Tipping

[cruisemainiac]

Next time I don't get off the ship at a port I'm going to ask for my port charges refunded. Why should I get charged if I don't use that port????

[gerapau]

When we cruised for the first time this past December we first thought that the service charge ($48 a day for our family in one room) was a bit steep. After looking into it though, and realizing that it really does end up taking the place of a major portion of the base salary of these employees as well as their tip, we were more than happy to make the payment (and add a bit on top).

 

That said, this really is only a way for the cruise lines to be able to advertise prices that are lower than the real price. It's sort of like what the cell phone companies used to do around here (and may still do). They would all advertise some great monthly rate but when you read the small print you would find that they all had some sort of hidden fee (in addition to the taxes) that wasn't included in their advertised price. So the $19.99 monthly fee ended up costing closer to $30. None of the cell companies wanted to get rid of the fee and include it in their advertised prices because that would mean that their advertised price would be greater than the other providers.

 

The cruise lines' service fees are more or less the same thing. A hidden (at least not shown in the advertised price) fee that helps keep their advertised prices lower by keeping the fee seperate. It would appear much more honest if they just included the fee in their advertised prices.

[SteveH2508]

Next time I don't get off the ship at a port I'm going to ask for my port charges refunded. Why should I get charged if I don't use that port????

 

So they will leave you outside the port in a small boat (if you're lucky!) whilst the rest go into port? ...:rolleyes:

[newmexicoNita]

Who are "we"??

 

We, as in those of us who live in America and the Caribbean. Of course there are those who do not beleive in tipping, and I will be the first (well not the first) to say they are cheap. We have customs that most of us follow. For those who do not want to follow them, no one will change their minds. But you and I know very well who "we" are. Of course it may not apply to you, many things I have noticed do not.

 

Nita

[Dancer Bob]

As gerapau points out, it's sleazy, but lots of companies besides cruise lines do it. How about the .9 cents fuel companies charge? Anyway, since there are no all-inclusive cruises, you have to read the fine print, to estimate what your final bill will be.

 

One topic that hasn't been mentioned much is the US dollar exchange rate- in the past few years, employees who send money home in other currencies have taken in effect a huge pay cut.

[newmexicoNita]

As gerapau points out, it's sleazy, but lots of companies besides cruise lines do it. How about the .9 cents fuel companies charge? Anyway, since there are no all-inclusive cruises, you have to read the fine print, to estimate what your final bill will be.

 

One topic that hasn't been mentioned much is the US dollar exchange rate- in the past few years, employees who send money home in other currencies have taken in effect a huge pay cut.

 

Many, if not all the restaurants in Florida add an 18% gratuity to all orders. That shocked the heck out of us and the only way we knew it was in small print at the bottlom of the meun. This had nothing to do with the size of the party I will add. Our daughter, who lives in Orlando says it has to do with many who do not beleive in tipping. The Bahama have had a 15% service charge on everything, food, drinks, resorts for years and they do not make it public knowledge prior to vacationing. Many hotels are now adding what they call a resort tax. Let's face it, we are going to have to accept this and stop this contant "but I don't want to pay it" attitude.

 

Nita

[mavin]

Nita, I am a Brit and I will never understand either. Service charges and tipping waiters, bar staff cabbies is normal here so why do so many of my fellow countrymen make me feel so ashamed?

 

Last summer on our Baltic cruise on the Sun I met some Brits in Stockholm from our sailing and they were shocked that I had no intention of removing our service charges and also giving extra to a few folks on board. Apparently they were doing it because the food wasn't as good as when they sailed Celebrity... Made me sour for the last 2 days and I still get angry about it now. In fact I would really prefer not to meet any Brits when I am cruising from now on as I have met too many whiners and cheapskates after 5 cruises.

you miss the point.its not the amount of the tip but i want to set my own tip and not have norwegian set it for me.

