HAL considering going totally non-smoking?

[MadManOfBethesda]

Lee Memorial Health System, which is one of the largest hospital systems in Florida, with 15 campuses, has completely banned smoking & use of any tobacco product, on all of their properties, including all outside areas leased or owned by the system..

 

Many other local businesses have jumped on board, as well!

 

 

I have no problem with any private enterprise making a business decision to ban smoking. I wouldn't even have a problem with HAL making the decision to ban smoking if they believed that it would help their bottom line.

 

What I do have a problem with - and strongly object to - are people who make an informed decision to cruise on a line with liberal smoking policies, and then whine incessantly that it ruined their cruise.

[sail7seas]

Of course, rather than leave a cruise line with which a person has sailed dozens of times, they can attempt to have the smoking policy altered. ;)

 

We should all feel free to express our choices and opinions.

If we don't like something the way it is, we can make an effort to have it changed.

I fear HAL be attracting smokers from other lines that have more rigid smoking policies.

On our recent Westerdam cruise, I heard someone refer to HAL as becoming "Ashtray of the Seas." We didn't much like that.

 

 

 

[MightyQuinn]

Just FYI - in British Columbia (Canadian province) you cannot smoke on the outdoor patios at restaurants.

You're right Ya Ya.

BC has long been a leader in passing legislation that limits smoking in public places. And maybe soon, coming to a Vancouver beach or park near you .... http://www.globaltvbc.com/health/Smoking+considered+city+parks+beaches/2466057/story.html

[hulamoon]

Ashytray of the Sea!!!:eek: Now that's a marketing plan.

 

I have spent half of yesterday on this thread and the other half investigating Marina.

 

More than any thread this one has helped me clarify the difference between hoping for change and accepting that change has already happened.

[donh1]

Don't you just love these smoking threads. I'm in the non-smoking / been negatively impacted by smokers camp. There is no point in trying to reason with someone who continues to smoke even after being clearly informed of the health hazard. Trying to reason with someone who has the kind of logic to defend their habit and rights is pointless. We all have the right to breath clean air. Smoking policy should be focus on that right.

I strongly believe it's only a matter of time until HAL will be swept up in the healthy movement toward a very restrictive smoking policy.

Meanwhile smokers should enjoy it while it lasts.:)

[Zappa Fan]

Zappa Fan,

 

Thank you for your kind comment. While on board the Veendam, we decided to book a transatlantic crossing with Oceania. We are now doing a b2b cruise on the Regatta's November'10 sailing. HAL smoking policy made the decision easier.

 

http://www.cruisecritic.com/memberreviews/memberreview.cfm?EntryID=61359

 

Hmmmmm.... going to take a look at what you've booked! :)

 

If you haven't seen this review, you'll enjoy it. I'm thinking that the Marina looks good in the future.

 

I still adore HAL, btw, but am willing to cut down on the ciggies in order to try Oceania.

 

Happy Friday!

[pms4104]

If the changes have been made, why keep sending out the survey? It gives false hope to those who want further restriction.

Yeah, I wondered about that a couple of pages ago.

 

Smoke and mirrors, perhaps?

[RuthC]

I strongly believe it's only a matter of time until HAL will be swept up in the healthy movement toward a very restrictive smoking policy.

One of the things I learned early on in the management game is never present a problem without presenting a viable solution.

Please, share with us your vision of what the smoking policy should be.

[sail7seas]

Permit smoking in Sports Bar, Casino Bar and perhaps one section in Crows Nest

Permit smoking on one side of outside decks.

 

No smoking on verandas.

 

I'm open to discussion re: smoking in cabins.

 

Succint, direct and very clear what I suggest. ;)

 

 

 

[suse]

Permit smoking in Sports Bar, Casino Bar and perhaps one section in Crows Nest

Permit smoking on one side of outside decks.

 

No smoking on verandas.

 

I'm open to discussion re: smoking in cabins.

 

Succint, direct and very clear what I suggest. ;)

 

 

 

Good ideas except for the smoking in cabin. The smell lingers in the bed, curtains, carpet and so forth. The smokers can say oh no, it doesn't, but it really does. They like pulling your leg on that one.

I was on one cruise where 2 ladies across the hall were smoking so much that they had their cabin door open 24/7. It was so icky. I cannot begin to tell you how disgusting that was and not only that, they were laying in bed smoking! Nothing like falling asleep in bed with a ciggie. The smell in the hallway was horrible but the fear in my heart was constant. I was terrified of a fire.

