Why only one "Splendor Class" ship?

[jetwet1]

Firstly, great thread, it's nice to see a thread on here discussing the actual ships and their design/workings rather than the "how can I sneak a bottle of JD on" threads :D

 

 

but, i would still think - that if they produced more dream class (largest) and a few spirit / modified-spirit (smallest of modern ships) - that if they wanted for that middle ground, they'd default to splendor class, not conquest. that's all i was sayin' :rolleyes:

 

Now here is something that has been going through my head of late.

 

What are they going to replace the Fantasy class with ? just keep build Spirit class and move the Conquest class down to operate the routes being run by the Fantasy class, or will we see CCL down gauge to a dedicated smaller class ?

 

As to the prospect of the Dream lacking deck space for the extra pax.

 

One thing I have noticed is more pax spending their sea days on their balconies, so it kind of becomes a non issue after a point, we will be on the Dream next year, a group of us have pretty much the whole of deck 8 aft as ours and are planing on spending most of our sea time there, if only they would put BBQ's on the wraps life would be so easy :D

[fpslim]

Some confusion might come from CCL themselves; as they offer multiple classifications for the same ship, depending on where you look:

 

http://www.carnival.com/FunShips.aspx

Triumph & Victory classified as Triumph class;

 

Or here:

 

http://www.carnival.com/CMS/Articles/history_virtual2.aspx

where CCL lists Triumph & Victory as "2nd Destiny class" and "3rd Destiny class"...

[Rowan555]

Now here is something that has been going through my head of late.

 

What are they going to replace the Fantasy class with ? just keep build Spirit class and move the Conquest class down to operate the routes being run by the Fantasy class, or will we see CCL down gauge to a dedicated smaller class ?

 

With the millions of dollars being put into the Fantasy class ships, I don't see Carnival even thinking about replacing them anytime soon - not for at least ten years or so. The Fantasy feels, to me, like a new ship, with the Evolutions of Fun upgrades, and I am as happy to sail on her as on much newer ships.

[Aplmac]

 

Not a pretty sight!

 

Mind you, the stern section portrayed isn't bad, even if it is/was Oasis-esque

but that overall bow-on shot doesn't show an attractive ship.

 

The bow section is weird, and what's with the hanging bridge? :confused:

 

.

[jetwet1]

Not a pretty sight!

 

Mind you, the stern section portrayed isn't bad, even if it is/was Oasis-esque

but that overall bow-on shot doesn't show an attractive ship.

 

The bow section is weird, and what's with the hanging bridge? :confused:

 

.

 

She still looks better than the Epic IMHO

 

 

With the millions of dollars being put into the Fantasy class ships, I don't see Carnival even thinking about replacing them anytime soon - not for at least ten years or so. The Fantasy feels, to me, like a new ship, with the Evolutions of Fun upgrades, and I am as happy to sail on her as on much newer ships.

 

I have to agree, the bolt on balconies are a nice addition, however the rest of the ship just leaves me cold, I am very much in the minority on that point I know, however when planning a fleet you have to look 10 + years out, design, construction etc, now at some point the Fantasy class will leave us, does CCL think it can grow is business enough to place Spirit class ships on 4/5 day cruises ?

[falkcor]

What are they going to replace the Fantasy class with ? just keep build Spirit class and move the Conquest class down to operate the routes being run by the Fantasy class, or will we see CCL down gauge to a dedicated smaller class?

 

i wouldn't think that carnival would build new ships much smaller if at all than the spirit class ships. they have a certain economy of scale in spirit class that obviously works for them.

 

and this is of course just my read / hypothesis, but i just can't see them building brand new fantasy class sized ships.

 

what i think would be more likely would be that as the destiny / conquest ships get older, they start to switch them out to the shorter itineraries currently run by the fantasy class.

 

you're already seeing that in destiny, the first big ship to run exclusively the shorter 4-5 day trips... and this fall, the triumph will debut out of new orleans with several of the shorter itineraries as well.

 

i'd think they'd move the big ships to shorter itineraries roughly in order of age - as you're already seeing with destiny and triumph. my bet would be that victory is next, followed by conquest, etc.

 

that being considered, you'd think that any new ships they debut would run the premium 7 night sailings, etc. that's part of why i'd assume they don't build ships much smaller than the spirit class, imo. ;)

[falkcor]

Some confusion might come from CCL themselves; as they offer multiple classifications for the same ship, depending on where you look:

 

http://www.carnival.com/FunShips.aspx

Triumph & Victory classified as Triumph class;

 

Or here:

 

http://www.carnival.com/CMS/Articles/history_virtual2.aspx

where CCL lists Triumph & Victory as "2nd Destiny class" and "3rd Destiny class"...

 

exactly... i really think it's just on the front-line consumer marketing that they're classified as the 'triumph class'...

 

calling the triumph and victory their own class, when they're just like destiny with an added mini passenger deck, would be like renaming a car model every year because there are some new features...

[falkcor]

Not a pretty sight!

 

Mind you, the stern section portrayed isn't bad, even if it is/was Oasis-esque but that overall bow-on shot doesn't show an attractive ship.

