Economy finally affecting luxury cruises???

[Wendy The Wanderer]

I would venture to say that lots of Regent cruisers are boomers or slightly older, and are contemplating retirement and their pensions and investments. These people are not recession-proof, au contraire; many will be being fairly cautious right now. I am definitely in this category.

[ERParadise]

With regard to the economy, normally the early stages of a downturn effect the lower income levels. I'm not sure there is much impact at the higher incomes as of yet.

 

Who owns Regent Cruise Line?

 

So far it doesn't seem that prices or incentives have increased that would reflect a lower level of bookings.

 

Steve

[Travelcat2]

First, "Bklynbill" -- why am I surprised that you live in Bellingham (your "name" does a great job of hiding your location:)). Yes, the restaurant industry in northwest WA is having stuggles (we frequent restaurants on an almost daily basis). It would seem that cruise lines also have to consider whether to continue to raise prices or cut back somehow.

 

None of want to pay more for less. . . it does not seem possible to keep prices down while expenses go up. The bath product change on Regent is certainly not a big deal -- I used that reference because it was the only change I observed on the boards last week. Since starting this thread, I did read about the menu change in Compass Rose.

 

People in the U.K. are still paying rather high prices -- especially in London (will have to tell my DH that there is a new mayor of his hometown). We don't see our friends or relatives traveling more (or less). Having offices in the U.K. and Australia as well as the U.S./Canada would cover a lot of bases for marketing cruises.

 

At what point do people decide not to take a a cruise (a few people on these boards already have)? Regent raised prices considerably in the past year -- yet, the Mariner will be full when we are on board in 11 days (but, whose counting:-) I will be looking for changes on our sailing -- not something we typically do, just curious. The majority of passengers will be from CA -- one of the hardest hit in terms of the housing slump, foreclosures (except the OC, of course!)

[Kissing Seahorses]

I wonder if the change away from Aveda products had more to do with the Ownership change than the economy. Aveda and the former owner - Carlson, are both Minnesota based companies, that may have been the connection and the new owners didn't have the same relationship or had different suppliers that they had relationships with.

[Leejnd4]

I would venture to say that lots of Regent cruisers are boomers or slightly older, and are contemplating retirement and their pensions and investments. These people are not recession-proof, au contraire; many will be being fairly cautious right now. I am definitely in this category.

Wendy I'm in the same category, although we're not looking at retirement any time soon (we're more in the boomer category). We are DEFINITELY not insulated from the recession. My observation was based more on the fact that I've noticed at least a couple posters on this board who evidently are not suffering any personal impact from the recent economic downturn...and thus seem to think that there IS none.

 

My personal reaction to the downturn in the economy is to try to pay less for my cruises - hence my switching from a Silversea cruise to a similar (but WAY less expensive) Celebrity cruise. I am well aware that it won't be in the same class, but oh well...financially I just can't justify the additional cost of the luxury cruise lines. ESPECIALLY when I keep reading about the luxury lines doing their own cost-cutting, thereby bringing that cruise experience just that much closer to the non-luxury cruise lines, to the point where I'm not seeing enough value in the huge price gap. But then we've kinda talked that subject to death in here. ;) But in any case, I am one more former luxury cruise pax who is taking a relative step down in my cruises, primarily BECAUSE of the current economic situation.

[Wendy The Wanderer]

Lee-Anne, I'm a boomer too, but I'm at the head of the boom, and my husband beat it by several years. Not retiring, although I may be changing careers. I absolutely agree with you. We are looking at travelling less (especially since my employment situation is shaky right now), travelling closer to home, and going to cheaper places. Land trips may supplant cruises, since we don't actually like to travel first class when we do land trips. We'll just find places that are cheaper--Portugal, Eastern Europe, Turkey, who knows? Of course, we have that "last" fling on the PG coming up next winter. And I *will* try Oceania soon, but I think would rather travel by land that do a mass market cruise, but I understand with your mother you don't have that option.

[Iamboatman]

I look at simple things to see how the economy is going. It is not only how far out people book their cruises (some luxury bookings are well into 2010, but more modest lines are generally earlier in 2009), but how hard is it to get a reservation on a Saturday night at a popular restaurant (was impossible, now easy) or simply "luxury items" like deck wash. Home Depot doesn't even carry larger sizes of deck wash, or any variety in brands, any more. Reason: People are just not spending money on unimportant "beauty" items and Home Depot needs to keep its inventory costs down. All is not well, but it is not a disaster.

