pool, I’m buying. Of course if we're sitting around a MUTS pool, we'll need twice as much to drink, so you're buying. ;)

I choose to like...FoxNews

:rolleyes:

Much like the Cruise Critic Newsletter I get in the mail, they offer unique information I can't elsewhere. I have no problem with them being upbeat and "in bed" with the cruise lines. I like the insider information I often read there first, presented in a positive manner. I can come here and get all the negative angles on anything cruising I want.

It’s one thing not to have issues with the positive spin that some media put on the cruise industry reports – it’s another thing to site those reports as objective evidence in a debate as you did previously on this thread.

To paraphrase from Ainsley Hayes from The West wing, sometimes I feel like it's not so much that the traditionalists here don't like MUTS, it's that they don't like the people who do like MUTS. I hesitate even to post this here because, given the hostility on this thread already, I'm sure I'm about to get flamed.

Let me be the first to light the match. Right, I prefer a traditional cruise experience and right, when the bulk of the passenger load prefers the non-traditional experience, I’m not going to enjoy my cruise. That’s why I don’t choose to sail ships with MUTS that do the 7-day Caribbean, entry level type of cruising. And for that, I’ve been told that my opinion doesn’t count because I’ve not experienced it. What it doesn’t mean is that I dislike non-traditional cruisers or I don’t feel that they should have their choice. What it does mean is that I object to their choice infringing on mine. I already don’t like large ships with high density passenger loads. I don’t care for MUTS on a ship. If the cruise industry continues to follow the path of large and/or MUTS laden ships, how do you suggest that I choose a cruise vacation?

The snide and personal comments that come out of these debates usually stem from a lack of fact or objectivity when debating. If someone doesn’t have a reasonable argument, they attack. That’s exactly the type of new cruiser who I don’t want to spend what is supposed to be a relaxing vacation with. It must be nice to be able to be so neutral in regard to this subject, but I was always under the impression that this was a board where opinions were to be expressed.

[Dreamer333]

As a casual observer, I thought this comment was completely unwarranted. Perhaps, you should worry more about how you present yourself and less about others.

 

I agree!!!

[bdjam]

I agree!!!

And I guess as a follow up to my post above, I’d say in order to keep the personal attacks to a minimum and keep the discussion on track of the topic at hand, we shouldn’t continue to inflate the attacks with these kinds of posts – myself included.

[Dreamer333]

And I guess as a follow up to my post above, I’d say in order to keep the personal attacks to a minimum and keep the discussion on track of the topic at hand, we shouldn’t continue to inflate the attacks with these kinds of posts – myself included.

 

Sorry, bdjam, I didn't even read your post (it was too long, and I usually enjoy reading your posts, but I think that I have a pretty clear understanding of how you feel about MUTS).

 

I agree that harsh comments/attacks should not be inflated, however I do feel that it should be made known that many of us on the boards do not accept those types of comments.

 

To stay on the subject... I have experienced MUTS on the CB, and on that ship, it was extremely easy to find quiet places to read, sunbathe, relax, etc...

 

I thank the OP for the new information, but I think the MUTS discussions are getting a bit tiresome, so I am signing out of this discussion, folks!

See ya on other threads!!!! :)

[mrdawson]

The bottom line on MUTS is.....majority rules....far more people enjoy them than do not. I've read plenty of articles confirming this, cruise lines don't just toss around millions of $ for these so some newbies will be enticed. It has to have staying power.

 

Like many have said there are plenty of pools without MUTS and around 500 different places to quietly read on ANY cruise ship, so why all the vemon from those who don't like it? Hmmmmmmmm, sounds like the same people who think if you don't think like them politically you must be ignorant and uneducated :D

 

I haven't yet enjoyed MUTS yet and I know plenty of you (not all) who bash it haven't either, but I probably will enjoy it and I look forward to it.:eek:

 

For goodness sake, ITS JUST A BIG FRIKKIN TV, GET OVER YOURSELVES..

 

I know, I know, your traditionalists...well enjoy your cruise on a steamship with no air conditioning, I'll take progress!!:)

 

Party on..pass the popcorn...put down that book, your blockin my MUTS:p

[eroller]

The bottom line on MUTS is.....majority rules....far more people enjoy them than do not. I've read plenty of articles confirming this, cruise lines don't just toss around millions of $ for these so some newbies will be enticed. It has to have staying power.

 

 

 

I guess the authority has spoken? Last I checked, a total of nine ships in the world offer MUTS, or are confirmed to offer MUTS in the future. I would hardly consider that a "majority". I would also like to know which articles you have read that "confirm more people enjoy MUTS then do not". I imagine those articles are in magazines and publications that receive advertising dollars from major cruise lines. Hardly objective. I would also imagine most of the people interviewed are first time cruisers since those are the majority of people that sail on ships offering MUTS. Again, not an objective sampling.

 

There is a simple solution ... leave the existing ships alone and without MUTS ... and go ahead and put it on the future 5000+ passenger floating cattle-call barges that will soon be constructed.

 

Ernie

[bdjam]

The bottom line on MUTS is.....majority rules....far more people enjoy them than do not. I've read plenty of articles confirming this, cruise lines don't just toss around millions of $ for these so some newbies will be enticed. It has to have staying power.

