Royal Caribbean Fights Back!

[1corona4u]

Your memory is probably better than mine. :)

 

If you don't have TiVo, you should get it.:) It's a great resource.;)

[havebagswilltravel]

if one of the three left early to order room service; not only would it explain some mismatches; but there should be three time certain records in the SeaPass system. The investigators must have this information available.

(1) he enters his room

(2) room service order is placed

(3) the other three enter room - (unless they knock and are allowed in - OR does the SeaPass entry system show EVERY opening - key or from inside?)

 

Thanks for listening - I'm soooooo new - I have no idea how to do this, but I've been watching EVERYTHING you all have said (on ALL the threads) and couldn't be shy any longer.

[1corona4u]

FC, I tend to agree. However, that is the way the guy described it in his interview with Greta. I do notice that this man tends to be very specific in drawing conclusions about what he hears. For example, he distinctly describes "drinking games" as what was going on before he called security. He says smoething to the effect "there was a raising of voices as if to encourage the doing of shots or chugging of beers". He also describes a heated argumant later on the balcony, although he says he cannot hear exact words in either case. He is a police officer, so maybe he is more finely tuned to listen for clues than the average person. He does seem to read a lot into things, though. There is always the possibility that he is misinterpreting what he heard.

 

You know, Greta is small, but I also thought the cop would have reallly been stretching around the divider to see inside their cabin the next day...but given the fact that the bed would have been to the far side of the Smith's cabin, maybe not.....

[1corona4u]

if one of the three left early to order room service; not only would it explain some mismatches; but there should be three time certain records in the SeaPass system. The investigators must have this information available.

(1) he enters his room

(2) room service order is placed

(3) the other three enter room - (unless they knock and are allowed in - OR does the SeaPass entry system show EVERY opening - key or from inside?)

 

Thanks for listening - I'm soooooo new - I have no idea how to do this, but I've been watching EVERYTHING you all have said (on ALL the threads) and couldn't be shy any longer.

 

I think just if the Seapass is used....

[Barky]

If you don't have TiVo, you should get it.:) It's a great resource.;)

 

I live on a pension so my VCR has to do. But, I had to tape Monk last night so I had to watch Greta. :)

[1corona4u]

I live on a pension so my VCR has to do. But, I had to tape Monk last night so I had to watch Greta. :)

 

LOL....:D hey, you gotta have priorities....I got mine from Santa, and I didn't even ask for it. I was confused as to why he brought it to me, but now, I really like it.

[Barefoot_Pirate]

Bark, the RCCL guy was wimpy in the way he moved stuff around....and you can slam those drawers, doors to the closet, water closet, etc. In fact I slam the closet folding doors by accident more than I would like to admit...sorry to all on that.

 

But he was cautious in the way he moved the furniture, IMHO

 

If there is a MIA that was left in the room when the three amigos left, then there is a problem...but gosh that would have come out you would think...the last person to see DH alive for gosh sake.

 

I'm just glad DW is looking good, the crew is no longer being dragged into this, the three drinking buddies look good & Elvis is still the king. The list is getting shorter... and my heart goes out to the family...even with their lawyers and all, they have lost their son and husband which is a grief I would not want anyone to have.

[DroopySails]

You know, this is a very tight timeline here, with not much time in between some very important events. By my count, the noise complaint was placed at 4:05, so they must have been in the room for at least a little while at that point in order for the neighbor(cop) to get sufficiently annoyed to place the call. The cop said there was more noise after that, maybe as much as 30-40 minutes worth, and then the thud. JHS was wheeled into the room at 5:00 AM, so a lot happened between 4:05 and 5:00.

 

Apparently, these guys had met earlier in the week and had been hanging out some since. They all left the casino together along with at least one casino employee, according to reports. They went to the disco in the Crown and continued to party. This is where the argument between GS and JHS, and the reported groin kick occured. Some stories have JHS stumbling out of the disco alone while GS stayed and continued drinking with the guys. Other stories have her leaving with the casino employee, although that my be the less believable of the two. I am thinking that this story is attributed to Josh, but I am not certain. RCI's version is that she was in the elevator alone after the disco. RCI also states that 4 men accompanied GS back to his room. Only 3 were witnessed leaving, but MACOP states that one of them may have left previous to the other 3, and that may be true. It would certanly make more sense that way.

 

This is by far the most complete and accurate summation of events between 4:00 and 5:00 I've seen on these boards. I'd only add that the crew members found JHS passed out around 4:30 and went back to the cabin to see if they could find her husband to help retrieve her. 4:30 was, IIRC, about the time security arrived at the cabin to investigate the noise complaint. So events in the cabin were more or less over by 4:30, or at least there was an interval of quiet at that time.

 

RCI's release states that the neighbor knocked on the wall about the time he called in a complaint (4:05) and that the noise abated as a result of him knocking on the wall. If he's also saying it went on for 30-40 more minutes, does he mean at a lower (tolerable?) volume?

