Bait and switch

[sparks1093]

Same with me. No deal breaker at all.

 

And the Pearson who made this list probably shouldn't buy.

 

Why does it hurt so much to see the changes in one place? They don't matter to you, they may matter to someone else. We won't see the same info from NCL, that's for sure.

[NLH Arizona]

Part of the problem with NCL's overall strategy is that it's a "death by a thousand cuts" rather than a couple major changes. There have been lots of changes over the last year, so adding them all up means that people who booked very far in advance are getting a significantly different experience than what they thought they were getting

I agree some are not getting what they expected. Some are, because the changes are inconsequential to them or they don't care or don't use the majority of items that have been cut. Not every change affects everyone, so for some it doesn't make a difference. If it makes a huge difference and one is outside the cancellation penalty period, I would suggest possibly alternative plans more to their liking.

 

The point is, NCL can and have made the changes and it is up to each and every customer to decide if the changes will have an impact on them and to make changes if necessary. If they make a change or changes that I feel lessens my cruising experience, I'll just move along, but until then, I'm happy with the product. Not saying you or anyone else has to be happy, as I only speak for myself.

[abe3]

Why does it hurt so much to see the changes in one place? They don't matter to you, they may matter to someone else. We won't see the same info from NCL, that's for sure.

 

 

Doesn't hurt me. Just pointing out it is not a deal breaker for me.

[sparks1093]

Doesn't hurt me. Just pointing out it is not a deal breaker for me.

 

Then why are you hyper-critical of the person that made it? Let them make their list and if it doesn't matter to you then you don't have to read it or comment on it.

[abe3]

Then why are you hyper-critical of the person that made it? Let them make their list and if it doesn't matter to you then you don't have to read it or comment on it.

 

 

Just my opinion and I am entitled to it.

[abe3]

Also if you want to get technical that list is not bait and switch.

[fshagan]

 

• Nickelodeon gone
  
• Geoffrey Zakarian gone
  
• 18% gratuity on specialty dining
  
• DSC raised twice
  
• drink prices raised
  
• 18% gratuity on drinks
  
• 18% gratuity on food/coffee purchases ( Java Cafe/Carlo's/gelato etc)
  
• Asian Noodle restaurant complimentary but reduced menu
  
• Hippo Slide on GSC gone
  
• Fireworks gone
  
• UDP is now SDP
  
• UBP used to be for everyone in room, but now it's just first two passengers
  
• Room service $7.95 except for a much smaller limited "continental breakfast"
  
• Blue Man Group gone
  
• Now pay taxes on "free" UBP/SDP
  
• No more kids pricing in specialty restaurants
  
• Port times shortened on a number of itineraries "for your convenience"
  
• No more free Cirque or Illusionarium on first night with dining package
  
• Margaritaville on Escape is now a la carte. Used to be included.
  
• Cancellation policy got much worse.
  

 

Thanks for this list! I think it puts it in perspective that the cumulative impact of so many changes in such a short time period uses up some / all of the "goodwill capital" they have built up over the years with their customers.

 

A couple of the items are contractual, and would probably go away anyway. Blue Man Group, for instance, would start to be less and less of a draw by the 3rd or 4th cruise, and I believe NCL replaced BMG with another show. Nickelodeon is being replaced by a very well respected children's educational program that may be more enriching and better received by the kids (we shall see!)

 

Does anyone know about the fireworks issue? I have often wondered if they send out lifeboats to pick up all the debris or if we simply trash the marine environment for pretty lights in the sky. I wonder if there are huge fines they have to pay for the discharge of debris at sea. Also, I don't recall if fireworks were fleet wide or just on the -Away ships (although I seem to recall it was only on one or two ships).

 

But still, that's an impressive list.

[sparks1093]

Just my opinion and I am entitled to it.

 

Just the same as the person who made the list. Glad that's established;).

[LMaxwell]

Part of the problem with NCL's overall strategy is that it's a "death by a thousand cuts" rather than a couple major changes. There have been lots of changes over the last year, so adding them all up means that people who booked very far in advance are getting a significantly different experience than what they thought they were getting.

