Overcrowded ports on itinerary with ships

[Vineyard View]

I started researching cruise timetables to understand better how many ships we will be in port with at some of the locations. I realize that may be just the case to always expect at a couple we have not been to (ie Santorini, Palma De Mallorca) but I was nonetheless a bit surprised. I also realize time of year has an impact (our sail date is 5/18 and 14 days), so maybe these places are better to visit at other times. Santorini will have 4 ships 9,900 pax, Palma de Mallorca 8,800 pax - these are the two I am most concerned with from an ability to enjoy them standpoint having never been. Barcelona, we have been to and stayed multiple times is embarkation (so not as concerned), but 5 ships, 13k+ pax. Rome, disembarkation so not as concerned, also been to, but six ships. Athens, we have been to, 9,640 pax so is it even worth revisiting and getting off the ship. Argostoli we have not  been 3300 pax. Valletta we have been but 4130 pax.  Several others have ships in port but not like these. 
I think I would mostly appreciate input as we have never been, would be on Palma de Mallorca, Santorini, and Argostoli. We experienced Malta with a big MSC ship this year and it was impactful - thank goodness it sailed early. Thank you 

 

[EJL2023]

10 minutes ago, Vineyard View said:

I started researching cruise timetables to understand better how many ships we will be in port with at some of the locations. I realize that may be just the case to always expect at a couple we have not been to (ie Santorini, Palma De Mallorca) but I was nonetheless a bit surprised. I also realize time of year has an impact (our sail date is 5/18 and 14 days), so maybe these places are better to visit at other times. Santorini will have 4 ships 9,900 pax, Palma de Mallorca 8,800 pax - these are the two I am most concerned with from an ability to enjoy them standpoint having never been. Barcelona, we have been to and stayed multiple times is embarkation (so not as concerned), but 5 ships, 13k+ pax. Rome, disembarkation so not as concerned, also been to, but six ships. Athens, we have been to, 9,640 pax so is it even worth revisiting and getting off the ship. Argostoli we have not  been 3300 pax. Valletta we have been but 4130 pax.  Several others have ships in port but not like these. 
I think I would mostly appreciate input as we have never been, would be on Palma de Mallorca, Santorini, and Argostoli. We experienced Malta with a big MSC ship this year and it was impactful - thank goodness it sailed early. Thank you 

 

We just sailed on Vista in May and many of the ports were really overwhelmed.  The tour guides told us it was insane the number of tourists they were seeing. One of our stops was Santorini. And let’s just say the crowds were absolutely crazy.  This is also a tethered port, but I would say that part was quite smooth.  The biggest issue though was getting back to the point to be tethered back to the ship. The only way there basically is via cable car lift.  With all the cruisers trying to get back, we were in the line for just this for over 1.5 hours.  There is a path to walk down but we talked to a few people who did this and they said was quite difficult and with the heat and no cover was extremely difficult, and they were some of the younger cruisers…Mykonos was equally crowded but at least did not have to deal with the cable car lift issue.  

Edited July 6, 2023 by EJL2023

[See_More]

Santorini is a huge problem, even with fewer ships than that.  Getting up the hill was not mentioned by the previous poster.  The line is formidable to get up but years ago we did find a way around that which I’ll explain in a minute.  We found no good option for back down.  We tried walking down once, but never again, two of our group slipped and landed in donkey poop. 
Back to our arrival after getting off the tender.  We saw numerous small boats offering to take us to the other end of the island. Some offered a mini tour which included a bus ride up the hill at that end by Oia which is my favorite part of Santorini, and a bus ride back to the town where the cruise ship is. Worked out perfect and we just took a local bus back to town, less than a dollar at the time and really scenic. Still couldn’t avoid the huge wait for the lift down. If there are no tour offerings with a bus ride you can walk up the road at the far end of the island. 

[EJL2023]

20 minutes ago, See_More said:

Santorini is a huge problem, even with fewer ships than that.  Getting up the hill was not mentioned by the previous poster.  The line is formidable to get up but years ago we did find a way around that which I’ll explain in a minute.  We found no good option for back down.  We tried walking down once, but never again, two of our group slipped and landed in donkey poop. 
Back to our arrival after getting off the tender.  We saw numerous small boats offering to take us to the other end of the island. Some offered a mini tour which included a bus ride up the hill at that end by Oia which is my favorite part of Santorini, and a bus ride back to the town where the cruise ship is. Worked out perfect and we just took a local bus back to town, less than a dollar at the time and really scenic. Still couldn’t avoid the huge wait for the lift down. If there are no tour offerings with a bus ride you can walk up the road at the far end of the island. 

