Muster -- inside or outside?

I'm wondering which lines are doing muster drill inside these days. On our last Carnival cruise, I was distressed to find they were still doing it outside, in the heat. Took forever and I was crammed against the wall behind many taller people. Princess and Celebrity at least had the good sense to hold the drill in theaters and lounges. What does HAL do?

On my last cruise on Eurodam, three years ago, it was held outside. Could have changed by now.

Yes but doing it outside at least gets you to your actual life boat

Both have merits

Cunard from memory was inside also

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Oceania on their larger ships it is inside ..smaller ships in & out

I'm wondering which lines are doing muster drill inside these days. On our last Carnival cruise, I was distressed to find they were still doing it outside, in the heat. Took forever and I was crammed against the wall behind many taller people. Princess and Celebrity at least had the good sense to hold the drill in theaters and lounges. What does HAL do?

All three of our HAL cruises we mustered outside next to the lifeboat we were assigned to.

DCL some of the muster locations were inside, majority were outside.

Carnival, we started inside and then were walked outside (up stairs!!!!) to the boat we were assigned.

HAL does it outside. Princess and Celebrity do it inside. We are sticking to the lines we have cruised in the past year since others may have changed.

Hank

Cunard from memory was inside also

 

 

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That is correct. You never actually go to the lifeboats - you are not assigned a specific one just a muster station. You also have to take your life preserver with you to the muster station and put it on when instructed.

HAL always has their lifeboat drills outside -- no matter the weather.

We have stood in the hot sun -- stood in sweeping rain.

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Carnival, we started inside and then were walked outside (up stairs!!!!) to the boat we were assigned.

Carnival's Fantasy class has 5 out of the 6 muster stations start inside, then go outside.

The rest of Carnival's fleet has the whole muster at the actual loading areas.

Holland does it out side ...

It depends more on the ship design than on any particular cruise line's policies. The flag state and the classification society will review a proposed station bill (the big chart that shows where all muster locations are and where all crew are to be stationed in an emergency), and determine if inside locations will meet the requirements to move all the guests mustered there to the lifeboats in a timely fashion. So, the availability of large public spaces close to the boat embarkation area, and their access to those embarkation areas (passageway sizes and number of doors) will determine if inside locations can be used for muster locations. Also, the size of the promenade deck at the boat locations will determine if mustering is allowed there, and still have room for guests to pass by on the way to their stations.

Depending on ship RCI holds them outside, or a combination of inside and outside locations, and does not require you to take or wear the life jackets in recent years in our experience. The required quantity of life jackets are stored at or near each muster station as well as in the staterooms to the occupancy capacity of each room.

And as indicated it is not a matter of "good sense" to move them indoors but a matter of function regarding accessing lifeboats in a real muster situation. Muster is not held for the comfort of the passengers but to provide a functioning plan for the passengers and protocol with the crew to assure as safe and complete an evacuation of the ship in case of a real emergency.

HAL also requires those on longer cruises to attend every muster drill. This can become a mild pain since HAL will often have many cruise segments. On a 28 day cruise (last fall) from Quebec to San Diego we had to attend 3 drills in the first 10 days (Quebec, Boston and Ft Lauderdale). But some other lines such as Princess only require that you attend 1 drill...and will excuse passengers from repeated drills due to cruise segments.

Hank

...On our last Carnival cruise, I was distressed to find they were still doing it outside, in the heat. Took forever and I was crammed against the wall behind many taller people.... What does HAL do?

I understand your frustration and discomfort, as I am claustrophobic myself. I would have moved, if I were in this situation. You are still present for muster - no big deal to move to a more open place where you are more comfortable.

Additionally, I see you found the Holland America board once before; that would be the best place for your research and questions instead of this general forum. Just a suggestion. :)

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/forumdisplay.php?f=171

Have fun. :)

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Yes but doing it outside at least gets you to your actual life boat

You never actually go to the lifeboats - you are not assigned a specific one just a muster station.

And as indicated it is not a matter of "good sense" to move them indoors but a matter of function regarding accessing lifeboats in a real muster situation. Muster is not held for the comfort of the passengers but to provide a functioning plan for the passengers and protocol with the crew to assure as safe and complete an evacuation of the ship in case of a real emergency.