 

• Nickelodeon gone
  
• Geoffrey Zakarian gone
  
• 18% gratuity on specialty dining
  
• DSC raised twice
  
• drink prices raised
  
• 18% gratuity on drinks
  
• 18% gratuity on food/coffee purchases ( Java Cafe/Carlo's/gelato etc)
  
• Asian Noodle restaurant complimentary but reduced menu
  
• Hippo Slide on GSC gone
  
• Fireworks gone
  
• UDP is now SDP
  
• UBP used to be for everyone in room, but now it's just first two passengers
  
• Room service $7.95 except for a much smaller limited "continental breakfast"
  
• Blue Man Group gone
  
• Now pay taxes on "free" UBP/SDP
  
• No more kids pricing in specialty restaurants
  
• Port times shortened on a number of itineraries "for your convenience"
  
• No more free Cirque or Illusionarium on first night with dining package
  
• Margaritaville on Escape is now a la carte. Used to be included.
  
• Cancellation policy got much worse.
  

 

Good list.

 

You can add *AARP early booking discount no longer combinable with any promos as they were earlier this year.

[LMaxwell]

Ncl is not exactly doing anything illegal with M ville but it reflects poorly on their business and marketing and customer service

 

I'm starting to think of Ncl in terms of snake oil salesmen.

 

Also since I know Ncl pays the crew a salary I might reduce my dsc because now I can do it in the privacy of my own home and not defend my actions to guest services

 

My reducing dsc will not hurt the crew at all

 

If I didn't give my steward a cash tip that will hurt them but I'm not talking about reducing that am I

 

Nicely put

[janpo]

Part of the problem with NCL's overall strategy is that it's a "death by a thousand cuts" rather than a couple major changes. There have been lots of changes over the last year, so adding them all up means that people who booked very far in advance are getting a significantly different experience than what they thought they were getting.

 

• Nickelodeon gone
  
• Geoffrey Zakarian gone
  
• 18% gratuity on specialty dining
  
• DSC raised twice
  
• drink prices raised
  
• 18% gratuity on drinks
  
• 18% gratuity on food/coffee purchases ( Java Cafe/Carlo's/gelato etc)
  
• Asian Noodle restaurant complimentary but reduced menu
  
• Hippo Slide on GSC gone
  
• Fireworks gone
  
• UDP is now SDP
  
• UBP used to be for everyone in room, but now it's just first two passengers
  
• Room service $7.95 except for a much smaller limited "continental breakfast"
  
• Blue Man Group gone
  
• Now pay taxes on "free" UBP/SDP
  
• No more kids pricing in specialty restaurants
  
• Port times shortened on a number of itineraries "for your convenience"
  
• No more free Cirque or Illusionarium on first night with dining package
  
• Margaritaville on Escape is now a la carte. Used to be included.
  
• Cancellation policy got much worse.
  

 

 

Very impressive list, especially all together in one place . An eye opener for most but I'm sure not some.

[SteveH2508]

Part of the problem with NCL's overall strategy is that it's a "death by a thousand cuts" rather than a couple major changes. There have been lots of changes over the last year, so adding them all up means that people who booked very far in advance are getting a significantly different experience than what they thought they were getting.

 

• Nickelodeon gone
  
• Geoffrey Zakarian gone
  
• 18% gratuity on specialty dining
  
• DSC raised twice
  
• drink prices raised
  
• 18% gratuity on drinks
  
• 18% gratuity on food/coffee purchases ( Java Cafe/Carlo's/gelato etc)
  
• Asian Noodle restaurant complimentary but reduced menu
  
• Hippo Slide on GSC gone
  
• Fireworks gone
  
• UDP is now SDP
  
• UBP used to be for everyone in room, but now it's just first two passengers
  
• Room service $7.95 except for a much smaller limited "continental breakfast"
  
• Blue Man Group gone
  
• Now pay taxes on "free" UBP/SDP
  
• No more kids pricing in specialty restaurants
  
• Port times shortened on a number of itineraries "for your convenience"
  
• No more free Cirque or Illusionarium on first night with dining package
  
• Margaritaville on Escape is now a la carte. Used to be included.
  
• Cancellation policy got much worse.
  

 

Also add UBP price raised by $5 pppd.

[DMH15]

I agree some are not getting what they expected. Some are, because the changes are inconsequential to them or they don't care or don't use the majority of items that have been cut. Not every change affects everyone, so for some it doesn't make a difference. If it makes a huge difference and one is outside the cancellation penalty period, I would suggest possibly alternative plans more to their liking.

