Food in decline?

[jeh10641]

6 hours ago, cruiseboy89130 said:

Something is wrong with your font settings!

Nothing wrong with my font settings. I find it easier to read this way.

[Tangibelle]

I just got off of Independence and really enjoyed our dinners in the MDR. Chops was great and so was Izumi Hibachi. The Taste of Royal was lovely. The Windjammer was typical from my point of view. Not the best but not the worst either. 

 

It was my sister's first cruise and she LOVED all the food. I was joking with her about how I have heard people talk about the decline in food quality, she quipped, "well if this is what a decline in quality is like, I don't ever want to know what it was like before. I am more than happy with this so I don't want to know what I missed" lol 

[mjldvlks]

14 hours ago, Tatka said:

. . . 

My first 3 cruises - Splendor in 2004 and Explorer in 2007/2009 - featured weaker food than during last year.

 

. . .  Celebrity, Holland, Princess had always better food, but even they were not fine dining . . . but I do not think current food on RCI is Golden Corral quality. It is in between. Maybe somewhat worse than pre-pandemic, but not Corral worse.

 

I do not think it is done on purpose, . . . There is huge competition as cruising is still evolving. I do not believe RCI would upset loyal following on purpose. 

Interesting that my first cruise on Royal was also aboard Splendour. Mine in 2007. On that cruise we had multiple bread options that aren’t around any more. The bread baskets were also kept filled. We had a midnight buffet. On the second formal night we had Baked Alaska for dessert flambéed in our presence in the MDR. The baked goods were always fresh and well prepared. We overall had more choice and better food and with decent portions. I know it wasn’t “fine dining” but it was good a plentiful. We also had a waiter and assistant waiter who only had 2 or 3 tables so could be more attentive to us.  We also had a head waiter who actually introduced himself and got to know us. Told us jokes and did magic tricks. The entire staff seemed to enjoy their jobs — they weren’t constantly begging for high ratings out of fear for their jobs.
 

That is not remotely comparable to the vastly inferior product we experienced on Odyssey last fall or Anthem last month. 
 

Again, no one has suggested that the MDR  or Windjammer should be or ever were “fine dining.” But I still maintain I would find a more enjoyable meal experience at about any buffet or casual dining restaurant shoreside such as Golden Corral, Applebees or the like.

You appear to agree that the food is worse than it used to be so maybe our disagreement is only a matter of degree. But in the last several years I have noticed a long and steep decline in the quality of the product. This goes beyond food. For example, cabin attendants now have many more rooms to take care of and can only tend to each one once a day.
 

Despite agreeing there has been a decline, you say you don’t believe it’s intentional. I cannot agree with that. I think the pattern of nickel and diming has been clear since well before the pandemic. I for one am tired of the pandemic being used as an excuse. I think the decline started in earnest about the time they started adding specialty restaurants. For me it has reached the breaking point. The worst day of cruising used to be the last day — the day we had to leave. On our last two cruises I have been eager to get the heck off of the tub.   The bean counters have taken control. For goodness sake the CEO of Royal’s parent company is an accountant with little or no operational experience. I am convinced these bean counters have persuaded themselves that cruise demand is a virtual bottomless pit that they can abuse to no end. Well not for me. I may cruise again. But unless things change, it will be a while — and then only if I am really interested in the itinerary.  I no longer have any interest in cruising just for the ship life. 

[Kbonner]

To sum the decline up: it has a name, Jason Liberty

[Engineroom Snipe]

4 hours ago, mjldvlks said:

Well not for me. I may cruise again. But unless things change, it will be a while — and then only if I am really interested in the itinerary.  I no longer have any interest in cruising just for the ship life. 

 

Times have changed since my first voyage too. As you have stated, maybe not for the better in some areas.

 

I have toned down my expectations about food onboard. As a long time cruiser, you have many memories to compare today's reality of what is against what was.

 

Maybe cut back the amount of cruising on Royal and try other lines or another vacation experience.

