More evidence HAL likes new passengers better!

[iancal]

Most businesses that I have worked with have at least two specific goals.

 

Keep the customers that you do have and increase their annual spending with you.

 

Grow the base, attract new customers who become regulars. Your base can contract as easily as it can grow or remain constant.

 

So the trick is to reward your loyal customers with incentives, price advantages, while at the same time attract new customers.

 

I don't see much in the way of this at HAL. The Mariner loyalty program, is well, uninteresting.

It appears that one of the other benefits of the program is that loyal customers get to pay more than newbies from time to time for identical cabins. Not good.

 

At the same time I cannot see HAL doing much to attract new, younger cruisers who will eventually become loyal customers.

 

We do like HAL, but from a business perspective I see them treading water and in some cases sailing backwards

 

Heck, HAL has trouble fielding reasonable on board entertainment let alone all the other things that new cruisers are looking for. Signature of Excellence is just a little bit overused and much overrated depending on the ship and itinerary that one selects. We certainly do not see any significant difference between HAL and a number of other cruise lines in terms of service, food, and quality of the environment. You can only 'trade' on your past for so long without making positive changes otherwise your competitors will pass you by.

[cruz chic]

Most businesses that I have worked with have at least two specific goals.

 

Keep the customers that you do have and increase their annual spending with you.

 

Grow the base, attract new customers who become regulars. Your base can contract as easily as it can grow or remain constant.

 

So the trick is to reward your loyal customers with incentives, price advantages, while at the same time attract new customers.

 

I don't see much in the way of this at HAL. The Mariner loyalty program, is well, uninteresting.

It appears that one of the other benefits of the program is that loyal customers get to pay more than newbies from time to time for identical cabins. Not good.

 

At the same time I cannot see HAL doing much to attract new, younger cruisers who will eventually become loyal customers.

 

We do like HAL, but from a business perspective I see them treading water and in some cases sailing backwards

 

Heck, HAL has trouble fielding reasonable on board entertainment let alone all the other things that new cruisers are looking for. Signature of Excellence is just a little bit overused and much overrated depending on the ship and itinerary that one selects. We certainly do not see any significant difference between HAL and a number of other cruise lines in terms of service, food, and quality of the environment. You can only 'trade' on your past for so long without making positive changes otherwise your competitors will pass you by.

Agree with most of what you are saying. It seems like some folks on here think it's perfectly ok to treat your regular customers like yesterdays garbage and roll out the carpet for the newbies. I just don't understand that reasoning. Hal needs to attact new customers but you still need to keep the "old" ones happy.

[cruz chic]

I think this is about the 4th or 5th cruise line I've heard that makes that claim.

No kidding:). Would love to see some real numbers.

[sail7seas]

Most businesses that I have worked with have at least two specific goals.

 

Keep the customers that you do have and increase their annual spending with you.

 

Grow the base, attract new customers who become regulars. Your base can contract as easily as it can grow or remain constant.

 

So the trick is to reward your loyal customers with incentives, price advantages, while at the same time attract new customers.

 

I don't see much in the way of this at HAL. The Mariner loyalty program, is well, uninteresting.

It appears that one of the other benefits of the program is that loyal customers get to pay more than newbies from time to time for identical cabins. Not good.

 

At the same time I cannot see HAL doing much to attract new, younger cruisers who will eventually become loyal customers.

 

We do like HAL, but from a business perspective I see them treading water and in some cases sailing backwards

 

Heck, HAL has trouble fielding reasonable on board entertainment let alone all the other things that new cruisers are looking for. Signature of Excellence is just a little bit overused and much overrated depending on the ship and itinerary that one selects. We certainly do not see any significant difference between HAL and a number of other cruise lines in terms of service, food, and quality of the environment. You can only 'trade' on your past for so long without making positive changes otherwise your competitors will pass you by.

 

 

What doesn't seem to be considered here is today's generation does not look at loyalty the way their elders do/did.

