Norwegians shocking demise of quality on all fronts

[laudergayle]

4 minutes ago, RocketMan275 said:

So, your solution is NCL should increase prices or reduce profits to increase differentiation?

Ok…I said I wouldn’t post.  So I lied.

 

In business, there is this thing called ROI.  You should, in fact, spend more money to differentiate if your differentiation delivers a return greater than investment.  That could be by way of increased occupancy, increased frequency or increased rates or spending onboard.

 

Now, I’m done with this thread snd won’t be lured back in.

[RocketMan275]

2 minutes ago, laudergayle said:

Ok…I said I wouldn’t post.  So I lied.

 

In business, there is this thing called ROI.  You should, in fact, spend more money to differentiate if your differentiation delivers a return greater than investment.  That could be by way of increased occupancy, increased frequency or increased rates or spending onboard.

 

Now, I’m done with this thread snd won’t be lured back in.

Elementery marketing.    It's quite easy to claim that spending will result in  "increased occupancy, increased frequency or increased rates or spending onboard."  It's another entirely different thing to demonstrate how specific ways of spending money would result in a positive ROI. 

[cruiseny4life]

6 minutes ago, laudergayle said:

Ok…I said I wouldn’t post.  So I lied.

 

In business, there is this thing called ROI.  You should, in fact, spend more money to differentiate if your differentiation delivers a return greater than investment.  That could be by way of increased occupancy, increased frequency or increased rates or spending onboard.

 

Now, I’m done with this thread snd won’t be lured back in.

I didn't mean that I was done with this thread. I meant the post. Haha....of course then I kept on typing. Cuz, well, it's me.

 

But, thank you for your kind words earlier and isn't there an old adage, "ya gots to spend ze cash, to make ze cash." Or, something like that. Anyway - see ya on the flip! 

[MoCruiseFan]

On 2/28/2024 at 12:41 PM, JT222 said:

Hi to all

 

I’m interested in everybody’s feedback regarding NCL product these days. As a very loyal cruiser to NCL I have decided not to book with them again! Since Del Rio left there has been a MASSIVE drop in quality from food to service to entertainment.( This could also just be coincidence or result of covid debts).Is it us or are other loyalists of the same opinion? Even senior management (Katty Byrd) can not be bothered to respond to questions. 
 

The food quality has plummeted in all venues INCLUDING SPECIALITY. The Shrimp in Cagneys was cheap and crunchy. The buffet is repeated and boring to say the least, The entertainment poor. Guest services rude and miserable, Bar staff understaffed( along with many other departments) and overworked. 
 

I could go on and on but more than anything I’m so sad that this once excellent cruise line has become so poor. So are we alone in this thought or are other loyalists feeling the same? To senior management I challenge you to join me on a cruise of MY CHOICE undercover to see what your decisions have done. Enjoy the boom now but when things calm down you will suffer as people go elsewhere. 
 

I would also like to invite management to discuss their love of the environment. Selling a cruise and then changing the itinerary to save fuel is NOT done for the environment. It’s to SAVE MONEY. So sell the cruise with less stops initially so environmental lovers can book and feel so good about it!

 

Anyway, what’s all your thoughts and maybe someone will listen before the damage is not reversible.

 
Regards

 

We have been sailing NCL since about 2010 and there has been no drop in quality (massive or otherwise) that we have experienced.  We get taken care of very well on all of out cruises and have zero complaints.  Sorry that you are choosing to feel the way you do.  Hope you find some place that fits yoru vacation needs better.

[MoCruiseFan]

On 2/28/2024 at 1:23 PM, gmbhardy said:

For those of you who haven’t noticed a steep decline in the NCL cruising experience, I suggest you take your blinkers off.

 

Blinkers?

[JamieLogical]

1 minute ago, MoCruiseFan said:

 

We have been sailing NCL since about 2010 and there has been no drop in quality (massive or otherwise) that we have experienced.  We get taken care of very well on all of out cruises and have zero complaints.  Sorry that you are choosing to feel the way you do.  Hope you find some place that fits yoru vacation needs better.

