Appropriate tip for butler in Haven

[Cuizer2]

I like your quip because it is probably exactly what the marketing folks said = how do we create an option to charge more for a room. If you look at the history of the DOS on the various NCL ships you'll find it quite interesting.

 

Do you think that they will upgrade DOS to Windows some time in the future?

[MizDemeanor]

It is actually very simple. You tip amount that you feel comfortable with.

 

Thank you for giving me permission to do that. ;p

[MizDemeanor]

We are just back and having been interested in this topic for our Getaway cruise and after being in suites on Celebrity cruises and NCL I'd like to share my thoughts on tipping now that we have completed our cruise.

 

I really contemplated this gratuity. I wanted to be fair and I wanted to be sure that the amount was in tune with what I was comfortable with. As I walked away from my Butler experience, I am 1,000 % sure that my cabin attendant did a materially better job enhancing my enjoyment than my Butler did.

 

So I dwelled on what I was going to do about my impressions, and I thought about those who shared their experiences here.

 

At the end of the day, I shared a wonderful hug and Thank You with our cabin attendent along wth some extra cash. Our cabin was picture perfect each and every day. Like every day was better than a first day. Organized and spotless. We are very easy to care for, we don't leave a mess, and she had papers organized that we might have left astray. I have never had such a high level of attention. She was our Vacation Hero.

 

We have had butlers on NCL before and on Celebrity in various suites. On Celebrity the Butlers have been in the service charge. Apparently on NCL this is not the case, or so they say here.

 

If I suggest that on Celebrity for example in a non-suite we have tipped the staff who brings us a breakfast tray at what was a suggested $2.00, then should I say that a bulter who brings milk for our coffee should be mathematically $2.00 per milk trip?

 

If I say that a cabin steward on Celebrity that brings us room service is a $2.00 tip for the tray, are the afternoon goodies that come with the Haven a $2.00 per trip gratuity?

 

Let's say that the breakfast tray is now $5.00 and the afterrnoon snack is $5.00. That's $10.00 a day. Is that $70.00 or perhaps $80.00 then?

 

We gave our Butler $100.00. Was it to be PC? Maybe. Probably. But I don't think I will ever do that again for milk for the coffee machine and the afternoon canapes that the cabin come with anyway.

 

Especially when the cabin attendant outshined the Butler by a mile.

 

The DSC is higher for suites although it is not defined that suites = The Haven since many suites are not Haven, so its sort of smoky to me. I do think that the Butlers do get a share of the DSC weven wothout proof that they do, and that the idea of a gratuity on top of that is more or less what anyone would do over and above for any non Haven cabin steward, and I'll bet in this day and age most don't think twice about leaving a penny more with so many looking to have the DSC eliminated from their account.

 

Especially when NCL says go ahead and do just that.

 

In the end I think tipping the Butler is a hot mess. I'll go as far as to say for standard cabin services like leaving milk for the machine instead of the creamers or bringing afternon canapes that are standard fare....leaving a gratuity is not at all necessary.

 

If they unpack you, if they bring you full DR meals and serve you above and beyond and cater to specialized whims what ever they may be, yes, those are above standard services. Tip on that.

 

But tip on what I am describing, milk and afternoon canapés? No, I personally don't think it is justified.

[maja651]

We are just back and having been interested in this topic for our Getaway cruise and after being in suites on Celebrity cruises and NCL I'd like to share my thoughts on tipping now that we have completed our cruise.

 

I really contemplated this gratuity. I wanted to be fair and I wanted to be sure that the amount was in tune with what I was comfortable with. As I walked away from my Butler experience, I am 1,000 % sure that my cabin attendant did a materially better job enhancing my enjoyment than my Butler did.

 

So I dwelled on what I was going to do about my impressions, and I thought about those who shared their experiences here.

 

At the end of the day, I shared a wonderful hug and Thank You with our cabin attendent along wth some extra cash. Our cabin was picture perfect each and every day. Like every day was better than a first day. Organized and spotless. We are very easy to care for, we don't leave a mess, and she had papers organized that we might have left astray. I have never had such a high level of attention. She was our Vacation Hero.

