credit card chip?

[SwissDave]

Ok, semantics here. Same principle as the PIN is not changeable.

 

 

So how was i able to change the pin on both my work credit cards and both of my personal credit cards and both of my debit cards? All of which are true chip n pin.

It is not semantics. Embedded has a completely different meaning to stored.

 

Sent from my iPhone. Please excuse tryping orrers.

Edited July 18, 2014 by SwissDave

[caviargal]

There must be a difference in cards issued in Europe. Either that or companies like Amex are totally clueless, which I find difficult to believe.

[Mark_T]

There must be a difference in cards issued in Europe. Either that or companies like Amex are totally clueless, which I find difficult to believe.

 

Clueless is a bit harsh, but lacking in technology might cover it ...

 

https://www.americanexpress.com/icc/eurodollar/chip-and-pin.html

 

"Where can I change my PIN?

Once your PIN is issued you will not be able to change your PIN unless you visit the UK, where you can use UK LINK ATMs that offer PIN Management services."

 

The cards are capable of having the PIN changed, the technology just isn't widely available in the USA to do it yet ...

[SwissDave]

I almost forgot, all my cards also have 6 digit pin codes and have never had a single problem using them anywhere that I have travelled to.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone. Please excuse tryping orrers.

[caviargal]

Clueless is a bit harsh, but lacking in technology might cover it ...

 

https://www.americanexpress.com/icc/eurodollar/chip-and-pin.html

 

"Where can I change my PIN?

Once your PIN is issued you will not be able to change your PIN unless you visit the UK, where you can use UK LINK ATMs that offer PIN Management services."

 

The cards are capable of having the PIN changed, the technology just isn't widely available in the USA to do it yet ...

 

That makes sense and yes, we are behind the times in many ways. I am reminded of that with every trip I make to Europe.

 

I forgot about the 6 digit pins. My cards only have 4.

 

Amex tells me they will have this for my Business Platinum card by Nov. 2014.

[Donray]

It is stored on the chip and on the mag strip. It is not embedded on it.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone. Please excuse tryping orrers.

 

What do you think embedded in the chip means? The PIN is embedded into the Chip memory, either static or volatile memory. There is no a pin stored on the magnetic strip.

 

Maybe it is the difference in what know for the terminology and what I would use. I worked on the first tube type computers to give you an idea of how long I have been involved in computers and technology. Many use the term embedded in memory and stored in memory interchangeable.

Edited July 18, 2014 by Donray

[Host Jazzbeau]

Here is a snip from the Bank of Montreal website, which seems to confirm that the Chips can be reprogrammed with new PINs as long as the terminal has this capability. They point out that Canadian ATMs do, but US ATMs do not:

 

5. Can you change your chip debit or credit card PIN?

 

If you reside in Canada, you can easily change your debit or credit card PIN at any BMO ATM to something easier for you to remember, but which could not be easily guessed by others. We recommend you change your PIN periodically for extra security. BMO ATMs are available 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, for your convenience.

 

U.S. ATMs are not yet chip-enabled for customers to change their PIN. If you reside in the U.S. and you forget your PIN or your card has been locked out of the system because the PIN was entered incorrectly 3 times. You must obtain a new PIN from BMO. However, if you are travelling in a country that has adopted chip technology, we can reset your PIN remotely, you will then be directed to visit a chip-enabled ATM within a specific time period, to choose a new 4-digit PIN.

 

So hopefully the information I was given by Barclays [that my new Arrival+ card is a true Chip and PIN and that my personally-chosen PIN will become effective as soon as I use it at a terminal in Europe] is true.

[ewizabeff]

My understanding is that the PIN number of the chip can be updated with the software that is used to scan the chip. My Barclays chip + pin card made me call in and set the PIN, but said that it wouldn't really be "set" until I swiped it overseas at an online kiosk, because the chip + pin scanner would scan the chip, match it with my pin that is associated with it on the credit cards network, and then embed it in the chip so it could be used in an offline kiosk.

 

Made sense to me.

[Host Jazzbeau]

My understanding is that the PIN number of the chip can be updated with the software that is used to scan the chip. My Barclays chip + pin card made me call in and set the PIN, but said that it wouldn't really be "set" until I swiped it overseas at an online kiosk, because the chip + pin scanner would scan the chip, match it with my pin that is associated with it on the credit cards network, and then embed it in the chip so it could be used in an offline kiosk.

 

Made sense to me.

 

The only problem is that you can't tell is a kiosk is online or not. Barclays advised me to use it that first time at a staffed station to be sure.

[Hydrokitty]

That makes sense and yes, we are behind the times in many ways. I am reminded of that with every trip I make to Europe.

 

I forgot about the 6 digit pins. My cards only have 4.

 

Amex tells me they will have this for my Business Platinum card by Nov. 2014.