 

I vote for no smoking in bed, er, staterooms.:eek:

[donh1]

My suggestion would be a designated smoking area on one of the outside decks (definitely aft) and a glass enclosed area ventilated to the outside somewhere inside the ship convenient to the smokers . Smoking anywhere else will result in getting booted off the ship. Crew members could negotiate for their own areas.

Canadians in Ontario are very familiar with our Tim Horton's coffee shops who had what we referred to as fish bowls within the coffee shop. It was a glass enclosed ventilated smoking section. It solved the problem for Tim Hortons.

Ontario has since gone smoke free in all restaurants so the smoking has stopped and the fish bowls are gone.

Again breathing clean air is a fundamental right. Anyone who thinks otherwise should try holding their breath for 10 minutes.

Seriously, I believe even the worst die hard smoker could live with these conditions. A good compromise that eliminates the lion's share of the complaints is what is needed. As the numbers of smokers dwindles so does their power. Smokers have a lot riding on finding a workable solution. To simply say people bothered by cigarette smoke should find another ship is wrong.

[HouseRulz]

As a smoker I have to say that not being able to smoke for an entire cruise would be extremely difficult. However, I agree that every effort should be made to ensure that no non-smoker has to smell smoke. As the crackdown on smoking has continued in recent years, most smokers have become accustomed to having to be inconvenienced to smoke (i.e. going outside of a hotel even though your room is on the 40th floor, having to put on your coat to go outside of a restaurant, etc.). I think the best example of how to deal with this is provided by stadiums/arenas. These facilities understand that it is a virtual impossibility to eradicate smoking, but they also provide as little space as possible for smokers. I think smoke-free is going overboard (no pun intended), but I also think that way less than half the ship's outdoor spaces should be designated as smoking. I would be in favor of a small smoking area in the Lido/Pool area, one bar, and the casino (we can't give preference to one vice over others can we?). As for cabins, I have to confess that I thought it was alright to smoke on the Veranda; never gave a thought to stagnant smoke when their isn't wind. Perhaps also a suitable number of cabins (based on survey responses) on each of the veranda floors, stacked on top of each other, and clearly labeled as "smoking cabins", so that non-smokers who were easily irritated by smoke could avoid the area. I think this type of plan would recognize that unfortunatly (shame on me!) there are still many smokers, and they will smoke; at the same time practically eliminating inconvenience to non-smokers.

 

Oh and if you are on the Eurodam on the 27th and see me smoking, feel free to slap me!! ;)

[Copper10-8]

deleted

[sandypaper]

As a smoker I have to say that not being able to smoke for an entire cruise would be extremely difficult. However, I agree that every effort should be made to ensure that no non-smoker has to smell smoke. As the crackdown on smoking has continued in recent years, most smokers have become accustomed to having to be inconvenienced to smoke (i.e. going outside of a hotel even though your room is on the 40th floor, having to put on your coat to go outside of a restaurant, etc.). I think the best example of how to deal with this is provided by stadiums/arenas. These facilities understand that it is a virtual impossibility to eradicate smoking, but they also provide as little space as possible for smokers. I think smoke-free is going overboard (no pun intended), but I also think that way less than half the ship's outdoor spaces should be designated as smoking. I would be in favor of a small smoking area in the Lido/Pool area, one bar, and the casino (we can't give preference to one vice over others can we?). As for cabins, I have to confess that I thought it was alright to smoke on the Veranda; never gave a thought to stagnant smoke when their isn't wind. Perhaps also a suitable number of cabins (based on survey responses) on each of the veranda floors, stacked on top of each other, and clearly labeled as "smoking cabins", so that non-smokers who were easily irritated by smoke could avoid the area. I think this type of plan would recognize that unfortunatly (shame on me!) there are still many smokers, and they will smoke; at the same time practically eliminating inconvenience to non-smokers.

 

Oh and if you are on the Eurodam on the 27th and see me smoking, feel free to slap me!! ;)

 

 

LOL.....I love your sense of humour! I to am a smoker and agree with all the things you've mentioned. I will be on the Zuiderdam May 29th so please feel free to slap me also. :-)

[DizzyDallasDi]

What I do have a problem with - and strongly object to - are people who make an informed decision to cruise on a line with liberal smoking policies, and then whine incessantly that it ruined their cruise.

 

Bravo! I think you and I are the only ones on this thread that "get it."

[hulamoon]

I mentioned earlier in this thread that I checked the smoking policy of the other cruise ships listed on cruise critic. I couldn't actually make heads or tails of Carnivals but it hasn't been on my radar so didn't take notice.