 

It was VERY common for folks in the previous generations to take a job when they finished school and stay with 'the company' for their whole career. If the job treated them well and the employee was 'good', it was close to expected they would work their whole life at that job and retire from there.

 

Today, it is very different. It is sometimes looked at as a lack of ambition if someone stays at the same job for 'too many' years.

 

Loyalty is perceived very differently in today's world.

Few large (and not so large) companies give loyalty to their workers or customers these days and few workers or customers give loyalty to any 'brand'. Today's society does just what pleases them at the moment and rarely settles onto one brand for anything. Yes, I acknowledge there are always exceptions and will not generalize and say 'all' fit this description.

 

Rather than tell a company how they should be doing business and trying to direct their methods and manners, move on to a company that suits you better. If the company is not 'loyal' to you in any which way you expect, no big deal. You aren't loyal to them either. Each can go their own way.

 

 

I am making no judgment which way is better IF one way actually is better than the other.

 

My only 'judgement' would be that a company should respect and value the customer's loyalty...... they cannot expect it and can only hope for it.

 

The newest group of cruisers are never going to be loyal to any cruise line in the way their parents and grandparents may have been. They jump from cruise line to cruise line, deal/bargain/steal to best price possible. They can leave a ship perfectly happy and satisfied they got value for their money and no serious complaints with the whole experience and book their next cruise on the competing cruise line. ;)

 

Look around your life/kids' lives/community and evaluate if you think loyalty is a common trait these days.

 

JMO....

 

[smoothsailors]

:rolleyes: Just an interesting observation on HAL's marketing strategy: we'd cruised often with HAL but had not sailed with them since 2006. During these past 7 years we received constant mail and at least twice-weekly eblasts about flash sales and special mariner pricing. In May we booked 23-nights in an SA on the Eurodam for March 2014...no special pricing or OBC offered, but the dates/itinerary worked for us and we were able to obtain reward business-class flights 10 months out. Since then we've noticed that we haven't had one mailing or e-mail from HAL...coincidence or assumption that they already have us...hmmm?

[iancal]

'Hoping' for loyalty is not enough.

 

You have to earn the loyalty of your customers-day in and day out.

 

It is very hard to earn loyalty, it is far easier to loose it.

 

We are only loyal to any for profit service or product provider to the extent that they continue to provide goods, services, and customer service that we value at a price that is competitive.

 

I have been a member of an airline points reward plan for some time. But I do not fly on that airline when the prices are higher than the competition. Same for my hotel rewards plans.

 

If at some point we perceive that we are no longer getting value or that the goods and services are no longer competitive we switch suppliers.

 

I do not think that this notion has changed substantially over the years. The challenge to this is keeping abreast of the market, the other suppliers, and the products and services that they provide. Why pay more if you perceive the product or service to be the same?

[sail7seas]

Maybe, just maybe they understand the new world better than we give them credit.......

 

They don't even hope for loyalty. I'm not sure any cruise company realistically can expect the loyal cruiser as has been present in the near past. Those days are gone. IMO If they get loyalty, they'd call it an added, unexpected bonus. I don't think they are looking for your loyalty and they do not expect to get it.

 

They need to provide the best product they can for the least amount of money as people are not willing to pay more to get a better product....... for the most part. (Yes, there are exceptions.)

 

The cruise companies know the vast majority are buying cruises mostly by price, some by itinerary, a little by past good experience.

 

[Jade13]

 

I don't see much in the way of this at HAL. The Mariner loyalty program, is well, uninteresting.

 

It appears that one of the other benefits of the program is that loyal customers get to pay more than newbies from time to time for identical cabins. Not good.

 

At the same time I cannot see HAL doing much to attract new, younger cruisers who will eventually become loyal customers.

 

Signature of Excellence is just a little bit overused and much overrated depending on the ship and itinerary that one selects .

