Pacific princess hit breakwater In port nice

[Belle]

I would think it's not that that they wouldn't

want to stay. It's the money! Then if they

stay and then Princess cancels the next cruise

after that!

 

Wishing them a safe trip home and then they

can decide what to do with the rest of the cruises.

[kennicott]

We board the Pacific Princess on Nov. 21st, or hope to. I’m still trying to find out more detail on the severity of the damage, which is hard to come by. On another forum a poster said this, but didn’t reveal his source:

 

“Two small hull breaches have been reported: a hole 30cm in diameter and a gash 20cm by 2cm. Princess plans to operate the October 28 sailing from Civitavecchia as scheduled.”

 

The latest from the Maritime Herald was yesterday, a short article which said this:

 

“The collision cause large breaches of the cruise ship’s hull and water ingress inside some compartments. The vessel remained afloat and succeeded to dock at Nice, but crew was forced to close some watertight doors to prevent the inflow of sea water from flooding further compartments.”

 

A C.C. poster on the ship said they were in a midship cabin on deck 4 right above the damage. They said water on deck 2 right below them was reported.

[bcnvcanada]

So happy to hear that Princess stepped up, especially those officers on the Pacific to assist you with travel plans home. That was the good

news. Especially, with all that is happening on board that ship. Sad that you wouldn't be cruising for a while. Thinking of all the positives, didn't you want to be home for the holiday's. Please let us your readers, know of your safe arrival and any plans that you make for cruising. SAFE TRAVELS

 

To all the others impacted by this, we send our thoughts and hope you will be able

to do something else, either in Europe or somewhere else with your time.

[Steelers0854]

Maybe she can have her TA look for other cruises out of Barcelona or a close by port they can take since princess refunded them their cruise fare. I would think you may score a good deal so close to sailing and at least you aren't stuck with a lot of expenses on land or have to fly all the way home.

[Bill B]

PescadoAmarillo,

 

You might want to try the American Embassy. After all you are in need of help and maybe they might offer some. You are stranded in Europe for 12 days.

 

https://fr.usembassy.gov/u-s-citizen-services/

 

Why would someone who spends four months a year living on cruise ships need help from an embassy just because they are 'stranded' in Europe for 12 days?

[likeadisguise]

We board the Pacific Princess on Nov. 21st, or hope to. I’m still trying to find out more detail on the severity of the damage, which is hard to come by.

 

It'd likely to be a couple of days before Princess has an estimate as to how long the repairs are going to take and how many cruises will be affected. Hopefully we'll hear something from them next week.

[jewelsea21]

I would not be very happy if the company I work for told me to take 12 days off with no pay. Just sad for all involved.

 

Where did you get this information?

[chengkp75]

The crew are guaranteed a minimum wage, and if the DSC is not being paid, due to no guests onboard, the company has to pony up the difference to make up the minimum wage, just like in drydock.

[sawtooth]

Hoping that J&G can salvage the rest of their winter at sea.

It may be back to the Caribbean for them.

I was so enjoying the posts. I'm sure they were enjoying as well.

If only it were certain that the 10/28 sailing was taking place, there are some great low key places to travel and fill in the time. Another poster suggested Crete or Sardinia...and airfares are so low in Europe.

[geocruiser]

Why would someone who spends four months a year living on cruise ships need help from an embassy just because they are 'stranded' in Europe for 12 days?

 

There are many reasons and it would be their choice to ask for help, if they want to.

[Bill B]

As automatic gratuities are shared fleetwide they shouldn't be much affected

 

The tip/DSC/"Pool" is not shared fleet-wide. Here's how it works on Princess -

 

"A separate Pool of passenger contributions will be collected and maintained by the Company for each voyage of each vessel for the benefit of crew members eligible to receive distributions from the Pool, i.e. those working on the vessel voyage associated with a particular Pool in positions so specified in each crew member’s Acceptance of Employment Terms & Conditions. Employees who might be eligible to participate in the Pool include all persons working in any capacity in the Hotel and Food and Beverage Departments. Each crew member agrees that the Company reserves and has the exclusive right to determine, in its sole discretion, the eligibility and number of total crew members entitled to share in the Pool and the proportionate share applicable to each position.

 

Since passenger participation in the Pool for any given vessel voyage is strictly voluntary, the Company cannot predict and does not guarantee the size of the Pool or the amount of money any eligible crew member may receive from the Pool for that given voyage. Some crew members do not receive a fluctuating share of the vessel voyage Pool, although these crew members do receive a minimum wage guarantee. All crewmembers understand and agree that such crew members who are not eligible to receive a fluctuating share of the vessel voyage Pool will nonetheless receive some of their guaranteed monthly compensation from that Pool on a fixed basis, before the fluctuating share of eligible crew members is calculated from the remaining balance of the Pool.

