So now that they've back-pedalled..

[OlsSalt]

200 to 300%? Therein lies the problem. I am seeing 400 - 500% markup on HAL's wine list.

 

Don't buy it then. Market place. HAL makes zero money on wines so overpriced they do not sell. Someone just gave an example of a Zonin brand wine one can get at Trader Joe's going for 300% mark-up.

[Windsailer]

Actually the retail price for the Zonin is $9.99. HAL pays wholesale. Retail is 1.5x wholesale. HAL's price is $36.25. More than a 300% mark-up.

[Tampa Girl]

Don't buy it then. Market place. HAL makes zero money on wines so overpriced they do not sell. Someone just gave an example of a Zonin brand wine one can get at Trader Joe's going for 300% mark-up.

 

I don't buy them. But if other pax decline, as well, I am at a loss to understand how HAL thinks it will increase revenue by prohibiting bringing wine aboard and continuing with its overpriced, underwhelming inventory.

[Linda&Vern]

Actually the bigger and more complex an organization the more likely things like this are going to happen. You'd think the opposite would be true, that an established company would have well tried and tested change processes and procedures that would preclude this kind of knee-jerk, hair trigger, and totally mishandled change. No telling what really happened. Could be everything from management not anticipating the backlash to somebody with operational responsibilities overstepping their authority. In kind of a cynical and sarcastic way I can't count the number of times in my 44 year career I heard versions of "what the boss meant to say was...." when a change or new policy or whatever didn't go exactly as planned. :)

B-I-N-G-O

 

I'm not going into details about where I worked for almost 30 years except to say it was the world headquarters of a Fortune 100 company with divisions all over the world. I can tell you from experience that what is said "at the highest top level" is many times not what happens at the "implementation level."

 

Personally, I don't think HAL was trying to sneak anything into their cruise guidelines - someone took control and did their own thing. I do think they indeed intended to change their wine policy - just not the way it happened. That's my opinion - I know others will disagree.

[Tampa Girl]

I spoke to a TA on Vancouver Island yesterday and they had not been advised of Hal's change in wine policy and they do a huge volume of bookings for Hal which Lisa's employers does not.

 

 

I don't understand your post. Have you not read any of the prior postings? Lisa was informed by a HAL rep. See #39. Are you seriously trying to suggest that the policy had never been put in place?

[OlsSalt]

Actually the retail price for the Zonin is $9.99. HAL pays wholesale. Retail is 1.5x wholesale. HAL's price is $36.25. More than a 300% mark-up.

 

I thought the issue was about wines you could purchase for yourself for retail and bring on board instead, of choosing HAL wines they were able to buy at wholesale. So the passenger cost savings lost under the new policy would need to be based upon retail prices; not HAL's costs of goods.

 

A $10 bottle of Trader Joe wine is then closer to 300% mark-up, if you are now prevented from bringing your own supply on board for in cabin use. 10 day cruise - $250 for a 10 day cruise at a bottle a day in this case.

 

Let's say for purpose of example $250 x 1000 passengers would mean a quarter of a million dollars in potential lost revenues for that 10 day cruise. I can see why HAL wanted to revisit this policy. And keep fares lower for the rest of us.

[OlsSalt]

.....

Personally, I don't think HAL was trying to sneak anything into their cruise guidelines - someone took control and did their own thing. I do think they indeed intended to change their wine policy - just not the way it happened. That's my opinion - I know others will disagree.

 

I think you are right. Hospitality industry is about pleasing as many people as possible; not alienating them.

[Laminator]

B-I-N-G-O

 

I'm not going into details about where I worked for almost 30 years except to say it was the world headquarters of a Fortune 100 company with divisions all over the world. I can tell you from experience that what is said "at the highest top level" is many times not what happens at the "implementation level."

 

Personally, I don't think HAL was trying to sneak anything into their cruise guidelines - someone took control and did their own thing. I do think they indeed intended to change their wine policy - just not the way it happened. That's my opinion - I know others will disagree.

 

I agree completely. The corporate level can become a maze of miscommunication. You see it with HAL on many things. One reservation agent says one thing while a different reservation agent says another.

 

Since HAL has always given long notice on significant changes, smoking policy would be one instance, I believe the ball was dropped here. I think their goal was for the announcement to be made last weekend. I do not believe it was their intention for implementation to begin last weekend.

 

I am not sure their wine policy will change much. The most I think we can hope for is a tiered level depending on cabin selection. Plus I believe they should offer HAL sponsored wine excursions that would allow attendees to bring a few bottles back for onboard consumption.

 

I am sailing on the Oosterdam August 25th. I should know the F&B manager on that ship so I'll see if I can get additional info.

 

Also I would appreciate it if everyone can give me some ideas as to what they would settle for. Having your cake and eat it too I am quite sure will not be an option.

 

Since I do not drink wine I have no dog in this hunt. I also believe that posting your ideas on FB will garner much more attention than posting here. Major corporations have personnel that are hired to specifically handle their social media pages. I can assure you HAL has no one hired to respond on CC.

 

These I know are major discussion points.

