Service expectations on ncl?

[spookylu]

6 minutes ago, ready2cruzagain said:

Not gonna happen here. I pay 20% on the drink package. I am not going to tip another dollar or more per drink. I get waited on just fine. I understand you don't have the drink package so that is different to me but with the drink package 20% is enough for me.

I'm with you. I prepay my gratuities and that is all I'm paying unless I want to recognize an individual who was truly exceptional. 

 

I tip 20% as a rule and I have noticed a lot of '"tip creep" the past few years. You're now expected to tip more places, and where 20% used to be considered generous, now it seems to be the bare minimum you can do without seeming like a cheapskate. There is pressure to tip more and more and I don't love it. I always tip (even for not so great service) and would never dream of reducing my prepaid gratuities unless service was simply awful uniformly across the cruise,  but I am not carrying around a stack of bills to hand out on top of that. 

 

Something to consider: the more people "double tip" by prepaying gratuities and then also cash tipping, the more it becomes "the norm" and expected of the rest of us.

[Daruma]

1 hour ago, spookylu said:

I'm with you. I prepay my gratuities and that is all I'm paying unless I want to recognize an individual who was truly exceptional. 

 

I tip 20% as a rule and I have noticed a lot of '"tip creep" the past few years. You're now expected to tip more places, and where 20% used to be considered generous, now it seems to be the bare minimum you can do without seeming like a cheapskate. There is pressure to tip more and more and I don't love it. I always tip (even for not so great service) and would never dream of reducing my prepaid gratuities unless service was simply awful uniformly across the cruise,  but I am not carrying around a stack of bills to hand out on top of that. 

 

Something to consider: the more people "double tip" by prepaying gratuities and then also cash tipping, the more it becomes "the norm" and expected of the rest of us.

 

This is probably one of the most egregious new attempts to increase tipping by DoorDash, (linked below).

 

Now you're actually bidding to get your order delivered at all, or at least promptly. 

 

DoorDash is saying that drivers pick their deliveries, and not tipping enough may cause your order to not be picked up at all, or picked up last.

 

Tipping extra just increases this "tip me, and tip me BIG," entitlement behavior. 

 

I now see tip options for tipping at Subway, McDonald's, Burger King, etc... and I never tip.

 

Tipping at places like that wasn't expected before the pandemic, and I'm sure as hell not tipping at those places now.

 

https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/2023/11/01/no-tip-orders-delivered-slower-doordash/71409399007/

[seemoreroyals]

1 hour ago, spookylu said:

I'm with you. I prepay my gratuities and that is all I'm paying unless I want to recognize an individual who was truly exceptional. 

 

I tip 20% as a rule and I have noticed a lot of '"tip creep" the past few years. You're now expected to tip more places, and where 20% used to be considered generous, now it seems to be the bare minimum you can do without seeming like a cheapskate. There is pressure to tip more and more and I don't love it. I always tip (even for not so great service) and would never dream of reducing my prepaid gratuities unless service was simply awful uniformly across the cruise,  but I am not carrying around a stack of bills to hand out on top of that. 

 

Something to consider: the more people "double tip" by prepaying gratuities and then also cash tipping, the more it becomes "the norm" and expected of the rest of us.

 

The tipping thing has gotten out of hand.  Both on cruise ship and on land.   One of the places we eat has a new device that when you pay the bill literally gives you tipping choices of 20% 25% and other,  in that order.  We request the waiter to bring us a copy of our bill so we can tip what we want not some preconceived amount they want us to tip.  

 

I am not that guy that tips $2 on the total bill regardless of the amount.  We all know a few people that do that.   I generally tip between 15-20% depending on the level of service.  Have tipped less sometimes more.  Depending on level of service.  On a cruise ship the only time I tip over and above the tips I have already prepaid is when a waiter, cabin steward, bartender, or other NCL staff member does something over and above our expectations. 

 

As I have mentioned in previous posts it is genius how NCL and other cruise lines have developed a system whereby cruisers prepay their tips upfront and persist for whatever reason to pay again and again and again for something they have already paid for.  I am sure the bean counters are aware of this and take advantage of the generosity thereby continuing to raise the level of DSC and other upfront forms of tipping that have become the norm.

 

What used to be leave what you want in an envelope at end of cruise for tip became $12 per day DSC and is now $20 per day ($25 Haven) and no doubt will continue to go higher.  If it makes you happy to double tip every time you order a drink or slipping the room steward an extra $20 or more by all mean continue to do so.  IMO treating the waiters, bartenders, cabin stewards, and other NCL with respect and being pleasant and not making unreasonable demands will probably get you just as good or better level of service than by leaving extra money on the table.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[mjkacmom]

8 minutes ago, Daruma said:

 

This is probably one of the most egregious new attempts to increase tipping by DoorDash, (linked below).