 

Agree with some of you that the whereabouts of the fourth man (now identified as the Russian-Americans' teenage brother, IIRC) is key to the story. He may have left earlier than the other three. He may also have been still present in the room when GS went overboard...not necessarily having any part of it, but witnessing it.

 

Having him still be in the room, and talking to GS, is the most credible explanation for the male voice heard by the neighbor after the other three men left. I don't put a lot of stock in the GS talking-to-self theory. He'd have to have been talking pretty dang loudly for the neighbor to hear him, and people generally speak more volubly when they're addressing others than when they're talking aloud to themselves.

[Barky]

Forgive me but what does IIRC mean? I've seen it often and never asked.

[1corona4u]

Having him still be in the room, and talking to GS, is the most credible explanation for the male voice heard by the neighbor after the other three men left. I don't put a lot of stock in the GS talking-to-self theory. He'd have to have been talking pretty dang loudly for the neighbor to hear him, and people generally speak more volubly when they're addressing others than when they're talking aloud to themselves.

 

Maybe George was on the phone though........then he may have been modulated. Maybe Jen called him, or one of the other guys...

[EBFURR]

Bark, the RCCL guy was wimpy in the way he moved stuff around....and you can slam those drawers, doors to the closet, water closet, etc. In fact I slam the closet folding doors by accident more than I would like to admit...sorry to all on that.

 

But he was cautious in the way he moved the furniture, IMHO

 

If there is a MIA that was left in the room when the three amigos left, then there is a problem...but gosh that would have come out you would think...the last person to see DH alive for gosh sake.

 

I'm just glad DW is looking good, the crew is no longer being dragged into this, the three drinking buddies look good & Elvis is still the king. The list is getting shorter... and my heart goes out to the family...even with their lawyers and all, they have lost their son and husband which is a grief I would not want anyone to have.

 

Pirate, I am glad you mention Elvis again. I have always been a fan and would like to see him cleared in this matter. Although he is known to have shot at his TV on occaision, I do not see him as actually being able to harm another human being, especially at his advanced age.

 

Now those aliens are another story altogether. I don't know if you are an O'rielly fan, but on his show last night, he had a couple who had actually been abducted by aliens. This has happened to each of them multiple times. They were both returned safe each time, thank goodness, but there are probably ruffians in the alien population too. Who is to say that all aliens are kind and gentle? Personally, I am putting the aliens right up there on the suspect list, especially in light of the information from Bill O'rielly's show.

[1corona4u]

Pirate, I am glad you mention Elvis again. I have always been a fan and would like to see him cleared in this matter. Although he is known to have shot at his TV on occaision, I do not see him as actually being able to harm another human being, especially at his advanced age.

 

Now those aliens are another story altogether. I don't know if you are an O'rielly fan, but on his show last night, he had a couple who had actually been abducted by aliens. This has happened to each of them multiple times. They were both returned safe each time, thank goodness, but there are probably ruffians in the alien population too. Who is to say that all aliens are kind and gentle? Personally, I am putting the aliens right up there on the suspect list, especially in light of the information from Bill O'rielly's show.

 

LOL, yeaahhh riggghhhtt....:D

[Barky]

I'm wondering if Jen being near the crew section was purely accidental (I've made more than one bad turn so I know it is easy to do) or if she was seeking out Lloyd... or returning from Lloyd's cabin?????????????

[1corona4u]

I'm wondering if Jen being near the crew section was purely accidental (I've made more than one bad turn so I know it is easy to do) or if she was seeking out Lloyd... or returning from Lloyd's cabin?????????????

 

That crossed my mind too...

[Barky]

That crossed my mind too...

 

Great minds think alike. :D

[wolfganghowell]

Have to go to the gym (hey - I have a cruise in 3 months - must get prepared!). Watched Greta's show this morning - finally a news show that focused on events, varying accounts and known evidence without bias.

 

Be back later.

[zotzer]

You know, Greta is small, but I also thought the cop would have reallly been stretching around the divider to see inside their cabin the next day.....

 

Has it been said anywhere what time he peered around the balcony and looked in the room? This has been bugging me.....the curious cop, kept awake half the night by comings and goings, was nosey enough to peer around into the cabin, but didn't notice the big blood splotch on the canopy?

 

Tracy

[EBFURR]

LOL, yeaahhh riggghhhtt....:D

 

corona, I don't make the news, I just comment on it.:D I said before that pirate is a pretty sharp cookie and he (she?) is looking smarter all the time.

 

Unfortunately, I did not record Bill's show, but he did cite a poll indicating that over 50% of Americans think the US Gov. is covering up UFO information. One European country (sorry, can't recall or spell the name) has a population where more people believe in aliens than believe in God. (I am not making this up, unfortuntely).

