Just booked our first cruise! Passport thoughts....

[sparks1093]

56 minutes ago, Flatbush Flyer said:

And, yet anyone’s chance of having a problem is always 50/50. Either you do or you don’t encounter an issue. Odds are different than probability.

The OP has one port of call in a foreign port, and that is in Canada. Their risk is substantially lower then a typical closed loop cruise in the Caribbean. You might feel that this justifies spending $350 and that's fine. Others might make a different choice and that's fine, too.

[TheOldBear]

4 hours ago, CruiserBruce said:

"Enhanced" IDs and "real" IDs are two entirely different things.

The 'enhanced' id is supposed to have the same utility as a passport card for crossing land borders to Canada and Mexico.

[sparks1093]

21 minutes ago, CruiserBruce said:

In the OP's first post they also made reference to "Real IDs".

Yes, but you quoted his post where the OP describes their EDL.

[TheOldBear]

In New York, the paperwork for the 'Real Id' and 'Enhanced Drivers License' are the same, except for the increased fee for the EDL.

 

Both require either a current passport [DMV photocopies a page] or the same documents you would use to obtain a passport.

 

Both are useful, as the standard NY license may longer be used to indicate citizenship or residency status.

Edited July 12, 2023 by TheOldBear
additional info

[new_cruiser]

6 hours ago, Gopher40 said:

My current Michigan license says enhanced drivers license above my picture with an American flag by my picture, it also has a gold circle with white star in it in the upper right corner. 

 

If you both have enhanced driver's licenses, that works for taking Skagway train and Skagway road trips that cross the border into Canada. It also means that it is sufficient by itself to board the cruise. You don't need to bring a birth certificate because the Enhanced License covers showing that you are a US citizen as well as being a picture ID. 

 

Enhanced IDs would also work for taking a cruise from Vancouver if one crossed into Canada at a land border (e.g. train or bus). Enhanced ID just wouldn't let enter or leave Canada by air. 

[sparks1093]

9 hours ago, TheOldBear said:

In New York, the paperwork for the 'Real Id' and 'Enhanced Drivers License' are the same, except for the increased fee for the EDL.

 

Both require either a current passport [DMV photocopies a page] or the same documents you would use to obtain a passport.

 

Both are useful, as the standard NY license may longer be used to indicate citizenship or residency status.

Except that folks who aren't US citizens can also apply for and receive REAL ID compliant licenses by showing proof of legal status in the US. 

[Tapi]

One thing to consider when traveling without a passport are the embarkation and debarkation lines.

 

In many places, passengers are split between passport holders and birth certificate holders. Those with passport breeze through US customs upon returning home (specially at ports with new face recognition portals) while those with birth certificates get to stand in line that can sometimes be at a standstill. 
 

On my last three cruises, the line for birth certificate holders has been insanely long, while I, traveling with a passport, never stopped moving, cleared customs and exited the terminal in 5 minutes. 
 

The one thing that baffles my mind is that some people will balk at getting passports, but will then purchase “VIP” packages to expedite their debarkation . We did a 2 night cruise on Margaritaville at Sea a few months ago and people without passports were paying $400 for this add-on to bypass the long birth certificate line. More than the actual cruise fare. 🤯 

[sparks1093]

42 minutes ago, Tapi said:

One thing to consider when traveling without a passport are the embarkation and debarkation lines.

 

In many places, passengers are split between passport holders and birth certificate holders. Those with passport breeze through US customs upon returning home (specially at ports with new face recognition portals) while those with birth certificates get to stand in line that can sometimes be at a standstill. 
 

On my last three cruises, the line for birth certificate holders has been insanely long, while I, traveling with a passport, never stopped moving, cleared customs and exited the terminal in 5 minutes. 
 

The one thing that baffles my mind is that some people will balk at getting passports, but will then purchase “VIP” packages to expedite their debarkation . We did a 2 night cruise on Margaritaville at Sea a few months ago and people without passports were paying $400 for this add-on to bypass the long birth certificate line. More than the actual cruise fare. 🤯 

I traveled without a passport on closed loop cruises several times before getting them and this was not even a consideration. So I stand in a line for an extra 20 minutes once every year. Not a deciding factor at all. (And for what it's worth our actual time in front of the Customs agent was the same regardless of documentation used.)