 

We have had butlers on NCL before and on Celebrity in various suites. On Celebrity the Butlers have been in the service charge. Apparently on NCL this is not the case, or so they say here.

 

If I suggest that on Celebrity for example in a non-suite we have tipped the staff who brings us a breakfast tray at what was a suggested $2.00, then should I say that a bulter who brings milk for our coffee should be mathematically $2.00 per milk trip?

 

If I say that a cabin steward on Celebrity that brings us room service is a $2.00 tip for the tray, are the afternoon goodies that come with the Haven a $2.00 per trip gratuity?

 

Let's say that the breakfast tray is now $5.00 and the afterrnoon snack is $5.00. That's $10.00 a day. Is that $70.00 or perhaps $80.00 then?

 

We gave our Butler $100.00. Was it to be PC? Maybe. Probably. But I don't think I will ever do that again for milk for the coffee machine and the afternoon canapes that the cabin come with anyway.

 

Especially when the cabin attendant outshined the Butler by a mile.

 

The DSC is higher for suites although it is not defined that suites = The Haven since many suites are not Haven, so its sort of smoky to me. I do think that the Butlers do get a share of the DSC weven wothout proof that they do, and that the idea of a gratuity on top of that is more or less what anyone would do over and above for any non Haven cabin steward, and I'll bet in this day and age most don't think twice about leaving a penny more with so many looking to have the DSC eliminated from their account.

 

Especially when NCL says go ahead and do just that.

 

In the end I think tipping the Butler is a hot mess. I'll go as far as to say for standard cabin services like leaving milk for the machine instead of the creamers or bringing afternon canapes that are standard fare....leaving a gratuity is not at all necessary.

 

If they unpack you, if they bring you full DR meals and serve you above and beyond and cater to specialized whims what ever they may be, yes, those are above standard services. Tip on that.

 

But tip on what I am describing, milk and afternoon canapés? No, I personally don't think it is justified.

 

I’m sorry, but if you continue to book suites on NCL and do not tip anything, I feel sorry for your future butlers. I believe there is an expectation of at least a bare minimum of $100 tip for 2 people in a 7 night suite.

[emcelh]

I’m sorry, but if you continue to book suites on NCL and do not tip anything, I feel sorry for your future butlers. I believe there is an expectation of at least a bare minimum of $100 tip for 2 people in a 7 night suite.

If no special requests are made and the butler does nothing more than deliver snacks in the afternoon, I think a tip of $100 is high. If that's the expectation it isn't a realistic one IMO.

[MizDemeanor]

I’m sorry, but if you continue to book suites on NCL and do not tip anything, I feel sorry for your future butlers. I believe there is an expectation of at least a bare minimum of $100 tip for 2 people in a 7 night suite.

 

Let me ask you a question then....do you also Tip out the Haven Dining Staff or the Hostess? Both categories of this service group in the MDR's have been tipped out on other lines. If so why, and if not why not if you are willing to share your thoughts.

[erdoran]

100/7 = ~$14/snack

[Ironworker808]

Let me ask you a question then....do you also Tip out the Haven Dining Staff or the Hostess? Both categories of this service group in the MDR's have been tipped out on other lines. If so why, and if not why not if you are willing to share your thoughts.

 

I’m not the poster you asked, but I’m giving you my response to the question nonetheless.

 

I do not, unless I feel they’ve gone ‘above and beyond’. They are included in the DSC. The butler is not. I’ve been lucky enough to have exemplary butlers on my last two (and only) Haven cruises (Maxi and Roland). And a couple of bartenders (Debbie and Oswald, both in the Haven). And Budi, our steward. Those four people received tips from us.

 

Why?

 

Because THEY MADE OUR EXPERIENCE BETTER!!!

 

That is our qualification. If you enhance the cruise experience, you are compensated accordingly. Period.

 

We haven’t yet dined in the MDR. Between the Haven restaurant, SDP, and room service, we’ve never been to a MDR.

[DMH15]

We are just back and having been interested in this topic for our Getaway cruise and after being in suites on Celebrity cruises and NCL I'd like to share my thoughts on tipping now that we have completed our cruise.

