Excursions and ability level.

[Breckski]

We are almost always one of the youngest couples on a Viking cruise and pretty fit.  We've never had an excursion where someone's lack of mobility/fitness has hindered our enjoyment whatsoever - even if we made slight modifications to the original excursion plan.  

 

The couple of times on excursions where someone obviously had bitten off more than they could chew, the passengers clearly knew what they had made a mistaken in their selection and self-limited certain aspects of the excursion.  

 

Just use some common sense.  Don't book a 5-mile hike if you can only walk a mile.  You'll be fine.  Most importantly have a good trip.

 

 

 

[CDNPolar]

14 hours ago, duquephart said:

 

Where does it say he was American?

 

I did not state the citizenship or country of residence of the individual, and the post did not say he was American on purpose.

 

Looks alone don't tell you where someone is from or where they were born, but accent generally does and if I were to say where this gentleman was from the accent would confirm it.

 

It is not about where the person is from as any country has people that are ignorant to other cultures, their history, and their ways of life - even my own country Canada has these folks.  It was just about the fact that he did not appreciate the history and the beauty of cobblestones in a country that probably designed and built these cobblestone streets and sidewalks centuries before he was born.  He just wanted the countries that we were visiting to pave the history over so it would be easier for him to walk.

 

And, perhaps I should not have brought this situation into this discussion, but it was to build the point that for those that may be mobility challenged, even the Easy excursions can be challenging.

 

I was impressed however in our recent (December 2023) Treasures of the Rhine Viking River Cruise, that they had a new level of excursion group for those doing included excursions only.  So we were assigned to our excursion groups and busses as normal and they were "A", "B", "C", etc., but then they added a new category they called "L" or "Leisurely" and you signed up to be in this group.  In the "L" group they would. move at a slower pace and be more aware of the mobility challenges.

 

This is the first time I had seen this group offered on Vining and I was very appreciative of the fact that Viking did this and I hope that they do this on all included tours across the fleet, as I have seen many times on included "Easy" tours those that cannot keep up at the same pace as the guide.

[Squawkman]

Our last 2 river cruises had group “G” for gentle.

[OneSixtyToOne]

23 minutes ago, Squawkman said:

Our last 2 river cruises had group “G” for gentle.

That is standard for the river cruises.

On our last VO Mediterranean cruise they had initiated a pilot program to do the same for Ocean. Does anyone know if this has been implemented on all VO ships?

[Redtravel]

On riverboats, there is usually a gentle walker version. We always take it. If they don’t offer it, the regular tour is often not very strenuous.  We never take any difficulty strenuous tours. It doesn’t work for us.  We don’t want to hamper the pace of the tour. Opt out if the tour is too demanding.  We were on Grand European riverboat cruise, Marksburg Castle was the only included tour for Koblenz. Level was demanding. Read online how demanding it was to walk up the uneven roads to the castle. There was no other included option. We chose to skip that tour, and just walked around the old town. Sometimes people take included tours that aren’t suitable for them.  They go on a tour because they paid for it.  One gentleman took the Marksburg tour and had a heart attack . He died.  It would be nice if there were options to suit a variety of mobility challenges.  

[SantaFe1]

What a terrible story!  I just looked, and on our cruise this fall there is an included tour called Historic Koblenz rated moderate.  The castle is marked demanding is is now $99.  

[OneSixtyToOne]

29 minutes ago, Redtravel said:

On riverboats, there is usually a gentle walker version. We always take it. If they don’t offer it, the regular tour is often not very strenuous.  We never take any difficulty strenuous tours. It doesn’t work for us.  We don’t want to hamper the pace of the tour. Opt out if the tour is too demanding.  We were on Grand European riverboat cruise, Marksburg Castle was the only included tour for Koblenz. Level was demanding. Read online how demanding it was to walk up the uneven roads to the castle. There was no other included option. We chose to skip that tour, and just walked around the old town. Sometimes people take included tours that aren’t suitable for them.  They go on a tour because they paid for it.  One gentleman took the Marksburg tour and had a heart attack . He died.  It would be nice if there were options to suit a variety of mobility challenges.  

