Celebrity in Hot Water - Edge sailed too close to Kauai’s NaPali Coast

[NMTraveller]

[yogini06]

9 minutes ago, NMTraveller said:

State investigating amid reports cruise ship sailed too close to Kauai’s Na Pali Coast (hawaiinewsnow.com)

 

It is rather obvious why they were sending sand all over the floor.  I see a sand bar to the rear right of the ship.  Am I the only one who sees the ship in shallow water?

 

Previous reports said the reflection on the right is reflection from the helicopter windshield 

[NMTraveller]

14 minutes ago, yogini06 said:

Previous reports said the reflection on the right is reflection from the helicopter windshield 

OK.  Then they were just very shallow...

[NMTraveller]

35 minutes ago, yogini06 said:

Previous reports said the reflection on the right is reflection from the helicopter windshield 

The top one looks like a reflection perhaps ...  The one below it looks like a sandbar ...  The bottom one really does not look like a helicopter.

 

Much closer to an accident than I originally imagined...

Edited May 4 by NMTraveller

[msolok]

30 minutes ago, NMTraveller said:

58 minutes ago, yogini06 said:

Previous reports said the reflection on the right is reflection from the helicopter windshield 

The top one looks like a reflection perhaps ...  The one below it looks like a sandbar ...  The bottom one really does not look like a helicopter

 

The stuff at the bottom of the image above is 100% a reflection on glass. Even a little bit of a zoom in shows that.

 

Not saying that there wasn't churned up sand, but that picture 100% isn't showing it, only blue water and a reflection.

[NMTraveller]

OK.  Now I see 2 reflections.  Or a second one.  Still way way to close to the sandbar.

[NMTraveller]

1 minute ago, msolok said:

 

The stuff at the bottom of the image above is 100% a reflection on glass. Even a little bit of a zoom in shows that.

 

Not saying that there wasn't churned up sand, but that picture 100% isn't showing it, only blue water and a reflection.

The sandbar is brown.  The one/two reflections are transparent ...

[markeb]

15 minutes ago, NMTraveller said:

The sandbar is brown.  The one/two reflections are transparent ...

If you look really closely, you can see Bigfoot and the Loch Ness Monster carving out square edges ending in a curved end of that tan sandbar….

Edited May 4 by markeb

[Cap_D]

Having watched a number of the Captain Kate videos where she talks up the bridge crew, the coverage of the bridge, etc. it seems inexplicable that the route and all other movements of the ship were not consciously made, and couldn't be questioned by a crew member (although I'm skeptical that the bridge crew would actually challenge the captain given how they are placed on a pedestal)*.  The reports of the flip comment from the Captain in the theater make this more disturbing since at that point he shouldn't be performing on stage as part of the evening entertainment.  

 

*Many of the bridge crew on Beyond seem quite inexperienced as feature in Captain Kate's videos.  Wonder how much experience is present on Edge.

Edited May 4 by Cap_D

[NMTraveller]

🤣

47 minutes ago, markeb said:

If you look really closely, you can see Bigfoot and the Loch Ness Monster carving out square edges ending in a curved end of that tan sandbar….

The square edges are of the reflection above.  But the sandbar does look a bit like a marlin with a curved beak.

 

I hope that y'all are looking at the picture on a large (32") high res (4k) monitor and not on your phones...  Otherwise it is a Roshak test...

 

You do notice that the front and rear propulsion are moving it from left to right on the screen.  If it goes straight across it will hit part of the sandbar...

Edited May 4 by NMTraveller

[Dancing Shoes]

This is why many people in Hawaii don't want big ships.  Geeze, they use to tender in Lahaina.  Only small snorkel vessels should be there!!

[NMTraveller]

1 hour ago, msolok said:

 

The stuff at the bottom of the image above is 100% a reflection on glass. Even a little bit of a zoom in shows that.

 

Not saying that there wasn't churned up sand, but that picture 100% isn't showing it, only blue water and a reflection.

The picture is a point in the video before they got closer to the sand bar.  You can tell from the picture that they are moving left to right on the screen with the propulsion.

 

If I get bored this weekend I will find out how close they came.

Edited May 4 by NMTraveller

[Georgia_Peaches]

3 hours ago, cruisetonowhere10 said:

And regardless of who is at fault, the captain is in charge and pending an investigation should be removed.  At the end of the investigation you reinstate if warranted. 

Remove first, then investigate?  🤔 

[Mr. Click]

2 hours ago, NMTraveller said:

Yes they were too close but this picture is misleading. It was made with a telphoto lens and that will compress the look. It makes the ship look shorter and closer to the shore. The aerial images give a better perspective on the distance.

[NMTraveller]

16 minutes ago, Mr. Click said:

Yes they were too close but this picture is misleading. It was made with a telphoto lens and that will compress the look. It makes the ship look shorter and closer to the shore. The aerial images give a better perspective on the distance.

The problem is that the fishing vessels and smaller ships were the ones in deeper water.  Most likely where the photo was taken from.  

[Mr. Click]

Just now, NMTraveller said:

The problem is that the fishing vessels and smaller ships were the ones in deeper water.  Most likely where the photo was taken from.  

That is all well and good but the point I am trying to make is that use of a telephoto lens will make things appear closer, more compressed than they really are. 

[NMTraveller]

1 minute ago, Mr. Click said:

That is all well and good but the point I am trying to make is that use of a telephoto lens will make things appear closer, more compressed than they really are. 

Take a look at the overhead picture...  That tells how flipping close they came ...

[Mr. Click]

24 minutes ago, NMTraveller said:

Take a look at the overhead picture...  That tells how flipping close they came ...

I saw, I said they were close. My only point about the picture I quoted was it is misleading because of the lens optics. 

