Jump to content
Cruise Critic Community

Spirit of Adventure: riding out the storm ?

FannyLiz

By FannyLiz,
in Saga Cruises

 Share

Recommended Posts

twotravellersLondon Excellent Advice! Rare

twotravellersLondon

Posted
Posted
37 minutes ago, rslrhu said:

This screenshot was from Sunday when the worst of the wind had passed but the swell was still significant.  I wish I'd taken a screenshot from Saturday because that showed an altogether different story - I was tracking it out of concern for my Mum and couldn't believe that they were pushing on.  The swell chart was at the top of the scale on Windy.com, as it had been forecast to be.  As I said, more clarification needed as to why it wasn't possible to turn back south when they first knew there was no other options north on Friday.

 

We think the you'r absolutely correct. There are so many people who have had a frightening experience... to say the least... that "those who knows" must look into the entire circumstances of the cruise.

 

What we would say is that... The Spirit of Discovery was very far from the middle of the storm. 

 

The middle was almost 1,500 nautical miles away just off Cape Farewell on the South-eastern tip of Greenland. Had the Spirit of Discovery been there, wind speeds would have been about 70 knots... that is above Hurricane force 12 and is off the Beaufort Scale! The waves would have been well in excess of 16 m and what scientists would describe a "phenomenal."

 

These strong storms are formed in the mid-Atlantic every year. Their exact position, strength and the directions of the winds as they flow Eastwards is partially controlled by the Polar Jet Stream which in turn is partially controlled by cold air moving south from the Arctic and warm air moving North from the Tropics. Europe has had some exceptional weather this summer... that was caused by the movement of the Polar Jet Steam. That's little or no consolation to folks who have experienced such a storm... in the same way as it would be of little consolation to those who experienced the extreme temperatures in the Mediterranean during the summer.

 

This is a time for serious reflection by those who have the authority to ensure safety at sea, the real data, the experience, the understanding and nautical expertise to make an informed professional judgement. Some consideration should also be given to another UK cruise ship which had deck 4 windows blown in during the same storm. Nine years ago two cruise ships were very badly damaged in a similar storm in the Bay of Biscay.

 

We very much hope that your parents are safe and well and that they have and... will be... well looked after by SAGA. (We certainly have been in the past when things have gone wrong... through no fault of SAGA.)

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites
FatBoy20

FatBoy20

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, twotravellersLondon said:

 

We think the you'r absolutely correct. There are so many people who have had a frightening experience... to say the least... that "those who knows" must look into the entire circumstances of the cruise.

 

What we would say is that... The Spirit of Discovery was very far from the middle of the storm. 

 

The middle was almost 1,500 nautical miles away just off Cape Farewell on the South-eastern tip of Greenland. Had the Spirit of Discovery been there, wind speeds would have been about 70 knots... that is above Hurricane force 12 and is off the Beaufort Scale! The waves would have been well in excess of 16 m and what scientists would describe a "phenomenal."

 

These strong storms are formed in the mid-Atlantic every year. Their exact position, strength and the directions of the winds as they flow Eastwards is partially controlled by the Polar Jet Stream which in turn is partially controlled by cold air moving south from the Arctic and warm air moving North from the Tropics. Europe has had some exceptional weather this summer... that was caused by the movement of the Polar Jet Steam. That's little or no consolation to folks who have experienced such a storm... in the same way as it would be of little consolation to those who experienced the extreme temperatures in the Mediterranean during the summer.

 

This is a time for serious reflection by those who have the authority to ensure safety at sea, the real data, the experience, the understanding and nautical expertise to make an informed professional judgement. Some consideration should also be given to another UK cruise ship which had deck 4 windows blown in during the same storm. Nine years ago two cruise ships were very badly damaged in a similar storm in the Bay of Biscay.

 

We very much hope that your parents are safe and well and that they have and... will be... well looked after by SAGA. (We certainly have been in the past when things have gone wrong... through no fault of SAGA.)

See also the Saga statement in the BBC website article on the Cruise.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Polly79

Polly79

Posted
Posted

I got some screenshots on Sat, as I couldn’t believe it was in the black area and I was worried about the poor people on board. I had been tracking the ship, as our own captain on Princess had avoided some bad weather on our route back over the Bay on 28th October yet it still felt really bumpy on board so I was interested in whether other ships would go across in even worse weather and was shocked to see this ship in the location it was. 