 

Caviargal: tI got my business amex with the pin last month before I left for Europe. When I called them to tell them my travel plans, I asked when new cards would be available I was told that it was taking months, but that since I had called and asked for it, they would issue it immediately and they did. So if you need it in the near future, call and ask for it. Interestingly, my Capital One card had the chip technology when it was first issued, over a year ago. :)

[Hydrokitty]

That makes sense and yes, we are behind the times in many ways. I am reminded of that with every trip I make to Europe.

 

I forgot about the 6 digit pins. My cards only have 4.

 

Amex tells me they will have this for my Business Platinum card by Nov. 2014.

 

Caviargal, I too have an Amex Business card and when I called them in May to tell them I would be traveling in Europe, I asked about the new cards and was told it will take months.....BUT since I called and asked, they would issue one immediately if I wished and less than a week later I had one. So, if you need/want the new card and you're traveling soon, call them and ask them for it. As an interesting side note, when I got my Capital One card last year it came with the chip technology.

[steamboats]

Actually here in Germany a couple of banks do offer credit cards where you can change the PIN. I don´t know how often you can change it. But obviously there is a technology where you can change the PIN and that change is saved on your card (aka chip). Otherwise that German credit card wouldn´t work over here!

 

BTW, no ATMs in Germany do not only give out 20 Euro bills. Actually I usually receive 50 Euro bills (and sometimes 100 Euro :eek:). But it depends on the amount you withdraw (and the bills left in the ATM). Usually there is an option "chose your own amount" (instead of using the 50, 100, 150... Euro suggestions). There you can also chose the bills you want to have (but then you have to count and make sure that the bills you´ve choses fit the amount you want to withdraw).

 

steamboats

[caviargal]

Caviargal, I too have an Amex Business card and when I called them in May to tell them I would be traveling in Europe, I asked about the new cards and was told it will take months.....BUT since I called and asked, they would issue one immediately if I wished and less than a week later I had one. So, if you need/want the new card and you're traveling soon, call them and ask them for it. As an interesting side note, when I got my Capital One card last year it came with the chip technology.

 

This is so frustrating! I called them just lack week about this and they said November. They did send me the chip card but it is a C&S not a C&P.

 

The customer service has been so great with my Platinum card that I thought they were accurate. But I will try again. Thanks!

[purduemom1]

Actually here in Germany a couple of banks do offer credit cards where you can change the PIN. I don´t know how often you can change it. But obviously there is a technology where you can change the PIN and that change is saved on your card (aka chip). Otherwise that German credit card wouldn´t work over here!

 

BTW, no ATMs in Germany do not only give out 20 Euro bills. Actually I usually receive 50 Euro bills (and sometimes 100 Euro :eek:). But it depends on the amount you withdraw (and the bills left in the ATM). Usually there is an option "chose your own amount" (instead of using the 50, 100, 150... Euro suggestions). There you can also chose the bills you want to have (but then you have to count and make sure that the bills you´ve choses fit the amount you want to withdraw).

 

steamboats

 

I didn't realize that because when I used the Deutsche Bank ATM at the Frankfurt airport, twice, for a €200 withdrawal, I received only 20s and was never asked to choose a denomination. Good to know that isn't necessarily always the case.

[whatnot]

This is all so confusing! I just talked to Capital One and got an upgraded card. The Capital one card I have had for several years has a pin number but no one has ever asked for it. It too was a chip and sign. When I asked about when I could get a true chip and pin they said they did not know but it would be before the end of 2015. So are you sure your Capital One card really is a chip and pin?

[purduemom1]

One person in our group found a station in Budapest that had a manned booth, from which she purchased. Yes, you could use cash (local currency). There was also a cash option in the Vienna metro station. We used ATMs to obtain cash in Budapest (once at the Gellert Spa, and the other from a street corner Bankomat). The currency in Hungary is based on a system that seems like everything costs a fortune - thousands of HUF! The bills were large but it was no problem. I love my currency converter phone app - OANDA Currency Converter - it worked once downloaded from the internet onboard in each port without using data. In Prague, we only got currency once, right at the airport ATM.

We tried very hard to get rid of our currencies. We gave our CZK as additional tips onboard (figuring the crew was going to be in Prague again).

 

Thanks. I plan to download the OANDA app on my iPhone-it will be great to have.

[caviargal]

Caviargal, I too have an Amex Business card and when I called them in May to tell them I would be traveling in Europe, I asked about the new cards and was told it will take months.....BUT since I called and asked, they would issue one immediately if I wished and less than a week later I had one. So, if you need/want the new card and you're traveling soon, call them and ask them for it. As an interesting side note, when I got my Capital One card last year it came with the chip technology.