 

They certainly do not put any money into upgrading the gyms on the older ships which have old outdated equipment and carpet. My DH thinks it is because the older clientele does not care about the gym, and HAL is not trying to attract younger passengers.

[iancal]

We do not buy cruises that way even though we try several different cruise lines.

 

We buy based on past experiences, expectations, price, itinerary, and above all ship. DW has a predisposition at the moment towards Celebrity. That certainly did not prevent us from making a Princess decision on our next cruise. We viewed the product, service,ship etc. as similar.

 

We are much more concerned with perceived value than we are with price. Loyalty does not play any part in our decision.

 

The price delta was 30 percent so guess what...Princess won our business. It could have just as easily been HAL. Not so sure had it been Costa, Pulmantur, or Thomson even if the price was lower since we have never been on these lines and the reviews are mixed.

 

We are loyal to a degree. But that loyalty quickly disappears when the like for like price delta exceeds ten percent or a (to us) significant money difference.

[sail7seas]

 

 

<snip>

 

 

We are loyal to a degree. But that loyalty quickly disappears when the like for like price delta exceeds ten percent or a (to us) significant money difference.

 

 

 

THAT is my point.

You are loyal to price first like most others these days.

NOTHING wrong with that but HAL knows it. They do not expect your loyalty and certainly not for the reasons the few generations ahead of you were loyal to HAL.

 

It is a new $$ world with todays new cruisers.

The cruisers of yesterday did not put price as the first or even second priority. They put service, comfort of ship, itinerary, quality of food, entertainment, lectures, excursions and the like ahead of the price. They could afford to do that. Cruising was not then accessible to many as it is today.

 

Again, I am not saying it is better or worse....... I am saying different.

 

Your statement I quoted is a large part of the loyalty/lack of loyalty story.

 

[iancal]

Absolutely. We are hardly going to be loyal to a HAL, or a Princess, or a Celebrity, or whatever if we perceive all three to be similar if the price difference, at time of booking, is 30 percent or more....as it actually was on 3 of our Med cruises over the past two years.

[navybankerteacher]

The problem with focusing on loyalty program freebies is that it is simply an indirect way of focusing on price. There are certain lines I will not sail because I do not like what they offer -- even if they are cheaper than others. Similarly, there are certain lines I prefer, even if they might be a little more expensive. You may not always get what you pay for - but you wil be even less likely to get something you do not pay for.

 

Sure, I'd like to get a lower out of pocket cruise - but it has to be one I want -- so I will continue to sail a line whose product I prefer, even though it may be a bit more costly -- and it makes absolutely no difference to me if the cost is due to just plain sticker price, or lack of loyalty freebies; many of which could not interest me in any case.

[cruz chic]

They certainly do not put any money into upgrading the gyms on the older ships which have old outdated equipment and carpet. My DH thinks it is because the older clientele does not care about the gym, and HAL is not trying to attract younger passengers.

You've got that right. I've got a better eliptical at home then they have had on any of the ships I've been on lately.

[Christine Frances]

I guess I am "loyal" to Celebrity because Celebrity "rewards" me nicely for cruising with them. When considering another cruise line I have to factor in the cost of 3 hrs free internet, 60 items of free laundry and then the appreciated amenities such as an Elite Lounge from 5-7 every evening with free drinks and appetizers and the enjoyable Elite Breakfast in a Specialty restaurant with smoked salmon, meats, pastries, fruit, smoothies along with Cappuccinos, Espresso, Mimosa's and Bloody Mary's. Really makes it hard for us to go with another line - we have been happy with the itineraries so far but when we can't find what we want we will then have to make a decision. It will be hard to not be "appreciated" lol

[Kenito]

I guess I am "loyal" to Celebrity because Celebrity "rewards" me nicely for cruising with them. When considering another cruise line I have to factor in the cost of 3 hrs free internet, 60 items of free laundry and then the appreciated amenities such as an Elite Lounge from 5-7 every evening with free drinks and appetizers and the enjoyable Elite Breakfast in a Specialty restaurant with smoked salmon, meats, pastries, fruit, smoothies along with Cappuccinos, Espresso, Mimosa's and Bloody Mary's. Really makes it hard for us to go with another line - we have been happy with the itineraries so far but when we can't find what we want we will then have to make a decision. It will be hard to not be "appreciated" lol

 

You make good points... and that's why we all have our favorites.

