Time to stop single passenger supplements

I don't know about this. The Norwegian Epic studio rooms for solos are not my cup of tea. They're loud and tiny. I go on the ships to relax whereas most solo rooms seem built for someone out to party out and do nothing but sleep in.

Have you stayed in one?

Two friends have done them, neither one is a partyer and neither indicated others were party animals either. Don't know about one but the other would take one again in a heartbeat.

Yes, the studio cabins are tiny but I see post after post from people in regular cabins saying all they do is shower and sleep in the cabin.:D

Have you stayed in one?

 

Two friends have done them, neither one is a partyer and neither indicated others were party animals either. Don't know about one but the other would take one again in a heartbeat.

 

Yes, the studio cabins are tiny but I see post after post from people in regular cabins saying all they do is shower and sleep in the cabin.:D

Do any of those solo cabins have at least a very small verandah? I could be happy with verandah just big enough for one chair in which I could read and get fresh air. I don't need a big space but I need 'air'.

Do any of those solo cabins have at least a very small verandah? I could be happy with verandah just big enough for one chair in which I could read and get fresh air. I don't need a big space but I need 'air'.

 

I haven't seen one yet with a veranda; NCL solo cabins are all insiders. I also would love a "single" veranda studio - it's quite annoying to have to pay for the "whole" studio. Give me a twin bed, a bathroom, and a veranda for one chair and I'd be a very happy cruiser. The cruise line could take a few "regular" suite rooms, divide that footage into 2 "studios". It would be hard to retrofit due to plumbing, but a new build could do it...

Do any of those solo cabins have at least a very small verandah? I could be happy with verandah just big enough for one chair in which I could read and get fresh air. I don't need a big space but I need 'air'.

 

The newer Royal ships (All Quantum class and Harmony Oasis class and new builds) have/ will have studio cabins with balconies. In fact I think megacruiser stayed in one on his recent Anthem of the Seas sailing.

Link to Megacruisers review, pics of studio cabin with balcony on page 2:

http://boards.cruisecritic.co.uk/showthread.php?t=2207428&page=2#

Actually hotels already have different prices. Double rooms at most hotels cost more than a single room. Usually its just $10-20 more for a double so maybe that should be the reduced price for anyone just wanting a single bed on a cruise ship.

I have not seen this. Most of the hotels I have booked, either here in the US or in other countries, charge the same amount for a room whether it has a single king size bed or two twin size beds. Both arrangements are clearly intended for double occupancy, and typically both arrangements are in the same sized room. What I did see on our Asia vacation in February were a few hotels hotels that offered two beds, but only made them available in a larger room, usually at least 30 sq feet larger. In these cases, you are paying for a few dollars more for a larger room, not the amount of people it can sleep. Either size room still was capable of double occupancy, regardless of the arrangement of the beds.

I have not seen this. Most of the hotels I have booked, either here in the US or in other countries, charge the same amount for a room whether it has a single king size bed or two twin size beds. Both arrangements are clearly intended for double occupancy, and typically both arrangements are in the same sized room. What I did see on our Asia vacation in February were a few hotels hotels that offered two beds, but only made them available in a larger room, usually at least 30 sq feet larger. In these cases, you are paying for a few dollars more for a larger room, not the amount of people it can sleep. Either size room still was capable of double occupancy, regardless of the arrangement of the beds.

Go to a travel website and look at the price of a king bed versus 2 queen beds and there will be a slightly higher price most the time for the double. At least that's the case here in the Midwest and in Vegas.

HAL new build currently under construction at Fincantieri Boat Yard in Italy will have solo cabins but I am unclear if they will be insides or possibly have verandahs. I tend to doubt they'll be a balcony but certainly will check it out. I'm also interested the pricing. No way I would take an inside cabin, No cruise is worth that to me.

I have stayed in the solo rooms three times and I am not a party person. The rooms are very small but perfect for one person. There is so much to do on a cruise that one is never in one's room.

Go to a travel website and look at the price of a king bed versus 2 queen beds and there will be a slightly higher price most the time for the double. At least that's the case here in the Midwest and in Vegas.

You also need to look at the total square footage for these rooms. The "double" is almost always in a larger room. Plus, I doubt that the two beds are queen size. Most likely, they are double sized beds, often called a "twin". All the hotels I have stayed at in Vegas, including the Venetian, Paris and Ceasar's Palace, had twin beds in the rooms I booked, not two queens. But, that could be because I stay in the standard rooms and not the luxury rooms.

