Carnival Corp "leaving HMC alone"

[FlaMariner]

So looks like no pier for HMC but that may be a good thing.  Looks like Carnival Corp is developing another private island.  Hope this means HMC is here to stay and the Carnival ships will no longer call....And paradise remains?

 

https://www.thestreet.com/investing/carnival-unveils-a-surprise-answer-to-royal-caribbeans-cococay

 

 

[albingirl]

Well, Carnival ships are never there when Holland America is, so I don't see how this makes any changes for HAL.  One of my favorite cruise stops, that's for sure.  

[rkacruiser]

The battle of Private Islands has been underway for awhile.  This news is not a surprise to me.  If any have read my posts when I returned from my experience on MSC's Ocean Cay, you may remember that I said Half Moon Cay was in danger of being "left behind".  

 

Half Moon Cay is a wonderful island experience.  Just no debate about that.  But, it has reached its limits as far as development, I think.  There is nothing to compare to Ocean Cay's Yacht Club experience.  

[jeh10641]

Carnival is not developing another private island. It is building on Grand Bahama near the city of Freeport. About $200,000,000 to $300,000,000.

[AFNavigator]

On 5/20/2022 at 3:36 PM, FlaMariner said:

 Hope this means HMC is here to stay and the Carnival ships will no longer call....And paradise remains?

Carnival likely will continue to call at HMC even with a new resort at Freeport.  HAL only sails in the Caribbean late October through mid April.  HMC would sit idle for 6 months a year if Carnival ships didn't use it.  That may sound like a good thing on the surface but tropical island infrastructure tends to decay fast if not used and maintained frequently.  Without that spring/summer Carnival use, spinning up HMC after 6 months of non-use would be a huge and costly job.

[FlaMariner]

6 hours ago, AFNavigator said:

Without that spring/summer Carnival use, spinning up HMC after 6 months of non-use would be a huge and costly job.

 

When HAL owned HMC (pre Carnival) wasn't it left idle in the off season?

[CruiserBruce]

30 minutes ago, FlaMariner said:

 

When HAL owned HMC (pre Carnival) wasn't it left idle in the off season?

It was much less developed then.

[terrydtx]

After sailed on 4 HAL cruises with HMC on the itinerary, we have only been there once, the others canceled because of high winds, making using tenders too dangerous. That pier was sorely needed.

[CruiserBruce]

57 minutes ago, terrydtx said:

After sailed on 4 HAL cruises with HMC on the itinerary, we have only been there once, the others canceled because of high winds, making using tenders too dangerous. That pier was sorely needed.

On the other hand, we are 8 for 8 getting there, with only one challenging visit.

 

Pier would be nice, but I disagree...not sorely needed.

[Homosassa]

Any HAL cruise we have been on that had Half Moon Cay scheduled for a port of call, we made HMC.

 

The reason Half Moon Cay is such a beautiful beach is because there has been no channel dredging and jetty building for a cruise ship pier.

 

Such development destroys a beach as the natural ebb and flow of the sand on the beach is destroyed.

 

One can see the destruction of HMC of the beach in the area of the jetty and channel for the tenders. Hurricanes have removed the beach area that butted up to the channel.  Last time I was there (precovid in 2019), the beach area that contained the children's water play park and the sandy beach walk to the large party villa was washed out from previous storms.

 

The stairs to the beach in that area was closed as the stairs ended several feet about the narrow strip that remained.

 

I don't know if the area has been repaired.

 

 A good example of this is the rocky private beach known as Princess Cay. When the beach was first used by Regency Cruises it was a beautiful wide sand beach with a sandy bottom. Regent used the ships tenders to go ashore which anchored in about two feet of water and one went over the side.

 

While MSC now also has a private island that has a pier, it is an island that is being reclaimed from the industrial wasteland it was when the island was stripped of its sand to be used to refurbish beaches elsewhere.

 

As a reclaimed island, the sand on its beaches and under the water contains bits of coral from whatever area was mined for its sand.

 

 

Edited May 22, 2022 by Homosassa

[rkacruiser]

8 hours ago, Homosassa said:

As a reclaimed island, the sand on its beaches and under the water contains bits of coral from whatever area was mined for its sand.

 

Yes, water shoes are recommended, but, I am unsure about Ocean Cay's beaches.  Heard no comments about that after MSC Meraviglia visited Ocean Cay.  