[NMTraveller]

19 minutes ago, Mr. Click said:

I saw, I said they were close. My only point about the picture I quoted was it is misleading because of the lens optics. 

The point that they had smaller vessels all around the ship,  just goes to show what the hey?  Why the heck is a big a$$ cruise ship on the beach less than a ship length away?

 

If this is normal,  I will sign up.  But this seems like the muff up where they just missed an accident.

 

My recollection is that when they are in unmarked or shallow water that a tug boat will guide them in?  What am I missing?

 

They are more than 2000 foot inshore more than they are supposed to be.

 

The fact that the smaller ships are in deeper water to avoid the big a$$ cruise ship is idiocy...

 

They are in much much much closer than most of my tenders.

Edited May 4 by NMTraveller

[markeb]

1 hour ago, NMTraveller said:

🤣

The square edges are of the reflection above.  But the sandbar does look a bit like a marlin with a curved beak.

 

I hope that y'all are looking at the picture on a large (32") high res (4k) monitor and not on your phones...  Otherwise it is a Roshak test...

 

You do notice that the front and rear propulsion are moving it from left to right on the screen.  If it goes straight across it will hit part of the sandbar...

 

It's a 67 KB file in an open source format known to be highly compressed. If you blow it up, you just get even less detail and more grain. On my 32 inch monitor it's already losing detail at the posted resolution, which is 980 x 1305. Gets worse if I try to go full screen. Unless someone has the original, uncompressed photo, what you see on the web is what you get. But that's clearly not a sandbar. Looks much more like a window seat on a helicopter reflected in a window.

 

Not that I think that matters. They're somewhere they shouldn't be. Not directly because of navigable depth. They stir up the seabed all the time, but usually in harbors where that's expected. And there are photos (without the ship, as I recall) that clearly show the seabed stirred up. Regardless of depth they shouldn't have been there, and they shouldn't have been disturbing the seabed. 

 

Almost all of the photography I've seen distorts size and distance. Sometimes badly. And much, like the one overhead oblique shot with reflections from the helicopter, were taken with pretty poor quality equipment and compressed even more to post on the internet. I'm not sure why anyone would pay for a helicopter tour of the islands to just take bad iPhone photos...

[NMTraveller]

23 minutes ago, markeb said:

 

It's a 67 KB file in an open source format known to be highly compressed. If you blow it up, you just get even less detail and more grain. On my 32 inch monitor it's already losing detail at the posted resolution, which is 980 x 1305. Gets worse if I try to go full screen. Unless someone has the original, uncompressed photo, what you see on the web is what you get. But that's clearly not a sandbar. Looks much more like a window seat on a helicopter reflected in a window.

 

Not that I think that matters. They're somewhere they shouldn't be. Not directly because of navigable depth. They stir up the seabed all the time, but usually in harbors where that's expected. And there are photos (without the ship, as I recall) that clearly show the seabed stirred up. Regardless of depth they shouldn't have been there, and they shouldn't have been disturbing the seabed. 

 

Almost all of the photography I've seen distorts size and distance. Sometimes badly. And much, like the one overhead oblique shot with reflections from the helicopter, were taken with pretty poor quality equipment and compressed even more to post on the internet. I'm not sure why anyone would pay for a helicopter tour of the islands to just take bad iPhone photos...

So your point is that they were more than a ships length from shore and hitting the rock?  LOL  

Low res or high res they were closer than that.

 

So who is sitting on that window seat with the brown Marlin onboard with the curved bill?  Why is the sandbar a foot or two underwater?  Reflections do not show that characteristic ...

 

A reflection is a single layer.  The picture shows two or more layers...

Edited May 4 by NMTraveller

[NMTraveller]

One more shot..

 

[Mr. Click]

YES, THE SHIP WAS WAY TO CLOSE TO SHORE, YES, THEY WERE WHERE THEY WERE NOT SUPPOSED TO BE. I AM NOT ARGUING THAT POINT.  I WAS SIMPLY POINTING OUT THAT THE ONE PICTURE WAS NOT REALLY TELLING THE STORY BEAUSE OF LONG LENS COMPRESSION.

 

I worked as a photographer for close to 50 years, I owned small boats for about 15 of those years...just an fyi.  Oh, the only way I go up in a helicopter is if the doors are off or these is a window to open.  Whey take a few thousand dollars worth of camera gear to shoot through plexiglass?

[markeb]

14 minutes ago, NMTraveller said:

One more shot..

 

 

Same photo, same resolution. They're too close to shore, and I'm not an expert on interpreting overhead photography. The original article alleged 1000 feet. That's possible, but the distance will be distorted by the angle. Blowing up a 67 KB photo that appears to have been chosen because the original poster didn't have or didn't want to use any data isn't going to give you a better view. Apparently some of the recent Android phones use this as a file format. Or that's what Hawaii News Now uses on their web page. They should probably expect a subpoena from the investigators and maybe they actually have a real photo that can be examined. I'm assuming it hasn't been manipulated.

 

Those are reflections. They all follow the same curvature. The one "closest" to the ship actually overlaps the stern, so it's clearly not underwater. The tan has an unnaturally precise shape, and again, since it's on the same curvature as the other artifacts, it's a reflection of a manmade object. Almost certainly on the helicopter. It actually could be a human hand on a controller; that may be a thumb. Someone somewhere has pictures of the interior of tourist helicopters in Hawaii that will match that look; the helos I've flown in, long ago, had open doors and jump seats. 

 

But yes, they're too close to shore. And they may have damaged the sea floor. I'm far more interested in how it happened and how to prevent it in the future.

 

[jelayne]

5 hours ago, NMTraveller said:

Still less than a ship's length from the shore when they did the turn around .

I was there, we were never within a ships length of shore from our view.