 

Better Selection

Reasonable Pricing

Allowing a bottle to be brought on in port

Allowing more than one bottle per pax at embarkation

[Wakepatrol]

I thought the issue was about wines you could purchase for yourself for retail and bring on board instead, of choosing HAL wines they were able to buy at wholesale. So the passenger cost savings lost under the new policy would need to be based upon retail prices; not HAL's costs of goods.

 

A $10 bottle of Trader Joe wine is then closer to 300% mark-up, if you are now prevented from bringing your own supply on board for in cabin use. 10 day cruise - $250 for a 10 day cruise at a bottle a day in this case.

 

Let's say for purpose of example $250 x 1000 passengers would mean a quarter of a million dollars in potential lost revenues for that 10 day cruise. I can see why HAL wanted to revisit this policy. And keep fares lower for the rest of us.

 

I mentioned something like this yesterday and the spin masters were trying to tell me that HAL would actually make MORE money by letting people bring their own beverages.

[Two@Sea]

I thought the issue was about wines you could purchase for yourself for retail and bring on board instead, of choosing HAL wines they were able to buy at wholesale. So the passenger cost savings lost under the new policy would need to be based upon retail prices; not HAL's costs of goods.

 

A $10 bottle of Trader Joe wine is then closer to 300% mark-up, if you are now prevented from bringing your own supply on board for in cabin use. 10 day cruise - $250 for a 10 day cruise at a bottle a day in this case.

 

Let's say for purpose of example $250 x 1000 passengers would mean a quarter of a million dollars in potential lost revenues for that 10 day cruise. I can see why HAL wanted to revisit this policy. And keep fares lower for the rest of us.

 

Wine preferences are extremely personal. No cruise line can offer every possible preferred selection for every passenger. Choice, not cost, is my concerning factor. Cost, not choice, is HAL's concern (rightfully so).

 

I feel it is reasonable for HAL to request a corkage fee for any wine I bring onboard to mitigate their losses by my doing so.

[OlsSalt]

.....

 

I feel it is reasonable for HAL to request a corkage fee for any wine I bring onboard to mitigate their losses by my doing so.

 

This looks like a good compromise. And one done under the CCL umbrella already on Princess according to a report here.

[jtl513]

I just checked the "before you cruise" documents on the Princess website. There has been no change on page 6. It clearly states the new policy. There may be a statement on FB or elsewhere, but there have been no changes to what is currently in the official print.

Presuming you meant HAL, not Princess, click HERE and then Onboard Policies under Shipboard Life on the left side. That is official print. KBYG has not yet been corrected.

[Storylady]

HAL may not be unique but it certainly is atypical with a lot of LONG, interesting itineraries. Seems to me the policy that makes sense is something like "one bottle for each 10 days of the cruise". How about allowing one bottle to be brought to the cabin at embarkation and leaving vouchers in the cabin to allow an additional bottle every subsequent 7 or 10 days. The voucher could either be used to retrieve a bottle that was confiscated at embarkation or buy one at a port. Or perhaps the vouchers could be given out at checkin.

 

Roy

 

I really like that idea of a voucher especially if it was in conjunction with a shore excursion. We enjoyed bringing a bottle or two that we bought during a wine tasting shore excursion & we were disappointed we wouldn't be able to do it anymore. A voucher of exception for those who booked a HAL Wine Tasting Shore excursion should be included.

 

The corkage fee would probably prevent us from purchasing wine ashore at ports. But I have no problem with it being applied to anybody else who can afford to pay it.

[Laminator]

I really like that idea. We enjoyed bringing a bottle that we bought during a wine tasting shore excursion & we were disappointed we wouldn't be able to do it anymore. A voucher of exception for those who booked a HAL shore excursion and a voucher probably every 7 days would be fair to those who booked cruises longer than 7 days.

 

 

These are solid ideas. Let's try to offer reasonable solutions. Something that would be a win/win for pax and HAL. Now is the time to start a discussion. It may fall on deaf ears but at least there was an attempt made.

[jtl513]

I really like that idea. We enjoyed bringing a bottle that we bought during a wine tasting shore excursion & we were disappointed we wouldn't be able to do it anymore. A voucher of exception for those who booked a HAL shore excursion and a voucher probably every 7 days would be fair to those who booked cruises longer than 7 days.

Or just set a limit of one free bottle per seven days, and all in excess of that would be charged a $15 corkage fee. If you were booked for 21 days you could bring on your 3 bottles all at once at embarkation or any port of your choice, or spread out over several ports. Each bottle brought on would be tallied by scanning your key card.

[OVgirl]

I agree completely. The corporate level can become a maze of miscommunication. You see it with HAL on many things. One reservation agent says one thing while a different reservation agent says another.

 

Since HAL has always given long notice on significant changes, smoking policy would be one instance, I believe the ball was dropped here. I think their goal was for the announcement to be made last weekend. I do not believe it was their intention for implementation to begin last weekend.

 

I am not sure their wine policy will change much. The most I think we can hope for is a tiered level depending on cabin selection. Plus I believe they should offer HAL sponsored wine excursions that would allow attendees to bring a few bottles back for onboard consumption.