We did not have an issue at starting point as excursions started close to where tether dropped off.  The initial drop off point and tether back to the ship were two separate locations. 

Edited July 6, 2023 by EJL2023

[AMHuntFerry]

2 hours ago, Vineyard View said:

I started researching cruise timetables to understand better how many ships we will be in port with at some of the locations. I realize that may be just the case to always expect at a couple we have not been to (ie Santorini, Palma De Mallorca) but I was nonetheless a bit surprised. I also realize time of year has an impact (our sail date is 5/18 and 14 days), so maybe these places are better to visit at other times. Santorini will have 4 ships 9,900 pax, Palma de Mallorca 8,800 pax - these are the two I am most concerned with from an ability to enjoy them standpoint having never been. Barcelona, we have been to and stayed multiple times is embarkation (so not as concerned), but 5 ships, 13k+ pax. Rome, disembarkation so not as concerned, also been to, but six ships. Athens, we have been to, 9,640 pax so is it even worth revisiting and getting off the ship. Argostoli we have not  been 3300 pax. Valletta we have been but 4130 pax.  Several others have ships in port but not like these. 
I think I would mostly appreciate input as we have never been, would be on Palma de Mallorca, Santorini, and Argostoli. We experienced Malta with a big MSC ship this year and it was impactful - thank goodness it sailed early. Thank you 

 

I had similar concerns on our June Alaska cruise since my dad had warned me about the zoo when cruise ships are in port, and we were going to be in most ports with larger ships (10k+ in small towns...eek!). However, we found that as soon as we walked a few blocks out of the tourist area, it was practically deserted except for the locals walking their dogs or going about their normal business. I noticed the same thing when visiting Vancouver for a conference many years ago. The "shopping opportunities" near the cruise ships were packed, but the surrounding areas were normal.
In a place like the Italian coast where steep hills may restrict movement to only the hardy, planning ahead for transport away from the crowds may be a good idea. Also, look for "alternate" things to do that don't draw the hoards if you want to get away. One of the silly things we do when traveling, and we want to take a break, is to look for mini-golf; a certain Seattle-area person made a whole business taking people off the beaten path, so have fun and find your own uncrowded fun...enjoy!

[pinotlover]

In June, on the Vista, in Santorini.

 

First understand that the tenders into port are not ran by Oceania, but by the port authority. Their boats can carry about twice as many as an Oceania tender. That’s the good news. The rest of the story is they also manage crowd control at the pier, and thus the vernacular up, by running the tender craft on a time basis as to not overload the pier. This means the longer wait may be inside the Lounge waiting for your number/color to be called. I believe we waited around 30 minutes in the Lounge, and then 45 minutes in line at the bottom.

 

Coming back with all the people on the other ships was horrible. About 1.5 hours in the hot sun, to catch the ride down.

[EJL2023]

6 minutes ago, pinotlover said:

In June, on the Vista, in Santorini.

 

First understand that the tenders into port are not ran by Oceania, but by the port authority. Their boats can carry about twice as many as an Oceania tender. That’s the good news. The rest of the story is they also manage crowd control at the pier, and thus the vernacular up, by running the tender craft on a time basis as to not overload the pier. This means the longer wait may be inside the Lounge waiting for your number/color to be called. I believe we waited around 30 minutes in the Lounge, and then 45 minutes in line at the bottom.

 

Coming back with all the people on the other ships was horrible. About 1.5 hours in the hot sun, to catch the ride down.

When there in May we did not have to take the cable lift up as the tender drop off point was at the Ferry port which had a large parking lot full of buses and vans awaiting. It was probably a good 20 minute ride on tender from ship to the port. 

Edited July 6, 2023 by EJL2023

[pinotlover]

1 minute ago, EJL2023 said:

When there in May we did not have to take the cable lift up as the tender drop off point was at the Ferry port which had a large parking lot full of buses and vans awaiting. It was probably a good 20 minute ride on tender from ship to the port. 

