China Visa denied update

[amster65]

:rolleyes: Personally if it was me, I would have never put those felonies on that form. At least you would have a chance that they would not investigate any further. Might not have worked, but who knows.

[sail7seas]

I've never applied for a Visa to PRC.........

 

Does it specifically ask the question: Have you been convicted of a felony?

 

[Christine Frances]

I hope this can be opened - it is an application for a Chinese Visa with instructions. Hope this helps:)

 

 

https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&pid=explorer&chrome=true&srcid=1R06A0fxsn338jZfusDNDwLpuNl_ysy33HDQnp7Veb4CQ-us0HvbebKz7v73_&hl=en_US

[6rugrats]

Agree as OP admits to booking the cruise a year in advance but not to getting around to applying for the visas until after final payment was applied, which IMHO to put it midly is using poor judgement.

 

But a single entry visa is only good for 90 days, so OP couldn't have applied any earlier. And yes, the form asks, "Do you have any criminal record in China or in any other country?"

 

In any case, OP has not been back to any of the threads he started about this problem.

[sail7seas]

Thanks.

 

Yes, I noticed OP has not returned to this thread or the one on the other Forum.

 

I really don't blame him for not posting again but hope he read the threads.

[tcook052]

But a single entry visa is only good for 90 days, so OP couldn't have applied any earlier.

 

Who says he could only apply for a single entry visa? As I mentioned in post#71 OP could've applied for even a double entry permit and had 180 days validity and it would've cost only a few dollars more but would've been money well spent IMHO.

[callmedeb]

There is also a secret Visa that is good for multiple entries for up to two years. You have to know someone or be going with a VIP to get this.

 

I had the most surreal experience getting them for a deligation from Toronto. Dropped off the passports in the morning, picked up and paid for the visas the same afternoon.

 

I went to the back door of the consulate and knocked.

 

"Who is your contact?"

 

"Grace"

 

pause

 

"Grace is not a Chinese name"

 

Repeat for 20 minutes.

 

LOL.

 

Deb

[xxoocruiser]

There is also a secret Visa that is good for multiple entries for up to two years. You have to know someone or be going with a VIP to get this.

 

 

2 Year Chinese Visas are not a secret. Anyone can apply for it . You don't have to know someone or being going with A VIP to apply for a 24 month Visa. Just check out the China Embassy Website : http://www.china-embassy.org/eng/hzqz/zgqz/t84246.htm

US Citizens can apply for a:

Single Entry

Double Entry

6 Month Multiple Entry

12 Month Multiple Entry

24 month Miltiple Entry

[SixOneTwo]

Having a bit of experience in applying for Chinese visas on behalf of business travelers, and even traveling to a Chinese consulate in the US to conduct other business, I can vouch for the fact that dealing with the PRC is like your absolute worst day at the Department of Motor Vehicles...even when you are not at their mercy.

 

May I suggest two possible options? 1. Contact a Visa Service. If you're going it alone, a service may be able to provide great knowledge from experience. 2. Contact an immigration attorney or an attorney who specializes in Chinese adoptions, who know the ins-and-outs of obtaining visas for incoming and outbound China travelers. Surely the costs of consulting these experts would be well worth the peace of mind they will likely bring. The previous suggestions of contacting the US Embassy in China or any of your Congresspeople are also good.

[cccole]

Having a bit of experience in applying for Chinese visas on behalf of business travelers, and even traveling to a Chinese consulate in the US to conduct other business, I can vouch for the fact that dealing with the PRC is like your absolute worst day at the Department of Motor Vehicles...even when you are not at their mercy.

 

May I suggest two possible options? 1. Contact a Visa Service. If you're going it alone, a service may be able to provide great knowledge from experience. 2. Contact an immigration attorney or an attorney who specializes in Chinese adoptions, who know the ins-and-outs of obtaining visas for incoming and outbound China travelers. Surely the costs of consulting these experts would be well worth the peace of mind they will likely bring. The previous suggestions of contacting the US Embassy in China or any of your Congresspeople are also good.