 

I am sailing on the Oosterdam August 25th. I should know the F&B manager on that ship so I'll see if I can get additional info.

 

Also I would appreciate it if everyone can give me some ideas as to what they would settle for. Having your cake and eat it too I am quite sure will not be an option.

 

Since I do not drink wine I have no dog in this hunt. I also believe that posting your ideas on FB will garner much more attention than posting here. Major corporations have personnel that are hired to specifically handle their social media pages. I can assure you HAL has no one hired to respond on CC.

 

These I know are major discussion points.

 

Better Selection

Reasonable Pricing

Allowing a bottle to be brought on in port

Allowing more than one bottle per pax at embarkation

 

On one of the other threads taxmantoo posted that when they boarded Nieuw Amsterdam on July 14 with 10 bottles of wine, they were stopped by a wine steward and told that the new policy was only 1 bottle per person. They protested and after speaking to someone higher up, were allowed to keep their wine.

 

KirkNC was also on that cruise and has said that there were signs when they returned from ports about the wine restrictions.

 

So, yes, the policy was in effect even before we were made aware of it here on CC.

After all of the pressure from members of Cruise Critic (and similar sites) and Facebook, the company did change their minds.

 

With all the different discussions going on right now on this board, it is hard to keep track of all the current information.

 

Main point being, that HAL listened to us and made a change to their policy because we spoke up.

[Tampa Girl]

I mentioned something like this yesterday and the spin masters were trying to tell me that HAL would actually make MORE money by letting people bring their own beverages.

 

 

If 1,000 passengers is 1/2 of the total number, you are assuming that half of the contingent will buy a bottle of wine a day. Are you basing that on anything concrete or just speculation?

[OlsSalt]

.....

Main point being, that HAL listened to us and made a change to their policy because we spoke up.

 

So far they only delayed the policy, but did not change it. There have been some good alternative suggestions made for change so that is the interesting next chapter.

[smokinmike]

Not only do I not board with wine, I do not drink wine (or anything alcoholic) while on board. I concentrate on having fun, and I don't need a glass in hand to do that.

 

Blowing this policy way out of proportion is only going to backfire.

 

Well - you have your way of having a good time and others have theirs. That's kind of the way it is.

 

. . . no need to sound pejorative about "a glass in hand" though.

 

Cheers!

[OlsSalt]

If 1,000 passengers is 1/2 of the total number, you are assuming that half of the contingent will buy a bottle of wine a day. Are you basing that on anything concrete or just speculation?

 

it was total speculation, for context only.

[Two@Sea]

Or just set a limit of one free bottle per seven days, and all in excess of that would be charged a $15 corkage fee. If you were booked for 21 days you could bring on your 3 bottles all at once at embarkation or any port of your choice, or spread out over several ports. Each bottle brought on would be tallied by scanning your key card.

 

That sounds reasonable to me.

[Laminator]

On one of the other threads taxmantoo posted that when they boarded Nieuw Amsterdam on July 14 with 10 bottles of wine, they were stopped by a wine steward and told that the new policy was only 1 bottle per person. They protested and after speaking to someone higher up, were allowed to keep their wine.

 

KirkNC was also on that cruise and has said that there were signs when they returned from ports about the wine restrictions.

 

So, yes, the policy was in effect even before we were made aware of it here on CC.

After all of the pressure from members of Cruise Critic (and similar sites) and Facebook, the company did change their minds.

 

With all the different discussions going on right now on this board, it is hard to keep track of all the current information.

 

Main point being, that HAL listened to us and made a change to their policy because we spoke up.

 

That is why I think someone in corporate dropped the ball. This all sounds like mass confusion to me.

 

You're correct in HAL did listen to their pax. However come Jan. 31st everyone will be right back to where they started. With a wine policy that is extremely prohibitive. That is why a discussion needs to be started soon.

 

The voucher idea is a good one.

[Wakepatrol]

If 1,000 passengers is 1/2 of the total number, you are assuming that half of the contingent will buy a bottle of wine a day. Are you basing that on anything concrete or just speculation?

 

There's more money to be made charging people for wine, beer, and soda than having people bringing their own. Just ask any sports team.

[dogo88]

Sorry, but after reading this thread and listening to the moral police tell me what I should and should not do I need to comment.

 

If you don't drink, then as someone else has pointed out in a prior post, "you don't have a dog in the hunt", and should look to another topic to offer up your wisdom on. For me, this change if implemented as initially advertised, will cause me to look elsewhere.

 

Also, to those the don't drink but continue to list that HAL needs to make that money, well from my perspective the non drinkers are looking to mooch off my booze money that I spend on the ship.

 

So perhaps we need a non drinker charge to cover all the lost $ that the bar waiters and wine stewards should get?

 

Dan

[cruz chic]

There's more money to be made charging people for wine, beer, and soda than having people bringing their own. Just ask any sports team.

No way! Here I thought the only way to bring money in was for charging for corkage. Sure could have fooled me. Now you tell me that they can make money by selling booze:D;). That's absurd;).