You also need to look at the total square footage for these rooms. The "double" is almost always in a larger room. Plus, I doubt that the two beds are queen size. Most likely, they are double sized beds, often called a "twin". All the hotels I have stayed at in Vegas, including the Venetian, Paris and Ceasar's Palace, had twin beds in the rooms I booked, not two queens. But, that could be because I stay in the standard rooms and not the luxury rooms.

Stayed at Hard Rock in Vegas this past January. Their rooms are 1 king or 2 queens. Minimum room size on both is 460 sq ft on a deluxe room. Price for single can be $39 per night whereas the price for the double on the same night is $55.

Mandalay also is 1 king or 2 queens 550 sq ft on both options.

Mirage is also 1 king or 2 queens with room size on both being 371 sq ft.

Paris website lists an option of 1 king or 2 queens with both options at 390 sq ft.

The Caesar's room are a choice between a king or two doubles.

It is VERY UNFAIR that lone travellers have to pay hefty supplements to travel alone.

 

It is about time the travel industry, especially cruise lines did away with this very unfair supplement.

 

Whi agrees with me?

Both NCL and RCCL and most river cruises agree with you and have cabins for single travelers. I'm sure this will spread to other cruise lines in the near future as these cabins have been very successful.

Stayed at Hard Rock in Vegas this past January. Their rooms are 1 king or 2 queens. Minimum room size on both is 460 sq ft on a deluxe room. Price for single can be $39 per night whereas the price for the double on the same night is $55.

 

Mandalay also is 1 king or 2 queens 550 sq ft on both options.

 

Mirage is also 1 king or 2 queens with room size on both being 371 sq ft.

 

Paris website lists an option of 1 king or 2 queens with both options at 390 sq ft.

 

The Caesar's room are a choice between a king or two doubles.

Vegas gives away hotel rooms for other reasons. This doesn't happen in other cities.

Both NCL and RCCL and most river cruises agree with you and have cabins for single travelers. I'm sure this will spread to other cruise lines in the near future as these cabins have been very successful.

I think you are right - with the evolving demographic of retired/reliring baby-boomers having the resources and the time as well (sadly) as many of them being widowed former partners - who still want to cruise and have the resources, there will likely be an expansion of single cabins. While not all of NCL's innovations appeal to everyone, they have a good idea in this area.

I think that there's no reason for charging solos double, other than the cruise line can......and that's fine and fair in the sense that it's a discretionary product, no one needs it, and they can charge what the market will bear. I don't buy any of the BS that says it's fair from a utility standpoint (i.e. solos cost the cruise line as much as two passengers), but it's fair for the operator of a vacation property to charge what they can and make a profit if they can.

I personally won't pay double (i.e. a 100% supplement) to cruise - I don't want any cruise I've seen badly enough to do that. I don't believe it's fair practically, even though I think it's fair as a business model, and I don't like being treated like I'm a burden or a undesirable guest who has to pay extra to come to the party. They don't need solo passengers when they can sell two tickets instead. While it's true that solos generally spend more on board than a person traveling as part of a pair or group, there's still space at the bar/lounge/etc that could be filled if they'd sold two tickets instead of that one.

I don't like not being wanted by most cruise lines just because I'm traveling solo, but that's the way it is. They think they're doing me a favour by offering me more expensive inside cabins, but I see that as an insult, not a favour.

It's one of the reasons I discovered Crystal cruises, and I'm very happy paying a 30% supplement for my window cabin.

I think you are right - with the evolving demographic of retired/reliring baby-boomers having the resources and the time as well (sadly) as many of them being widowed former partners - who still want to cruise and have the resources, there will likely be an expansion of single cabins. While not all of NCL's innovations appeal to everyone, they have a good idea in this area.

RCCL is even added balcony cabins with the Quantums' Super Studio Ocean View. I expect these will be very successful and other cruise lines will follow suit.

http://www.royalcaribbean.com/findacruise/cabinclass/cabinTypes/cabinType/cabin/home.do?br=R&cabincls=B&cabinType=UB&shipCode=QN

HAL new build currently under construction at Fincantieri Boat Yard in Italy will have solo cabins but I am unclear if they will be insides or possibly have verandahs. I tend to doubt they'll be a balcony but certainly will check it out. I'm also interested the pricing. No way I would take an inside cabin, No cruise is worth that to me.

 

They are outside cabins (at least the ones I looked at), so not inside -- but no verandah.

I have not seen this. Most of the hotels I have booked, either here in the US or in other countries, charge the same amount for a room whether it has a single king size bed or two twin size beds. Both arrangements are clearly intended for double occupancy, and typically both arrangements are in the same sized room. What I did see on our Asia vacation in February were a few hotels hotels that offered two beds, but only made them available in a larger room, usually at least 30 sq feet larger. In these cases, you are paying for a few dollars more for a larger room, not the amount of people it can sleep. Either size room still was capable of double occupancy, regardless of the arrangement of the beds.