 

Example, there is a significant vacation home value drop in the Lake Tahoe, California area. However, there are actually very few foreclosures. People are paying their bills, but they are not shelling out the bucks like they used to. Possibly they are taking a Regent cruise instead (a nice luxury with a smaller price tag...and the ability to walk away with no further expenses when its over).

[Bklynbill]

First, "Bklynbill" -- why am I surprised that you live in Bellingham (your "name" does a great job of hiding your location:)).

I was born and more than partially raised in Brooklyn. My fiance and I chose B'ham for the quality of life two years ago (we love it). Have fun on the Mariner! (we're both very jealous)! -Bill

[Leejnd4]

And I *will* try Oceania soon, but I think would rather travel by land that do a mass market cruise, but I understand with your mother you don't have that option.

 

LOL it's not that I don't HAVE the option of land trips with Mom - it's just that if I want to avoid strangling her to death in a foreign land, it's best if we take cruises! ;) We did have a great time on our recent Hong Kong/Bali land-based trip, but I swore by the end of that trip that we will be sticking with cruises going forward. I guess in the current economy, ya gotta pick the lesser of the evils. And rotting in a foreign prison for matricide sounds worse than dealing with those mass-market-cruise indignities. :p

 

I'm kidding of course - but in all seriousness, we COULD afford to do some pretty first-class land-based trips. But we're choosing the "premium" cruise instead, because of our strong preference for cruising. I would much prefer to go on Regent...but at today's prices, that option's been ruled out. :(

[canadagal]

I keep asking myself more and more is it value for the money. With so many price increases over the past year it's becoming less and less value for the money IMO and reaching my threshold for what I find good value. As so many others have said, I can always go someone less for a land vacation. As far as cruises being booked well into 2010.....that may be so. It's easy to book something 18 months or more out but the big test is when final payment comes. That's when I want to see the numbers of how many ships are sailing full.

Pat

[Travelcat2]

ERParadise -- Regent was purchased by Apollo (Prestige Cruise Holdings) in 2008 (this is how Regent refers to them in their Q&A's).

 

I mentioned foreclosures because it made the front pages of our little newspaper last week. Wish I could quote it (cannot find the article). It did say, in part, that although the state (CA) as a whole does not have the most foreclosures in the country, some cities are the highest in the U.S. Also read that (and I'm paraphrasing) The number of California homes lost to foreclosure in the first quarter of 2008 surged 327% as compared to first quarter 2007 levels. An average of 500 homes foreclose per day.

 

One reason we are currently staying with luxury cruising is the cost of land vacations. Before our vacation to Puerto Vallarta, Mexico last month I was researching luxury all-inclusives. Several were in the $1,000-$1,500 range (this includes Cabo San Lucas). We stayed at a 4 star resort for the "bargain"(?) price of $450/night. Maui (1997) was $500/night at a mediocre Marriott (not all-inclusive). Yes -- this is less expensive than luxury cruising -- just unsure how to weigh one against the other.

 

Some air travel is now almost as much as a cruise -- $13,000 for two round trip to Istanbul or Santiago. . . (Business Class -- also checked First Class to Singapore -- $23,000 for two). Guess I'm finding the new "reality" daunting.

[surfklutz]

Paint Horse -

have to agree with you - I think much of it is "talking down" the economy - which naturally comes with an election year. Everyone is promising to fix things - and it is much more compelling when you can convince people that everything badly needs to be fixed.

Anyone who lived through the Carter years has to be thinking that this is a cakewalk.

I have not altered my travel plans at all based on the economy. I hate paying what we do for gas here is Florida - but I complain, and I fill up and I don't alter anything else that I do. I complain more, but that is the only thing that has changed.

By the way - it seems as all the economic shows yesterday - no matter what the station, indicated that the US might have bottomed out and things are on the way up.

[Iamboatman]

Warren Buffett said yesterday that recessions do not play a part in his investment strategies because he looks at the long term. I think that even the cruise lines look at things similarly. The problem for the passengers is that many cannot afford to look long term for their pleasures as they need to be sure that they have enough to enjoy those pleasures in future years. For many in the luxury market a slow down or recession it isn't going to change a thing, but for another "many" it already has.