 

I really contemplated this gratuity. I wanted to be fair and I wanted to be sure that the amount was in tune with what I was comfortable with. As I walked away from my Butler experience, I am 1,000 % sure that my cabin attendant did a materially better job enhancing my enjoyment than my Butler did.

 

So I dwelled on what I was going to do about my impressions, and I thought about those who shared their experiences here.

 

At the end of the day, I shared a wonderful hug and Thank You with our cabin attendent along wth some extra cash. Our cabin was picture perfect each and every day. Like every day was better than a first day. Organized and spotless. We are very easy to care for, we don't leave a mess, and she had papers organized that we might have left astray. I have never had such a high level of attention. She was our Vacation Hero.

 

We have had butlers on NCL before and on Celebrity in various suites. On Celebrity the Butlers have been in the service charge. Apparently on NCL this is not the case, or so they say here.

 

If I suggest that on Celebrity for example in a non-suite we have tipped the staff who brings us a breakfast tray at what was a suggested $2.00, then should I say that a bulter who brings milk for our coffee should be mathematically $2.00 per milk trip?

 

If I say that a cabin steward on Celebrity that brings us room service is a $2.00 tip for the tray, are the afternoon goodies that come with the Haven a $2.00 per trip gratuity?

 

Let's say that the breakfast tray is now $5.00 and the afterrnoon snack is $5.00. That's $10.00 a day. Is that $70.00 or perhaps $80.00 then?

 

We gave our Butler $100.00. Was it to be PC? Maybe. Probably. But I don't think I will ever do that again for milk for the coffee machine and the afternoon canapes that the cabin come with anyway.

 

Especially when the cabin attendant outshined the Butler by a mile.

 

The DSC is higher for suites although it is not defined that suites = The Haven since many suites are not Haven, so its sort of smoky to me. I do think that the Butlers do get a share of the DSC weven wothout proof that they do, and that the idea of a gratuity on top of that is more or less what anyone would do over and above for any non Haven cabin steward, and I'll bet in this day and age most don't think twice about leaving a penny more with so many looking to have the DSC eliminated from their account.

 

Especially when NCL says go ahead and do just that.

 

In the end I think tipping the Butler is a hot mess. I'll go as far as to say for standard cabin services like leaving milk for the machine instead of the creamers or bringing afternon canapes that are standard fare....leaving a gratuity is not at all necessary.

 

If they unpack you, if they bring you full DR meals and serve you above and beyond and cater to specialized whims what ever they may be, yes, those are above standard services. Tip on that.

 

But tip on what I am describing, milk and afternoon canapés? No, I personally don't think it is justified.

 

Facts:

 

First. Butlers and Concierges are definately not part of the DSC.

 

Second the minimal increase in DSC for suites is for the size of the room for the steward. It takes more time to clean.

 

Opinion:

 

Lastly, if a USA land-based restaurant server does the minimum, say, bring your meal, refill your tea, bring your check, do you use your same logic and tip Nothing?

 

I just cannot imagine anyone letting a butler do their job all cruise and then tip nothing.

 

Wow.

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums

[maja651]

Let me ask you a question then....do you also Tip out the Haven Dining Staff or the Hostess? Both categories of this service group in the MDR's have been tipped out on other lines. If so why, and if not why not if you are willing to share your thoughts.

Let’s see. Regarding Haven staff. We did actually tip the Haven restaurant maitre-d on the Getaway because she was amazing (she is in fact now a concierge with NCL, Suzanna). We also tipped one of the waitresses (Michelle W.) in the Haven restaurant of that same cruise. We did that because we ate in the Haven Restaurant a lot that cruise and those 2 ladies made a huge positive impact on our cruise. On the Epic we did not, but we did not spend much time in the Haven restaurant on the Epic.

I feel like if you are cruising in a suite, tipping extra needs to be a part of your budget. We always budget a certain amount and if the concierge is not great, for example, we give that extra money to the room stew and the butler. We rarely come back with tip money unspent.

And regarding the people not using the butler, why not? I am more than capable of doing things myself as well, but part of the enjoyment of booking a suite is the relaxation and splurging of having someone else do it for you! That’s what the butler is for, to make your cruise amazing. I feel if you are kind to the butler, tip him/her well for their service, why not use their services! You want some pretzal rolls from the buffet, just call your butler! You forgot your wine in the room and you’re at one of the restaurants, call the butler!

