MV Portland Bay Recovery Attempt.

[Mr Princess]

 

Following on from the recent rescue of the disabled MV Portland Bay cargo vessel off the coast of Sydney, and as a frequent cruiser out of Sydney, I wonder how the Australian Maritime Safety Authority (AMSA) would handle a similar emergency with a cruise ship of 100,000+ tonnes.

Would they have the tug boat capability to bring that size vessel to port, even if it was stranded, powerless, just out of Sydney in a 7-9m swell, or would the crew and passengers ( many aged & frail) have to endure days on board in those terrible conditions?

If you too have concerns, as I have, drop the AMSA  an email, and ask.

Regards,

MP.

 

 

 

 

 

[MMDown Under]

12 minutes ago, Mr Princess said:

 

Following on from the recent rescue of the disabled MV Portland Bay cargo vessel off the coast of Sydney, and as a frequent cruiser out of Sydney, I wonder how the Australian Maritime Safety Authority (AMSA) would handle a similar emergency with a cruise ship of 100,000+ tonnes.

Would they have the tug boat capability to bring that size vessel to port, even if it was stranded, powerless, just out of Sydney in a 7-9m swell, or would the crew and passengers ( many aged & frail) have to endure days on board in those terrible conditions?

If you too have concerns, as I have, drop the AMSA  an email, and ask.

Regards,

MP.

 

 

 

 

 

I did think of the Costa Concordia disaster and hoped the Government had strategies in place to handle if a passenger ship lost power in similar circumstances. 

[Docker123]

A few years ago there a cruise ship which kept breaking down. After about a lot of repair stops, it broke down entirely in Bass Strait. Norwegian Star, 2017.

 

A/Some very large tugs we’re sent to tow it back to Melbourne.

 

I don’t know whose tugs, but there are some around the coast which can be deployed.

 

[OzKiwiJJ]

Don't cruise ships and other large ships have more than one engine? I seem to recall that Celebrity Solstice had two or more engines after seeing the presentation on how she was built when we were on her in 2019.

[Aus Traveller]

3 minutes ago, OzKiwiJJ said:

Don't cruise ships and other large ships have more than one engine? I seem to recall that Celebrity Solstice had two or more engines after seeing the presentation on how she was built when we were on her in 2019.

I believe so. In 2013, the Dawn Princess on its world cruise, lost power in one engine when it was in 'pirate waters' off Africa. It proceeded at a slower speed on one engine.

[Rassa]

30 minutes ago, Docker123 said:

A few years ago there a cruise ship which kept breaking down. After about a lot of repair stops, it broke down entirely in Bass Strait. Norwegian Star, 2017.

 

A/Some very large tugs we’re sent to tow it back to Melbourne.

 

I don’t know whose tugs, but there are some around the coast which can be deployed.

 

I remember that well when Star was at Station Pier after it had been towed there.  I was leaving on a cruise on Radiance and the CD made a joke about we were going and Star was not - of course he would when it was a different cruise line.  When googled it appears it was a propulsion problem.  

[Aus Traveller]

24 minutes ago, Aus Traveller said:

I believe so. In 2013, the Dawn Princess on its world cruise, lost power in one engine when it was in 'pirate waters' off Africa. It proceeded at a slower speed on one engine.

Correction. I think this incident was in 2011.

[arxcards]

Cruise ships have lost total power, but I am not aware of any in rough seas close to the coast. The Carnival Spam cruise comes to mind - oops, that was on Carnival Splendor.

 https://www.theguardian.com/world/2010/nov/10/carnival-splendor-towed-san-diego

 

Part of the findings from that was that a cruise ship power could no longer be totally lost from a single engine room fire, and that at least one engine have separate controls. With multiple engines and more than one control room, that would be unlikely to be repeated.

 

If a 7-9 metre swell was present off a departure port, I think it likely the cruise line would delay the sailing for passenger comfort alone. There is also a likelihood that port authorities would close the port to such a departure.