Could you please tell me where you find the articles that confirm the majority of people enjoy MUTS? I’d like to read them. Could you also tell me why Princess decided not to continue with an aggressive retro-fit of MUTS on their ships if the "majority rules?"

Like many have said there are plenty of pools without MUTS and around 500 different places to quietly read on ANY cruise ship, so why all the vemon from those who don't like it? Hmmmmmmmm, sounds like the same people who think if you don't think like them politically you must be ignorant and uneducated

As I previously posted, could you please tell me where on board Sea Princess – retro-fitted with MUTS – I can go to sit by the pool and not have to look at the MUTS screen? Perhaps when they added MUTS to the ship they added an additional pool I’m not aware of? As for politics, I don't believe that's something that should be discussed on this thread.

For goodness sake, ITS JUST A BIG FRIKKIN TV, GET OVER YOURSELVES..

Exactly. I don’t need my cruise vacations cluttered up with a big TV. As for getting over myself, I don’t need to – all I ask for is a choice of a ship that hasn’t been ruined by the contraption. I think there are far more valuable experiences to be gleaned from a cruise vacation than watching TV.

I know, I know, your traditionalists...well enjoy your cruise on a steamship with no air conditioning, I'll take progress!!

Having a big screen TV blaring all day is progress?

There is a simple solution ... leave the existing ships alone and without MUTS ... and go ahead and put it on the future 5000+ passenger floating cattle-call barges that will soon be constructed.

And remember they will be built on a 2600 passenger ship platform…

[dosi]

Now parents just slap a video into the in-car entertainment system so the kids will shut up.

 

 

No we don't. As the very involved mother of a five year old I find your comment upsetting. Some of us actually do talk to our children and read to them and enjoy their company. We also take them cruising with us and while we are on the ship we do not "PARK" them anywhere.

 

As for MUTS, it doesn't matter to me either way. The ships are large and I can always find a quiet place to sit and relax in the sun if that is what I have a mind to do. We are not big on being entertained but prefer to entertain ourselves and therefore MUTS would not influence our choice of ships in any way.

[britsbest]

Its really quite easy-

If you don't like MUTS then read some where else if you can't then go on a different ship

[calikak]

First, I'd like to say, bdjam, I wasn't even remotely talking about you being rude to other posters on this thread. As CruzinSuzan and Dreamer pointed out, other posts on this thread were very personal and I think that's unnecessary and inappropriate. In fact, I see that there is another new one in the last few minutes from the other side of the aisle. I understand the frustation of people who love traditional cruising and see the market trending away from what they love about it. If I felt strongly about it, I'm sure I'd be upset too, because I don't see how the trend can be reversed. But no matter how upsetting it is to see the industry trending away from traditional-style cruising, we don't need to be hurtful to each other in order to disagree about something.

 

Also, I don't recall that I've ever told you that your opinion doesn't count because you choose not to sail on a ship with MUTS. If I have, I'm very sorry and I would seek to withdraw that remark. If others have, your beef is with them, not with me.

Personally, I think it's perfectly appropriate for someone who is a traditionalist to prefer sailing with others who have the same idea of what a good vacation is. I mean, I don't like going out to a bar that I know is going to be filled with drunken college guys. Their idea of a fun night out and mine are very different, and being around them puts me in a bad mood. Instead, I choose a bar that whos customers enjoy doing the same things I do. I can understand why it would be frustrating for someone who is used to finding a traditional crowd on Princess to now be surrounded by fellow passengers who like watching football poolside and refuse to follow the dress code. It makes for a whole different cruise experience, one that is not enjoyable to someone who likes a traditional cruise. It's OK to not like being around certain people, and when I made my earlier post, I wasn't trying to imply that we should all like everyone and be some sort of commune or something. I was simply stating that I think this is what's really going on with people's frustration with MUTS. It's not about a movie screen being on a ship, it's about the atmosphere on the ship going from a traditional cruise to...well, whatever it is that cruising is today on the mass-market lines. Non-traditional, I guess. And that I think that frustration was what was driving some of the unpleasant, personal comments in some of these MUTS threads. What drives the non-traditionalists to be rude is another good question, I have no idea what possible reason they could have for being so upset about someone not liking MUTS.

 

What to do about the changing nature of cruising? I don't know, sail on the expensive traditionalist cruise lines, or possibly HAL, I hear it's still pretty traditional. I don't think there's a way to stem the tide of non-traditionalism that's moving into the Princess experience, but maybe a letter-writing campaign or something. Frankly, it's a big corporation and I don't think a letter-writing campaign would be that effective, but I've been wrong before and I'll be wrong again, and it never hurts to try.

 

It must be nice to be able to be so neutral in regard to this subject, but I was always under the impression that this was a board where opinions were to be expressed.

 

I certainly wasn't trying to quash someone's freedom of speech, because yes, this is a place for discussing opinions (as well as facts). What I was trying to say was that I think it's OK to be upset that cruising is changing/has changed, and to voice that unhappiness, but it's not OK to make personal attacks, no matter upset you are.