 

Each crew member understands and agrees that the amount which will be distributed to crew members participating in the Pool on a fixed basis is within the sole discretion of the Company, and may change from time to time.

 

Each crew member understands and agrees that the funds in the Pool allocated on a fixed basis to crew members not eligible to participate in the Pool on a fluctuating basis are not and shall not be deemed wages of the remaining crewmembers in the Pool under any circumstances."

[Bill B]

There are many reasons...

 

Like what? I assume their passports weren't ruined or lost when the ship hit the breakwater... and they're not injured or ill.

[pinguy]

This was on cruisejunkie.com today:

 

"Nice Matin reports the ship hit a breakwater of the port of Nice's side this Friday at 7:10. According to the schedule of the port of Nice, the ship arrived at 6:15 Friday morning and had to leave in 17 hours. A leak was found in compartment - 2 of the ship. Since the dike, only a penetration of the hull on the port side (left) is visible. From a passenger: Pacific princess was in beautiful Portofino yesterday and sailed to Nice overnight. But approaching the harbor before dawn there were thunderstorms ànd big wind...35-40 kts. We were up early for an 8am tour as the ship entered the tiny harbor under our own power (no tug). Just as we passed the 300 ft wide opening in the breakwater a big gust from the storm hit us and skidded us into the corner of the breakwater. Heard two grinding sounds in close succession, and I realized we'd rapped our bottom somewhere. They thrusted off and called a damage control party on the pa. But it turned out we'd sprung a leak in a mechanical compartment, and soon lost water pressure and vacuum in all the lavs due to flooding. They got us alongside safely with help from a tug. At 3pm they said the damage was significant -probably needing drydock - and since the vacuum was out none of the lavs on the ship worked. So they have us all in half a dozen hotels in Nice tonight, and the plan is to bus us to Barcelona all day tomorrow for flights home Sunday."

 

If they go into drydock, I'm feeling a lot less certain I'll be boarding on October 28th in Civitavecchia.

[kennicott]

This was on cruisejunkie.com today:

 

"Nice Matin reports the ship hit a breakwater of the port of Nice's side this Friday at 7:10. According to the schedule of the port of Nice, the ship arrived at 6:15 Friday morning and had to leave in 17 hours. A leak was found in compartment - 2 of the ship. Since the dike, only a penetration of the hull on the port side (left) is visible. From a passenger: Pacific princess was in beautiful Portofino yesterday and sailed to Nice overnight. But approaching the harbor before dawn there were thunderstorms ànd big wind...35-40 kts. We were up early for an 8am tour as the ship entered the tiny harbor under our own power (no tug). Just as we passed the 300 ft wide opening in the breakwater a big gust from the storm hit us and skidded us into the corner of the breakwater. Heard two grinding sounds in close succession, and I realized we'd rapped our bottom somewhere. They thrusted off and called a damage control party on the pa. But it turned out we'd sprung a leak in a mechanical compartment, and soon lost water pressure and vacuum in all the lavs due to flooding. They got us alongside safely with help from a tug. At 3pm they said the damage was significant -probably needing drydock - and since the vacuum was out none of the lavs on the ship worked. So they have us all in half a dozen hotels in Nice tonight, and the plan is to bus us to Barcelona all day tomorrow for flights home Sunday."

 

If they go into drydock, I'm feeling a lot less certain I'll be boarding on October 28th in Civitavecchia.

 

Thanks for the update, that's the first I heard about a "mechanical compartment" being flooded. I was beginning to feel a little more positive about things until that news, as it could well mean a lot of equipment is damaged due to salt water flooding and will have to be replaced as well as a couple of holes in the hull having to be patched.

[kennicott]

We cruised quite a bit on the original Royal Princess. One disadvantage of that ship was no stern thruster(s), meaning we constantly had tug assists, since it only had rudder with conventional propeller and shaft propulsion. It did have two bow thrusters. I notice that the R ships, did not have stern thrusters. The Pacific Princess is R-3. So I guess it hasn’t any either. It has been recognized for sometime in marine publications that “A modern cruise ship that does not have azipods has to be equipped with stern thrusters in order to maneuver when docking and undocking.”

 

If posters are correct that thunderstorms with wind squalls were prevalent at the time the Pacific Princess entered the channel with no tug assist and a sudden gust took it into the breakwater striking rocks at around midship, I wonder if the absence of stern thrusters and or tugs might have been a huge contributing factor here. (I’m not sure where compartment “2” is on that vessel but apparently it is a mechanical compartment.)