 

Along that line, I think we all would agree that if we sat with someone on a cruise that spent their time telling us how great they have if financially we probably would be turned off, regardless if we were in better, worse or the same shape. I'm just not sure why of late there are more posts about an individual's wealth rather than simply the ability to cruise...or not. I don't think it is because it is an election year, though.

[Leejnd4]

Along that line, I think we all would agree that if we sat with someone on a cruise that spent their time telling us how great they have if financially we probably would be turned off, regardless if we were in better, worse or the same shape. I'm just not sure why of late there are more posts about an individual's wealth rather than simply the ability to cruise...or not. I don't think it is because it is an election year, though.

 

BAHAHAHA!!! Eric, I HAVE sat with that cruiser! And yup, it was pretty painful. Seriously, haven't people heard that pretentious braggadocio about one's personal riches is considered crass and unpleasant?

 

I don't really understand the people who seem intent on denying that there is a slowing of the US economy. I'm not an economist so I'm not going to even try going toe-to-toe with anyone on specifics, but one can't deny the basic raw data. Perhaps the media plays a role,, certainly the election does...but that doesn't change the reality that many Americans are faced with. And I can guarantee you Host Dan and I are not the only luxury cruise lovers who are changing our travel plans based on current economic realities.

 

I do hope the economy has bottomed out. And I REALLY hope the dollar makes a comback in the next year - before I have to head to Europe for my Med cruise!

[Travelcat2]

I'm not sure how this thread became political. . . Whether the economy is really poor, or, if we just perceive it that way, it affects the way most people plan their lives.

 

Unless I missed something (very possible), no one on this thread was talking about how much money they do or do not have. In fact, I am learning how others are reacting (or not) to the economy. What is important to one person isn't to another. I know people who earn barely above minimum wage and drive a new Lexus -- not sure how they do it. There are wealthy movie stars that drive a Prius. Most posters on Regent, Silversea or Seabourn enjoy luxury cruising -- this doesn't necessarily mean that the people are old, young, rich......

 

The "baby boomer" talk does make me smile -- this generation seems to be a huge part of the population (1946 - ?????). As we age, will the world be ready for us? Hmmm, now I've gotten myself off topic. I could be incorrect, but, it seems that the majority of luxury cruisers are from this generation. We're more or less very active, risk takers. . . . I'm glad that I'm not the only one pausing to think of what effect, if any, all of this has on our future plans (cruising or otherwise).

 

Think I'll go out and get a $6 loaf of bread. . . . .:confused:

[newlondon]

Travelcat, Istanbul--$13k--I don't understand that. DW and I are going Boston-Istanbul Bus. Class in mid Sept. early Oct. for $8k combined. Must be a great TA. Also doing the Venice-Istanbul Regent cruise.

[DavidJ]

Paint Horse -

Anyone who lived through the Carter years has to be thinking that this is a cakewalk.

.

 

I think the families of the 150,000 troops in Iraq would take GREAT EXCEPTION to that statement!

[quepaquete]

Has anybody watched the David Walker video?? Here....

 

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/03/01/60minutes/main2528226.shtml

[Leejnd4]

I'm not sure how this thread became political. . . Whether the economy is really poor, or, if we just perceive it that way, it affects the way most people plan their lives. [/Quote]

 

I'm not sure it became "political" as such...it's simply been talk of the economy, not political beliefs. I haven't seen anyone mention who they're voting for, anway! I don't know if I would call differences of opinion about whether or not we are currently experiencing an economic downturn "political"...and hey, the topic of this thread is whether or not the economy is affecting luxury cruises, so it's inevitable that you'll see lots of posts talking about...the economy! :)

 

Unless I missed something (very possible), no one on this thread was talking about how much money they do or do not have. [/Quote]

 

Oh, there's been a bit of that around here lately. Not just in this thread, tho, for sure. Sorry, but when people start posting that the economy can't be all bad because they personally are paying this many millions for real estate...and others talk about not batting an eyelash over dropping $2500 on a bottle of champagne...it's kinda hard to suppress the eye-rolling. ;)

 

I could be incorrect, but, it seems that the majority of luxury cruisers are from this generation. We're more or less very active, risk takers. . . . I'm glad that I'm not the only one pausing to think of what effect, if any, all of this has on our future plans (cruising or otherwise). [/Quote]