 

Cruise ships are much more stable than empty cargo ships. They don't need to pump ballast water into the holds to be stable. That would make them easier to tow than a vessel being bounced around by waves. We have tugs capable of doing the job.

 

SOLAS has a pretty long list of safety requirements. The greatest risk to life at sea is fire, and there is inherit risk in any type of travel. A ship in harbour is safe, but that is not what ships are built for.

[NSWP]

Great work by the Tug crews, a couple of them on Channel 9 this morning.   Big insurance claim going in I bet, those tugs and crews don't come cheap when they out working 24/7 for a few days.

[NSWP]

2 hours ago, Docker123 said:

A few years ago there a cruise ship which kept breaking down. After about a lot of repair stops, it broke down entirely in Bass Strait. Norwegian Star, 2017.

 

A/Some very large tugs we’re sent to tow it back to Melbourne.

 

I don’t know whose tugs, but there are some around the coast which can be deployed.

 

There are two massive sea tugs stationed at Eden. 

 

Edited July 7, 2022 by NSWP

[lyndarra]

I was on HAL Volendam when it had a power failure somewhere between Darwin and Singapore. IIRC there was a problem with one or more of its generators. We drifted about on a dead calm sea for a couple of hours until it got going again. All power was shut down except emergency supply to the bridge and the casino!!

[JohnGc]

I was on the Ovation when we left Wellington and stopped in the shipping channel'. Good job the weather was calm, that is a lot of ship to get blown around. This was a following report.

 

On November 18, 2019, at ~7:30 pm, upon leaving Port Wellington NZ (near Steeple Rock), the cruise liner suffered an engine issue resulting in temporary loss of power (and propulsion) and drifting. Luckily, the weather was favourable and two tugboats were quickly dispatched to assist the ship. After ~30 min, the mechanical fault was fixed and the liner was able to continue the voyage as planned.

 

 

[MicCanberra]

Bad report, the Ovation is not a liner.

[JohnGc]

42 minutes ago, MicCanberra said:

Bad report, the Ovation is not a liner.

Yes I noted that, they must of been on the Titanic 😊

[MicCanberra]

Cunard's QM2 is the only cruise liner left in operation as far as I know.

[JohnGc]

4 hours ago, MicCanberra said:

Cunard's QM2 is the only cruise liner left in operation as far as I know.

I suppose now that modern ships can handle bad sea conditions fairly well on long ocean voyages, such as Transpacific cruises, the need for ocean going liners that were built specially for those conditions are no longer required.

[arxcards]

20 minutes ago, JohnGc said:

I suppose now that modern ships can handle bad sea conditions fairly well on long ocean voyages, such as Transpacific cruises, the need for ocean going liners that were built specially for those conditions are no longer required.

It is just in the terminology. Cruise ships are for holidays, cruise liners are for transport. Way back when, ships were used for emigration and transport, with the Transatlantic route being the most frequented. The decline of passenger liners was due to the advent of reliable international passenger flights.

 

In that sense, QM2 isn't really a liner either. Sure, some passengers use a Transatlantic as a line voyage instead of flying, but most just board again and do the return trip, aka a B2B cruise. 

[JohnGc]

4 minutes ago, arxcards said:

It is just in the terminology. Cruise ships are for holidays, cruise liners are for transport. Way back when, ships were used for emigration and transport, with the Transatlantic route being the most frequented. The decline of passenger liners was due to the advent of reliable international passenger flights.

 

In that sense, QM2 isn't really a liner either. Sure, some passengers use a Transatlantic as a line voyage instead of flying, but most just board again and do the return trip, aka a B2B cruise. 

Thanks for your reply. I don't know if you are interested, as I am in the history of ships, if so the following article is good.      https://www.chriscunard.com/history-fleet/ocean-liners/#:~:text=Ocean Liners are designed to,the coast%2C sailing between ports.