 

I called again and was told that they do not have the technology and it would be available at year end. :confused:

[Hydrokitty]

I called again and was told that they do not have the technology and it would be available at year end. :confused:

 

I don't understand..I'm looking at my business card now and the chip is on the face of it big as life! Now, what I have discovered through this board is that apparently not all chips are the same....and I don't know what mine is because I've used it and never been asked for a pin only a signature. What is the difference between chip and sign or chip and pin and why would it matter to me?

[caviargal]

I don't understand..I'm looking at my business card now and the chip is on the face of it big as life! Now, what I have discovered through this board is that apparently not all chips are the same....and I don't know what mine is because I've used it and never been asked for a pin only a signature. What is the difference between chip and sign or chip and pin and why would it matter to me?

 

I have the Platinum card with chip but it is a chip and signature and not a chip and pin. The difference is that, in Europe, based on personal experience, sometimes only a chip and pin is accepted. This happened to us at the train station in AMS and elsewhere.

[sippican]

I don't understand..I'm looking at my business card now and the chip is on the face of it big as life! Now, what I have discovered through this board is that apparently not all chips are the same....and I don't know what mine is because I've used it and never been asked for a pin only a signature. What is the difference between chip and sign or chip and pin and why would it matter to me?

 

Our friends used their Citibank Chiped card all over Europe (they were promised it would be accepted everywhere). That came to a screeching halt at the kiosk for the Metro in Budapest, where only true chip & pin cards could be used. A local informed us that Budapest is transitioning to the unmanned kiosks all over the city. At the two stops we tried, there was no other option to buy tickets. If we had not had our card available to purchase their passes they would have needed to go to an ATM, get local currency, and return to the station.

[nana541]

I was also unable to use my Chip & Sign in Venice at any Kiosk and at train.... Same at gas stations in Germany & Netherlands. Turn away from purchasing in 2 small stores and had to pay cash in a rest. (Told is it was due to liability if they accepted a sig rather than a pin) This info is incorrect but this was what these employees had been told by their employers.

 

I think this is going to become a much bigger issue in the next year!

 

We made sure to have 200 or so Euros on us at all times. And did not arrive in Europe without same (just in case).

 

 

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[whatnot]

On a trip to France in June, we were able to use our chip and signature at gas stations, grocery stores, and even at toll booths as long as we stopped at a manned booth. Our only problem was in Lyon for public transit. We had only large euro bills and it wanted small change. We were able to go next door to the tourist office and change bills into smaller change. Just beware of trying to use chip and signature cards at unmanned kiosks! They won't work! Be sure to have some local currency with you. After our Lyon experience we always had Euros as a backup in case the card did not work.

[Hydrokitty]

On a trip to France in June, we were able to use our chip and signature at gas stations, grocery stores, and even at toll booths as long as we stopped at a manned booth. Our only problem was in Lyon for public transit. We had only large euro bills and it wanted small change. We were able to go next door to the tourist office and change bills into smaller change. Just beware of trying to use chip and signature cards at unmanned kiosks! They won't work! Be sure to have some local currency with you. After our Lyon experience we always had Euros as a backup in case the card did not work.

 

I always carry Euros as well, but some countries (like Romania) won't accept Euros or dollars and that's where I used my Capital One with the chip and sign. OK I got the difference between them straight, but if everyone will be demanding the chip and pin, why are we wasting time and money on the chip and sign?

[Ozjohnno]

I always carry Euros as well, but some countries (like Romania) won't accept Euros or dollars and that's where I used my Capital One with the chip and sign. OK I got the difference between them straight, but if everyone will be demanding the chip and pin, why are we wasting time and money on the chip and sign?

 

I must admit that's a question many of us Aussies ask. Our system will be totally chip and pin starting August 1st and you can change your pin at your company ATM's. Europe was moving towards chip and pin when we were last there in 2011 and although there were places you could sign there were also many that you couldn't. For our trip starting very soon all our cards both CC's and debit are all chip and pin. I'm sure that the U.S. will be forced into chip and pin or end up being the only country in the world that isn't.

[whatnot]

After the Target credit card fiasco, the US is suppose to be committed to making the switch to Chip and Pin by the end of 2015. MOST US credit card holders only use their cards in the US. So until they finally figured out that chip and pin is safer for the consumer, the US never saw the need for this technology. The problem is the cost of switching to chip and pin. Every person who accepts a credit card in the US will have to buy a new machine that accommodates this new technology. The girl who cuts my hair (she owns her own business and is a one person salon) just recently told me that the credit card company called her and said she had to buy a new $3000 + machine to deal with the new cards. She said she can't afford it so she just won't take credit cards anymore.

 

This is one area of technology where the US is really lagging behind the rest of the world. I am ready for the change after having some of my cards compromised. Chip and Pin is suppose to make this more difficult. I just want our credit card companies to get their act together soon! We travel quite frequently and we, as well as other frequent travelers, need to be able to use our cards abroad and also use them safely!