 

I imagine most luxury cruisers do fall in this demographic, for understandable reasons: first, we've had the decades to work up to a financial position to be able to afford this (we certainly couldn't as a young couple just starting out!). Second, a large percentage of younger pax want (or need) to vacation with their kids, and luxury cruises generally aren't geared for kids. Third, the younger people who CAN afford these cruises, in many cases probably don't WANT to, because they know that most of the folks they're going to find on them will be....US! :D

 

And I too am glad to know I'm not the only person who's concerns for the economy have impacted my travel plans. Although I do seem to be one of the few in here who thinks that the answer is to try a mass-market line! :eek: (And I'm not even sure myself...)

[Host Dan]

Well said LeeAnne! (and for the record, I am a baby boomer, 2 months shy of being a generation x'r - last year 1964)

 

Host Dan

[BILLP1]

We were on the Mariner for twelve days in April and we met a lot of people at the pool and the lounges. Not one person menioned the economy or shampoo. The only line that I waited on was to book our next Regent cruise.

[Leejnd4]

Thanks Host Dan!

 

Well Bill, I'll tell you what - I don't know about you, but when I'm on vacation I try not to talk (or think) about depressing things like an economic downturn. I worry more about that in the planning stages...when trying to decide whether or not I can afford to go! :)

[JunPOA]

:D

 

I imagine most luxury cruisers do fall in this demographic, for understandable reasons: first, we've had the decades to work up to a financial position to be able to afford this (we certainly couldn't as a young couple just starting out!). Second, a large percentage of younger pax want (or need) to vacation with their kids, and luxury cruises generally aren't geared for kids. Third, the younger people who CAN afford these cruises, in many cases probably don't WANT to, because they know that most of the folks they're going to find on them will be....US! :D

Yes - we're in that demographic segment with you LeeAnn - 1957 for me-do the math.

 

And I too am glad to know I'm not the only person who's concerns for the economy have impacted my travel plans. Although I do seem to be one of the few in here who thinks that the answer is to try a mass-market line! :eek: (And I'm not even sure myself...)

NO - U R not alone LeeAnn - As I stated recently - we're pretty set and are planning our budget for a 2009 Mediterraen cruise - the question that remains is which cruiseline? I am concerned about the rising airfares to Eurpoe for 2009. While my heart & emotions say "Luxury & romance"" the brain & purse are telling me to stay grounded, to remember the purpose of the trip is location & it is port driven. So 1st narrow my choices down by itinerary among my favorite lines (Regent, SS, HAL, etc) then by means of elimination the list is next further narrowed down by price. Then it becomes a no-brainer.

Our last two cruises with the adult children have been mucho $$ (Galapagos/Macchu Picchu DEC '07)and this month Alaska/Denali cruise tour on Cruise West. Certainly NOT luxury - with the DH in his 60's I am trying to please him by priroritizing locations we MUST see before we die or become nursing home candidates:eek: (sorry I know that sounds morbid).

 

So for 2009, the directive has already come down it will ONLY be the Med. cruise and any other vacations wil be in our Florida or Quebec ski vacation homes - I'm sorry I know I do not have your pity BUT we make NO $$ on these homes and pay high RE taxes out the you know what! Now if we could both just retire and have more time to see the workld in "luxury" - that would really be the life. We bought these properties planning for our snow-bird days.:)

 

LeeAnn - Please keep me posted on what you eventually choose for your next cruise purchase and you & I will continue to "clip coupons".:D

[JunPOA]

Sorry folks - I need to learn how to master the multiple quote reply function - please be patient with me.:o

[Travelcat2]

Travelcat, Istanbul--$13k--I don't understand that. DW and I are going Boston-Istanbul Bus. Class in mid Sept. early Oct. for $8k combined. Must be a great TA. Also doing the Venice-Istanbul Regent cruise.

 

Your pricing is very good. Actually, our October cruise includes Business Class air fare. I was checking it to determine which airline Regent would probably use from Seattle (guessed Luftansa -- probably misspelled). Airfare is not included in our February '09 cruise. I think the high prices are partly due to the three "legs" of the trip. We go from Seattle to Santiago -- then Sydney to Seattle. We actually came up with "multi-city" airfare (Business Class) of $30,000. Quite over the top. Not sure -- but, it's possible that fares to Istanbul are higher from the west coast!