 

The point is, NCL can and have made the changes and it is up to each and every customer to decide if the changes will have an impact on them and to make changes if necessary. If they make a change or changes that I feel lessens my cruising experience, I'll just move along, but until then, I'm happy with the product. Not saying you or anyone else has to be happy, as I only speak for myself.

Your words are so true. I just can't imagine myself being so unhappy with a company and what they deliver that I would ever continue to patronize them. I would never put myself through that. Life is too short to be miserable. And to pay for it too?

 

One thing I have learned in this life is that change is inevitable. I look back in my life and see how many things have changed. For an example, I loved "Chili's" when the first one opened in Dallas in the Fall of 1975. It was our "go to" place. Over the years it has changed... I have not been there in years! I did not like the changes they have made but they are still around so others must still like it. My loyalty changed.

[janpo]

Your words are so true. I just can't imagine myself being so unhappy with a company and what they deliver that I would ever continue to patronize them. I would never put myself through that. Life is too short to be miserable. And to pay for it too?

 

One thing I have learned in this life is that change is inevitable. I look back in my life and see how many things have changed. For an example, I loved "Chili's" when the first one opened in Dallas in the Fall of 1975. It was our "go to" place. Over the years it has changed... I have not been there in years! I did not like the changes they have made but they are still around so others must still like it. My loyalty changed.

 

 

Did Chili's change the rules and prices on you after you ordered and were waiting for your meal?

[Sizzlechest]

A couple of the items are contractual, and would probably go away anyway. Blue Man Group, for instance, would start to be less and less of a draw by the 3rd or 4th cruise, and I believe NCL replaced BMG with another show. Nickelodeon is being replaced by a very well respected children's educational program that may be more enriching and better received by the kids (we shall see!)

 

I agree, but on the other hand, NCL hasn't "refreshed" a lot of the entertainment. The GEM still has the same stale shows as before. I loved Rock of Ages on the Breakaway 2 years ago, and on the next Breakaway sailing I'm taking, it will still be on there. I don't mind since it will only be the second time seeing it, but NCL apparently doesn't mind people seeing the same show 3 or 4 times.

 

What's the new kids' program? I haven't heard anything about it.

 

Does anyone know about the fireworks issue? I have often wondered if they send out lifeboats to pick up all the debris or if we simply trash the marine environment for pretty lights in the sky. I wonder if there are huge fines they have to pay for the discharge of debris at sea. Also, I don't recall if fireworks were fleet wide or just on the -Away ships (although I seem to recall it was only on one or two ships).

 

Other cruise lines like Disney still do fireworks, so it's not a legal issue. Ironically, NCL still advertises fireworks on the BA on their youtube channel:

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iFOSvMKzI1E

 

But still, that's an impressive list.

 

Thank you. That's what I mean by "Death by a thousand cuts." Individually, they're not noticeable, but together they represent a drop in service and quality. NCL might find itself in the same boat (pardon the pun) as GM and Ford. For years, they made tiny little cuts to quality while the Japanese companies continued to make a quality product. Eventually many of the die hards switched to the alternatives and never looked back. I'm sure if you asked people what's the one thing GM or Ford could have changed to win them back, they probably couldn't be very specific. It was a general dissatisfaction from a bunch of annoyances that lead up to a "straw that broke the camel's back" situation and boom. Customer gone. I booked over a year out for my July cruise on the Breakaway. I got a good price at the time, but I'm not sure I'd do it next year at the current prices. I'm also taking a break from cruising in 2017. I'm not tired of it. I wouldn't mind doing a GEM cruise from NY to Nassau again, but I'm fed up with the way things are changing and I have little hope it's going to get better in 2017. If anything, there will be more cuts, not less. NCL is slowly turning into Carnival and I'm not going to cruise like that.

Edited December 23, 2015 by Sizzlechest

[DMH15]

Did Chili's change the rules and prices on you after you ordered and were waiting for your meal?

 

 

Actually, I ordered the Margarita Chicken based on years of it being fire-grilled from a raw chicken breast to it being pre-cooked and warmed on a flat grill. There was no "disclaimer" in the menu as to this significant change.

[janpo]

Actually, I ordered the Margarita Chicken based on years of it being fire-grilled from a raw chicken breast to it being pre-cooked and warmed on a flat grill. There was no "disclaimer" in the menu as to this significant change.

 

 

So the answer would be no.