We’ve been on two VR cruises that stopped at Koblenz and both times there was an included tour of Ehrenbreitstein Fortress for those with mobility issues.

[duquephart]

1 hour ago, OneSixtyToOne said:

We’ve been on two VR cruises that stopped at Koblenz and both times there was an included tour of Ehrenbreitstein Fortress for those with mobility issues.

 

Or ----- perhaps for those who wanted to tour Ehrenbreitstein Fortress?

[OneSixtyToOne]

6 minutes ago, duquephart said:

 

Or ----- perhaps for those who wanted to tour Ehrenbreitstein Fortress?

Yes, but this was in response to the post that there were no other included options other than the demanding Marksburg Castle. I do not believe Viking does not offer an included tour for those with mobility issues.

[Sunflower & The Scientist]

8 hours ago, CDNPolar said:

I was impressed however in our recent (December 2023) Treasures of the Rhine Viking River Cruise, that they had a new level of excursion group for those doing included excursions only.  So we were assigned to our excursion groups and busses as normal and they were "A", "B", "C", etc., but then they added a new category they called "L" or "Leisurely" and you signed up to be in this group.  In the "L" group they would. move at a slower pace and be more aware of the mobility challenges.

I think this is a great thing for Viking to do. We've had two experiences where people over estimated their abilities and it caused issues. My husband is very athletic and was on a Viking kayak excursion. The kayaks were two person kayaks and a woman was put in his kayak that had never kayaked and should not have been attempting to do the excursion. The waters were rough and he had to do all the work for two people and worry about her not causing any safety issues. It was very unpleasant for him. On another cruise line excursion where we both were snorkeling, an elderly frail woman had snorkeling on her bucket list, which was totally unrealistic. The guys running the excursion were very kind to her and basically carried her for a while, but then had to take her back to shore which messed things up for the rest of us. 

 

I don't think our experiences were the norm.  Most people recognize what their abilities are. Some "demanding" excursions might not be demanding, but there are those that are! 

 

[CDNPolar]

16 hours ago, Sunflower & The Scientist said:

I think this is a great thing for Viking to do. We've had two experiences where people over estimated their abilities and it caused issues. My husband is very athletic and was on a Viking kayak excursion. The kayaks were two person kayaks and a woman was put in his kayak that had never kayaked and should not have been attempting to do the excursion. The waters were rough and he had to do all the work for two people and worry about her not causing any safety issues. It was very unpleasant for him. On another cruise line excursion where we both were snorkeling, an elderly frail woman had snorkeling on her bucket list, which was totally unrealistic. The guys running the excursion were very kind to her and basically carried her for a while, but then had to take her back to shore which messed things up for the rest of us. 

 

I don't think our experiences were the norm.  Most people recognize what their abilities are. Some "demanding" excursions might not be demanding, but there are those that are! 

 

 

I don't think I mentioned this before, but we became friends with a woman who was travelling with her 90 year old mother.  On the first day, we were on excursion together and although "Mom" kept up, it seemed at times that she was struggling a bit with the pace.

 

Next day daughter decided to sign them up for the Leisurely "L" group.

 

The next day they were back with us because Mom insisted that they were too slow in this "L" group.

 

Mom did great for the rest of the trip and she managed to keep up anytime we were on excursion with them.  

 

 

[FoggyEthan]

It sounds like OP is concerned both about holding up a group and about being held up by a group. I think you have a lot of options, if you're willing to do some research beforehand.

 

I'd suggest not being dependent upon being with a tour group. Most of your ports are in towns or cities. Learn how to get back to the ship independently, or else to the bus that takes you back to the ship. Figure out how you can summon a taxi or uber, e.g. do you have to find a taxi stand, does the city have uber, etc.

 

This way you can start with the tour group, but if the pace is wrong then you can break out on your own.

 

If money allows, look into hiring private guides / tours, where you can customize the itinerary however you like and it will always travel at your own pace. Sometimes you can find other people to travel with you on a private tour, and share the costs, by posting in a roll call.