IMG_3194.jpeg

IMG_3202.png

IMG_3193.jpeg

IMG_3199.png

IMG_3192.png

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Method81

Method81

Posted
Posted
7 hours ago, twotravellersLondon said:

The evidence seems to shows otherwise... have a look at post 142 which contains this screen-shot.

 

The most severe winds and waves are orange, red and brown. The less severe wind and waves are green and blue. 

The evidence would appear otherwise. If you look at the swell chart rather than the wind chart you will see that they went through the area with the absolute highest swells right at the peak of the storm, this is also when SoD hove too. I wish I’d taken some screenshots now. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Vivaldi

Vivaldi

Posted
Posted

My thoughts are very much with the passengers who had to endure these awful conditions, and I hope that those with injuries recover quickly and without lasting consequences.

 

"Cruise passengers 'scared for their lives' in storm" is the most-read item on the BBC website currently, and the story also features on the Sky News website.

 

General booking has opened for the Jan-March 2025 period, and since my 80th birthday falls in that period I had been very interested in celebrating it on a Saga cruise. However, until I am convinced that Saga does indeed put the comfort and safety of its passengers first, before any commercial considerations, I'm not going to proceed with any booking. I doubt I'm the only one with such concerns.

 

 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites
JoJo1947

JoJo1947

Posted
Posted
33 minutes ago, Vivaldi said:

My thoughts are very much with the passengers who had to endure these awful conditions, and I hope that those with injuries recover quickly and without lasting consequences.

 

"Cruise passengers 'scared for their lives' in storm" is the most-read item on the BBC website currently, and the story also features on the Sky News website.

 

General booking has opened for the Jan-March 2025 period, and since my 80th birthday falls in that period I had been very interested in celebrating it on a Saga cruise. However, until I am convinced that Saga does indeed put the comfort and safety of its passengers first, before any commercial considerations, I'm not going to proceed with any booking. I doubt I'm the only one with such concerns.

 

 

I have every confidence in Saga. The full facts have not been reported correctly. When you consider Saga cruises have been in operation for many years they are a responsible Company and this was an exemption and safety ports had been closed. A Fred Olsen ship also got into trouble with damage to the ship. Exceptional yes but we take the risk travelling on the Bay this time of year. Too many scaremongers won't help

  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Dermotsgirl

Dermotsgirl

Posted
Posted
23 minutes ago, JoJo1947 said:

I have every confidence in Saga. The full facts have not been reported correctly. When you consider Saga cruises have been in operation for many years they are a responsible Company and this was an exemption and safety ports had been closed. A Fred Olsen ship also got into trouble with damage to the ship. Exceptional yes but we take the risk travelling on the Bay this time of year. Too many scaremongers won't help

Were you on board? If so what were your experiences?
 

I’ve been following this incident closely on a Facebook group, and people’s testimonies are all remarkably similar, indicating an extreme situation that was terrifying for both staff and crew.

 

There are many questions that need to be answered by Saga, not least being why were they in the middle of the storm in the first place, given that the storm was fully forecast and they had at least two days to find shelter. Indeed, SOD was the only passenger ship out there, so other ships managed it.

 

I agree that the ‘full facts’ have not been reported correctly - in this case the media reporting plays down what happened


I have my second Saga cruise booked for May, which I will more than likely proceed with, but I will hold off booking another until I see Saga’s full response - I’d like to know what sort of company I’m dealing with 

 

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites
rslrhu

rslrhu

Posted
Posted (edited)
34 minutes ago, JoJo1947 said:

I have every confidence in Saga. The full facts have not been reported correctly. When you consider Saga cruises have been in operation for many years they are a responsible Company and this was an exemption and safety ports had been closed. A Fred Olsen ship also got into trouble with damage to the ship. Exceptional yes but we take the risk travelling on the Bay this time of year. Too many scaremongers won't help

What facts have not been reported correctly?  Were you on board because I'd be happy to hear a fuller justification on why the decision was made to attempt the crossing?  Most of the original reporting was a re-hash of the Saga statement and letter that was distributed which was very much the Saga side of events which as many have pointed out leaves a couple of glaring questions that they may or may not have reasonable answers to - part of me hopes that they do.  Now passenger accounts are coming out which lay bare the situation on board.  My Mum was on board and has cruised for many years on Saga, experienced storms and is someone who doesn't scare easily.  She has now lost confidence in them completely, and is gutted because she truly loved going with them.  Full transparency is required from them.