 

That is what I am doing.

 

The cruise lines made record breaking profits last year. I do not think they will miss us. New cruisers will fill the cabin.

 

Occasionally, I have been able to snag a few cruises with extremely good price-points contrary to the higher prices seen on most voyages. This tends to negate some of the drawbacks. Getting a good deal is the only way I can fight the bean-counters (even then, I am sure they are not losing money on my purchase).

 

Until the ships sail empty, nothing is going to change.

 

Sometimes, it is hard letting go of past great memories expecting them to happen again.

[Georgeny]

Don't know if links to other sites are allowed here but will give it a try.

 

https://www.royalcaribbeanblog.com/2023/09/22/photos-show-what-it-was-cruise-royal-caribbean-the-1980s

[time4u2go]

15 hours ago, mjldvlks said:

Interesting that my first cruise on Royal was also aboard Splendour. Mine in 2007. On that cruise we had multiple bread options that aren’t around any more. The bread baskets were also kept filled. We had a midnight buffet. On the second formal night we had Baked Alaska for dessert flambéed in our presence in the MDR. The baked goods were always fresh and well prepared. We overall had more choice and better food and with decent portions. I know it wasn’t “fine dining” but it was good a plentiful. We also had a waiter and assistant waiter who only had 2 or 3 tables so could be more attentive to us.  We also had a head waiter who actually introduced himself and got to know us. Told us jokes and did magic tricks. The entire staff seemed to enjoy their jobs — they weren’t constantly begging for high ratings out of fear for their jobs.
 

That is not remotely comparable to the vastly inferior product we experienced on Odyssey last fall or Anthem last month. 
 

Again, no one has suggested that the MDR  or Windjammer should be or ever were “fine dining.” But I still maintain I would find a more enjoyable meal experience at about any buffet or casual dining restaurant shoreside such as Golden Corral, Applebees or the like.

You appear to agree that the food is worse than it used to be so maybe our disagreement is only a matter of degree. But in the last several years I have noticed a long and steep decline in the quality of the product. This goes beyond food. For example, cabin attendants now have many more rooms to take care of and can only tend to each one once a day.
 

Despite agreeing there has been a decline, you say you don’t believe it’s intentional. I cannot agree with that. I think the pattern of nickel and diming has been clear since well before the pandemic. I for one am tired of the pandemic being used as an excuse. I think the decline started in earnest about the time they started adding specialty restaurants. For me it has reached the breaking point. The worst day of cruising used to be the last day — the day we had to leave. On our last two cruises I have been eager to get the heck off of the tub.   The bean counters have taken control. For goodness sake the CEO of Royal’s parent company is an accountant with little or no operational experience. I am convinced these bean counters have persuaded themselves that cruise demand is a virtual bottomless pit that they can abuse to no end. Well not for me. I may cruise again. But unless things change, it will be a while — and then only if I am really interested in the itinerary.  I no longer have any interest in cruising just for the ship life. 

Excellent post!  I agree with everything you said.

 

While food in general is certainly subjective, you have pointed out some things that are most definitely not subjective, and that have diminished the cruising experience for many.

[Morecruisesplz]

18 hours ago, mjldvlks said:

Interesting that my first cruise on Royal was also aboard Splendour. Mine in 2007. On that cruise we had multiple bread options that aren’t around any more. The bread baskets were also kept filled. We had a midnight buffet. On the second formal night we had Baked Alaska for dessert flambéed in our presence in the MDR. The baked goods were always fresh and well prepared. We overall had more choice and better food and with decent portions. I know it wasn’t “fine dining” but it was good a plentiful. We also had a waiter and assistant waiter who only had 2 or 3 tables so could be more attentive to us.  We also had a head waiter who actually introduced himself and got to know us. Told us jokes and did magic tricks. The entire staff seemed to enjoy their jobs — they weren’t constantly begging for high ratings out of fear for their jobs.
 

That is not remotely comparable to the vastly inferior product we experienced on Odyssey last fall or Anthem last month. 
 