 

I've never cruised Celebrity... mostly because in the past few years I've been getting back into cruising, it has been easy to be port and itinerary driven... and that has lead me to other lines. I haven't given the others a chance, and my taste has been honed on the value lines.

 

But since I haven't had the perks you receive on Celebrity, I have not really had a problem using my smart phone and finding available wifi while on shore enjoying a drink or cup of coffee... room service brings me my smoked salmon, etc., while I 'wake up' in the morning... and from 5-7 I'm usually getting ready for dinner, and being ready earlier would cut into my day hours. If your perks were available to me, I'd certainly enjoy them, but not if I had to give up cruising as often as I'd like. It's not a perk if you don't use it.

 

There are no absolutes, or 'right' or 'wrong' with all of this... we each have our preferences, budgets, and expectations. Seems to me the cruise lines offer a lot of options for us to explore... not to take advantage of us. At least, not any more than if I buy different sizes of soda at the fast food restaurant, and don't blame them for not giving me more.

[Christine Frances]

I totally agree with you that there is no "right or wrong". I was just trying to point out that Celebrity does try to show appreciation for my business and it does influence my decision to look at them first when choosing a cruise..

[All aboard??]

I am sure the cruise lines monitor these boards; who knows maybe from our active discussion on this they may just bring about more tangible and benefits :)

[Hlitner]

I totally agree with you that there is no "right or wrong". I was just trying to point out that Celebrity does try to show appreciation for my business and it does influence my decision to look at them first when choosing a cruise..

 

Christine, We totally agree with you. Celebrity really treats its Elites very well, and the provided amenities can be worth a substantial amount of money. DW and I will sometimes have a Bellini and/or Bloody Mary at the Elite breakfast, and 2 or 3 cocktails at the daily cocktail part. This means that on many days we will get about $40 (per person) just in free drinks. There is no way to price the hot and cold hors d'oevres provided at the daily Elite cocktail party. And then there are the upgrades (unlike HA....Celebrity does seem to upgrade their frequent cruisers). And then there are the other amenities like free internet minutes, free laundry (unlike HA..this is only for a limited number of items) etc. We also appreciate that Celebrity ships might actually have more then a few folks awake after 10 pm :)

 

Hank

[Thebes]

Christine, We totally agree with you. Celebrity really treats its Elites very well, and the provided amenities can be worth a substantial amount of money. DW and I will sometimes have a Bellini and/or Bloody Mary at the Elite breakfast, and 2 or 3 cocktails at the daily cocktail part. This means that on many days we will get about $40 (per person) just in free drinks. There is no way to price the hot and cold hors d'oevres provided at the daily Elite cocktail party. And then there are the upgrades (unlike HA....Celebrity does seem to upgrade their frequent cruisers). And then there are the other amenities like free internet minutes, free laundry (unlike HA..this is only for a limited number of items) etc. We also appreciate that Celebrity ships might actually have more then a few folks awake after 10 pm :)

 

Hank

 

Hank &christine

 

How many cruises/ days did you guys have to take in order to be in the elite level w celebrity. We did boom on HA but final payment is not till October. I emailed HA today and I'm a new passenger in order to see if they offer anything extra for B2B cruisers and they said NADA. Nothing to offer. Customer service was below average when I called asking a technical question about balcony sizes. Rep pretended to be an expert but didn't know @&&$. I'm Looking into celebrity. Keeping my eyes open.