In 2017, several of O tour groups went out of that other pier. This time none of Oceania’s did. It appeared that MSC tours were being taken there.🥂

[YoPhilly]

We visited Santorini on O back in 2009.  I don't remember how many ships were in port, but the island was OVERWHELMED with visitors.  Crowds everywhere.  I took the funicular up but my husband chose to walk.  He enjoyed the walk but we both took the funicular down.  I'm sure the situation is even worse these days with more massive ships.  In fact, I'm surprised the Greeks don't limit ship visitors the way Venice has done.  Santorini is such a stunning island, but I won't recommend it to anyone anymore.

[WildWanderers]

Our excursion in Santorini left us at the top;  we were told to take the cable car down.  We didn't walk far until we came across the line for the cable car.  When we realized what it was and how far it was from the cable cars - very far, we thought that we had better get into the line.  We spent our whole afternoon in that line, waiting for the cable car.  If Destination Services had told us (via the Currents newsletter, say)  that all of the other cruise ships were leaving by 3:30 p.m., all we would have had to do was have lunch, walk around and then take the cable car when ours was the only ship left to descend.  Our afternoon was spent in the line-up, and lunch was over when we got back.

[LHT28]

35 minutes ago, WildWanderers said:

If Destination Services had told us (via the Currents newsletter, say)  that all of the other cruise ships were leaving by 3:30 p.m., all we would have had to do was have lunch, walk around and then take the cable car when ours was the only ship left to descend.  Our afternoon was spent in the line-up, and lunch was over when we got back.

You are expecting  DS  to know about other ships  when they cannot even get the correct info for Oceania  🙄

[Vineyard View]

Well, Santorini sounds like a place we should have chosen to go long ago. What a shame that they do not control some of this crowding. Dubrovnik finally has and it in my opinion was a smart idea.

to your point See_more, maybe there are some private tours available that will take you via boat round trip? I have thought of visiting Santorini for a long time, but this just does not sound like a good way to spend a lot of time. I really appreciate all this feedback and information. 
 

What about Palma de Mallorca?  It has also been in my sites for some time. That said, if these places are better visited at a different time of year, it would be a good thing to know. I wish this itinerary was earlier in the year, but it is not. 

 Athens. We spent several days their pre-cruise in the past. Kind of feel like we’ve been there, done that as far as the top things to do. With almost 10k cruise pax that day, does that sound like a ship day, or does anyone have suggestions that would be different?

 

thanks much again

 

[cruisemom42]

Overcrowding of ports has been a growing (ha!) problem, not just in the Med but it's very obvious there. 

 

Santorini and Dubrovnik are two of the most often cited, and both have promised in the past to strongly consider setting limits on the daily number of cruise passengers that would be allowed. It doesn't seem like this has been implemented in either case....

 

Some ports such as Rome, Athens, Barcelona etc. are large enough cities to handle the crowds. Rome itself receives thousands upon thousands of tourists NOT associated with cruising: every year it has over 10 million foreign visitors. For the most part they are handled well, dispersed among many sites and locations. In Santorini, that's just not possible.

 

I will only now consider Med cruises in the early spring (April through mid-May) or late fall (mid-October through November). Even then it's wise to look at how many and which other ships will be in port.

 

In Santorini, the best work-arounds are 1) take a ship tour that requires a bus; when that is the case, passengers are tendered to a different location and avoid the steep path up to Fira. A few ships offer excursions that also end at this secondary port, but you have to read and interpret the descriptions carefully. 2) When you arrive at the bottom of the cliff up to Thira, take one of the boats that ferry passengers around to the other side of the island (where pretty Oia is located). This avoids that wait for the lift up, but unfortunately you still have to return to Fira from Oia by taxi or local bus and then get down the cliff at the end of your visit.

 

Edited July 6, 2023 by cruisemom42

[cruisemom42]

3 minutes ago, Vineyard View said:

Athens. We spent several days their pre-cruise in the past. Kind of feel like we’ve been there, done that as far as the top things to do. With almost 10k cruise pax that day, does that sound like a ship day, or does anyone have suggestions that would be different?

 

If you haven't already, a private tour to Corinth and Mycenae would be alternate destinations from Piraeus easily done in a day. Or, if the time of year is good (warm weather, smooth seas) a ferry to nearby Aegina for the day could work.