 

As for your last paragraph people are going to spend their money on what makes sense to them, it doesn't need to make sense to anyone else. There are some people that would pony up $350 for passports for the same cruise OP is taking, which doesn't make sense to me, but it doesn't need to so I don't worry about it.

[Gopher40]

This is my license. Also there is a flag next to my pick. 

[sparks1093]

33 minutes ago, Gopher40 said:

This is my license. Also there is a flag next to my pick. 

Similar to my Vermont EDL, except the state is different. 🙂 

[sanger727]

13 hours ago, TheOldBear said:

In New York, the paperwork for the 'Real Id' and 'Enhanced Drivers License' are the same, except for the increased fee for the EDL.

 

Both require either a current passport [DMV photocopies a page] or the same documents you would use to obtain a passport.

 

Both are useful, as the standard NY license may longer be used to indicate citizenship or residency status.

 

We don't offer "Enhanced drivers license" in Ohio; but the "Real ID" actually required more documentation than a passport. In additional to proving identity and citizenship, we had to provide current bills to prove residence in Ohio. 

[sparks1093]

8 minutes ago, sanger727 said:

 

We don't offer "Enhanced drivers license" in Ohio; but the "Real ID" actually required more documentation than a passport. In additional to proving identity and citizenship, we had to provide current bills to prove residence in Ohio. 

One reason is that the passport proves citizenship, which is not dependent on where you live. You remain a US citizen even if you are living in a different country. A drivers license is issued to residents of a state so it makes sense that one needs to show that one is a resident to get one.

[TheOldBear]

The discussion was about passport alternatives - the EDL is similar to the passport card in its utility [land border crossings - indicates residence & citizenship]. The drivers license [state id] + birth certificate option is only available to citizens [of WHTI countries ?]

Real ID compliant licenses can be issued to green card and other visa holders, so they are not passport card equivalent. [but do indicate residence]. 

In New York, the standard driver license is less authoritative as it may be issued to anyone - including undocumented / illegal aliens. [no longer proof of residence]

[sanger727]

18 minutes ago, sparks1093 said:

One reason is that the passport proves citizenship, which is not dependent on where you live. You remain a US citizen even if you are living in a different country. A drivers license is issued to residents of a state so it makes sense that one needs to show that one is a resident to get one.

 

I know. I was just pointing out that a "real ID" actually can require more documentation than an "enhanced driver's license"

[sparks1093]

4 minutes ago, TheOldBear said:

The discussion was about passport alternatives - the EDL is similar to the passport card in its utility [land border crossings - indicates residence & citizenship]. The drivers license [state id] + birth certificate option is only available to citizens [of WHTI countries ?]

Real ID compliant licenses can be issued to green card and other visa holders, so they are not passport card equivalent. [but do indicate residence]. 

In New York, the standard driver license is less authoritative as it may be issued to anyone - including undocumented / illegal aliens. [no longer proof of residence]

Actually the EDL proves identity and citizenship- the authorities don't care about residence. While the passport card and EDL were initially developed with land border crossings in mind DHS extended their use to sea ports of entry when returning from Canada, Bermuda, Mexico and the Caribbean.

[sparks1093]

1 minute ago, sanger727 said:

 

I know. I was just pointing out that a "real ID" actually can require more documentation than an "enhanced driver's license"

I figured you did but there are others who might wonder why so I thought an explanation was in order. 

[Ferry_Watcher]

OP, use your Enhanced Driver's License on your upcoming Alaska cruise. 

As for getting a passport - I would suggest dreaming big - there an amazing world out there just waiting for you.

[Mum2Mercury]

On 7/11/2023 at 3:49 PM, CruiserBruce said:

"Enhanced" IDs and "real" IDs are two entirely different things.

Yes, and plain old driver's licenses are still a thing too, and the variety causes confusion.  Personally, I think the whole system could use an overhaul.  If I were in charge of the world, I'd: 

- standardize driver's licenses across the 50 states.  If every state's license was identical, law enforcement would more easily spot fakes.  

- I'd do away with either "enhanced" or "real" and just have one upgraded driver's license available for everyone.  I would say just have every driver "upgrade", but some people have enough trouble proving their identification for a plain driver's license.  

- do away with the old-fashioned passport "book" and create simple plastic cards sized like driver's licenses, which would fit into wallets and pockets more easily and would be less subject to water damage.  Today all the information is coded on those magnetic strips anyway.  