 

If you want to stick to the safety and lack of advance planning that comes with using the cruise's tours, as everyone has said, read the details in the itinerary. Often things seem to be "moderate" simply because you have to walk around. You're in Europe, so try to explore it as best as you're able!

[ChrisB123]

1 hour ago, FoggyEthan said:

It sounds like OP is concerned both about holding up a group and about being held up by a group. I think you have a lot of options, if you're willing to do some research beforehand.

 

I'd suggest not being dependent upon being with a tour group. Most of your ports are in towns or cities. Learn how to get back to the ship independently, or else to the bus that takes you back to the ship. Figure out how you can summon a taxi or uber, e.g. do you have to find a taxi stand, does the city have uber, etc.

 

This way you can start with the tour group, but if the pace is wrong then you can break out on your own.

 

If money allows, look into hiring private guides / tours, where you can customize the itinerary however you like and it will always travel at your own pace. Sometimes you can find other people to travel with you on a private tour, and share the costs, by posting in a roll call.

 

If you want to stick to the safety and lack of advance planning that comes with using the cruise's tours, as everyone has said, read the details in the itinerary. Often things seem to be "moderate" simply because you have to walk around. You're in Europe, so try to explore it as best as you're able!

Exactly! 

[molymoo]

I have been watching this thread for awhile and, personal feelings aside (I will admit that I find it disheartening to see those with any sort of mobility so frequently "shamed" here on this forum) I would like to present (perhaps) another side to the "story".  

 

To preface, I am a senior citizen who travels with my daughter (not a senior citizen) and although I am not quite as "spry" as I was in my early days, I have no mobility issues and in 20 Viking cruises I don't believe I have ever been one who slowed down the group on any excursion.

 

We recently returned from the Egypt itinerary and it was certainly as challenging as its reputation. We considered this and gave careful thought to what excursions/activities we would complete and which (if any) we might choose to skip.  There were 53 on our trip (a little more than half the number originally slated for the trip) and we were split into three groups ... each with 20 or fewer members.  Despite the fact that the whole group was pretty much representational of the "typical" Viking demographic we ended up in a group of much younger (20's and 30's) members of families and some hard core "commandos" who were obviously very fit, still working, and regularly worked out and walked "several" miles daily.  Great for them but it made it difficult for those of us "more typical" individuals to keep up the pace.  A good example was during one excursion the group was spread out a bit and I was "huffing and puffing" to keep up with two of the commandos ahead of me.  I could hear but not see our guide.  After a few minutes my daughter asked me why I was hurrying and my response was "to keep up with our guide".  She laughed and pointed behind me at our guide.  She said she didn't know where the others were going but apparently they had their own agenda!  It was that way throughout the entire trip and continued into the Jordan extension.  If I heard "I can rest when I die" one more time, I might have "lost it"!  We did request a group change but it was obvious that that would have been difficult so we "resigned" ourselves to being "those people" who might be slowing down the group (in fairness, there were about 6 of us "normal" people).  I'm not sure there were any complaints about us "slow pokes" (they honestly seemed oblivious to the rest of us most of the time).  But in all honestly I'm not sure it would be fair to measure our "ability level" against theirs.  

 

Just another POV.

[CDNPolar]

21 hours ago, molymoo said:

I have been watching this thread for awhile and, personal feelings aside (I will admit that I find it disheartening to see those with any sort of mobility so frequently "shamed" here on this forum) I would like to present (perhaps) another side to the "story".  

 

 

Sorry, I don't want of offend you, but I don't see this discussion as "shaming" anyone, but an honest discussion about the demands of certain countries and the excursions that are offered.

 

I am not suggesting that you are calling me out, but from my perspective, I am purely sharing what I have seen and observed.

 

My heart actually goes out to those that are mobility challenged on the average excursion because I want them to be able to travel and see what I do, but there is the desire on the side of the individual to participate and then the reality that it may be more challenging than they thought.

 

I have seen far too often those that part way into the excursion ask the guide if they can sit the rest out and have the guide circle back to escort them to the bus.  

 

If any of my comments have caused you to think I am shaming anyone, my sincere apologies as that was not intended.