 

Now you're actually bidding to get your order delivered at all, or at least promptly. 

 

DoorDash is saying that drivers pick their deliveries, and not tipping enough may cause your order to not be picked up at all, or picked up last.

 

Tipping extra just increases this "tip me, and tip me BIG," entitlement behavior. 

 

I now see tip options for tipping at Subway, McDonald's, Burger King, etc... and I never tip.

 

Tipping at places like that wasn't expected before the pandemic, and I'm sure as hell not tipping at those places now.

 

https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/2023/11/01/no-tip-orders-delivered-slower-doordash/71409399007/

DoorDashers always chose based on tips, they get $2.50 per order, who is going to drive to a restaurant, wait for food, drive to your house and deliver it, for $2.50? They’re just being transparent now.

[spookylu]

2 minutes ago, Daruma said:

 

This is probably one of the most egregious new attempts to increase tipping by DoorDash, (linked below).

 

Now you're actually bidding to get your order delivered at all, or at least promptly. 

 

DoorDash is saying that drivers pick their deliveries, and not tipping enough may cause your order to not be picked up at all, or picked up last.

 

Tipping extra just increases this "tip me, and tip me BIG," entitlement behavior. 

 

I now see tip options for tipping at Subway, McDonald's, Burger King, etc... and I never tip.

 

Tipping at places like that wasn't expected before the pandemic, and I'm sure as hell not tipping at those places now.

 

https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/2023/11/01/no-tip-orders-delivered-slower-doordash/71409399007/

Yep, this is exactly what I'm talking about. I don't use DoorDash because I'm unwilling to pay as much for delivery and tip as I would for the meal itself. I'll just go pick it up.

 

I understand that people have strong opinions about tipping and not everyone is going to agree with me, but I think tipping is getting a little out of control and people should be drawing a line in the sand somewhere. That's all. 

[DCGuy64]

2 minutes ago, spookylu said:

Yep, this is exactly what I'm talking about. I don't use DoorDash because I'm unwilling to pay as much for delivery and tip as I would for the meal itself. I'll just go pick it up.

 

I understand that people have strong opinions about tipping and not everyone is going to agree with me, but I think tipping is getting a little out of control and people should be drawing a line in the sand somewhere. That's all. 

I agree with you 100%. My wife and I never order from those delivery companies because they rob you blind in extra charges. In fact, we've had several local restaurants tell us to call them and order by phone directly in order to cut out the middleman. (It's worth noting, however, that my wife and I don't buy our food this way most of the time. We usually cook our own meals or occasionally eat at sit-down restaurants.)

[spookylu]

3 minutes ago, mjkacmom said:

DoorDashers always chose based on tips, they get $2.50 per order, who is going to drive to a restaurant, wait for food, drive to your house and deliver it, for $2.50? They’re just being transparent now.

That's true, and even understandable. What blows my mind is how many people are willing to pay that much to get food delivered.

[Daruma]

7 minutes ago, mjkacmom said:

DoorDashers always chose based on tips, they get $2.50 per order, who is going to drive to a restaurant, wait for food, drive to your house and deliver it, for $2.50? They’re just being transparent now.

 

Thank you, that may very well be, (I've never used any of these meal delivery services... I was going to once, but when I calculated that the base price for X is already higher than just ordering directly at the store, then add in a delivery fee & tip... I just go pick it up myself 🤷).

 

The point however is that now they're actually throwing it in your face to tip big, or risk a slow delivery of now cold food.

 

I find that offensive, and frankly essentially extortion. 

Edited November 30, 2023 by Daruma

[bkrickles1]

1 hour ago, spookylu said:

I tip 20% as a rule and I have noticed a lot of '"tip creep" the past few years. You're now expected to tip more places, and where 20% used to be considered generous, now it seems to be the bare minimum you can do without seeming like a cheapskate. There is pressure to tip more and more and I don't love it.

 

Something to consider: the more people "double tip" by prepaying gratuities and then also cash tipping, the more it becomes "the norm" and expected of the rest of us.

I disagree with both of these points.

First of all, I go out plenty and have never felt pressure to tip "more and more". In fact, I've never felt pressure to tip at all. 

With regards to the "double tip", that's ridiculous!

I sail enough to know that nothing more is expected and that cash tipping is not "the norm".

But I am on the side of tipping extra.

We feel good about it and have been doing it for over 30 years, wherever we vacation, but especially on cruises. 

We know these hard workers appreciate the extra $ and it does lead many times to better relationships, being remembered and sometimes even better service.

[pete_coach]

13 hours ago, dbrown84 said:

I tip per drink, and the level of service you get at the bar is amazing when you do.  Granted, I don't usually have the FAS drink package so I'm no pre-paying any gratuities.  But even the one time I did do the FAS package, I still tipped per drink.  Take care of your bartenders and they will take care of you.