[sparks1093]

you miss the point.its not the amount of the tip but i want to set my own tip and not have norwegian set it for me.

 

Again, like it or not this is the way NCL does it. If you don't like it don't take it out on the staff. Really stick to NCL and cruise with a different line;).

[Traveller20074]

you miss the point.its not the amount of the tip but i want to set my own tip and not have norwegian set it for me.

 

But, if it's cheaper than what it would be if I tipped at a restaurant...then, I'm good with them setting it cheaper LOL

[newmexicoNita]

you miss the point.its not the amount of the tip but i want to set my own tip and not have norwegian set it for me.

 

Well, normally when I read something like this, I will question whether or not the person really does decide to tip accordingly, but more important, this isn't just NCLs policy it has become the policy on many lines. On RCI and Celeberity now, it is mandatory to pay up front prior to even sailing if you choose flex dining.

 

If you feel so strongly go to the reception desk, explain how you feel and every penny you decide to give to crew members will still go into the pool.

 

You have a few options here, get over what you want to do and follow the policy, go to reception and play on their sympathy or just simply find a cruise line that still has the old fashion way of tipping.

 

Nita

[TPEINC1958]

you miss the point.its not the amount of the tip but i want to set my own tip and not have norwegian set it for me.

 

That is why they call it a service charge. It is not a tip.

[Elcruzer]

IMHO the reason why most cruiselines have added the automatic "service" charge is that too many people did not tip and not only non Americans I am sad to say. That is why you saw so many empty seats on the last night of the cruise, the cheapskates did not want to face the people who had faithfully served them but they were going to stiff them:mad:. I think the lines should all agree to just add on the service charge as they do port charges and taxes and not let people opt out of them. If they have a legit complaint, they should address it at the front desk to have it resolved.

[newmexicoNita]

IMHO the reason why most cruiselines have added the automatic "service" charge is that too many people did not tip and not only non Americans I am sad to say. That is why you saw so many empty seats on the last night of the cruise, the cheapskates did not want to face the people who had faithfully served them but they were going to stiff them:mad:. I think the lines should all agree to just add on the service charge as they do port charges and taxes and not let people opt out of them. If they have a legit complaint, they should address it at the front desk to have it resolved.

 

you are right, on our very first cruise our waiter was probably the best we ever had, he had our table of 6, a table of 4 and a table or either 4 or 6 middle aged women. The last night, the table of women did not show up for dinner, they didn't even show for breakfast the final morning. We knew, as did he, why and we felt so bad. He was from Tiaway I beleive and hadn't been home for 8 months. At home he had a wife and twin daughters nine years old.

 

Nita

[tincup74]

I am kinda afraid to make my first post in this tipping thread... With that said... I am 29 and just booked my first cruise...

 

Will be a honeymoon...

 

I have read every post in this thread and have not once seen what TIPS stands for.....

 

"To Insure Proper Service"

 

I was at first surprised about the xtra tip fee... All it is in my view point is a way for the powers that be can pass along more xpense to the consumer.

 

Now I have no idea what it cost them to operate. But all this is IMO is passing on expense to the consumer... I understand we would end up paying for it anyway if it was other ways.... But it is just passing on expense...

 

There is fundamentally different views in this thread... Some do not believe in tipping... Some might just be Cheap... Age comes into play... Heritage... Life experiences... etc...

 

At best all someone could really argue is something along the lines of "Everyone could agree the RIGHT thing to do is pay the tip fee" Some will even have issues with that...

 

In MY perfect world I would like an All Inclusive option... And the Tip fee built in... and the option to tip someone who did good and it not go into a pool... If someone makes his job easier he should pass on the love...

 

So.....After thought... (very little) I will pay the tip fee... With the realization of what it really is... And tip for above and beyond type attitudes...