[molymoo]

52 minutes ago, CDNPolar said:

 

Sorry, I don't want of offend you, but I don't see this discussion as "shaming" anyone, but an honest discussion about the demands of certain countries and the excursions that are offered.

 

I am not suggesting that you are calling me out, but from my perspective, I am purely sharing what I have seen and observed.

 

My heart actually goes out to those that are mobility challenged on the average excursion because I want them to be able to travel and see what I do, but there is the desire on the side of the individual to participate and then the reality that it may be more challenging than they thought.

 

I have seen far too often those that part way into the excursion ask the guide if they can sit the rest out and have the guide circle back to escort them to the bus.  

 

If any of my comments have caused you to think I am shaming anyone, my sincere apologies as that was not intended.

I really wasn’t implying that THIS thread was “shaming” anyone.  It is however a frequent topic that appears here in the CC site and some comments are just plain cruel.  We have always been sympathetic of those who struggle and have often opted to “hang” back with them.  The upshot has been the fact that we have had the opportunity to get to know some absolutely lovely people and enjoyed the excursion on a different level.  Sometimes it’s nice to stop, take a breath and really take in the location.  You’re not going to “see everything” on a single excursion so why not give yourself the opportunity to enjoy and experience what you can?  

[CDNPolar]

4 minutes ago, molymoo said:

I really wasn’t implying that THIS thread was “shaming” anyone.  It is however a frequent topic that appears here in the CC site and some comments are just plain cruel.  We have always been sympathetic of those who struggle and have often opted to “hang” back with them.  The upshot has been the fact that we have had the opportunity to get to know some absolutely lovely people and enjoyed the excursion on a different level.  Sometimes it’s nice to stop, take a breath and really take in the location.  You’re not going to “see everything” on a single excursion so why not give yourself the opportunity to enjoy and experience what you can?  

 

 

Ok... understood.  

I work in DEI heavily (Diversity Equity and Inclusion) and wanted to understand where you were coming from.

 

It can be a touchy and slippery slope sometimes in how one refers to an individual that is mobility challenged, or has any kind of limitation that is either physical or if they are neural divergent.  Some terms can be acceptable in one country and not in another.

 

It is a shame that some threads are not taking care to how they speak to this segment of our society.

 

The sad part is that many places in the world today do not yet recognize that every living being should have the same accessibility.  But when you look at some of these countries and then recognize that compared to the USA and Canada we are but toddlers to their centuries of background and infrastructure that cannot easily or reasonably be modified, it makes more sense.

 

One day...

[molymoo]

5 minutes ago, CDNPolar said:

 

 

Ok... understood.  

I work in DEI heavily (Diversity Equity and Inclusion) and wanted to understand where you were coming from.

 

It can be a touchy and slippery slope sometimes in how one refers to an individual that is mobility challenged, or has any kind of limitation that is either physical or if they are neural divergent.  Some terms can be acceptable in one country and not in another.

 

It is a shame that some threads are not taking care to how they speak to this segment of our society.

 

The sad part is that many places in the world today do not yet recognize that every living being should have the same accessibility.  But when you look at some of these countries and then recognize that compared to the USA and Canada we are but toddlers to their centuries of background and infrastructure that cannot easily or reasonably be modified, it makes more sense.

 

One day...

 

5 minutes ago, CDNPolar said:

 

 

Ok... understood.  

I work in DEI heavily (Diversity Equity and Inclusion) and wanted to understand where you were coming from.

 

It can be a touchy and slippery slope sometimes in how one refers to an individual that is mobility challenged, or has any kind of limitation that is either physical or if they are neural divergent.  Some terms can be acceptable in one country and not in another.

 

It is a shame that some threads are not taking care to how they speak to this segment of our society.

 

The sad part is that many places in the world today do not yet recognize that every living being should have the same accessibility.  But when you look at some of these countries and then recognize that compared to the USA and Canada we are but toddlers to their centuries of background and infrastructure that cannot easily or reasonably be modified, it makes more sense.

 

One day...

Glad to hear from another proponent of inclusion!  I taught children with multiple disabilities for more than 40 years so that’s where I am coming from.  Although the US and Canada have come a long way … even we still have a long way to go !