When you tip extra for a drink (as 20% is already added), it does not go to the bartender (unless you leave cash). There is no name on the bill, it just goes into the gratuity pool that all gratuities go into.

I think that the bartender notices but, it does not go to him/her, it goes to the giant tip pot.

Edited November 30, 2023 by pete_coach

[mjkacmom]

5 minutes ago, Daruma said:

 

Thank you, that may very well be, (I've never used any of these meal delivery services... I was going to once, but when I calculated that the base price for X is already higher than just ordering directly at the store, then add in a delivery fee & tip... I just go pick it up myself 🤷).

 

The point however is that now they're actually throwing it in your face to tip big, or risk a slow delivery of now cold food.

 

I find that offensive, and frankly essentially extortion. 

Before the word got out, many folks just never got their food. Now they know why. I’d rather know ahead of time that if I didn’t leave a tip, I was going to just be hungry. You can’t force someone to volunteer to pick up your dinner.

[DCGuy64]

7 minutes ago, spookylu said:

That's true, and even understandable. What blows my mind is how many people are willing to pay that much to get food delivered.

I always remember a quote my dad told me that was originally by PT Barnum: "A fool and his money are soon parted." In short, if people can be suckered into parting with their money, they will be.

[dbrown84]

7 minutes ago, pete_coach said:

When you tip extra for a drink (as 20% is already added), it does not go to the bartender (unless you leave cash). There is no name on the bill, it just goes into the gratuity pool that all gratuities go into.

I think that the bartender notices but, it does not go to him/her, it goes to the giant tip pot.

well, I should have pointed out that I was talking about a cash tip.  Honestly, there wouldn't be any other way to tip since you're not given a receipt to sign.  and as I mentioned, I'm not double tipping since I don't take the drink package with the pre-paid gratuities.  I'm not necessarily advocating tipping, I was just saying that I also see a difference in service when I do tip (I was responding to someone who noticed the same).

[mjkacmom]

Just now, dbrown84 said:

well, I should have pointed out that I was talking about a cash tip.  Honestly, there wouldn't be any other way to tip since you're not given a receipt to sign.  and as I mentioned, I'm not double tipping since I don't take the drink package with the pre-paid gratuities.  I'm not necessarily advocating tipping, I was just saying that I also see a difference in service when I do tip (I was responding to someone who noticed the same).

If you don’t take the package and pay per drink, a 20% gratuity is added to your purchase (I take the FAS and tip per drink anyway).

[dbrown84]

Just now, mjkacmom said:

If you don’t take the package and pay per drink, a 20% gratuity is added to your purchase (I take the FAS and tip per drink anyway).

yes, for those that do that.

[DCGuy64]

3 minutes ago, mjkacmom said:

If you don’t take the package and pay per drink, a 20% gratuity is added to your purchase (I take the FAS and tip per drink anyway).

Great point! So, even those who don't pay the 20% as part of the package, end up paying it each time they order a drink (on TOP of any additional cash tip they choose to leave). I need to buy stock in NCLH!

[Daruma]

9 minutes ago, mjkacmom said:

Before the word got out, many folks just never got their food. Now they know why. I’d rather know ahead of time that if I didn’t leave a tip, I was going to just be hungry. You can’t force someone to volunteer to pick up your dinner.

 

I don't drive for Uber or Lyft, so I don't know if the following is true or not, but this is what I've been told by people who do drive for Uber and/or Lyft.

 

When they receive a notification to pick someone up, they don't see where the pickup is, or where the destination is... they just have to either accept the ride or not.

 

Once they accept it they see the pickup, but not the destination yet.

 

After they pick up the passenger they then see the destination. 

 

This prevents them from cherry picking rides... they're either going to service the ride or not.

 

Bailing too often on rides they grabbed results in increasingly negative scoring that can get them removed from service. 

 

IMHO DoorDash should work the same way... they just see that a delivery is available, they take it or not... once taken they see the restaurant... once they pick up the food they see the delivery location... once the order is completed they see the tip/money they're getting. 

 

No more extorting the customer for higher tips.

[mjkacmom]

44 minutes ago, Daruma said:

 

I don't drive for Uber or Lyft, so I don't know if the following is true or not, but this is what I've been told by people who do drive for Uber and/or Lyft.

 

When they receive a notification to pick someone up, they don't see where the pickup is, or where the destination is... they just have to either accept the ride or not.

 

Once they accept it they see the pickup, but not the destination yet.

 

After they pick up the passenger they then see the destination. 

 

This prevents them from cherry picking rides... they're either going to service the ride or not.

 

Bailing too often on rides they grabbed results in increasingly negative scoring that can get them removed from service. 

 

IMHO DoorDash should work the same way... they just see that a delivery is available, they take it or not... once taken they see the restaurant... once they pick up the food they see the delivery location... once the order is completed they see the tip/money they're getting. 