Edited by rslrhu
  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites
twotravellersLondon Excellent Advice! Rare

twotravellersLondon

Posted
Posted (edited)
42 minutes ago, NorbertsNiece said:

Yeah. A* in creative writing 

 

Surprised that the hints of conversation that seems to be pretty laid back and casual on the video clip of someone seemingly opening a door from a public space onto an open deck.

 

We've been on board the Spirit of Discovery twice in the last year and there is no way that we would want people opening door to the wind and waves in the conditions that some are reporting.

 

What on earth were they doing?

Edited by twotravellersLondon
  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites
seasickphil

seasickphil

Posted
Posted
58 minutes ago, JoJo1947 said:

I have every confidence in Saga. The full facts have not been reported correctly. When you consider Saga cruises have been in operation for many years they are a responsible Company and this was an exemption and safety ports had been closed. A Fred Olsen ship also got into trouble with damage to the ship. Exceptional yes but we take the risk travelling on the Bay this time of year. Too many scaremongers won't help

 

 If you were on the the ship, i wonder if you would be making that statement.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
JoJo1947

JoJo1947

Posted
Posted
On 11/6/2023 at 3:47 PM, Harry Peterson said:

Once you understand the financial position of the Saga group of companies, you start to view decisions like this in a different light. And you can imagine a scenario in which a captain might take a particular view, but be overruled by someone further up the management chain. I’m not for a minute suggesting the ship was put at risk, but decisions made for the wrong reasons were the underlying cause of the Titanic disaster.

 

Saga once had an impeccable record for absolute trustworthiness. However, for large numbers of Saga life members earlier this year they proved themselves anything but trustworthy by unilaterally cancelling the legal right of all those life members (who paid a hefty advance sum) to receive the Saga magazine every month. No excuses, no reasons (other than financial), no backing down by the CEO (who has a fascinating track record before Saga)  - just tough luck. We don’t care.

 

Maybe that’s the sort of thinking from the top that’s behind this. 

Speculation and only your opinion 🤦

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Harry Peterson

Harry Peterson

Posted
Posted
11 minutes ago, JoJo1947 said:

Speculation and only your opinion 🤦

The financial position is hard fact. That Saga chose to break its contract with all its life members, who paid substantial sums for those life memberships, is also fact - I’m one of those directly affected.

 

The only opinion involved is whether Saga’s financial issues led to the decision to put a ship containing largely elderly people into the middle of a pretty substantial storm.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites
nosapphire

nosapphire

Posted
Posted

It is probably true to say that we do not know the full facts.

I assume that is what JoJo1947 intended to say, rather than implying insider knowledge of other facts hidden from the rest of us.

The only way the "full correct facts" could be established would be an independent investigation - whether or not that will happen, no idea.

But it would be interesting to know if it really was a case of no port in a storm - or just a case of no port that suited HQ in a storm.

 

A company having been in business for many years is no particular guarantee of anything at all - especially when senior management changes.

No matter how reputable or "cuddly" the company, I am sure that in a toss-up between the balance sheet and the customer, it will not be the customer who is prioritised.

Saga are no better or worse than any other company - yes, they are very reputable  - but still a business, in it to make a profit out of you and me.

 

 

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Banjo an

Banjo an

Posted
Posted

We have just joined the SOD for our Caribbean cruise.

All through the previous cruise I watched the ships progress before and during the storm. I tracked the route that the ship took and noticed that the Master rode out the worst part well away from the worst weather in the Bay doing only 3 kph to minimise damage and injury to passengers. I am convinced that had he taken an earlier route through the Bay then the casualties would have been much higher.

As a ex merchant seaman, Lifeboat crew member for many years and a boat owner I feel qualified to express that opinion.

  • Like 7
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Please sign in to comment

You will be able to leave a comment after signing in



Sign In Now
 Share
Go to topic listing
  • Forum Jump
    • Categories
      • Welcome to Cruise Critic
      • New Cruisers
      • Cruise Lines “A – O”
      • Cruise Lines “P – Z”
      • River Cruising
      • ROLL CALLS
      • Cruise Critic News & Features
      • Digital Photography & Cruise Technology
      • Special Interest Cruising
      • Cruise Discussion Topics
      • UK Cruising
      • Australia & New Zealand Cruisers
      • Canadian Cruisers
      • North American Homeports
      • Ports of Call
      • Cruise Conversations
×
×
  • Create New...