 

9 hours ago, CruiserBruce said:

On the other hand, we are 8 for 8 getting there, with only one challenging visit.

 

Pier would be nice, but I disagree...not sorely needed.

 

I have been more successful in making Half Moon Cay visits than not.  

 

A "maybe" interesting story for some:  a Christmas/New Year's sailing from Port Everglades for both my Prinsendam and the Maasdam.  Both ships first port of call was Half Moon Cay.  Maasdam sailed first; Prinsendam sailed a few minutes later.  Before we sailed, our Captain announced that we were skipping Half Moon Cay because of the weather forecast which predicted tendering would not be possible.  We would proceed to our next port and would arrive early.  The Maasdam's Captain chose to go to Half Moon Cay and found that the weather forecast was correct.  Tendering could not be accomplished.  

 

Half Moon Cay can be a crap shoot.  A pier would be helpful, but, even with pier at Ocean Cay, the wind and sea conditions also prevent MSC ships from docking there.  

 

22 hours ago, jeh10641 said:

Carnival is not developing another private island. It is building on Grand Bahama near the city of Freeport. About $200,000,000 to $300,000,000.

 

May not be a true private "island".  But, how do you think their marketing department is going to describe it?  

[CruiserBruce]

@rkacruiser, another common issue, dockwise, is Grand Turk. Enough wind there, and the ships can't dock, due to cross winds. So docks are always the savior.

[rkacruiser]

12 minutes ago, CruiserBruce said:

@rkacruiser, another common issue, dockwise, is Grand Turk. Enough wind there, and the ships can't dock, due to cross winds. So docks are always the savior.

 

When one visits Grand Turk and sees the narrow channels along the piers, I wonder why it would not have been a wiser idea to dredge much wider areas in order to allow the ships to more easily dock.  

 

[CruiserBruce]

9 minutes ago, rkacruiser said:

 

When one visits Grand Turk and sees the narrow channels along the piers, I wonder why it would not have been a wiser idea to dredge much wider areas in order to allow the ships to more easily dock.  

 

But that gets deeper into environmental issues. As I imagine putting a big dock at HMC would. Of course when they put that channel in for the tenders, that wasn't much better.

[AFNavigator]

20 hours ago, CruiserBruce said:

On the other hand, we are 8 for 8 getting there, with only one challenging visit.

 

Pier would be nice, but I disagree...not sorely needed.

The HMC pier project may not be cancelled after all.  Some news articles appear to say it is off due to the Grand Bahamas project being started.  That is not what Christine Duffy said in her speech though.

 

Immediately following a quote from her about the $200M Grand Bahamas resort, this article, http://www.tribune242.com/news/2022/mar/11/here-stay-and-bringing-1000-jobs/?news, then quotes her as saying:

“Also $100m of enhancements are planned for the island of little San Salvador home to the beautiful beaches of Half Moon Cay. This project will include a new tender marina and a pier that will accommodate larger ships including our spectacular new flag ship Mardi Gras which was inaugurated last year and Carnival Celebration which we will unveil later this year in Miami."

[jeh10641]

rkacruiser,

Probably not a "private island" but maybe a private resort?

 

Jim 

[rkacruiser]

12 hours ago, AFNavigator said:

the Grand Bahamas project

 

Thanks for the link to Ms. Duffy's comments.  I guess "Grand Bahamas"/Freeport did not initially sink into my mind.  Does CCL see Margaritaville at Sea a competitor of which CCL needs to be concerned?  

 

12 hours ago, AFNavigator said:

Also $100m of enhancements are planned for the island of little San Salvador home to the beautiful beaches of Half Moon Cay. This project will include a new tender marina and a pier 

 

Why is a new tender marina needed if there is a new pier?  And, where might that pier be located?  

[fatcat04]

I was thrilled to read this. HMC is so naturally lovely. Edenic really. We have only missed going once when the weather would not cooperate.  A small price to pay for such a pristine natural place. 

[NCTribeFan]

I have been to HMC many times (mostly on Carnival before I started sailing HAL).  Have missed it only once (Hurricane Sandy). I love it. IMO, there have already been too many "improvements" to the island.