On 7/11/2023 at 4:05 PM, GeezerCouple said:

[emphasis added]

 

But here is another thought.  The passports are good for 10 years.

What if you see another cruise, with a great sale price, especially possible occasionally for last minute travel, when someone may have cancelled late? ...

If, if, if ... if the OP takes this cruise, loves it, and decides international travel is for him, passports will still be available.  

On 7/11/2023 at 4:28 PM, thinfool said:

My God...do not get a passport.  We did back several years ago and we are several thousand dollars poorer for it ... 

If you did all that for several thousand, I'd love to hear your budget travel tips!  

On 7/12/2023 at 6:26 AM, Tapi said:

One thing to consider when traveling without a passport are the embarkation and debarkation lines.

The new -- okay, not really "new" anymore, but still -- the new facial recognition system for re-entering the country is so fast.  The first time I did it, I genuinely didn't recognize I was finished, and I just stood there.  You barely have to quit walking.  

Having expressed my admiration for the system, I do have several thoughts on the subject:  

- I'm not sure I'd pay $350 to avoid one line at the end of the cruise.  Even a long one.  

- The make-up of passengers is going to be different on every cruise.  At a glance, I'd bet the birth certificate line is longer on 3 and 4 day cruises, shorter for longer cruises.  

- If you and your companion are traveling with different documentation, you might be forced into different lines.  If you're two adults, no big deal, but if your companion is a child or an infirm person, this could matter.  

On 7/12/2023 at 6:26 AM, Tapi said:

We did a 2 night cruise on Margaritaville at Sea a few months ago and people without passports were paying $400 for this add-on to bypass the long birth certificate line. More than the actual cruise fare. 🤯 

Okay, that's just stupid.  Some people can't /won't do math.  

[Charles4515]

1 hour ago, Mum2Mercury said:

Yes, and plain old driver's licenses are still a thing too, and the variety causes confusion.  Personally, I think the whole system could use an overhaul.  If I were in charge of the world, I'd: 

- standardize driver's licenses across the 50 states.  If every state's license was identical, law enforcement would more easily spot fakes.  

- I'd do away with either "enhanced" or "real" and just have one upgraded driver's license available for everyone.  I would say just have every driver "upgrade", but some people have enough trouble proving their identification for a plain driver's license.  

That won't ever happen because drivers licenses are issued by states. That is a "states right" under the US constitution. Aso many Americans don't want a fedeal ID or internal passport for philosophical or political reasons. The reason that Real ID has been delayed going into effect is because many states did not want it. So they did not issue Real ID DL.The only reason states reluctantly gave in is because the federal government can regulate who gets on airplanes and their citizens would be upset if they could not get on airplanes. Real ID will have no other use than domestic air travel and some federal buildings. 

 

Some states only issue Real ID and others offer it as an option. The last two states I have lived in US citizens had to get Real ID. Some states you have to pay more for it. The only future problem is that if Real ID ever does go in effect some people will show up at airports clueless that they need Real ID, EDL, passport  or passport card. Could be a mess. 

Edited July 13, 2023 by Charles4515

[Charles4515]

1 hour ago, Mum2Mercury said:

do away with the old-fashioned passport "book" and create simple plastic cards sized like driver's licenses, which would fit into wallets and pockets more easily and would be less subject to water damage.  Today all the information is coded on those magnetic strips anyway.  

That would require international agreement.

[Mum2Mercury]

1 hour ago, Charles4515 said:

That won't ever happen because drivers licenses are issued by states. That is a "states right" under the US constitution. Aso many Americans don't want a fedeal ID or internal passport for philosophical or political reasons. The reason that Real ID has been delayed going into effect is because many states did not want it. So they did not issue Real ID DL.The only reason states reluctantly gave in is because the federal government can regulate who gets on airplanes and their citizens would be upset if they could not get on airplanes. Real ID will have no other use than domestic air travel and some federal buildings. 

 

Some states only issue Real ID and others offer it as an option. The last two states I have lived in US citizens had to get Real ID. Some states you have to pay more for it. The only future problem is that if Real ID ever does go in effect some people will show up at airports clueless that they need Real ID, EDL, passport  or passport card. Could be a mess. 

I know what you say is true, especially the political reasons; but I stilll think one single type of ID for all Americans would be easier in numerous ways.  