Many, many European hotels have solo rooms. (One bed, tiny room). They also will often offer a discount on a standard double room for single use. It's not much, but it's a discount.

Earlier post indicates that capacity averages 104%... went on to explain that that 'extra' 4% is third/fourth person in a cabin.

Who is that third/fourth? Probably kids... who spend nothing in the bars, casino, gift shop or fancy dining -- which is where the real profit for the cruise line is.

Kids are often free in hotels, because the hotel doesn't count on them to provide any additional revenue. Here, each pax is 'expected' (in the profitability formulas) to contribute.

Eliminating single supplements would require an increase in the average fare for all pax... a ship booked at 100% earns XXX$ in revenue. Fewer pax to produce that revenue means each pays more somewhere.

Cruiselines will accept the loss of the handful of solos who don't want to pay a supplement in exchange for meeting projected revenue goals... every day of the week.

Earlier post indicates that capacity averages 104%... went on to explain that that 'extra' 4% is third/fourth person in a cabin.

 

Who is that third/fourth? Probably kids... who spend nothing in the bars, casino, gift shop or fancy dining -- which is where the real profit for the cruise line is.

True kids don't spend much around the ship except maybe for drinks. I don't know about the bigger ships with all the bells and whistles if there are extra charges also. However, kids do provide income from shore excursions and maybe parents spending more money buying pictures.

True kids don't spend much around the ship except maybe for drinks. I don't know about the bigger ships with all the bells and whistles if there are extra charges also. However, kids do provide income from shore excursions and maybe parents spending more money buying pictures.

Kids Clubs on the ships are pricey. All space on a ship is precious and the square footage used for kids clubs takes from other money making possibilities. The crew/councilors must add a decent amount to the payroll costs as well as for room and board.

Kids Clubs on the ships are pricey. All space on a ship is precious and the square footage used for kids clubs takes from other money making possibilities. The crew/councilors must add a decent amount to the payroll costs as well as for room and board.

 

Absolutely, but think of kids clubs as a loss leader just like when supermarkets sell milk at or below cost just to get customers in the store to sell them lots of other stuff. And we all know those young parent cruisers can turn into long term cruisers who will buy lots of booze and gamble in the casino in future years. Or perhaps even on the same cruise, later on in the evening after the kiddies are in bed. ;)

Absolutely, but think of kids clubs as a loss leader just like when supermarkets sell milk at or below cost just to get customers in the store to sell them lots of other stuff. And we all know those young parent cruisers can turn into long term cruisers who will buy lots of booze and gamble in the casino in future years. Or perhaps even on the same cruise, later on in the evening after the kiddies are in bed. ;)

Sure, that is true for some.

But for some others, there are four of them in an inside cabin, they drink iced tea/coffee/water, use their cameras to get what photos they want, don't book excursions, don't buy in the shops, no gambling and no art auctions........ :)

It's so hard to generalize about any group. All are different in their own ways.

Sure, that is true for some.

But for some others, there are four of them in an inside cabin, they drink iced tea/coffee/water, use their cameras to get what photos they want, don't book excursions, don't buy in the shops, no gambling and no art auctions........ :)

 

It's so hard to generalize about any group. All are different in their own ways.

 

I don't think cruise lines mind getting four fares from a inside cabin. It would sure beat one an inside cabin if that passenger were paying no supplement. I suppose having kids in kids clubs allows adults to do adult activities and many times that involves spending money.

What don't you see? If they lowered the single supplement by just $1, they would lose that $1.

 

The bigger loss would come from having just one person in a cabin that could hold two, and that one person spends what one person spends on a cruise instead of having two people each spending what one person spends -- and such on board spending is where the big profits are.

 

Every cabin sold to a single passenger is a cabin that cannot be sold to two passengers -- and it makes no difference that some other cabins might hold three: that one cabin sold to a single passenger generates less revenue.

 

Of course, if just before sailing date there were many unsold cabins, the line would cut fares - but the fact is that with their pricing models the lines are pretty good at selling all their cabins.

Every cabin sold to two passengers is a cabin that can't be sold to four passengers. So by your logic, there should be a double supplement as well. :D

Sure, that is true for some.

But for some others, there are four of them in an inside cabin, they drink iced tea/coffee/water, use their cameras to get what photos they want, don't book excursions, don't buy in the shops, no gambling and no art auctions........ :)

 

It's so hard to generalize about any group. All are different in their own ways.

 

That was us. We tipped our stateroom attendant a little extra, but otherwise, didn't spend a dime on board! We aren't drinkers and heard the specialty restaurants aren't worth it.