 

With all that said... If I have a bad xperience or someone is lackadaisical about service because they know they have the tip (fee) already then I will not hesitate to remove their portion... And no I do not think that is contradictory to my fee attitude... The way I see it is if im paying a portion of their salary.. Then they better do their job... If you work in a "Customer Service" oriented field, and provide bad customer service... Thats one fired duck... or atleast in this case one under tipped cruise worker who might realize to not take stuff for granted...

 

Peace out and happy cruising :)

 

ogh btw... NCL Spirit ::: Nov. 27th '11

 

Guess I need to figure out how to put that in my sig

[smeyer418]

I am kinda afraid to make my first post in this tipping thread... With that said... I am 29 and just booked my first cruise...

 

Will be a honeymoon...

 

I have read every post in this thread and have not once seen what TIPS stands for.....

 

"To Insure Proper Service"

 

I was at first surprised about the xtra tip fee... All it is in my view point is a way for the powers that be can pass along more xpense to the consumer.

 

Now I have no idea what it cost them to operate. But all this is IMO is passing on expense to the consumer... I understand we would end up paying for it anyway if it was other ways.... But it is just passing on expense...

 

There is fundamentally different views in this thread... Some do not believe in tipping... Some might just be Cheap... Age comes into play... Heritage... Life experiences... etc...

 

At best all someone could really argue is something along the lines of "Everyone could agree the RIGHT thing to do is pay the tip fee" Some will even have issues with that...

 

In MY perfect world I would like an All Inclusive option... And the Tip fee built in... and the option to tip someone who did good and it not go into a pool... If someone makes his job easier he should pass on the love...

 

So.....After thought... (very little) I will pay the tip fee... With the realization of what it really is... And tip for above and beyond type attitudes...

 

With all that said... If I have a bad xperience or someone is lackadaisical about service because they know they have the tip (fee) already then I will not hesitate to remove their portion... And no I do not think that is contradictory to my fee attitude... The way I see it is if im paying a portion of their salary.. Then they better do their job... If you work in a "Customer Service" oriented field, and provide bad customer service... Thats one fired duck... or atleast in this case one under tipped cruise worker who might realize to not take stuff for granted...

 

Peace out and happy cruising :)

 

ogh btw... NCL Spirit ::: Nov. 27th '11

 

Guess I need to figure out how to put that in my sig

 

 

Welcome to cruise critic....

 

hope you enjoy it really.

 

Tips meaning to insure promptness is an urban legend.

see wikipedia. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tip_%28gratuity%29

 

and whether its in the fare or a mandatory service charge or a tip its the consumer who pays it anyway.

 

Most times when people reduce tips it has nothing to do with service(I didn't like the steak or the bad was too hard) but also no one says, or at least I don't that you shouldn't complain about poor service...and reduce it if it doesn't meet a minimum standard. But again most people who reduce it or want to leave less really don't have a service complaint...mostly...

 

but isn't what you describe as the perfect world

 

"In MY perfect world I would like an All Inclusive option... And the Tip fee built in." isn't that what the DSC does. It just doesn't mean that you have to pay it before hand. and if it was included in the fare and you got poor service how would you be able to adjust it?

 

Think about that....

 

BTW there are reasons is not just included in the fare. Most countries tax the fare(its small in the US its only a quarter of 1%), the TA's and the cruise companies have agreed on what is not commisionable and the included tip IS commissionable and the cruise lines don't want to open those negotiations again for a number of reasons...so be careful what you ask for it may cost YOU more to do the same thing,....

 

and welcome to cc again...

[Micchi]

I am kinda afraid to make my first post in this tipping thread... With that said... I am 29 and just booked my first cruise...

 

Will be a honeymoon...

 

I have read every post in this thread and have not once seen what TIPS stands for.....

 

"To Insure Proper Service"

 

I was at first surprised about the xtra tip fee... All it is in my view point is a way for the powers that be can pass along more xpense to the consumer.

 

Now I have no idea what it cost them to operate. But all this is IMO is passing on expense to the consumer... I understand we would end up paying for it anyway if it was other ways.... But it is just passing on expense...