Again, no one has suggested that the MDR  or Windjammer should be or ever were “fine dining.” But I still maintain I would find a more enjoyable meal experience at about any buffet or casual dining restaurant shoreside such as Golden Corral, Applebees or the like.

You appear to agree that the food is worse than it used to be so maybe our disagreement is only a matter of degree. But in the last several years I have noticed a long and steep decline in the quality of the product. This goes beyond food. For example, cabin attendants now have many more rooms to take care of and can only tend to each one once a day.
 

Despite agreeing there has been a decline, you say you don’t believe it’s intentional. I cannot agree with that. I think the pattern of nickel and diming has been clear since well before the pandemic. I for one am tired of the pandemic being used as an excuse. I think the decline started in earnest about the time they started adding specialty restaurants. For me it has reached the breaking point. The worst day of cruising used to be the last day — the day we had to leave. On our last two cruises I have been eager to get the heck off of the tub.   The bean counters have taken control. For goodness sake the CEO of Royal’s parent company is an accountant with little or no operational experience. I am convinced these bean counters have persuaded themselves that cruise demand is a virtual bottomless pit that they can abuse to no end. Well not for me. I may cruise again. But unless things change, it will be a while — and then only if I am really interested in the itinerary.  I no longer have any interest in cruising just for the ship life. 

And we fell in love with the experience. Spent lots of dollars chasing the C & A next level while they moved the goal posts and lowered the experience in most all areas. Now if you can't afford the new big ships and a suite you are likely to get the Granduer experience! 

Well said, mjldvlks!

[jeh10641]

On 2/20/2024 at 10:47 PM, mjldvlks said:

Interesting that my first cruise on Royal was also aboard Splendour. Mine in 2007. On that cruise we had multiple bread options that aren’t around any more. The bread baskets were also kept filled. We had a midnight buffet. On the second formal night we had Baked Alaska for dessert flambéed in our presence in the MDR. The baked goods were always fresh and well prepared. We overall had more choice and better food and with decent portions. I know it wasn’t “fine dining” but it was good a plentiful. We also had a waiter and assistant waiter who only had 2 or 3 tables so could be more attentive to us.  We also had a head waiter who actually introduced himself and got to know us. Told us jokes and did magic tricks. The entire staff seemed to enjoy their jobs — they weren’t constantly begging for high ratings out of fear for their jobs.
 

That is not remotely comparable to the vastly inferior product we experienced on Odyssey last fall or Anthem last month. 
 

Again, no one has suggested that the MDR  or Windjammer should be or ever were “fine dining.” But I still maintain I would find a more enjoyable meal experience at about any buffet or casual dining restaurant shoreside such as Golden Corral, Applebees or the like.

You appear to agree that the food is worse than it used to be so maybe our disagreement is only a matter of degree. But in the last several years I have noticed a long and steep decline in the quality of the product. This goes beyond food. For example, cabin attendants now have many more rooms to take care of and can only tend to each one once a day.
 

Despite agreeing there has been a decline, you say you don’t believe it’s intentional. I cannot agree with that. I think the pattern of nickel and diming has been clear since well before the pandemic. I for one am tired of the pandemic being used as an excuse. I think the decline started in earnest about the time they started adding specialty restaurants. For me it has reached the breaking point. The worst day of cruising used to be the last day — the day we had to leave. On our last two cruises I have been eager to get the heck off of the tub.   The bean counters have taken control. For goodness sake the CEO of Royal’s parent company is an accountant with little or no operational experience. I am convinced these bean counters have persuaded themselves that cruise demand is a virtual bottomless pit that they can abuse to no end. Well not for me. I may cruise again. But unless things change, it will be a while — and then only if I am really interested in the itinerary.  I no longer have any interest in cruising just for the ship life. 