 

Now, I have watched the lawyers for JHS and GS parents on MSNBC several times and these hard working and dedicated lawyers are adament that RCI is engaged in a coverup. In their eternal quest for truth, if they can determine that RCI is engaged (possibly with the cooperation of the US gov.) of covering up alien abductions aboard their vessels, I will be the first to stand up and applaud their hard work.

[Barky]

Has it been said anywhere what time he peered around the balcony and looked in the room? This has been bugging me.....the curious cop, kept awake half the night by comings and goings, was nosey enough to peer around into the cabin, but didn't notice the big blood splotch on the canopy?

 

Tracy

 

I think it was around 7 AM. He had been taking pictures so I guess he was looking at the horizon rather than down on a metal overhang.

[1corona4u]

Has it been said anywhere what time he peered around the balcony and looked in the room? This has been bugging me.....the curious cop, kept awake half the night by comings and goings, was nosey enough to peer around into the cabin, but didn't notice the big blood splotch on the canopy?

 

Tracy

 

Excellent point.:)

[Barefoot_Pirate]

I think he said what time he was looking around on the balcony...can't recall and ain't got no Tivo or even VCR anymore. But it was after sun rise and they were in port, so 7 or 8 would seem reasonable...well not for DW and myself when on a cruise.... He said he was looking out, not down which is why he did not see the blood. I am also glad that RCCL finally said that the canopy was metal, 'cuase some media folks seem to think it was canvas because of the term being used.

[DroopySails]

EBFURR, you crack me up.

 

Barky, it's "if I recall correctly."

 

Corona: Hadn't thought of the phone angle. Seems a bit unlikely given his allegedly advanced state of drunkenness, but who knows? Perhaps he was hoping for a pizza delivery.

[EBFURR]

EBFURR, you crack me up.

 

Barky, it's "if I recall correctly."

 

Corona: Hadn't thought of the phone angle. Seems a bit unlikely given his allegedly advanced state of drunkenness, but who knows? Perhaps he was hoping for a pizza delivery.

 

Droopy, I am simply trying to point out absurdity by being absurd. I am in no way trying to trivialize the death of GS IV. The absurdity in my opinion is in the misrepresentations, exaggerations, and disingenuousness being spewed forth by the attorneys for the families and their willing accomplices in the media (certain media exempted). They have absolutely no case for negligence against RCI and they know it. That is why they are concentrating on events after GS went missing. Their only avenue is to allege a cover-up by RCI. They have no real facts to support this. They have dragged out this confused couple who did not even know what cabin they were in to say (six months later) that the Smith cabin was being cleaned while it was supposed to be sealed. On Greta, the RCI official explained the confusion and indicated that the seapass records indicate that the cleaning crew was inside the cabin next to the Smith’s when the couple reported seeing them. I think these two might be well meaning, but their 15 minutes are pretty much over. You can bet that if the FBI uncovers any hard evidence that RCI has intentionally destroyed or suppressed evidence, there will be obstruction of justice charges coming forth. I strongly advise against holding ones breath while awaiting that eventuality.

The lawyers are operating under the guise of exposing corruption in the cruise industry and making it safer for the traveling public. The truth is that cruising is pretty darn safe already. Even in this case, it took some pretty reckless behavior to get to the point of the tragedy, no matter whether there was foul play or not.

Consider this: The lawyers are saying they intend to get to the bottom of GW’s disappearance. Meanwhile, the only way they are going to reap financial benefit is from a successful lawsuit against RCI for improper handling of the incident. There primary claim is that RCI destroyed or suppressed evidence and that it has impeded and prevented law enforcement from identifying, indicting, and prosecuting the perpetrator. If the FBI does succeed in the above, it will completely knock the legs from under the lawyers’ case. Based on that, it is actually in the best interest of the attorneys if a suspect is NOT prosecuted and convicted. It would also ruin them if the death was to be ruled accidental by the authorities. Their only chance for success comes from and unsolved crime. It is actually in the ATTORNEY’s best interest to impede the investigation, not RCI. RCI’s best interests are served by getting the case solved and out of the news.

corona, the phone angle is brilliant. More points for you.

[kenf333]

I'm wondering if Jen being near the crew section was purely accidental (I've made more than one bad turn so I know it is easy to do) or if she was seeking out Lloyd... or returning from Lloyd's cabin?????????????

 

You may have something there, in RCCL statement there was no mention of this guy, correct me if im wrong.

[Barky]

You may have something there, in RCCL statement there was no mention of this guy, correct me if im wrong.

 

Ken I couldn't find anything in their press releases but I do remember reading/hearing something somewhere (heaven knows where at this point) about Lloyd and another casino worker returning to their rooms; it might even have been prior to Jennifer leaving the disco but I'm not positive. I believe it was something to do with them reporting they had seapass documents and that RCI could prove the time though.

 

I threw it out because it raised a flag for me during Greta's show last night.