 

No more extorting the customer for higher tips.

Lol good luck getting drivers who will take a gamble like that for $2.50. Can you imagine getting stuck driving 30+ minutes and risk no tip? They’d lose money. It’s not a charity. At least the Uber driver gets paid more than $2.50, the longer the ride, the more $ made. It’s not the same thing as DoorDash, where the tip is most of the compensation.

[spookylu]

1 hour ago, bkrickles1 said:

I disagree with both of these points.

First of all, I go out plenty and have never felt pressure to tip "more and more". In fact, I've never felt pressure to tip at all. 

With regards to the "double tip", that's ridiculous!

I sail enough to know that nothing more is expected and that cash tipping is not "the norm".

But I am on the side of tipping extra.

We feel good about it and have been doing it for over 30 years, wherever we vacation, but especially on cruises. 

We know these hard workers appreciate the extra $ and it does lead many times to better relationships, being remembered and sometimes even better service.

That's okay! Everyone should do what they prefer and what they feel is right. 😀

[RocketMan275]

1 hour ago, pete_coach said:

When you tip extra for a drink (as 20% is already added), it does not go to the bartender (unless you leave cash). There is no name on the bill, it just goes into the gratuity pool that all gratuities go into.

I think that the bartender notices but, it does not go to him/her, it goes to the giant tip pot.

Exactly why any 'extra tips' we give are in cash and go directly to the server.

[luv2kroooz]

1 hour ago, seemoreroyals said:

became $12 per day DSC and is now $20 per day ($25 Haven) and no doubt will continue to go higher. 

Only NCL charges these ridiculous amounts, though. We just got off a Princess cruise....$16 per person per day, 2x stateroom service. Royal is $18, I think. The service was as good on Princess for a lot less money. Our cruise for three was 12 days, so we saved  $150 just in gratuities by choosing Princess over NCL. Just something to keep in mind. We acknowledge you can adjust DSC to whatever amount you feel is warranted by visiting guest service desk.

[Daruma]

30 minutes ago, mjkacmom said:

Lol good luck getting drivers who will take a gamble like that for $2.50. Can you imagine getting stuck driving 30+ minutes and risk no tip? They’d lose money. It’s not a charity. At least the Uber driver gets paid more than $2.50, the longer the ride, the more $ made. It’s not the same thing as DoorDash, where the tip is most of the compensation.

 

Fair enough, I'm no expert in how various gig workers are compensated that's for sure, lol.

 

I just know that if I were a frequent DoorDash user, and just found out about this newly visible, (though apparently always the mechanics), attempt at what I personally consider to be extortion, I'd stop using the service, but that's just me though 🤷

[mjkacmom]

9 minutes ago, Daruma said:

 

Fair enough, I'm no expert in how various gig workers are compensated that's for sure, lol.

 

I just know that if I were a frequent DoorDash user, and just found out about this newly visible, (though apparently always the mechanics), attempt at what I personally consider to be extortion, I'd stop using the service, but that's just me though 🤷

And those who expect someone to use their time and gas to deliver them food for nothing should definitely not order through DoorDash, but go get their own food.

[Daruma]

Just now, mjkacmom said:

And those who expect someone to use their time and gas to deliver them food for nothing should definitely not order through DoorDash, but go get their own food.

 

Ok, let's be clear here... I'm not a stingy tipper... every food delivery we get, (pizza, Chinese, etc... just not through DoorDash, but the restaurant's own delivery service), I tip between $10 to $15 even though 20% would be closer to $5 or $6. I've often been told that I  was the best tip of the day.

 

In a normal, sit down, wait staff restaurant, assuming adequate service, I tip 20% + $1 rounded up to the next dollar, and that's on the full TAXED amount. 

 

So,  a bill of $26.53 INCLUDING tax would get a $7 tip. Technically, tipping 20% on the UNTAXED amount would be, (7% sales tax here in FL), would be $4.95... so I'm actually tipping 28%.

 

My issue with DoorDash, (not counting this tip issue), as I mentioned above, is that the, say $5 burger from the place, is $6 or $7 through DoorDash, THEN you add a delivery/convenience fee, THEN you add a tip, and if the driver doesn't like the tip, they might not take the delivery? No, thanks... again  forgetting the tip issue... the added cost to the price PLUS the delivery/convenience fee puts it out of my considered "worth it" assessment. 

 

 

[DCGuy64]

Just now, Daruma said:

My issue with DoorDash, (not counting this tip issue), as I mentioned above, is that the, say $5 burger from the place, is $6 or $7 through DoorDash, THEN you add a delivery/convenience fee,

Exactly why we never use them. And as I alluded to before, the restaurants prefer you order directly from them because they get a larger proportion of the money when you buy direct vs using a food delivery service. And it costs ME less, too. Win/win! GrubHub ought to be called Money-Grub Hub, LOL!