 

If you are tempted to stay on the ship in Piraeus, at least consider getting off and visiting the local Piraeus archaeological museum. They have several bronzes there (discovered buried in Piraeus) that rival anything in the Athens Archaeological Museum. As well as a HUGE reconstructed Greek tomb from somewhere on the Black Sea that made me sit down and study it in detail for about half an hour.

[cjwags]

Just back yesterday from ten days on the Vista.  Yes, ports are crowded!  People are traveling more than ever, and not just cruising!

 

Santorini felt the most impacted with four ships in town. We took first tender off the ship n the morning, and there was no line at the cable car.  Had plenty f time to walk around before meeting our private guide at 10 am.  He brought us back at 4:15 and the wait for the cable car was about 45 minutes.  Line was long, but moved rather quickly.  One person in our group decided t walk down.  She said it was tough (and she is an avid hiker).  We were down the cable car, in the tender, and back on the ship before she was on her tender.  Given the huge crowds, it didn't seem that bad.  Oia was severely impacted with thousands of people.

 

Istanbul was crowded as well, but given that it was a muslim holiday when were were there, it was to be expected.

 

Malta was manageable, even with a huge MSC ship in port with us.  

 

We were in the Amalfi Coast for a week prior to our cruise and it was packed!  All the locals are appreciative of the business, but are seeing more tourism than the infrastructure can handle. 

 

We studied the cruise port schedules ahead of time, and planned accordingly.  We opted for ship excursions in ports where it would be helpful from a crowd and transportation perspective, and local guides in other paces.

 

Still an amazing trip, crowds and all.

[Vineyard View]

3 hours ago, cruisemom42 said:

 

If you haven't already, a private tour to Corinth and Mycenae would be alternate destinations from Piraeus easily done in a day. Or, if the time of year is good (warm weather, smooth seas) a ferry to nearby Aegina for the day could work.

 

If you are tempted to stay on the ship in Piraeus, at least consider getting off and visiting the local Piraeus archaeological museum. They have several bronzes there (discovered buried in Piraeus) that rival anything in the Athens Archaeological Museum. As well as a HUGE reconstructed Greek tomb from somewhere on the Black Sea that made me sit down and study it in detail for about half an hour.

We are also in Nafplion on this itinerary. We’ve been there before and went to Mycenae that time. We were looking at doing Corinth as an option from there but haven’t decided. Thank you for the suggestion. 
I am sure we will get off for a bit. We went to both museums last time including Piraeus. Both were incredible. Thank you very much as always. 

[Vineyard View]

2 hours ago, cjwags said:

Just back yesterday from ten days on the Vista.  Yes, ports are crowded!  People are traveling more than ever, and not just cruising!

 

Santorini felt the most impacted with four ships in town. We took first tender off the ship n the morning, and there was no line at the cable car.  Had plenty f time to walk around before meeting our private guide at 10 am.  He brought us back at 4:15 and the wait for the cable car was about 45 minutes.  Line was long, but moved rather quickly.  One person in our group decided t walk down.  She said it was tough (and she is an avid hiker).  We were down the cable car, in the tender, and back on the ship before she was on her tender.  Given the huge crowds, it didn't seem that bad.  Oia was severely impacted with thousands of people.

 

Istanbul was crowded as well, but given that it was a muslim holiday when were were there, it was to be expected.

 

Malta was manageable, even with a huge MSC ship in port with us.  

 

We were in the Amalfi Coast for a week prior to our cruise and it was packed!  All the locals are appreciative of the business, but are seeing more tourism than the infrastructure can handle. 

 

We studied the cruise port schedules ahead of time, and planned accordingly.  We opted for ship excursions in ports where it would be helpful from a crowd and transportation perspective, and local guides in other paces.

 

Still an amazing trip, crowds and all.

Thanks for the feedback. We were in the Mediterranean just into last month. We were mostly lucky in that a lot of the ports were not too bad that were very under the radar ones. I imagine it’s exploded since then. Thanks for the feedback. MSC sure impacted our Malta experience. 
Out of curiosity, where did you locate your private guide for Santorini?  We generally trend that direction but found them difficult to locate in todays post C world for this last trip. 