I

 

 

 

Thank you CC fam!

Sent from my iPhone using Forums mobile app

[Thebes]

Hank,

 

Can u please email me at :

 

taneous@hotmail.com

 

Thank you!

 

 

 

 

 

Thank you CC fam!

Sent from my iPhone using Forums mobile app

[Aquahound]

Hank &christine

 

How many cruises/ days did you guys have to take in order to be in the elite level w celebrity. We did boom on HA but final payment is not till October. I emailed HA today and I'm a new passenger in order to see if they offer anything extra for B2B cruisers and they said NADA. Nothing to offer. Customer service was below average when I called asking a technical question about balcony sizes. Rep pretended to be an expert but didn't know @&&$. I'm Looking into celebrity. Keeping my eyes open.

 

You make Elite after 10 cruises, but you earn an extra point if in Concierge Class or higher, or if the cruise is 12+ nights. You are also honorary Elite if you are Diamond on Royal Caribbean.

[cruz chic]

Christine, We totally agree with you. Celebrity really treats its Elites very well, and the provided amenities can be worth a substantial amount of money. DW and I will sometimes have a Bellini and/or Bloody Mary at the Elite breakfast, and 2 or 3 cocktails at the daily cocktail part. This means that on many days we will get about $40 (per person) just in free drinks. There is no way to price the hot and cold hors d'oevres provided at the daily Elite cocktail party. And then there are the upgrades (unlike HA....Celebrity does seem to upgrade their frequent cruisers). And then there are the other amenities like free internet minutes, free laundry (unlike HA..this is only for a limited number of items) etc. We also appreciate that Celebrity ships might actually have more then a few folks awake after 10 pm :)

 

Hank

 

I know that free drinks are hugely important to you. For me, that does very little. Also I think it's odd that Celebrity limits the free laundry. I'm pretty ok with the bennies offered by Hal. I just wish they had some free Internet. My 2 cruises on Celebrity were so poor that there is nothing to tempt me there. Princess also gives price breaks for frequent cruises so I appreciate that.

[cruz chic]

Hank &christine

 

How many cruises/ days did you guys have to take in order to be in the elite level w celebrity. We did boom on HA but final payment is not till October. I emailed HA today and I'm a new passenger in order to see if they offer anything extra for B2B cruisers and they said NADA. Nothing to offer. Customer service was below average when I called asking a technical question about balcony sizes. Rep pretended to be an expert but didn't know @&&$. I'm Looking into celebrity. Keeping my eyes open.

I

 

 

 

Thank you CC fam!

Sent from my iPhone using Forums mobile app

 

The Hal reps are not a good source of info sad to say. I'm curious if Celebrity would be any better. I think your best bet from good info is on the cc boards. Some folks really know their balcony sizes. It's certainly a great idea to look around and pick the cruise line that would be the best fit since you have the time to do it before you have to commit.

[Hlitner]

I know that free drinks are hugely important to you. For me, that does very little. Also I think it's odd that Celebrity limits the free laundry. I'm pretty ok with the bennies offered by Hal. I just wish they had some free Internet. My 2 cruises on Celebrity were so poor that there is nothing to tempt me there. Princess also gives price breaks for frequent cruises so I appreciate that.

 

Celebrity gives us Elite coupon books that have coupons for limited free laundry (it can vary by cruise). It might often be something like 20 or 35 free pieces per person (not cabin). A few years ago we took a couple of Celebrity cruises and were very underwhelmed and avoided this line for over a decade. Then about 3 years ago we went back to Celebrity and tried one of their Solstice Class ships are were "blown away" at the improvements in quality, the beauty and functionality of the ship, the excellent alternative restaurants, and the quality of entertainment. We have since been doing quite a few Celebrity (as well as many HA days) and it seem like Celebrity keeps improving their overall product (and ships) while HA is working hard at going backwards (cut-backs).

 

 

Hank

[Hlitner]

oops