[DarkJedi]

I’m sorry, but if you continue to book suites on NCL and do not tip anything, I feel sorry for your future butlers. I believe there is an expectation of at least a bare minimum of $100 tip for 2 people in a 7 night suite.

 

$100/2 = $50/7 = $7.15

$7.15 x 14 cabins = $100.10 x 3 (average # of occupants) = $300.30 x 274 (days of contract) = $82,282.20

 

That is $82,282.20 above their pay, not as their pay. And you are claiming that is the bare minimum that they should get as a bonus to their salary for simply existing.

 

 

And please don't use the "but you tip on land" BS. In Japan you don't tip because employers are expected to pay people a decent wage. In the US employers pay waitstaff well under minimum wage with the expectation that tips will make up the difference.

Well guess what, in the Seattle area you have Seatac, where servers make $15 an hour minimum. Do you think I plan on tipping when I eat there after my upcoming cruise? Nope. Not because I am cheap, but because tipping is supposed to be about going above and beyond, not about doing what is expected of you as the basic part of your job.

[erdoran]

Facts:

 

First. Butlers and Concierges are definately not part of the DSC.

 

Second the minimal increase in DSC for suites is for the size of the room for the steward. It takes more time to clean.

 

Opinion:

 

Lastly, if a USA land-based restaurant server does the minimum, say, bring your meal, refill your tea, bring your check, do you use your same logic and tip Nothing?

 

I just cannot imagine anyone letting a butler do their job all cruise and then tip nothing.

 

Wow.

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums

Does a suite steward have the same number of rooms to clean as a non-suite steward? And does a studio (99 sq ft) guest pay a lower DSC than a balcony (~200-300 sq ft) guest?

 

I get that the suites have more square footage, but in absence of some evidence that the suite steward has the same number of suites to clean as the balcony steward and studio steward (lucky guy!!) I don't think that justifies the higher DSC. My guess is that it goes to Haven staff: restaurant, pool, etc. So we pay DSC for the regular services, some we use, some we don't - but all are available if we choose to use them - AND we pay DSC for all Haven services.

 

I'd actually like to know that this is correct as I make my own tipping decisions, because the amount I'll tip someone who definitely gets no share of DSC is of course much higher than for someone who does.

 

As for butler tips, I'm of the school that if I make zero special requests of butler and concierge then why tip $100 for a week? I guess an argument can be made for "well, he/she is available and that's worth something"...No argument if I make special requests the tip increases proportionately. Don't all flame me at once, I get that whether or not I agree with this "price of entry" tip I'll still do it because I CAN afford it and I don't want to do the "wrong thing".

 

BTW my personal opinion is that cruise tipping is totally out of hand...."tip" plus "extra tip" plus DSC and "but the steward is so wonderful we tipped even more" seeming to be the norm now, and "walk into a suite, there's an expectation you are going to tip concierge and butler for doing their basic jobs, even if you ask for ZERO beyond that (basic job = pm snacks & refill coffee machine for butler, do the regular group escort thing for concierge)--and everything beyond that you pay for too". We are paying $$$$$$ for haven suites and part of that IS the butler & concierge service - that's a BIG part of the price.

 

Having said the above, the cruise tipping is a reality and I'll pull up my (cheap) big girl pants and buy in to "part of the cost of the Haven is tipping appropriately; if you can't afford/aren't willing to pay extra for the staff doing what they are paid to do, don't book there". I am entitled to my "I think it sucks" opinion regardless, though.

[BirdTravels]

If no special requests are made and the butler does nothing more than deliver snacks in the afternoon, I think a tip of $100 is high. If that's the expectation it isn't a realistic one IMO.

So,,,, people do this in restaurants too. Leave a couple of bucks on the table when they go to a fine dining place? Because the waiter does nothing more than deliver food?

[MizDemeanor]

I don't align land based retaurant tipping with cruise based tipping. I thinks its an error to try to rationalize the two beyond the idea that tippping is part of the game plan. Cruise tipping and land based restaurant tipping are two different worlds.