 

I'm surprised your state requires Real ID.  When I renewed my driver's license (2-3 years ago?) I figured getting the Real ID would never be convenient, so I might as well go ahead and do it -- so I read online, gathered up the various necessities, and took them into the DMV on a clipboard.  The examiner said practically no one does that -- she says people just grab a few things THEY THINK are identification and bring them in.  To borrow your word:  Clueless.  

1 hour ago, Charles4515 said:

That would require international agreement.

Why must passports from country to country be alike?  I mean, I know that my dual-citizenship grandson has two passports -- one blue, one red -- but why can't a country opt to change the format?  

[Charles4515]

46 minutes ago, Mum2Mercury said:

I'm surprised your state requires Real ID.  When I renewed my driver's license (2-3 years ago?) I figured getting the Real ID would never be convenient, so I might as well go ahead and do it -- so I read online, gathered up the various necessities, and took them into the DMV on a clipboard.  The examiner said practically no one does that -- she says people just grab a few things THEY THINK are identification and bring them in.  To borrow your word:  Clueless.  

Texas only issues Real ID. Renewals and new residents have to get Real ID. You have to bring the right documents. Texas has a website with a checklist that to run through I used when I moved here a couple of years ago that worked pretty well. So no problem when I went to the DMV. Funny thing was that four or five people when I was there did not bring their glasses for the vision test and could not complete and had to go home and get their glasses. 

 

My previous state Maryland if you were a US citizen or legal resident you had to get Real ID as a new resident or at the next in person renewal. In Maryland you can only get non Real ID if you are undocumented. Texas won't issue a DL without proof of legal presence. 

 

As far as Passport format I think that is by interenational treaties or an international agency. They have  to be machine readable. Individual countries can allow no passport or whatever for example some countries in the western hemisphere accept passport cards and EDL's. Or birth certificates. A card is feasible to replace books if all countries agree to accept. 

 

 

[sparks1093]

1 hour ago, Mum2Mercury said:

I know what you say is true, especially the political reasons; but I stilll think one single type of ID for all Americans would be easier in numerous ways.  

 

I'm surprised your state requires Real ID.  When I renewed my driver's license (2-3 years ago?) I figured getting the Real ID would never be convenient, so I might as well go ahead and do it -- so I read online, gathered up the various necessities, and took them into the DMV on a clipboard.  The examiner said practically no one does that -- she says people just grab a few things THEY THINK are identification and bring them in.  To borrow your word:  Clueless.  

Why must passports from country to country be alike?  I mean, I know that my dual-citizenship grandson has two passports -- one blue, one red -- but why can't a country opt to change the format?  

First you want all 50 states to have drivers licenses that are the same, but countries should just have whatever design suits them? REAL ID is an attempt to make licenses the same in the ways that matter and states (and their citizens) can chose to have a non-compliant license, which only limits one's ability to enter federal jurisdiction. We need passport books to hold stamps and visas, among other things. Granted the day may come with electronics that this can be done in a system of record (and no doubt is in some countries) but until that day comes we're stuck with books.

[new_cruiser]

4 hours ago, Mum2Mercury said:

- do away with the old-fashioned passport "book" and create simple plastic cards sized like driver's licenses, which would fit into wallets and pockets more easily and would be less subject to water damage. 

Passport cards don't need to be created. The US already issues them. Like Enhanced Driver's Licenses, they are only usable at land and sea border crossings.

 

Making them more broadly useful would require getting the rest of the world to accept a card instead of a book. I'd love to see that but doubt change will happen any time soon.

 

Maybe that will happen in a decade or two. For now, border agents in some countries still look through to see where else the passport has been stamped. But some countries aren't stamping it. When flying back to the US, the Global Entry kiosk pulls up my info from facial scanning and doesn't use the passport book. Many visas are electronic now and that's another thing that used to require the book format.

[PurpleHays]

11 hours ago, Mum2Mercury said:

- do away with the old-fashioned passport "book" and create simple plastic cards sized like driver's licenses, which would fit into wallets and pockets more easily and would be less subject to water damage.  Today all the information is coded on those magnetic strips anyway.  

I actually prefer to travel with my passport--it's bigger, so it's harder to drop/lose. I always drop my DL. Also, the husband can never find his DL when he takes it out of his wallet and puts it in a pocket. The book is just easier for us.