 

The bow section is weird, and what's with the hanging bridge? :confused:

 

the bow section is weird - i don't know why they didn't just build the bridge into the ship lol.

 

the only nice thing i could say about the bow is... LOOK AT THAT POOL! now that was a smart idea ;)

[ksatte03]

The pool at the bow is the coolest thing ever! I would be in there all day yelling "i'm the king of the world!!!!!!"

[*Mach*]

From your lips to God's ears (or Carnival's CEO)!

 

My only fear is we are going to loose our Spirit class ships to the "home ports"

 

For me, its a no brainer with Legend/Valor and Miracle/Freedom doing the same itenerarys, spirit class always wins!

 

 

With the increasing demand for different ports of call the current classes of ships are of limited help.

The Spirit class are relatively fast at 22 knots and the new Dream is a tad faster at 22.5 knots.

I'd expect to see ships of a somewhat smaller capacity than the Dream Class sailing to new and perhaps a bit more exotic ports at higher speeds. They could command a higher price and increase the profit margin perhaps even catering to a slightly more upscale Carnival customer...

:)

[jimbo5544]

With the increasing demand for different ports of call the current classes of ships are of limited help.

 

The Spirit class are relatively fast at 22 knots and the new Dream is a tad faster at 22.5 knots.

 

I'd expect to see ships of a somewhat smaller capacity than the Dream Class sailing to new and perhaps a bit more exotic ports at higher speeds. They could command a higher price and increase the profit margin perhaps even catering to a slightly more upscale Carnival customer...

 

:)

Now that would be very interesting. Wonder how much faster they would need in order to: 1. get where they needed to go to (assuming you are correct in your assumption. 2. Does that equal more profit? Even more interesting is attracting a slightly more upscale Carnival customer. I am not sure that softening or blending the lines would work in the industry but it sure is thought provoking.

[MamaParrotHead]

I've only sailed Triumph and Valor thus far, with Glory on deck. We're big OV fans and as much as I'd like to try a Spirit class ship...they don't have many (if any) true OV's (unobstructed). That really turns me off, as we have no need for the extra expense of a balcony nor do we want to drop down a category to the insides.

[glrounds]

I LOVED the Splendor.....which really surprised me because I am not a big fan of the Conquest class ships.

 

I'm hoping that will be true for me also. I really didn't like the Conquest Class (mainly because the entire Lido Deck was surrounded with glass and steel):( and fell in love with the Spirit Class, probably because the aft Lido Deck is almost entirely exposed to the OPEN SEA :)and the layout resembles the Fantasy Class so much.

[fpslim]

From your lips to God's ears (or Carnival's CEO)!

 

My only fear is we are going to loose our Spirit class ships to the "home ports"

 

For me, its a no brainer with Legend/Valor and Miracle/Freedom doing the same itenerarys, spirit class always wins!

 

I'm know I'm in the minority here, as I prefer the Conquest class.... I prefer the Lido pool area, much more open on the Destiny/Conquest/Splendor classes.

I didn't care for how it's divided on the Spirit class...

Just my opinion...

[jimbo5544]

I've only sailed Triumph and Valor thus far, with Glory on deck. We're big OV fans and as much as I'd like to try a Spirit class ship...they don't have many (if any) true OV's (unobstructed). That really turns me off, as we have no need for the extra expense of a balcony nor do we want to drop down a category to the insides.

 

I hear you but I would think that with all the newer ships, the class of room that is taking the hit (in terms of raw numbers) would be OV (less #'s as a % of total rooms as well). I don't know that but would be surprised if it was not true.

[jetwet1]

With the increasing demand for different ports of call the current classes of ships are of limited help.

 

The Spirit class are relatively fast at 22 knots and the new Dream is a tad faster at 22.5 knots.

 

I'd expect to see ships of a somewhat smaller capacity than the Dream Class sailing to new and perhaps a bit more exotic ports at higher speeds. They could command a higher price and increase the profit margin perhaps even catering to a slightly more upscale Carnival customer...

 

:)

 

But they already have ships for the slightly more upscale CCL pax, they are called Princess.

 

As to the higher speeds.....

 

Now that would be very interesting. Wonder how much faster they would need in order to: 1. get where they needed to go to (assuming you are correct in your assumption. 2. Does that equal more profit? Even more interesting is attracting a slightly more upscale Carnival customer. I am not sure that softening or blending the lines would work in the industry but it sure is thought provoking.

 

Of course the speed required depends on the destination and the travel time, however what I will say is (without checking my data so I stand to be corrected) above 26 knots the power required to increase the speed by 1 knot is doubled, so if your talking about a distant port in a short time frame then the amount of fuel used will make for very poor economics.

 

Take a look for the story of the Olympic Voyager, a ship that was built for just this type of thing and how it was a total money pit.

 

You also need to consider the way the ship will ride at these speeds, true liners have a very different hull design to cruise ships, there is a picture floating around of the QV and the QM2 doing the tandem crossing off the Atlantic, the picture illustrates very well how the hull of the QM2 cut's through the waves and the QV just crashes into them.