I will add my two cents. On our Anthem OTS cruise in October, we had two servers. Both were attentive and actually performed way above their paygrade. They had a pot of unsweetened ice tea for each dinner (about a dozen) in American Icon Grill MDR without us asking for it (see my review below, not available otherwise due the embarkation port and taste factors of Europeans according to the hotel director).

 

The two made us origami several times, without asking, including a napkin special one night. The head waiter came over every night to talk to us. He had the kitchen make us a special dessert that was no longer on the menu. We had only mentioned it in passing and never asked for it.

 

Our MDR dinners related, taste wise and appeal, to what I would expect in a land-based restaurant in the $30-40 range, per person (Seattle WA area). There were always 2-4 different items each night over 15 nights plus a few more that remained the same. Gourmet? Not really. However, it was still very good. If I ordered medium rare, it came medium rare. We like to dawdle over dinner but never had to stay more than 90 minutes in a leisurely atmosphere.

 

The Windjammer Buffet was light years ahead of any land-based buffet we ever ate at except maybe in Las Vegas where those buffets now start around $40 per person.

 

I have been cruising since 1959 but in recent years (after retirement) more actively. I do not classify myself as a "foodie" but I enjoy a good meal when I have one. I had only good top great meals on Anthem.

 

Jim       

Edited February 24 by jeh10641

[Thisguylikestocruise]

Got off Wonder a few days ago, food was great overall. The few items I didn’t like weren’t THAT bad, but were bland. Really enjoyed food I don’t eat often at home like arancini, baked alaska, risotto, falafel, vegetable tempura, stuffed peppers, curry, pistachio eclairs, banana pancakes, polenta, fried plantains, etc.

[edrussell]

We just disembarked Wonder on Feb 18, and dined every single night of our 7 nights in the MDR.  We aren't picky, we will be honest with food quality and while we also don't expect 5 star in the MDR on RCCL we do expect good food.  We received that in spades.  Of the 7 nights maybe 1 each of app/main/dessert was not up to par.  Food was hot, seasoned well and perfectly timed.  One in particular (I know this isn't food related, but it does relate to our overall experience) I arrived with my trademark whiskey already in hand and asked our server to have a replacement drink arrive right after our mains.  Well it did just that, almost to the minute.

 

Food elsewhere was fine, note that I say fine.  Not fantastic, not awful, just fine.  Windjammer for breakfast was OK.  Our only disappointment was the pizza in Sorrento's.  Just not good.  Then again I am not a pizza lover anyway.   

 

We've noticed a distinct uptick in the food on Wonder comparing it against our last RCCL which was Grandeur in May of 2023.  If we compare Wonder to Oasis on our last sailing on her there was no comparison, Wonder comes out ahead by a million miles.  Food is so subjective though.  Then again some come on here just to whine and complain no matter what they are served.  To each their own I suppose.

[Thisguylikestocruise]

4 hours ago, edrussell said:

We just disembarked Wonder on Feb 18, and dined every single night of our 7 nights in the MDR.  We aren't picky, we will be honest with food quality and while we also don't expect 5 star in the MDR on RCCL we do expect good food.  We received that in spades.  Of the 7 nights maybe 1 each of app/main/dessert was not up to par.  Food was hot, seasoned well and perfectly timed.  One in particular (I know this isn't food related, but it does relate to our overall experience) I arrived with my trademark whiskey already in hand and asked our server to have a replacement drink arrive right after our mains.  Well it did just that, almost to the minute.

 

Food elsewhere was fine, note that I say fine.  Not fantastic, not awful, just fine.  Windjammer for breakfast was OK.  Our only disappointment was the pizza in Sorrento's.  Just not good.  Then again I am not a pizza lover anyway.   

 

We've noticed a distinct uptick in the food on Wonder comparing it against our last RCCL which was Grandeur in May of 2023.  If we compare Wonder to Oasis on our last sailing on her there was no comparison, Wonder comes out ahead by a million miles.  Food is so subjective though.  Then again some come on here just to whine and complain no matter what they are served.  To each their own I suppose.