 

I am learning so much from this thread. Do you suggest using a Visa Service even if you do not think you have any flaws in your record? Should you try dealing directly with the PRC before using a Visa Service? Again, thank you for your helpful post. Cherie

[woodley]

:rolleyes: Personally if it was me, I would have never put those felonies on that form. At least you would have a chance that they would not investigate any further. Might not have worked, but who knows.

 

 

you would then be guilty of wilfull misrepresentation which is also grounds for non issuence of a Visa. It would demonstrate to the authorities that you are dishonest. Not worth the risk...be honest.

[foodsvcmgr]

In addition to PRC and Canada, what other countries may prove to be problematic for an in-transit cruise passenger with an old criminal offense?

 

This could be an issue on multiple port European and Caribbean itineraries

if not clearly known or understood in advance, particularly where a Visa is NOT required, i.e. Canada.

[HamburgAvonLady]

I am learning so much from this thread. Do you suggest using a Visa Service even if you do not think you have any flaws in your record? Should you try dealing directly with the PRC before using a Visa Service? Again, thank you for your helpful post. Cherie

 

In my opinion ---Yes, I will use a visa service when the need arises. We used http://www.itseasyvisaservice.com in NYC for our Brazilian visas two years ago and had them back in under a week !!! and we live at the opposite end of the state.

[cccole]

In my opinion ---Yes, I will use a visa service when the need arises. We used http://www.itseasyvisaservice.com in NYC for our Brazilian visas two years ago and had them back in under a week !!! and we live at the opposite end of the state.

 

Your .02 cents is important to me. Thank you for the website. I got Australian visas on-line for my kids last year, and visas to Zambia at the airport. I will use the website you provided when going to South America next year. I just never thought of using a service instead of going directly through the country involved. Thank you. Cherie

[tcook052]

I will use the website you provided when going to South America next year. I just never thought of using a service instead of going directly through the country involved. Thank you. Cherie

 

Note that while they offer an expedited service the cost of using the visa service firms can be double or triple what the actual visa costs are if done directly though that country's consulate or embassy so buyer beware.

[WriterOnDeck]

I am learning so much from this thread. Do you suggest using a Visa Service even if you do not think you have any flaws in your record? Should you try dealing directly with the PRC before using a Visa Service? Again, thank you for your helpful post. Cherie

 

I think a visa service can be a good idea if you can afford it. We used gotorussia.com to get Russian Visas for a visit a couple of years ago. The application was confusing at times, and they were able to expedite the process so we were only without our passports for about 10 days. They also were able to arrange train service from Moscow to Moldova and other not-so-common travel. Even though my companion spoke Russian, it was very helpful.

[DiploTraveler]

From all the discussion, it makes me think twice about visiting China via a cruise. Maybe by air or some other low-risk method. If you need to hire a visa service and/or buy any-reason insurance to protect yourself from their bureaucracy... I just don't see the point. Sounds like Russia is equally problematic?

[DiploTraveler]

While I understand what you were saying about "no fault" being assigned IMHO there has to be consequences, not winner or losers, just consequences. I believe there was enough time to apply for a visa prior to final payment but so whatever reason OP chose not to.

 

Now that doesn't mean I'm a hard hearted guy who wishes OP ill as I don't and hope a solution can be found to his predicament.

I agree with you that there are just consequences. They've already happened and now all the OP can do is figure out what to do next. Unfortunately, some posters want to make it a contest between the OP and HAL as if they were battling it out... hence my previous post.

 

Regarding the OP squandering time away instead of applying for a visa, that's debatable. Travel savvy people may have researched all visa options, but I don't think it is unreasonable for someone to see "single entry" and think "oh, that's exactly what I need" and stop there.

 

Getting back to the point... the OP was denied his visa. It's passed cancellation date. HAL has warned the OP that they will deny him boarding if he attempts it. These are the consequences of his denied visa and all that is left is to make the next move. I hope the OP finds a solution and I also hope that HAL helps him find that solution and not just give him the cold shoulder.