 

I was just at MSC's Ocean Cay in late April.  It will be nice in a few years after the vegetation grows in.  I prefer HMC, though.  I prefer somewhere relatively sedate with a beautiful beach and view of the water.  Sure, it was nice to walk off the ship but taking a tender just isn't a big deal to me.

 

And i personally can't see HMC with a ship the size of Mardi Gras docked there.  Way too many people.  They'll need to build more bars.  And restrooms.  And big cabanas with blaring music to house large groups. 

 

They'll end up ruining a beautiful island paradise.

[Kamfish642]

Half Moon Cay is beautiful "as is."  Please leave alone, since I enjoy just the beach experience.  Leave Coco Cay to those younger folks and families looking for an amusement park experience.

[Oceansaway17]

On 5/20/2022 at 7:51 PM, rkacruiser said:

The battle of Private Islands has been underway for awhile.  This news is not a surprise to me.  If any have read my posts when I returned from my experience on MSC's Ocean Cay, you may remember that I said Half Moon Cay was in danger of being "left behind".  

 

Half Moon Cay is a wonderful island experience.  Just no debate about that.  But, it has reached its limits as far as development, I think.  There is nothing to compare to Ocean Cay's Yacht Club experience.  

I do agree with you.  time for a dock.  HMC has one of the nicest curved beaches with great sand.

But with MSC, RCI, and Disney having docks, it is time I think to get one for HMC.  I would like to see it still stay as nice but a dock would help.

[rkacruiser]

11 hours ago, NCTribeFan said:

I was just at MSC's Ocean Cay in late April.  It will be nice in a few years after the vegetation grows in.  I prefer HMC, though.  I prefer somewhere relatively sedate with a beautiful beach and view of the water. 

 

As I have posted, in my opinion, Ocean Cay, as it develops, will be the competitor to be in the cruise industry.  There is so much potential.  On Half Moon Cay, there needs to be an upscale beach experience similar to MSC's Yacht Club.  HAL provides something like that now with the cabanas and the Lobster dining venue (whatever it's name is).  But, it is not as upscale as MSC's YC facility.  

[AFNavigator]

6 hours ago, rkacruiser said:

 

As I have posted, in my opinion, Ocean Cay, as it develops, will be the competitor to be in the cruise industry.  There is so much potential.  On Half Moon Cay, there needs to be an upscale beach experience similar to MSC's Yacht Club.  HAL provides something like that now with the cabanas and the Lobster dining venue (whatever it's name is).  But, it is not as upscale as MSC's YC facility.  

While CCL ponders starting their HMC pier project, it would be great to see them pour some maintenance money into the existing HMC structures.  The cabanas look nice from a distance but close up, you can see many are very weather worn and in need of new paint and refreshing some of the wood railings and steps.

 

When we were at HMC in December, some of the cabanas looked like they hadn't been worked on for years.  Two days later, we were at Amber Cove, also a CCL property, and the cabanas there looked much nicer, were larger, had more amenities (wifi for one, I believe), yet were priced significantly lower than the HMC cabanas.  CCL could also stand to plant trees near the beach to replace ones destroyed by previous storms.

[Florida_gal_50]

4 hours ago, AFNavigator said:

While CCL ponders starting their HMC pier project, it would be great to see them pour some maintenance money into the existing HMC structures.  The cabanas look nice from a distance but close up, you can see many are very weather worn and in need of new paint and refreshing some of the wood railings and steps.

 

When we were at HMC in December, some of the cabanas looked like they hadn't been worked on for years.  Two days later, we were at Amber Cove, also a CCL property, and the cabanas there looked much nicer, were larger, had more amenities (wifi for one, I believe), yet were priced significantly lower than the HMC cabanas.  CCL could also stand to plant trees near the beach to replace ones destroyed by previous storms.

Those cabanas at amber cove look really nice.  If I remember correctly they are over the water.

[AFNavigator]

31 minutes ago, Florida_gal_50 said:

Those cabanas at amber cove look really nice.  If I remember correctly they are over the water.

Amber Cove actually has 3 sets of cabanas.  "Ocean" (the ones built over the water), "Poolside", and "Hillside".   All have cable TV, WIFI, air conditioning, etc., and Hillside even have hot tubs.  All accommodate up to 8 guests.  If CCL is willing to invest $100M in a "new tender marina and pier", they could sure afford to spend a little on maintaining, or upgrading, the HMC cabanas.