Was on the same cruise. Did you feel like it was too crowded? Unlike my Wonder cruise last year, this one had lines everywhere. We went to MDR after 8pm with reservations and the line was to the elevator. Multiple days they had us go down to deck 3 where it was even more chaotic. WJ had a dozen people always lined up at the grill area where burgers and fries are. Unsupervised kids were running all over the place on day 6, pushing all the elevator buttons. One kid slammed into me coming around a corner sprinting at full speed and knocked a drink out of my hand, never stopped to apologize, kept running. 

Edited February 24 by Thisguylikestocruise

[edrussell]

Didn't find it crowded at all, no more than any Oasis Class anyway.  Then again I don't mind crowds.  We didn't stand in a line all week; well one line at El Loco Fresh for maybe 5 minutes.  We had reservations at the MDR for My Time for 6:45, we had already been in contact with a maitre d who kept our table so we walked through the line and went right straight in each night.  That definitely helped.  We learned that from Oasis on our sailing last year, to make a contact in the MDR.  We only went into the Windjammer twice and each time it wasn't that bad.  No issues with children but then again we expect children on RCCL.  If we wanted a child free cruise we'd sail another line.  We LOVED this sailing and plan on doing the same one next year.

 

[mjldvlks]

On 2/21/2024 at 5:44 AM, Engineroom Snipe said:

 

. . .  I have toned down my expectations about food onboard. As a long time cruiser, you have many memories to compare today's reality of what is against what was.

 

Maybe cut back the amount of cruising on Royal and try other lines or another vacation experience.

 

That is what I am doing. . . .

 

The cruise lines made record breaking profits last year. I do not think they will miss us. New cruisers will fill the cabin.

 

 . . .Until the ships sail empty, nothing is going to change. . . 

As to other cruise lines, we have tried Norwegian once (food was actually OK but that was shortly before Covid) and Princess a couple of times. Far and away the absolutely worst food/service I have ever had on a cruise ship was on Island Princess in 2022. Just as an example, we ate in the Italian specialty restaurant (Sabatinis I think) and I ordered a triple sampler. The 3 dishes being sampled were almost unrecognizable.  The lasagna sample was a pile of red goop with a white disc on top that, despite having the consistency of dried leather, I think was supposed to be pasta. Pretty sure it was not cheese. Just awful. 
 

As to cruise line profits, I read that Royal’s parent company had a $1 Billion profit in the third quarter last year. That was coupled with the comment that expenses were lower. Given that fuel prices and supplies are on a more or less inflationary trend, the only way I can conceive that being possible is by cutting the quality of the product delivered.

[jeh10641]

In terms of profitability of cruise lines: Yes, they are having great bottom line success. But be aware they incurred multiple BILLIONS of dollars in debt during the "Shut Down!". It will take them multiple years of big profits to pay that debt down, especially as they add new and refurbish old ships to their fleets. As a stockholder in two cruise lines, I want that debt brought under control even if it means I may have to pay more in order for that to happen.

[mjldvlks]

6 hours ago, jeh10641 said:

In terms of profitability of cruise lines: Yes, they are having great bottom line success. But be aware they incurred multiple BILLIONS of dollars in debt during the "Shut Down!". It will take them multiple years of big profits to pay that debt down, especially as they add new and refurbish old ships to their fleets. As a stockholder in two cruise lines, I want that debt brought under control even if it means I may have to pay more in order for that to happen.

Raising prices is one thing — and a thing that is not the issue here. Gutting the product is the issue. So far post covid demand has been strong. But I read somewhere above that future demand is softening. As they continue to cut and otherwise diminish the product, I know they will continue to bleed long time, previously loyal customers. As a shareholder I would think you would be concerned with how they pay down debt while driving off longtime cruisers. 

[cruisinfanatic]

On 1/11/2024 at 11:27 PM, twonpcb said:

I know this is a very touchy subject but I have seen several posts regarding how Royal’s food quality has gone south recently.  My husband and I were on a Celebrity cruise last January to Antarctica and we found the food superb.