[DiploTraveler]

World~Citizen made the point....... IMO, it is the whole point.

 

OP (and all of us) have the option to purchase HAL's 'Cancellation Coverage' that pays if you cancel for any reason.

 

Had OP purchased that coverage, which he could have done all the way up until final payment, he would be getting most of his money back.

 

Why should others pay for the coverage if 'exceptions' are made and some folks get their money back despite Not having purchased Cancellation Coverage?

 

I believe I made that point much earlier in this thread at Post #45.

 

I believe world~citizen also made it earlier but that point seems be overlooked in this converation.

 

Yes, there is that and there are hundreds of other insurance policies. They don't all cover the same thing and I don't think you should fault someone for not buying the "right" policy or multiple policies.

 

Anyway, that's besides the point, because I never said that HAL needs to refund this person. It's not HAL's fault. I just think HAL could help... whatever that means... I'll let HAL and the OP work out their options.

 

I made my previous post because some posters were quick to turn the OP's situation into a blame game instead of skipping the judgment and suggesting options/solutions.

[DiploTraveler]

Thanks.

 

Yes, I noticed OP has not returned to this thread or the one on the other Forum.

 

I really don't blame him for not posting again but hope he read the threads.

Honestly, he was probably scared off.

Or... maybe they worked something out and, being a newbie to CC, the OP didn't feel obliged to share with us. I'll stay optimistic and believe the latter until proven otherwise. :-)

[tcook052]

I agree with you that there are just consequences. They've already happened and now all the OP can do is figure out what to do next. Unfortunately, some posters want to make it a contest between the OP and HAL as if they were battling it out... hence my previous post.

 

Regarding the OP squandering time away instead of applying for a visa, that's debatable. Travel savvy people may have researched all visa options, but I don't think it is unreasonable for someone to see "single entry" and think "oh, that's exactly what I need" and stop there.

 

Getting back to the point... the OP was denied his visa. It's passed cancellation date. HAL has warned the OP that they will deny him boarding if he attempts it. These are the consequences of his denied visa and all that is left is to make the next move. I hope the OP finds a solution and I also hope that HAL helps him find that solution and not just give him the cold shoulder.

 

I think we're pretty much on a similiar wave length and will only add that IMHO had this been booked through a TA they might've prevented this senario by being more proactive than HAL at ensuring OP obtained the necessary visa.

[world~citizen]

Yes, there is that and there are hundreds of other insurance policies. They don't all cover the same thing and I don't think you should fault someone for not buying the "right" policy or multiple policies.

 

Anyway, that's besides the point, because I never said that HAL needs to refund this person. It's not HAL's fault. I just think HAL could help... whatever that means... I'll let HAL and the OP work out their options.

 

I made my previous post because some posters were quick to turn the OP's situation into a blame game instead of skipping the judgment and suggesting options/solutions.

 

I have compassion for the OP in the same way I have compassion for a person who suffers a catastrophic illness on a cruise and doesn't have insurance to cover it. Its a disaster. It may well ruin the finances of a family but it is unavoidable. Its not fair, but unavoidable at that point unless a charitable organization helps out. It stinks but that is the way we have organized human affairs. I don't like it but there it is.

 

If HAL sells a product to protect you from unforeseen trap doors and you don't buy it, I don't see how they could be expected to offer the benefits of that product for free. If you buy a car with a one year warranty and the engine blows up in two years, you can't claim the same relief as the person who bought an extended warranty.

 

Now you say HAL could help, but you are not sure how. Neither am I. I say that because I am not a lawyer. I do know though that if a business starts poking its nose around to provide benefits and services it is not paid or responsible for, then sometimes legally they can become responsible for it. That is a whole new can of worms HAL would not want to get into.

 

The very thoughtful post by Tamaracboy asks us if we want to live with corporations steeped in a litigious culture. We already do. I agree with him that it seems reasonable that cruise credits could be offered, even should be offered. It won't happen because the cruise contract doesn't provide for it and we live in a culture where lawyers call the shots more than maybe is healthy.