[geocruiser]

This was on cruisejunkie.com today:

 

"Nice Matin reports the ship hit a breakwater of the port of Nice's side this Friday at 7:10. According to the schedule of the port of Nice, the ship arrived at 6:15 Friday morning and had to leave in 17 hours. A leak was found in compartment - 2 of the ship. Since the dike, only a penetration of the hull on the port side (left) is visible. From a passenger: Pacific princess was in beautiful Portofino yesterday and sailed to Nice overnight. But approaching the harbor before dawn there were thunderstorms ànd big wind...35-40 kts. We were up early for an 8am tour as the ship entered the tiny harbor under our own power (no tug). Just as we passed the 300 ft wide opening in the breakwater a big gust from the storm hit us and skidded us into the corner of the breakwater. Heard two grinding sounds in close succession, and I realized we'd rapped our bottom somewhere. They thrusted off and called a damage control party on the pa. But it turned out we'd sprung a leak in a mechanical compartment, and soon lost water pressure and vacuum in all the lavs due to flooding. They got us alongside safely with help from a tug. At 3pm they said the damage was significant -probably needing drydock - and since the vacuum was out none of the lavs on the ship worked. So they have us all in half a dozen hotels in Nice tonight, and the plan is to bus us to Barcelona all day tomorrow for flights home Sunday."

 

If they go into drydock, I'm feeling a lot less certain I'll be boarding on October 28th in Civitavecchia.

 

Thank you very much for the up date. I hope repairs get done fast.

[CruisenOne]

 

(I’m not sure where compartment “2” is on that vessel but apparently it is a mechanical compartment.)

 

Compartment "2' would be the first compartment on the port side.

 

Even numbers Port; odd numbers Starboard.

[kennicott]

Compartment "2' would be the first compartment on the port side.

 

Even numbers Port; odd numbers Starboard.

 

Good point. Compartments #1 and #2 are the most forward compartments. The longitudinal and transverse bulkheads create the divides, on non-military ships anyway.

 

However, the way I understand it is, that the compartment numbering system on civil passenger ships begins at the "collision bulkhead". The collision bulkhead is the furthest forward bulkhead and not divided into two compartments. It is a super beefy bulkhead which, as it name implies, is going to take the brunt of a head on collision and protect all aft of it.

 

The most important point here though is that the collision bulkhead is not all that the close to the bow of the ship, but in some cases begins almost 8% of the total length of the vessel aft of the bow. Meaning that the compartments aft of it could contain machinery significant for operating the ship.

[hihilo]

The news releases I am seeing... YAHOO news,

uses this description of the events ---

""PACIFIC PRINCESS MADE CONTACT WITH THE BREAK WATER WALL""

while entering Nice, France.

 

Not "collided."

 

Not "Hit"

 

Ahhh well~~~~~ Bottom line, I am Beyond Sorry + Sad for all the passengers and the travel upheaval + uncertainty + disappointment + chaos.

[shredie]

This is just terrible news. :(

[Bill B]

The news releases I am seeing... YAHOO news,

uses this description of the events ---

""PACIFIC PRINCESS MADE CONTACT WITH THE BREAK WATER WALL""

while entering Nice, France.

 

Not "Hit"

 

"Your honor, I did not hit 'hihilo'... my fist merely made contact with his nose."

(Just kidding)

[chengkp75]

We cruised quite a bit on the original Royal Princess. One disadvantage of that ship was no stern thruster(s), meaning we constantly had tug assists, since it only had rudder with conventional propeller and shaft propulsion. It did have two bow thrusters. I notice that the R ships, did not have stern thrusters. The Pacific Princess is R-3. So I guess it hasn’t any either. It has been recognized for sometime in marine publications that “A modern cruise ship that does not have azipods has to be equipped with stern thrusters in order to maneuver when docking and undocking.”

 

If posters are correct that thunderstorms with wind squalls were prevalent at the time the Pacific Princess entered the channel with no tug assist and a sudden gust took it into the breakwater striking rocks at around midship, I wonder if the absence of stern thrusters and or tugs might have been a huge contributing factor here. (I’m not sure where compartment “2” is on that vessel but apparently it is a mechanical compartment.)

 

While I'm not aware of the source of your quote regarding stern thrusters, and while they are definitely an aid in docking, let me make a couple of observations regarding thrusters and rudder systems.

 

First, thrusters, by the nature of their design lose nearly all of their effectiveness when the ship is traveling more than about 3-5 knots ahead or astern. This is because the flow of water past the mouth of the thruster tunnel reduces the ability of the thruster to draw water into the tunnel to force it out the other side. For this reason, thrusters are not normally used (though they are running in idle) while the ship makes its approach to the harbor or while maneuvering in the harbor.