[cjwags]

We used Kalista Tours.  Our guide's name was Sontos and he was amazing!  We booked through Project Expedition, at our travel agent's suggestion.  

[Tranquility Base]

5 hours ago, LHT28 said:

You are expecting  DS  to know about other ships  when they cannot even get the correct info for Oceania  🙄

I wouldn’t have thought it would be too difficult for someone on the ship to get the ETD info of other ships there on the day and share that with the passengers.

After all, isn’t it those little extra efforts which differentiate a Luxury line from many of the others.

 

[alcpa1]

We were in Palma in April (Holy Week) on an island trip. One day there were at least 5 large ships which we could see from our hotel window. 

If you want to shop anywhere on the island, be aware that many of the more upscale shops and restaurants open when they want to no matter what their signs might say. 

Depending on the length of your port stop, even with other ships, just plan wisely. Don't bother with a boat tour at Silas. It definitely wasn't spectacular.....interesting but not anything I would recommend. 

Palma is a city and there are definitely some worthy sites scattered about. Just walking the alleyways was fun and after four days we were still discovering new areas within walking distance of our hotel. 

I don't remember when we were in Santorini but it's been a while. The issues everyone has noted is the return to the ship. I concur.

[Vineyard View]

1 hour ago, cjwags said:

We used Kalista Tours.  Our guide's name was Sontos and he was amazing!  We booked through Project Expedition, at our travel agent's suggestion.  

Thank you. I will look into this company and person. Really appreciate this. 
I am finding that private tour guides for a lot of ports are so much more difficult to locate than preC. I realize that many had to take a different career direction, but I sure do hope that these careers were financially stable enough that many start to come back soon. It was such a great way to see so many different places when we travelled. 

[Vineyard View]

2 minutes ago, alcpa1 said:

We were in Palma in April (Holy Week) on an island trip. One day there were at least 5 large ships which we could see from our hotel window. 

If you want to shop anywhere on the island, be aware that many of the more upscale shops and restaurants open when they want to no matter what their signs might say. 

Depending on the length of your port stop, even with other ships, just plan wisely. Don't bother with a boat tour at Silas. It definitely wasn't spectacular.....interesting but not anything I would recommend. 

Palma is a city and there are definitely some worthy sites scattered about. Just walking the alleyways was fun and after four days we were still discovering new areas within walking distance of our hotel. 

I don't remember when we were in Santorini but it's been a while. The issues everyone has noted is the return to the ship. I concur.

Thank you. Sounds like a lovely stay. I am not really looking for upscale shopping. We are more interested in exploring the historical character of where we are visiting. Thanks for the tip on Silas. If you were there for only a port day, what would be your top choices?  

[DrKoob]

If you can do it, travel in November. We have done Santorini, Mykonos and Rhodes in November and we were the only ships there. Most of the TA cruises happen before then. Was it cold, nope but it wasn't shorts weather either. In Santorini we went up and down the gondola without standing in a line for more than five minutes.  

[Vineyard View]

8 minutes ago, DrKoob said:

If you can do it, travel in November. We have done Santorini, Mykonos and Rhodes in November and we were the only ships there. Most of the TA cruises happen before then. Was it cold, nope but it wasn't shorts weather either. In Santorini we went up and down the gondola without standing in a line for more than five minutes.  

That sounds like it would be lovely. November would be more difficult for us than spring, but I may need to look into that concept more as I read more. We’ve travelled a lot in Spring as that is our best time. We really do prefer earlier than this itinerary. I am not aware of a lot of small ship November itineraries though, so would need to do some homework. Thank you. 

Edited July 7, 2023 by Vineyard View

[Hanoj]

Port overcrowding may be the demise of cruising, at least for the itinerary focused. Will capitalism decapitate the cruise industry? It seems most operators are seeking to increase their own market share in an increasingly competitive environment where all lines took on massive debt (or failed) during the shutdowns. One line in particular, which Oceania seems to want to emulate as indicated by its new SM campaign, is continuing to introduce new ships to beat the ban unabated. Is this sustainable (notwithstanding weak overtures to reducing carbon footprints as an excuse for shortening port stay durations)?
 

I would like to visit Santorini, but not with 10,000 other pax. So, if I cruise again (it’s been 4 years since our last cruise) after our Vista British Isles Splendors in August 2023, I will be more careful selecting itineraries and dates.