Inside muster stations are a much better process. In some cases, such as the Costa Concordia, some of the lifeboats may be unusable due to the listing of the ship. People assigned to those lifeboat stations would have been at risk by going directly there. With the new requirements to meet at the muster stations in an inside area, people can be quickly directed to the nearest lifeboat station that is still functional. Much better than having to wander around the ship trying to find a lifeboat because your assigned one is non-functional.

Inside muster stations are a much better process. In some cases, such as the Costa Concordia, some of the lifeboats may be unusable due to the listing of the ship. People assigned to those lifeboat stations would have been at risk by going directly there. With the new requirements to meet at the muster stations in an inside area, people can be quickly directed to the nearest lifeboat station that is still functional. Much better than having to wander around the ship trying to find a lifeboat because your assigned one is non-functional.

Not aware of any "requirement" to muster indoors, it was initially started when the public spaces grew to the point where the promenade decks no longer could accommodate the mustered passengers and still allow passage for others, and the lines found that mustering indoors was a better way to "herd" large numbers of people, but there is no legal requirement to do it that way, that I am aware of.

Not sure why the guests assigned to muster at a lifeboat that was unusable due to listing would be "at risk". I believe most of the Concordia's muster stations were at the boats. If the boat is not launchable due to list, the crewmember in charge of the muster location would direct the passengers to a new boat or a raft. But remember, there is only a little over 100% passenger capacity in the boats, so if one side's worth of boats isn't usable, then 50% of the passengers are "at risk", whether they mustered at the boat or in the MDR.

HAL also requires those on longer cruises to attend every muster drill. This can become a mild pain since HAL will often have many cruise segments. On a 28 day cruise (last fall) from Quebec to San Diego we had to attend 3 drills in the first 10 days (Quebec, Boston and Ft Lauderdale). But some other lines such as Princess only require that you attend 1 drill...and will excuse passengers from repeated drills due to cruise segments.

 

Hank

We used to be excused from HAL's lifeboat drills for the other segments. But after the Costa Concordia accident that all changed.

P&O has lifeboat drills indoors, which makes them useful if the emergency is slow-developing and there's plenty of time, but less so if the ship is going to roll over quickly and the deck is the place to be. But they don't insist on weekly or fortnightly repeat drills on world cruises. There's only so many times you can be told not to sit on the rails and to do what the crew tells you before it ceases to add value.

On Concordia, the fact that half the lifeboats were unusable should have been irrelevant. Certainly with hindsight, and even probably with foresight had there been a competent person in charge, the correct action would have been to get the passengers to shore from the usable lifeboats, and bring the lifeboats back for second and third runs if required, until all the passengers were ashore. If the ship is in trouble miles out to sea, that wouldn't work.

On Concordia, the fact that half the lifeboats were unusable should have been irrelevant. Certainly with hindsight, and even probably with foresight had there been a competent person in charge, the correct action would have been to get the passengers to shore from the usable lifeboats, and bring the lifeboats back for second and third runs if required, until all the passengers were ashore. If the ship is in trouble miles out to sea, that wouldn't work.

The Concordia was a unique situation. The ship settled on the bottom near shore and rolled about 45 degrees, making the upside lifeboats unusable. Then it was stable. If the ship had drifted out to sea instead of onto shore, the situation with the lifeboats would have been catastrophic if the ship listed as much. In that scenario, the operational lifeboats would not have been able to discharge passengers on shore and go back for more.

In the case of the Concordia, there have been many reports of passengers attempting to reach their assigned lifeboat stations only to find them unusable when they got there. They then had to climb back down a steeply tilted deck and across the interior of the ship to look for a usable lifeboat on the other side. If the ship had been rapidly sinking rather that settling onto rocks, they would have wasted critical minutes going to their assigned stations and having to turn back to find a usable lifeboat, and potentially might have been caught inside the ship as it sunk. In such a case they would have been much better off mustering at a central location and following the crew's directions to usable lifeboats.

If anything positive can be said about that disaster, it is that the ship did not sink in deeper waters. Otherwise, I hate to imagine the death toll that would have occurred.