 

If we really want to do something about this, write your Congressman, your Senator and every relevant government agency you can think of as well as the industry itself and tell them you want the cruise contract brought into the 21st century. I would even settle for the 20th century.

 

In short, this isn't an issue that we can just say someone else should do something about this. YOU have to do it. WE have to do it. It won't help the poor OP, but maybe we can prevent others from suffering similar consequences.

 

We glamourize the market system and corporate culture and pet cruise lines for the wonderful benefits that accrue to us from them. Lets be clear, we don't get any benefit from them that isn't written down in the contract or that we are entitled to under law.

 

So whats it going to be? We can let the industry with its interest groups and their lawyers and PR flaks tell legislators what they want and get it, or we can do it. The industry has the money but we have the votes. Don't let legislators buy your vote with money from political contributions from the industry.

 

We are the bosses. We can change things. Is our concern for the unfortunate situation the OP finds himself in enough to motivate us to write our legislators and tell them we want the industry to bring the cruise contract into the 21st century?

 

Or will we wear our compassion on our sleeves and leave the heavy lifting to someone else?

 

Smooth sailing...

[Tamaracboy]

Your post is well taken.

............SNIP.......

HAL knows that people get caught in the no refund zone all the time. They developed the cancel for any reason waiver that would give pax an escape hatch. So now we are forced to answer the question: would it be fair to people who buy that waiver to rescue them from the draconian HAL cruise contract if those benefits were given away for free?

 

That, for me, is the Gocha. How do you get around it?

.............SNIP...........

Its a HAL of a way to learn a lesson.

 

I (for one, not that you did either) never assumed that the OP was trying to do an end run around the no refund period and/or lack of purchasing "any reason" insurance (nobody knows if or not he purchased any type of insurance).

I'm always willing to give the benefit of the doubt (until proven otherwise).

AND, I would never recommend to HAL, or any other company, that they acquiesce to scam attempts.

However, this does NOT seem to be the case here.

Parenthetically, here I must comment on the suspicious minds of some of the contributors to this thread.

I must state that these suspicions seem to come from

within

, as if those would be the motives of the

poster

projected upon the OP.

At least I don't think that way, and I am NOT naive.

It does seem that every case, treated on an individual basis, would be self evident which way could/should act, without ever cutting into their, financially very profitable, insurance sales.

Either way, YES the contract needs to be brought into the 21st century, because, if for no other reason, anyone who bothers to actually read the entire (extremely boring & convoluted) contract might understandably never sail again.

AND, if they were to modernize the contract on their own, they just might avoid Congress stepping in as they did with Airline contracts and regulations after successful massive public outcries, as you suggest above.

 

JMHO,

r.

[Bobblsc]

Tamaracboy, I quote "It is in the public domain since before the first national campaign that George W Bush has a conviction for DUI.

 

Follow this link for one of MANY:

 

http://articles.cnn.com/2000-11-02/p...PM:ALLPOLITICS

 

Nothing questionable or debatable here."

 

OK, I first read World Citizen's post as saying that Bush was refused a visa to enter Canada. I beleive there has never been a visa requirement for a U. S. citizen to enter Canada, so his post was suspect. Then I read the post again and saw that World Citizen did not literally say he was referring to a visa or even a refusal for entry to Canada. But I say literally. This whole thread has been about visa refusal. Therefore it appears that World Citizen was strongly implying visa or other refusal for entry. Therein was my basis for comment. I recall the press publishing the DUI information a few days before the 2000 election. I have no question of this fact.

 

But why, World Citizen, did you post about Bush? This thread is about a visa for China. George Bush and his DUI have absolutely nothing to do with the subject of this thread. I have a strong suspicion that you so posted to denigrate our past President. Thereby you have apparently treaded on the boundry of CC rules against political comments. Tell me that is not so, if you can.

 

Bob :cool:

[Bobblsc]

Double post by CC