 

I just don't see how this can be factually accurate. Granted, I can't speak to the product in 2010, having only begun cruising in 2018, but since I first sailed with NCL in 2018, the following changes have occurred that are just objectively reductions in service:

 

• No more towel animals
• 2 Specialty Dining credits on 7-day sailings instead of 3
• Removal of straws
• No more evening turn-down service
• No more included room service breakfast delivery
• No more late-night snack
• Fewer large production shows
• Higher daily service charges
• Fewer drinks covered in the included drinks package

 

I am sure I am forgetting some. Now, you can say that those changes don't impact you, but I don't see how anyone can possibly argue that NCL is offering the same quality of product they were offering in 2018. Are they still offering a quality of product that you are satisfied with? Maybe. That's for you to determine for yourself. But it is just an undeniable fact that they have made cuts and reductions.

[rxlowry]

13 minutes ago, JamieLogical said:

 

I just don't see how this can be factually accurate. Granted, I can't speak to the product in 2010, having only begun cruising in 2018, but since I first sailed with NCL in 2018, the following changes have occurred that are just objectively reductions in service:

 

• No more towel animals
• 2 Specialty Dining credits on 7-day sailings instead of 3
• Removal of straws
• No more evening turn-down service
• No more included room service breakfast delivery
• No more late-night snack
• Fewer large production shows
• Higher daily service charges
• Fewer drinks covered in the included drinks package

 

I am sure I am forgetting some. Now, you can say that those changes don't impact you, but I don't see how anyone can possibly argue that NCL is offering the same quality of product they were offering in 2018. Are they still offering a quality of product that you are satisfied with? Maybe. That's for you to determine for yourself. But it is just an undeniable fact that they have made cuts and reductions.

Excellent post.  If I go further back to when I started with NCL in 2007, it’s so different.  I shrugged off many changes until I just couldn’t any more. But I still visit this board hoping NCL turn somethings around. 

[JT222]

2 hours ago, cruiseny4life said:

This thread saddens me. First, simply because I can't trust NCL to provide the product I book. I've spent too much time discussing that here. 

 

But more importantly, because some folks think we "whiners" are looking for compensation or are just complaining about little things. I know that I have not demanded NCL compensate me for anything in this thread. I don't need anything from NCL. My previous vacations were fine. Actually they were great! 

And that's the issue. I had great experiences onboard NCL ships. The crew were wonderful. They provided lovely service. I learned about their lives, their families, and what motivates them through long days for months at a time. The food was (mostly) good. I enjoyed my experience in the thermal suites, on the sundecks, and in the pools. Entertainment was good, some of it being great. We went to almost all the ports we were supposed to get to. Weather caused a couple port cancellations. Bad planning, leading to port congestion, caused one cancellation. 

 

I've written a review or a live on all of my cruises onboard NCL. I think from the tenor of those posts the reader will see that while trivial matters have cropped up, the overall experience was that of a very good to great vacation. Nothing written above by those that come to these boards and constantly bash those who are disappointed or had a less than good vacation is true when it comes to my experience. And yet, they will continue to claim that, since they didn't experience something or don't care about other things, the onboard experience just cannot be degraded. And I call a whole bunch of hooey on that. All the hooey.  

 

I have this nagging feeling that if I book a cruise right now for two months from now or two years from now, I won't have such a great cruise. Throughout all these conversations I have maintained a position of being grateful for the experience I had on NCL. Now, the company has made decisions that just don't give me the confidence to know if, moving forward, I can say that I'll be grateful for the expenditure of money a NCL cruise costs. 

 

I'm not even going to list the cutbacks and there have been cutbacks, despite what a few folks continue to claim. Sorry, not sorry. 