 

There is fundamentally different views in this thread... Some do not believe in tipping... Some might just be Cheap... Age comes into play... Heritage... Life experiences... etc...

 

At best all someone could really argue is something along the lines of "Everyone could agree the RIGHT thing to do is pay the tip fee" Some will even have issues with that...

 

In MY perfect world I would like an All Inclusive option... And the Tip fee built in... and the option to tip someone who did good and it not go into a pool... If someone makes his job easier he should pass on the love...

 

So.....After thought... (very little) I will pay the tip fee... With the realization of what it really is... And tip for above and beyond type attitudes...

 

With all that said... If I have a bad xperience or someone is lackadaisical about service because they know they have the tip (fee) already then I will not hesitate to remove their portion... And no I do not think that is contradictory to my fee attitude... The way I see it is if im paying a portion of their salary.. Then they better do their job... If you work in a "Customer Service" oriented field, and provide bad customer service... Thats one fired duck... or atleast in this case one under tipped cruise worker who might realize to not take stuff for granted...

 

Peace out and happy cruising :)

 

ogh btw... NCL Spirit ::: Nov. 27th '11

 

Guess I need to figure out how to put that in my sig

 

I will never understand why people think "tips" stands for To Insure Proper Service. That's not even a grammatically correct phrase. It would be correct if ENSURE was used, not INSURE, but either way it's a backronym.

 

Also, you cannot remove one person's portion. If you lower your DSC, you're stiffing everyone.

[Anjjmum0294]

"Also, you cannot remove one person's portion. If you lower your DSC, you're stiffing everyone."

__________________

Then perhaps the others getting stiffed should have a little talk with the reason why they are? I agree that its much cheaper this way than if I paid individually, however, my money is not to be given away "just because". I intend to leave on the charges, but if there is a reason to, it will be coming off. It is not my job to supplement everyone else whom I may or may not have seens paychecks, nor will I keep quiet because someone who had nothing to do with me directly may get less of a tip. I'm sorry they get paid so poorly, but that is a hazard of the job they took, and i'm sure NCL was very upfront with the wages they were getting when they signed on. I would not tip a waitress at my local restuarant if the service was poor regardless of the fact they pool their tips, so why should I do it here? Because they miss their families? Again, that is sad, and I feel for them on that note, but I also agree that is a foregone conclusion when they took the job. I give money for services that deserve it, not sympathy. However, if they deserve more, they will definately get more, and I will see to it that NCL is properly notified that they were deserving of additional notice by the line as well. Just as i'm sure they will have no problem reporting me if I am a particularly troublesome passenger.

[sdmike]

If you can't, or won't, pay the daily service charge pick a different vacation. If you have problem with any staff or services on the ship, please go report the situation at the guest service desk so they can rectify it.

[vwgolf]

Not sure what the rules in the US are, but in England it was once common practice for employers to count tips given in restaurants (other than those given direct to the staff concerned) as part of the minimum wage. This practice has either been outlawed, or will soon be outlawed, but it does show that some unscrupulous bosses will do anything to avoid paying their employees a decent wage.

 

I'm not suggesting that this is NCL's policy, but are we getting to the stage where people will work for nothing and all of their income derives from customer tips? Will the next stage be that these people will be classed as self employed, lose their employment rights and even pay a percentage of their tips over to the kind people who allow them to work on their premises? Where will it end???

[newmexicoNita]

Not sure what the rules in the US are, but in England it was once common practice for employers to count tips given in restaurants (other than those given direct to the staff concerned) as part of the minimum wage. This practice has either been outlawed, or will soon be outlawed, but it does show that some unscrupulous bosses will do anything to avoid paying their employees a decent wage.