[MicCanberra]

33 minutes ago, arxcards said:

It is just in the terminology. Cruise ships are for holidays, cruise liners are for transport. Way back when, ships were used for emigration and transport, with the Transatlantic route being the most frequented. The decline of passenger liners was due to the advent of reliable international passenger flights.

 

In that sense, QM2 isn't really a liner either. Sure, some passengers use a Transatlantic as a line voyage instead of flying, but most just board again and do the return trip, aka a B2B cruise. 

While most of what you said is correct , the QM 2 has a totally  different  hull structure to cruise ships and their cruising speed and comfortability reflect this.

[JohnGc]

28 minutes ago, MicCanberra said:

While most of what you said is correct , the QM 2 has a totally  different  hull structure to cruise ships and their cruising speed and comfortability reflect this.

Queen Mary 2 was intended for regular scheduled crossings of the Atlantic Ocean; the final construction cost was approximately $300,000 per berth. The cost was increased by the high quality of materials; having been designed as an ocean liner, 40% more steel was required than for a standard cruise ship.  ( wikipedia.)

Edited July 9, 2022 by JohnGc

[arxcards]

10 minutes ago, MicCanberra said:

While most of what you said is correct , the QM 2 has a totally  different  hull structure to cruise ships and their cruising speed and comfortability reflect this.

Yes, the liner days were all about speed. QM2 was built with speed in mind, but  also partly compromised by the need to be a good cruise ship too. She likely has the fastest top speed of any current passenger ship, but doesn't use it - not because of comfort, but fuel economy. 10 years or so back when the price of fuel shot up, they added a day to each of their Transatlantic voyages, so they were no longer trying to get from Southampton to New York as quick as possible, which is against the ethos of a line voyage. Even at speed though, QM2 is quite comfortable.

 

Yes, a cruise ship is generally built for comfort, and will usually slow down when conditions aren't favourable. On one of our Noumea to Sydney crossings, Radiance was going 5 knots faster than we have travelled on QM2. The current must have been good that day, as we were going faster than the ship specs say for her top speed. It was a little less comfortable, but a fun afternoon to soak it up on the promenade deck.

 

 

[arxcards]

1 hour ago, JohnGc said:

Thanks for your reply. I don't know if you are interested, as I am in the history of ships, if so the following article is good.      https://www.chriscunard.com/history-fleet/ocean-liners/#:~:text=Ocean Liners are designed to,the coast%2C sailing between ports.

Pretty much. Thanks.

 

I have met Chris Frame on a couple of cruises, where he often lectures on the history of Cunard or cruising in general. I have long been a fan of his work.

[MicCanberra]

Most cruise ships have a top speed of 23 knots but they tend to cruise between 14-17  knots.

QM2 has a top speed of 34 knots and when we were on her (Fremantle to Capetown)  it was generally around 25 knots and very comfortable.

[NSWP]

Having been on QM2, the Brit Cunarders get offended when you call it a cruise...'It is a voyage.' Also likewise not a cruise ship or even a cruise liner, it is an 'Ocean Liner.'   Yes QM2 is the only one.  The other Cunarders like Queen Victoria and Queen Elizabeth are basically Vista Class ships much like the HAL collection of Vista Class ships...Noordam, Westerdam etc and P&O UK - Arcadia But the two Cunarders QV and QE are 'flashed up.'  and a few cosmetic differences.

[MMDown Under]

1 hour ago, NSWP said:

Having been on QM2, the Brit Cunarders get offended when you call it a cruise...'It is a voyage.' Also likewise not a cruise ship or even a cruise liner, it is an 'Ocean Liner.'   Yes QM2 is the only one.  The other Cunarders like Queen Victoria and Queen Elizabeth are basically Vista Class ships much like the HAL collection of Vista Class ships...Noordam, Westerdam etc and P&O UK - Arcadia But the two Cunarders QV and QE are 'flashed up.'  and a few cosmetic differences.

My dream was to cruise to London on an ocean liner.  Lucky you, where did you cruise on QM2?