 

Traditional rudder systems tend to lose effectiveness in turning the vessel when it is moving below 3 knots, or at the same time that thrusters start to be effective, which is why thrusters were introduced. However, long before thrusters became almost universal on cruise ships, there was a new technology introduced for rudders, that is also nearly universal on cruise ships that have shafted propellers: Becker (trim tab) rudders. These rudders have hinged section at the trailing edge that act like an airplane's ailerons, and the more the rudder swings to one side or the other, the more the trim tab automatically increases the curvature of the rudder, creating more and more "airfoil" shape, and actually creating "lift" like an airplane wing, except this lift is in the sideways direction. Becker rudders do not lose their effectiveness at 3 knots like conventional rudders, and will provide sideways movement of the stern when nearly stopped.

 

When I was on cruise ships, the Captains used to practice harbor approaches and docking with various systems "out of order" (still running but not being used), like not using stern thrusters. "Splitting the shafts" (one propeller going ahead and one propeller going astern) along with use of the Becker rudders gave nearly the same performance as the two stern thrusters.

 

Now, as I say, stern thrusters are nice, and many ports may require a stern tug if there are no thrusters, but they are not mandatory for a skilled Captain.

[chengkp75]

Compartment "2' would be the first compartment on the port side.

 

Even numbers Port; odd numbers Starboard.

 

Good point. Compartments #1 and #2 are the most forward compartments. The longitudinal and transverse bulkheads create the divides, on non-military ships anyway.

 

However, the way I understand it is, that the compartment numbering system on civil passenger ships begins at the "collision bulkhead". The collision bulkhead is the furthest forward bulkhead and not divided into two compartments. It is a super beefy bulkhead which, as it name implies, is going to take the brunt of a head on collision and protect all aft of it.

 

The most important point here though is that the collision bulkhead is not all that the close to the bow of the ship, but in some cases begins almost 8% of the total length of the vessel aft of the bow. Meaning that the compartments aft of it could contain machinery significant for operating the ship.

 

The watertight compartments of a cruise ship are not segregated port and starboard, but extend all the way across the ship. Forward of the collision bulkhead, would be the "forepeak ballast tank". The engine room on cruise ships runs from just behind this bulkhead all the way aft to where the shafts stick out into the water, and actually behind this. A ship the size of Pacific Princess will have the engine room divided into about 10-12 watertight compartments, each separated by a hydraulically operated watertight door. When maneuvering into/out of port, all of these doors must be closed per international regulation, and when at sea, only certain ones may be left open (depending on design). So, the engineers must constantly be opening and closing these doors to proceed the length of the engine room.

 

The engine room is mainly on the lowest deck (deck 0), but where the actual engines are, the engine room will be two decks high, and then actually continue up to the funnels.

 

The watertight compartmentalization of the ship continues above the engine room, up to what is known as the "subdivision deck", usually deck 3 which is above the normal waterline of the ship. In these areas above the engine room will be the laundry and crew quarters. These will also be divided into the same watertight compartments by the same hydraulic watertight doors, which must also be kept closed when in restricted waters. This is why there are so many crew staircases in the lower decks, as with these doors closed, to go from your cabin to your neighbor's, you may have to go up 2 flights of stairs, forward 10 feet, and back down 2 flights of stairs.

 

Engineering equipment will be spread throughout the length of the ship. "Compartment 2" would be two compartments back from the collision bulkhead, and would likely contain things like potable water tanks, and non-critical items like the vacuum pumps for the toilets in the forward part of the ship. If there weren't a second set of vacuum pumps aft, even on a small ship like this, I would be surprised.

 

Depending on the severity of the damage to the hull, and based on the one description posted here, its not that bad, and also on where on the hull (how far below the waterline), will determine whether a drydock is needed. They can ballast the ship down aft to raise the bow higher out of the water, and then list it over to possibly bring the breaches above the water for repair. They can also use temporary cofferdams to cover the breaches (a metal box with one side missing that they place over the hole/tear with the open side against the ship, and pump the water out, and the force of the water around the outside of the box holds it against the hull). How long to repair any machinery inside the compartment is another thing, hard to say without knowing what it is.

[chengkp75]

The news releases I am seeing... YAHOO news,

uses this description of the events ---

""PACIFIC PRINCESS MADE CONTACT WITH THE BREAK WATER WALL""

while entering Nice, France.

 

Not "collided."

 

Not "Hit"

 

Ahhh well~~~~~ Bottom line, I am Beyond Sorry + Sad for all the passengers and the travel upheaval + uncertainty + disappointment + chaos.

 

Technically, a ship cannot "collide" with a breakwater. "Collision" (note the "co") assumes both objects are moving. In maritime parlance this is an "allision", or contact made with a stationary object.

[pablo222]

So, the engineers must constantly be opening and closing these doors to proceed the length of the engine room.

 

There was a guy killed a few years ago on crown, when the water

tight door closed on him.

 

Apparently, the practice was to activate the door, when it opened

just enough, squeeze through, and then release the control lever.

 

The control lever broke, or became disengaged at the wrong time.

 

Pretty gruesome.