 

I'm not suggesting that this is NCL's policy, but are we getting to the stage where people will work for nothing and all of their income derives from customer tips? Will the next stage be that these people will be classed as self employed, lose their employment rights and even pay a percentage of their tips over to the kind people who allow them to work on their premises? Where will it end???

 

There probably is no cut and dry rule as the ships are not registered in the USA. That being said, it still boils down to: whether the company pays more and increases prices to cover the difference or we continue the tipping policy, we will pay one way or the other.

 

Nita

[sparks1093]

Not sure what the rules in the US are, but in England it was once common practice for employers to count tips given in restaurants (other than those given direct to the staff concerned) as part of the minimum wage. This practice has either been outlawed, or will soon be outlawed, but it does show that some unscrupulous bosses will do anything to avoid paying their employees a decent wage.

 

I'm not suggesting that this is NCL's policy, but are we getting to the stage where people will work for nothing and all of their income derives from customer tips? Will the next stage be that these people will be classed as self employed, lose their employment rights and even pay a percentage of their tips over to the kind people who allow them to work on their premises? Where will it end???

 

As stated the US laws don't apply to cruise ships (except NCL's POA) but the general law in the states allows employers to pay tipped employees a smaller hourly wage as long as that plus the tips equals at least the minimum wage.

 

And remember, while we may turn up our nose at what cruise ship employees make seen in their terms, based on what they would be able to make in their home country, they are making much more than they could at home.

[smeyer418]

"Also, you cannot remove one person's portion. If you lower your DSC, you're stiffing everyone."

__________________

Then perhaps the others getting stiffed should have a little talk with the reason why they are? I agree that its much cheaper this way than if I paid individually, however, my money is not to be given away "just because". I intend to leave on the charges, but if there is a reason to, it will be coming off. It is not my job to supplement everyone else whom I may or may not have seens paychecks, nor will I keep quiet because someone who had nothing to do with me directly may get less of a tip. I'm sorry they get paid so poorly, but that is a hazard of the job they took, and i'm sure NCL was very upfront with the wages they were getting when they signed on. I would not tip a waitress at my local restuarant if the service was poor regardless of the fact they pool their tips, so why should I do it here? Because they miss their families? Again, that is sad, and I feel for them on that note, but I also agree that is a foregone conclusion when they took the job. I give money for services that deserve it, not sympathy. However, if they deserve more, they will definately get more, and I will see to it that NCL is properly notified that they were deserving of additional notice by the line as well. Just as i'm sure they will have no problem reporting me if I am a particularly troublesome passenger.

 

 

They do! especially the room stewards. If anyone removes the auto-tip a list is circulated. The one they definitely know is the room steward who WILL be asked what the problem was. In many cases the room steward will "return" cash to the pool....even when the passenger has left none to "prove" that they had done a good job and were tipped for it in cash(the money comes from other passengers who have left on the dsc and have tipped in cash additionally). Room stewards who have passengers consistently take off the DSC risk downgrading to poorer assignments, non renewal or firing.

the best way to deal with a poor employee is to complain or leave a negative style card. Taking the DSC off and then giving money to those you find deserving just makes it much harder for the deserving as they are required(on non NCL America ships) to turn in ALL the cash if the DSC is removed no matter how much it is...and yes they mostly turn it in(see my posting above).

If you find someone who has worked over and above leave a positive style card. Promotions, DAYS OFF( a real treat for an employee) and other perks get doled out based on positive style cards....and if you want some extra cash...

[vwgolf]

the general law in the states allows employers to pay tipped employees a smaller hourly wage as long as that plus the tips equals at least the minimum wage.

 

 

That was the case here but is, thankfully, changing!

[Traveller20074]

That is why they call it a service charge. It is not a tip.

 

semantics. I still consider it a tip :D or why would they say on the Norwegian site that tipping is not necessary unless you want to tip for exceptional service? :)

[sparks1093]

That was the case here but is, thankfully, changing!

 

So someone who is making $50k a year in tips would be happy to work for minimum wage?