 

I'm also sad because a few people I know through these boards are actively looking to leave NCL. Not really because they want to. The ones that don't care about NCL leave. They might leave a flaming review of horrors which we all know is untrue. But no. These people who are exploring other options are the ones who love NCL. Who enjoyed the really hard working and wonderful crew. Who get the "freestyle" life. Yet, now they are being cast aside by an immovable corporation insistent on degrading what was a great experience. And we sit here on the side writing these depressing posts, hoping that NCL isn't shooting itself in the aft. 

 

I hope not. I hope I'm wrong. And that in a year from now I'll be posting a live, sipping a capt. and coke while I watch the sun set on another glorious day onboard Norwegian V!va, Bliss, Jewel, or Getaway. Instead, I'm kind of cueing up the funeral dirge.  

 

Ok, uncue the drama. I'm done with this post for now (and I bet you were hoping I'd say bye bye). Let the bashers carry forth telling me that my opinions are wrong, because their experience is so vastly different or that I'm ignorant. I can take it - it's a cruise forum where all we do is talk about our vacations. A place where everyone can share their experiences, opinions, and adventures. I do love those lives! Just not quite so much as before.

A beautiful way of describing how I feel. 🙏 

[MoCruiseFan]

• No more towel animals
  - OH NO HOW COULD THEY - LOL a total non-issue.  Having a towel folded to resemble a fish is not going to make or break my cruise in any manner what-so-ever.
   
• 2 Specialty Dining credits on 7-day sailings instead of 3
  - This in no way impacts the quality of the food or service.
   
• Removal of straws
  - WHAT A HORRID THING TO DO! LOL (again).  Blame the tree huggers.
   
• No more evening turn-down service
  - Seriously you need soemoen to pull the sheets down on yoru bed for you to be abel to climb under the covers and get a good night's sleep?
   
• No more included room service breakfast delivery
  - Actualy you can still get continental breakfast, but we aren't tpp lazy to get out of bed to eat so a non-issue.
   
• No more late-night snack
  - O'Sheehans is open 24/7.  Go snack to your hearts content.
   
• Fewer large production shows
  - The same odl shows have been on most cruises we have been on.  Choir of Mna and Elements for example.  How many time do you want to go see the same show?
   
• Higher daily service charges
  - In 13 years almost everythng has gone up in cost, the raise in the DSC is (IMHO) minor and all but expected.
   
• Fewer drinks covered in the included drinks package
  - I don't drink.

 

I am sure I am forgetting

[JamieLogical]

7 minutes ago, MoCruiseFan said:

• No more towel animals
  - OH NO HOW COULD THEY - LOL a total non-issue.  Having a towel folded to resemble a fish is not going to make or break my cruise in any manner what-so-ever.
   
• 2 Specialty Dining credits on 7-day sailings instead of 3
  - This in no way impacts the quality of the food or service.
   
• Removal of straws
  - WHAT A HORRID THING TO DO! LOL (again).  Blame the tree huggers.
   
• No more evening turn-down service
  - Seriously you need soemoen to pull the sheets down on yoru bed for you to be abel to climb under the covers and get a good night's sleep?
   
• No more included room service breakfast delivery
  - Actualy you can still get continental breakfast, but we aren't tpp lazy to get out of bed to eat so a non-issue.
   
• No more late-night snack
  - O'Sheehans is open 24/7.  Go snack to your hearts content.
   
• Fewer large production shows
  - The same odl shows have been on most cruises we have been on.  Choir of Mna and Elements for example.  How many time do you want to go see the same show?
   
• Higher daily service charges
  - In 13 years almost everythng has gone up in cost, the raise in the DSC is (IMHO) minor and all but expected.
   
• Fewer drinks covered in the included drinks package
  - I don't drink.

 

I am sure I am forgetting

 

Like I said in my post "Now, you can say that those changes don't impact you, but I don't see how anyone can possibly argue that NCL is offering the same quality of product they were offering in 2018. Are they still offering a quality of product that you are satisfied with? Maybe. That's for you to determine for yourself."

 

Sounds to me like you are still satisfied with the quality of product they are offering, which is awesome for you! For some of us, it is no longer satisfactory, but it is clearly just factually untrue to say that it is the SAME quality of product that it was before.