 

But I just did a random check of who is ending or beginning cruises in HNL and saw the Spirit. So I investigated their policy. Turns out they do not allow smoking in Spa rooms, (something I have suggested before on other threads):rolleyes: or the suite accomodations. I don't know how it works for the line or guests but it is interesting to me that one of the CCL family has given it a try. Anyone know how it is working? Or is it a headache for the line and guests?

[DutchByAssociation]

ok KK .. you opened the door on this one

 

tell us who "the few heavy smokers in Seattle" are

 

IMHO, it's one thing to comment about smoking ..

 

however, it's an entirely different thing to "point the finger" especially if you don't identify the "CEO's etc"

 

please share your information with the board

 

I'd love to know too... and I work at the HQ... ;)

 

Sure there are people there that smoke, but the company has some fantastic programs in place for those that would like to quit. I don't see any more smoking at the HAL HQ than I do anywhere else, and the 4th floor (primarily the executive offices/area) is far from the ashtray that previous post makes it out to be.

 

You want an industry where "EVERY EMPLOYEE" smokes? Food service. My decade + in that industry tells me that most restaurant employees are smokers to some degree.

 

Me? Never had the desire... not even a puff.

[DutchByAssociation]

If the changes have been made, why keep sending out the survey? It gives false hope to those who want further restriction.

 

Because the policy is constantly being reviewed as trends in society change. If levels stay about the same... no huge need for further restrictions. If suddenly 99% of those forms on every ship start saying "non smoking" and stayed that way for the forseeable future... Bet you'd see some changes.

 

How do you propose, if these surveys are removed because they create "false hope" as you put it, (although I've previously identfied many changes these forms have helped bring about) that HAL find out the opinions of the guests on board with regard to this topic?

[Copper10-8]

I'd love to know too... and I work at the HQ...

 

Sure there are people there that smoke, but the company has some fantastic programs in place for those that would like to quit. I don't see any more smoking at the HAL HQ than I do anywhere else, and the 4th floor (primarily the executive offices/area) is far from the ashtray that previous post makes it out to be.

 

You want an industry where "EVERY EMPLOYEE" smokes? Food service. My decade + in that industry tells me that most restaurant employees are smokers to some degree.

 

Me? Never had the desire... not even a puff.

 

Maybe this helps!:cool:

 

[Zappa Fan]

Awwww, John.... don't be the next guy with the "funny/amusing" pictures, huh? :( (Luv you, man!)

[hulamoon]

I am glad to know it isn't a false hope and someday more change may occur.

My concern remains though, as more ships restrict cabin/balcony smoking more smokers will be filling out the survey.

[mechcc]

First of all - I am a smoker. A closet smoker (don't smoke around hubby and have no problem not smoking on a vacation but come that first day back at work and I have to have a smoke).

Honestly hate smoking in the cabins. The smell does linger plus it penetrates into the passageways. Have actually seen smokers who smoke in their cabins and keep the door open to the hallway to disperse the smoke!!!!

Smoking on balconies - have a mixed view on that one. Since smokers are rarer and rarer, I actually feel that the aft half of one side should be smoking. The rest non smoking. Cigars and Pipes should not be allowed on balconies regardless of where they are located and even outdoor common areas limited.

[MATHA531]

Of course it's time for this. Nobody's lungs should be forced to absorb the carcinogens these cancer sticks emit. When you get to a port, you can go off and smoke to your heart's content; not in any enclosed place where I must endure this garbage.

[momofmeg]

Bravo! I think you and I are the only ones on this thread that "get it."

 

Di, the problem is, just a few years ago-the policy was liberal on all lines. and because the smokers were more "evened out" over the lines, I never found this that much a problem on any line except Carnival. It had been almost 2 years since I had cruised HAL. I had not realized how much the HAL demographics of smokers had changed since Celebrity's policy had changed. I probably will go else where in the future where before booking HAL, or else just book an ocean view or inside room, if I really want the itinerary offered by HAL.

 

And that saddens me, because I love that HAL serves the best food, and it not kid friendly; and except for the smoking issue, I find HAL is the best mainstream line hands down.

[momofmeg]

I am glad to know it isn't a false hope and someday more change may occur.

My concern remains though, as more ships restrict cabin/balcony smoking more smokers will be filling out the survey.

 

Exactly, and because the other lines have restricted smoking, HAL will become the "smoking line," and not only the "smoking line," but the line that attracts chain smokers who are heavily addicted, as moderate smokers will probably still cruise their actual favorite line.