[MizDemeanor]

BTW my personal opinion is that cruise tipping is totally out of hand...."tip" plus "extra tip" plus DSC and "but the steward is so wonderful we tipped even more" seeming to be the norm now, and "walk into a suite, there's an expectation you are going to tip concierge and butler for doing their basic jobs, even if you ask for ZERO beyond that (basic job = pm snacks & refill coffee machine for butler, do the regular group escort thing for concierge)--and everything beyond that you pay for too". We are paying $$$$$$ for haven suites and part of that IS the butler & concierge service - that's a BIG part of the price.

 

I agree with you that cruise tipping it is out of hand. I do think though that Butlers are compensated in some fashion or else why would they take the job for no guarantee of income. I am going to bet that not everyone in Haven tips and not everyone tips $100.00 or more.

[emcelh]

So,,,, people do this in restaurants too. Leave a couple of bucks on the table when they go to a fine dining place? Because the waiter does nothing more than deliver food?

Maybe some people do. Service would have to be poor for me to tip less than 20% of the check in a restaurant however. On our last cruise, which was 10 days, we gave the butler $75. That's $7.50 a day for delivering a plate of snacks, generous considering he probably spent less than a minute in our cabin each time. He probably checked the coffee maker, which we didn't use.

[erdoran]

So,,,, people do this in restaurants too. Leave a couple of bucks on the table when they go to a fine dining place? Because the waiter does nothing more than deliver food?

In a restaurant you tip on 20% of the bill - so a $250 dinner gets a $50 tip.

 

Let's see - Haven cabins, one week cruise - say $5k - $20k? So then total tip at 20% would be $1k-$4k? Of course that would include DSC, so deduct that from additional total; let's say that comes to $250 for two people. With that logic, there should be an "extra tip" of $750-$3750. Nice!

[DarkJedi]

My guess is that it goes to Haven staff: restaurant, pool, etc. So we pay DSC for the regular services, some we use, some we don't - but all are available if we choose to use them - AND we pay DSC for all Haven services.

 

That would be my guess as well.

[DarkJedi]

So,,,, people do this in restaurants too. Leave a couple of bucks on the table when they go to a fine dining place? Because the waiter does nothing more than deliver food?

 

Why do you tip in a restaurant?

 

If you tip because it is expected, congrats, you are tipping as an American, where restaurants get away with paying workers well below minimum wage because of the "expected" tips.

 

Go to a country where they pay their workers appropriately and tipping is not only not expected, it is considered rude. Tipping a waiter in Japan is like telling them that their boss is too cheap to pay them.

 

Now, the butler and concierge are both making good salaries, around $63K fora 9 month contract. So tipping them an extra $82K for those 9 months and they make around $145K for 9 months.Concierge makes around $113K for those 9 months, before tips, just an FYI.

[littlelulu01]

$100/2 = $50/7 = $7.15

$7.15 x 14 cabins = $100.10 x 3 (average # of occupants) = $300.30 x 274 (days of contract) = $82,282.20

 

That is $82,282.20 above their pay, not as their pay. And you are claiming that is the bare minimum that they should get as a bonus to their salary for simply existing.

 

 

And please don't use the "but you tip on land" BS. In Japan you don't tip because employers are expected to pay people a decent wage. In the US employers pay waitstaff well under minimum wage with the expectation that tips will make up the difference.

Well guess what, in the Seattle area you have Seatac, where servers make $15 an hour minimum. Do you think I plan on tipping when I eat there after my upcoming cruise? Nope. Not because I am cheap, but because tipping is supposed to be about going above and beyond, not about doing what is expected of you as the basic part of your job.

Good luck with your plan. I went to dinner with my girlfriends last week in Seattle. Wasn’t paying much attention and one of the gals divided bill by 4 and added 20%. I thought my portion was a little higher than expected but didn’t argue. Afterward I realized 20% was already charged. We didn’t notice and payed an additional 20% so accidentally paid 40%. You will likely automatically be charged the 20% with an option for any additional. If opposed to this then you can opt to eat at McDonald’s. many places now charge the gratuity flat out in the bill so you might not get the opportunity to stiff the servers.