 

Edited March 8 by JamieLogical

[laudergayle]

46 minutes ago, RocketMan275 said:

It's another entirely different thing to demonstrate how specific ways of spending money would result in a positive ROI. 

Since @cruiseny4life is still in…why not!

 

Do you honestly believe that major, seemingly successful, companies actually just throw money at marketing initiatives.  Not hardly.  Just as I’m certain you used many different sources of information and insight in your past career to make solid and accurate decisions, so do the branding and marketing teams.  All types of qualitative and quantitative information is analyzed to determine an estimated ROI, then tested in a controlled environment to determine probable ROI.  Elementary marketing…that’s an insult to every professional marketer.  

[PATRLR]

38 minutes ago, MoCruiseFan said:

Sorry that you are choosing to feel the way you do. 

So those of us who are identifying various decreases in quality, etc are "choosing" to do so?  Does that mean that you are choosing to ignore them?  Becuase that sure is what it seems like you are doing, which of course is fine.  

And while I know you didn't direct your comment at me, I am one of those who has been vocal about all of the decreases.  How I "feel" I haven't communicated, I can't imagine anyone cares.  However, I have said that we are trying other lines and we are continuing to sail NCL, so, that may say a bit about how we "feel".

[PATRLR]

15 minutes ago, MoCruiseFan said:

• No more towel animals
  - OH NO HOW COULD THEY - LOL a total non-issue.  Having a towel folded to resemble a fish is not going to make or break my cruise in any manner what-so-ever.
   
• 2 Specialty Dining credits on 7-day sailings instead of 3
  - This in no way impacts the quality of the food or service.
   
• Removal of straws
  - WHAT A HORRID THING TO DO! LOL (again).  Blame the tree huggers.
   
• No more evening turn-down service
  - Seriously you need soemoen to pull the sheets down on yoru bed for you to be abel to climb under the covers and get a good night's sleep?
   
• No more included room service breakfast delivery
  - Actualy you can still get continental breakfast, but we aren't tpp lazy to get out of bed to eat so a non-issue.
   
• No more late-night snack
  - O'Sheehans is open 24/7.  Go snack to your hearts content.
   
• Fewer large production shows
  - The same odl shows have been on most cruises we have been on.  Choir of Mna and Elements for example.  How many time do you want to go see the same show?
   
• Higher daily service charges
  - In 13 years almost everythng has gone up in cost, the raise in the DSC is (IMHO) minor and all but expected.
   
• Fewer drinks covered in the included drinks package
  - I don't drink.

 

I am sure I am forgetting

So despite the shortcomings that @JamieLogical listed, because you don't care about those shortcomings, you stand by your statement that the quality of the NCL product is unchanged. 

What would it take for you to acknowledge a reduction in the NCL product quality?   

[RocketMan275]

12 minutes ago, laudergayle said:

Since @cruiseny4life is still in…why not!

 

Do you honestly believe that major, seemingly successful, companies actually just throw money at marketing initiatives.  Not hardly.  Just as I’m certain you used many different sources of information and insight in your past career to make solid and accurate decisions, so do the branding and marketing teams.  All types of qualitative and quantitative information is analyzed to determine an estimated ROI, then tested in a controlled environment to determine probable ROI.  Elementary marketing…that’s an insult to every professional marketer.  

I do get the impression that throwing money is exactly the desired course of action for some.  The argument  that spending money might result in improved performance is valid.  The issue here is whether such spending is cost effective.  All I've seen here is NCL needs to spend more to improve the cruise experience.   That's like saying Burger King should make their burgers bigger.  There is no cost effectiveness analysis behind those claims.

Edited March 8 by RocketMan275

[laudergayle]

18 minutes ago, RocketMan275 said:

I do get the impression that throwing money is exactly the desired course of action for some.  The argument  that spending money might result in improved performance is valid.  The issue here is whether such spending is cost effective.  All I've seen here is NCL needs to spend more to improve the cruise experience.   That's like saying Burger King should make their burgers bigger.  There is no cost effectiveness analysis behind those claims.