 

I was on the Zuiderdam (a Spirit class ship) back in 2004 trying to avoid hurricane Ivan, the seas were rough, nothing as extreme as I have seen and the ship just did not ride well at all, while it was ok at 15-16 knots, I hate to think what the ride would of been like at anything higher.

 

So in closing my long winded post, what I would actually like to see CCL do is put in place a secondary loyalty program, where a cruise on Carnival means something when your booking on Cunard or HAL or Princess, rather or as well as the lines own loyalty program, that way if you want to take a longer cruise you still gain a little, if you see where I am coming from.

 

Carnival itself will keep on doing what it's good at, providing a good product at a good value.

[jimbo5544]

But they already have ships for the slightly more upscale CCL pax, they are called Princess.

 

As to the higher speeds.....

 

 

 

Of course the speed required depends on the destination and the travel time, however what I will say is (without checking my data so I stand to be corrected) above 26 knots the power required to increase the speed by 1 knot is doubled, so if your talking about a distant port in a short time frame then the amount of fuel used will make for very poor economics.

 

Take a look for the story of the Olympic Voyager, a ship that was built for just this type of thing and how it was a total money pit.

 

You also need to consider the way the ship will ride at these speeds, true liners have a very different hull design to cruise ships, there is a picture floating around of the QV and the QM2 doing the tandem crossing off the Atlantic, the picture illustrates very well how the hull of the QM2 cut's through the waves and the QV just crashes into them.

 

I was on the Zuiderdam (a Spirit class ship) back in 2004 trying to avoid hurricane Ivan, the seas were rough, nothing as extreme as I have seen and the ship just did not ride well at all, while it was ok at 15-16 knots, I hate to think what the ride would of been like at anything higher.

 

So in closing my long winded post, what I would actually like to see CCL do is put in place a secondary loyalty program, where a cruise on Carnival means something when your booking on Cunard or HAL or Princess, rather or as well as the lines own loyalty program, that way if you want to take a longer cruise you still gain a little, if you see where I am coming from.

 

Carnival itself will keep on doing what it's good at, providing a good product at a good value.

 

Well thought out reply. There are supposed to be an overhaul of the loyalty program coming. You make a valid point of being able to sue the other CCL products. We'll see what happens.

[DarthGrady]

With the increasing demand for different ports of call the current classes of ships are of limited help.

 

The Spirit class are relatively fast at 22 knots and the new Dream is a tad faster at 22.5 knots.

 

I'd expect to see ships of a somewhat smaller capacity than the Dream Class sailing to new and perhaps a bit more exotic ports at higher speeds. They could command a higher price and increase the profit margin perhaps even catering to a slightly more upscale Carnival customer...

 

:)

 

They must have had Spirit floored as we were leaving Vancouver in May. She was doing 24 knots, maybe she got the sport package....:D

[lidodeckbound]

You had me at burrito bar. :cool:

[jimbo5544]

They must have had Spirit floored as we were leaving Vancouver in May. She was doing 24 knots, maybe she got the sport package....:D

You must have been going downhill

[jessemon]

I was looking at a comment about the Fantasy Class and the Spirit Class pertaining to size and profit....

The Fantasy Class ships carry 2052 pax with a tonnage of 70,367.

The Spirit Class ships carry only 72 more pax while having 18,000 more tons of space. Of course they make up the dollars with all the balconies at a higher price....

I agree with what someone mentioned I can't see the Fantasy Class going anywhere with the dollars being invested and the economical situation of the times.

Believe it or not I love the Fantasy Class. I like the size. I wish though they would find an area to put in a more upscale (pay for) restaurant....;)

[Nunu]

This thread has helped us decide on trying the Splendor next spring.

[maxamuus]

They must have had Spirit floored as we were leaving Vancouver in May. She was doing 24 knots, maybe she got the sport package....:D

 

Planes get tail winds....maybe you had a stern wave?

[jetwet1]

I was looking at a comment about the Fantasy Class and the Spirit Class pertaining to size and profit....

The Fantasy Class ships carry 2052 pax with a tonnage of 70,367.

The Spirit Class ships carry only 72 more pax while having 18,000 more tons of space. Of course they make up the dollars with all the balconies at a higher price....

I agree with what someone mentioned I can't see the Fantasy Class going anywhere with the dollars being invested and the economical situation of the times.

Believe it or not I love the Fantasy Class. I like the size. I wish though they would find an area to put in a more upscale (pay for) restaurant....;)

 

One thing to remember, the Spirit class has a lot more open spaces than the Fantasy class, that helps with the tonnage a bit.

 

Planes get tail winds....maybe you had a stern wave?

 

Or a stern wind, it does help believe it or not !

 

Actually the cruise speed is 22 knots, flank I think is around 25-26

[jimbo5544]

This thread has helped us decide on trying the Splendor next spring.

You have made a good choice. Class of ship aside, the Splendor is a beautiful ship. True there are issues (like having to go up to to get across the ship), but the +'s outweigh the -'s by a far amount. We will be on her Sunday for the 2nd time. Really looking forward to it.