[DMH15]

I agree, but on the other hand, NCL hasn't "refreshed" a lot of the entertainment. The GEM still has the same stale shows as before. I loved Rock of Ages on the Breakaway 2 years ago, and on the next Breakaway sailing I'm taking, it will still be on there. I don't mind since it will only be the second time seeing it, but NCL apparently doesn't mind people seeing the same show 3 or 4 times.

 

What's the new kids' program? I haven't heard anything about it.

 

 

 

Other cruise lines like Disney still do fireworks, so it's not a legal issue. Ironically, NCL still advertises fireworks on the BA on their youtube channel:

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iFOSvMKzI1E

 

 

 

Thank you. That's what I mean by "Death by a thousand cuts." Individually, they're not noticeable, but together they represent a drop in service and quality. NCL might find itself in the same boat (pardon the pun) as GM and Ford. For years, they made tiny little cuts to quality while the Japanese companies continued to make a quality product. Eventually many of the die hards switched to the alternatives and never looked back. I'm sure if you asked people what's the one thing GM or Ford could have changed to win them back, they probably couldn't be very specific. It was a general dissatisfaction from a bunch of annoyances that lead up to a "straw that broke the camel's back" situation and boom. Customer gone. I booked over a year out for my July cruise on the Breakaway. I got a good price at the time, but I'm not sure I'd do it next year at the current prices. I'm also taking a break from cruising in 2017. I'm not tired of it. I wouldn't mind doing a GEM cruise from NY to Nassau again, but I'm fed up with the way things are changing and I have little hope it's going to get better in 2017. If anything, there will be more cuts, not less. NCL is slowly turning into Carnival and I'm not going to cruise like that.

I think NCL is going the opposite of Carnival.

[SuiteCruiser]

I think NCL is going the opposite of Carnival.

 

So Carnival is offering more for less cost?

[DMH15]

So the answer would be no.

 

Well, you knew it would have been impossible for the change to be within a 30 minute window.... but my point is that corporations will forever be changing their products.

 

And some people will be unhappy with the changes. Some will leave.

 

I sure didn't keep going to Chili's and complaining every time. I moved on.

[DMH15]

So Carnival is offering more for less cost?

 

You imply NCL is offering less. I have not investigated price comparisons, since it doesn't apply to me.

 

There are so many more choices now at NCL it is mind boggling.

 

You can cruise cheap with no frills in an inside and eat at the buffet.

You can add on UBP, specialty dining, unlimited internet. You can have a hot breakfast in your cabin even if you are not in a suite, albeit at a small charge, etc.

 

Carnival has lots less dining options.

 

On NCL, you can cruise in a full suite with some of the best perks in the biz.

 

Carnival does not have as many options... and especially for suite cruisers.

[SuiteCruiser]

You imply NCL is offering less. I have not investigated price comparisons, since it doesn't apply to me.

 

There are so many more choices now at NCL it is mind boggling.

 

You can cruise cheap with no frills in an inside and eat at the buffet.

You can add on UBP, specialty dining, unlimited internet. You can have a hot breakfast in your cabin even if you are not in a suite, albeit at a small charge, etc.

 

Carnival has lots less dining options.

 

On NCL, you can cruise in a full suite with some of the best perks in the biz.

 

Carnival does not have as many options... and especially for suite cruisers.

 

NCL had all of those things for years (other than the unlimited internet). We're discussing a list of changes that have been made where fees are raised, services cut back, and you said Carnival was going the other way.

Edited December 23, 2015 by SuiteCruiser

[GoAndHaveFun]

Wait, at one point UBP was for everyone in the room? When was this? I remember for my cruise this past May in the Haven, we all had UDP but only parents had UBP while brother and I got soda package. For the longest time I thought it was UDP and UBP for everyone in the room for that trip but I guess it wasn't the case.

[mugtech]

So Carnival is offering more for less cost?

Yes, the opposite of bait and switch, it's a switch and bait.

[SuiteCruiser]

Wait, at one point UBP was for everyone in the room? When was this? I remember for my cruise this past May in the Haven, we all had UDP but only parents had UBP while brother and I got soda package. For the longest time I thought it was UDP and UBP for everyone in the room for that trip but I guess it wasn't the case.

 

I don't remember that being the case either. I always thought it was UDP for all and UBP for the first two.

 

The crazy thing is that if you buy the UBP, everyone in the cabin 18 or older has to buy it, yet if they give it out for the service fee, it's not the case. I guess only those who pay hundreds for it are more likely to scam drinks for their cabin mates?