 

Can anyone expound on this?  We have not cruised Royal since before the pandemic.

 

 

Same post by some 20 years ago.

[jeh10641]

14 hours ago, mjldvlks said:

Raising prices is one thing — and a thing that is not the issue here. Gutting the product is the issue. So far post covid demand has been strong. But I read somewhere above that future demand is softening. As they continue to cut and otherwise diminish the product, I know they will continue to bleed long time, previously loyal customers. As a shareholder I would think you would be concerned with how they pay down debt while driving off longtime cruisers. 

The "Law of Supply and Demand" will answer your question. If pricing drives away customers, prices will retreat, maybe not all the way but enough to spark demand.

 

In the meantime, our Royal cruise (Anthem OTS) had very few of the complaints found in this conversation. Included food was very good and choices were ample. Service was impeccable. Did i miss not having two cabin attendants? No. Did I miss two daily cabin cleanups? No. Most hotels do not offer those services.  Many do not even offer daily service on longer stays.

 

If you do not want to pay Icon OTS prices, there are many more options in Royal's fleet. I do not care about all the bells and whistles that she offers. For me, destinations are more important than the ship. The megaships cannot visit the smaller, less visited places. Those are what I like.

 

By the way, my preferred cruise line is HAL.

[jeh10641]

13 hours ago, cruisinfanatic said:

Same post by some 20 years ago.

I covered the food on board Anthem OTS extensively. My review is in my signature below.

[Morecruisesplz]

On 2/25/2024 at 1:47 PM, jeh10641 said:

In terms of profitability of cruise lines: Yes, they are having great bottom line success. But be aware they incurred multiple BILLIONS of dollars in debt during the "Shut Down!". It will take them multiple years of big profits to pay that debt down, especially as they add new and refurbish old ships to their fleets. As a stockholder in two cruise lines, I want that debt brought under control even if it means I may have to pay more in order for that to happen.

And you're happy with the decline in food and service?

[jeh10641]

1 hour ago, Morecruisesplz said:

And you're happy with the decline in food and service?

Please read all of my recent posts. I DID NOT find your supposition to be true about the food and service. You can read my extensive review of Anthem located in my signature below (expand it).

[Morecruisesplz]

30 minutes ago, jeh10641 said:

Please read all of my recent posts. I DID NOT find your supposition to be true about the food and service. You can read my extensive review of Anthem located in my signature below (expand it).

I never supposed. I cruise and saw the conditions myself. Good luck on one ship might happen but those are certainly not fleet wide. 

[sfaaa]

2 hours ago, Morecruisesplz said:

And you're happy with the decline in food and service?

Increase productivity and reduce op costs are always the right thing to do for for-profit companies.

[shofer]

On 1/21/2024 at 11:04 AM, gadaboutgal said:

Be careful in recommending Celebrity.  We are on Constellation for 30+ days right now and are extremely disappointed in the dining.  Case in point, last night's dinner offering was Meatloaf and a vegetarian pot pie with only mushrooms and potatoes.  We sail most of the cruise lines at least 100 or more days a year and find that Celebrity food at this point is no better than MSC or Royal-in fact their offerings are better than what we've found on Celebrity--such a decline, such a sad state of affairs!

Oh, that is so sad to hear.  DH & I always raved about X's food and I can only think of one time out of 7 cruises when I sent something back.  Our last trip with them was in 2018 for a 15 day Trans-Atlantic that they billed as Boston, Broadway & Bermuda.  That was the best new Itinerary I have been on in a while.

[shofer]

On 1/23/2024 at 1:20 PM, PACrew said:

I hope everyone is completing the surveys after the cruise. 

The worst food I ever had on a cruise was on Vision of the Seas-2015 Med cruise.  Even the buffet had poor selection and taste.  That survey got a big, fat ZERO.  Everyone in our group did the same. Two years later, we were on Vision again for a Baltic cruise and the food was great!  So I guess they do pay attention to the survey.