But you see, you keep quoting me.  I have never once said they should haphazardly spend money.  I have said that their spending cuts (or company savings) has eroded brand loyalty and they no longer have a strong brand positioning.  I would hope that NCL has the talented teams that know how to calculate ROI and balance operational savings vs. marketing investments.  If not they need to fire and rehire.

[gmbhardy]

1 hour ago, MoCruiseFan said:

 

Blinkers?

Another word for blinders. Do you understand that!

[CWMixer]

18 minutes ago, PATRLR said:

So despite the shortcomings that @JamieLogical listed, because you don't care about those shortcomings, you stand by your statement that the quality of the NCL product is unchanged. 

What would it take for you to acknowledge a reduction in the NCL product quality?   

Apparently nothing would, yet.

Despite acknowledging 9 specific reductions in service, they stand by the statement there have been no reductions in service.

Subjectively, that’s apparently true, for their personal experience, as there’s no personal value on those 9 services.

Objectively, 9 services (that others do place value on) have been agreed as being eliminated: that is by definition a reduction.

Until/unless some area(s) that they consider valuable are removed, there will be no reduction in quality to them.

 

(on a lighter note, this argument for some reason reminds me of the “ it’s only a flesh wound” scene in Monty Python and the Holy Grail)

[justhappy]

I’ve sailed with NCL since 2015, since that time I’ve not seen a big reduction in quality, but have seen a marked difference in value for my money, even accounting for inflation. 
At this time I’m giving NCL the benefit of the doubt that some reductions in services and product offerings are to help with debt reduction efforts.

What remains to be seen is if these items and services are reinstated after the debts are reduced to pre covid levels.

At that time I’ll decide whether to continue cruising with NCL or not.

 

[gmbhardy]

54 minutes ago, MoCruiseFan said:

 

• Fewer drinks covered in the included drinks package
  - I don't drink.

 

 

My father gave me some sage advice when I was growing up - never trust anyone who doesn’t drink. Amen.

[Distinctive-Destinations]

1 hour ago, MoCruiseFan said:

• No more towel animals
  - OH NO HOW COULD THEY - LOL a total non-issue.  Having a towel folded to resemble a fish is not going to make or break my cruise in any manner what-so-ever.

I think I actually might prefer not having towel animals. They’re just in the way, and seeing a towel animal makes me think that I am paying for towel animals.

 

Edited March 8 by Distinctive-Destinations

[JamieLogical]

"NCL has made no reductions in quality" and "NCL's cuts have not impacted my experience" are two very different statements. One could be subjectively true, but the other is objectively false. That is my point.

[ChiCruzr]

What I wonder is how a lack of towel animals constitutes a "reduction in service"?  Towel animals are not a service.

[JamieLogical]

3 minutes ago, ChiCruzr said:

What I wonder is how a lack of towel animals constitutes a "reduction in service"?  Towel animals are not a service.

 

What were they then? An amenity? A perk? An amusement? Whatever you want to call them, they are no longer offered. I honestly couldn't care less, though my husband would set them up in cute little scenes of them drinking our free prosecco and playing poker for when I came back from the casino. Clearly, they were not a necessity for most of us, but they were a feature that was once offered and is no longer.

[JamieLogical]

4 minutes ago, JamieLogical said:

 

What were they then? An amenity? A perk? An amusement? Whatever you want to call them, they are no longer offered. I honestly couldn't care less, though my husband would set them up in cute little scenes of them drinking our free prosecco and playing poker for when I came back from the casino. Clearly, they were not a necessity for most of us, but they were a feature that was once offered and is no longer.

 

 

[laudergayle]

21 minutes ago, JamieLogical said:

were a feature that was once offered

Feature…that’s a great word.  A feature of cruising… and an “unexpected” surprise.  Love you DHs humor.

 

Edited March 9 by laudergayle