 

Im sorry but in Seattle, tips are expected and the norm. The minimum wage rate isn’t an excuse to stiff the servers. Have you any idea what parking, housing and the general cost of living is in Seattle? Go ahead and make a stand by stiffing the servers but probably best to let them know up front your intentions.

 

The butler and concierge are tipped positions and Ncl clearly states they aren’t in the dsc tip pool. It’s customary to tip them according to service rendered. It’s a personal thing and can vary widely. There’s no set amount but unless they did nothing to enhance your vacation they should be given something.

 

Everyone else is in the tip pool. If you feel like giving them a little extra fine but if not they’re already well taken care of in the pretty hefty dsc. These arguments about dsc not being tips are absurd. The recent email I got from Ncl about my upcoming cruise dsc increases specifically outlined that the dsc makes it easy for me to provide gratuity to staff.

[MizDemeanor]

Now, the butler and concierge are both making good salaries, around $63K fora 9 month contract. So tipping them an extra $82K for those 9 months and they make around $145K for 9 months.Concierge makes around $113K for those 9 months, before tips, just an FYI.

 

 

Thank you for this insight. I almost want to ask how do you know this, but what trumps that question is the idea that there is such insistence that these category of workers are zero based and live only on the tips that are conveyed.

 

It frustrates me to want to do the right thing by the cruise staff, and to do so with solid information in hand to make respectful decisions for those others as well as myself, and when trying to accomplish that fair balance it is met with intimidation.

 

I’m pleased that this topic has been uncorked.

 

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[voyager1964]

According to this site http://www.cruiseshipjob.com/butler-jobs.html the salary range for a butler is $2,400 - $3,200 a month. So, $800 a week with 14 cabins ~= $60 per cabin. I guess this is what an expectation should be

[Cuizer2]

Why do you tip in a restaurant?

 

If you tip because it is expected, congrats, you are tipping as an American, where restaurants get away with paying workers well below minimum wage because of the "expected" tips.

 

Go to a country where they pay their workers appropriately and tipping is not only not expected, it is considered rude. Tipping a waiter in Japan is like telling them that their boss is too cheap to pay them.

 

Now, the butler and concierge are both making good salaries, around $63K fora 9 month contract. So tipping them an extra $82K for those 9 months and they make around $145K for 9 months.Concierge makes around $113K for those 9 months, before tips, just an FYI.

 

Where are you getting this information? Why do you believe a butler makes $63K before tips? Why do you believe a concierge makes $113K before tips? According to the article below, a butler makes $2400 to 3200 U.S. per month depending on gratuities (which means including gratuities - not in addition to gratuities).

 

http://www.cruiseshipjob.com/butler-jobs.html

 

 

 

Another site says average $1,500 / mo ...

 

http://www.cruiseshipjobs.com/job-positions/housekeeping/

 

 

 

Below are articles that discusses more about cruise ship pay. You've got the butler and the concierge making more than the hotel director.

 

https://www.cruisecritic.com/articles.cfm?ID=261

 

http://www.traveltruth.com/2012/10/14/cruise-crew-salaries-exposed/

 

 

This one says the concierge makes $3000+ per month ...

 

https://www.allcruisejobs.com/i1033/concierge/

 

 

 

If you know where a cruise ship concierge is making $100K+ per year, with four months vacation per year, please send me an application.

[Ironworker808]

The base salary of whomever I am tipping is irrelevant.

 

I don’t care if your salary is $1, $100, or $1000 a day.

 

If you have increased or elevated the pleasure of my experience, you will be compensated accordingly. Period.

[Cuizer2]

Thank you for this insight. I almost want to ask how do you know this, but what trumps that question is the idea that there is such insistence that these category of workers are zero based and live only on the tips that are conveyed.

 

It frustrates me to want to do the right thing by the cruise staff, and to do so with solid information in hand to make respectful decisions for those others as well as myself, and when trying to accomplish that fair balance it is met with intimidation.

 

I’m pleased that this topic has been uncorked.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

Don't believe everything you read on this site. Cruise ship employees are not making anywhere near DarkJedi is claiming. For any cruise ship crew member that interacts with the passengers, tips are a very big part of their pay.