Wonder Why Celebrity is accused of cutting corners and raising rates?

[coolmom]

Are you refering to me, Cruisingator?

 

Earlier in another thread I posted how nice the bath products were. Funny, I didn't see anyone jumping up and down about how some are not happy unless they have SOMETHING to sing praises about.

 

It's been several years since my husband and our friends cruised on Celebrity and it happened to be the Connie. The changes were noticeable. I don't need a midnight buffet, towel animals every night or even chocolates on the pillow. I'm over the whole baked Alaska parade. But the ship had a tired, neglected look about her that gave us the sads and it really apparent in the dining room.

 

BTW, none of us signed up for a future cruise. Another friend is sailing on a Silverseas 2-for-1 special, so I think I'll wait for one that has an appealing itinerary.

Edited July 24, 2014 by coolmom

[Ma Bell]

No moaning and groaning here either. I've been a Celebrity booster for many years and have always understood the changes they were making and supported them. I really feel there is a distinct change in quality and philosophy going on now. I hope I'm wrong and have taken a wait and see approach. If I come to the conclusion that the product is really headed downhill, I won't complain, I just wont be back.

[wallie5446]

Most here have an idea where we stand on the cut back, poor product, old looking ship, yada, yada, yada stuff, since we just booked our longest sailing in 25 years on Celebrity.

 

Yup it has changed, but not so bad as to turn us away. Just got a flyer in the mail for the Princess sailings from Houston, ( a short 1 hr flight, or 4 hr drive) the wife said not to even bother opening it.

 

Cheerleader? I dont think so, it has taken us 25 years to reach Elite cause we 'dated' around;)

[Cruising89143]

No moaning and groaning here either. I've been a Celebrity booster for many years and have always understood the changes they were making and supported them. I really feel there is a distinct change in quality and philosophy going on now. I hope I'm wrong and have taken a wait and see approach. If I come to the conclusion that the product is really headed downhill, I won't complain, I just wont be back.

 

I agree 100%. When I no longer like something I move on.

[bayonnejoe]

I have said this before, Celebrity is not the same experience it was that drew DW, her mom and dad, and myself to their brand. I still believe they give a good product for what the price, especially if you factor in the free beverage package. I hold no illusions about what the fare would be if we were to expect and get the same experience of the early days of Celebrity in food, entertainment, and service.

Edited July 24, 2014 by bayonnejoe

[NLH Arizona]

How about a naked flameless votive, is that something you'd equate to fine dining?

 

Ambiance plays an important part of the dining experience. If you look at google images for the best restaurants in the US, they all have either flowers or interesting candles. The San Marco on the Connie was dreary and rather sad, the most disappointing part of our cruise.

I really wouldn't care if the votives are on the table or not, naked or dressed. I guess we just go to different restaurants, because the majority I go to don't have flowers on the tables. Sometimes google images aren't always showing what is reality. I usually don't judge my dinner by what flowers or candles are on the table, I judge it by the service, the quality of the food and, probably most importantly, the company at my table, so I guess ambiance, as far as flowers or candles, doesn't play that big a part in my dining experience.

[Cruising89143]

Another article on today's earning call.

 

http://www.seatrade-insider.com/news/news-headlines/europe-asia-strength-buoy-royals-q2-company-sets-double-double-goal.html

[hvsteve1]

All of the cruise lines have been making changes over the years. Some have been good and some otherwise.

 

We started cruising with Regent (then Radisson) some ten years ago. We had our first cruise right after the line had decided to replace their mostly Scandinavian housekeepers with South Asians similar to most of their competition. There was much complaining and gnashing of teeth on the Regent boards when that happened. I have to say I had a problem on the cruise involving housekeeping. My cabin attendant was a nervous, inexperienced Filipino girl with almost no English. The housekeeping manager for my deck, who had to resolve the problem, was one of the last of the Scandinavians. I could see what the difference must have been in the old and new staff. However Regent made another change that was a sort of upgrade. When we first sailed, the Regent all-inclusive experience had a stocked bar in your room and anything you wanted to drink at lunch and dinner. However the lounges and bars were always empty because nobody wanted to pay for a drink in the lounge when they had complimentary liquor in their cabin and more waiting for them in the dining room. So the following year Regent made drinks anywhere on the ship complimentary. From then on people socialized in the lounges.

 

As Regent became more and more expensive and included shore excursions (which many cruisers didn't use) and airfares, we decided we couldn't cruise on a regular basis unless we made a change. So we tried Holland America a few times.

 

Again I saw many posts on CC complaining about cutbacks, especially in service and food quality. After two cruises we found that neither the service nor quality of the food was up to what we expect, even in the specialty restaurants. So here we are at X.

 

The point is, we are not going to stop cruising. However, we will change cruise lines. We left Regent and I'm sure others replaced us as I'm sure there will be some new customers for HAL, maybe those unhappy with some other less expensive cruise line. So long as there are a certain number of people cruising, I suspect all the cruise lines expect they will get their share.

[nekzaadvakil]

Having cruised on Celebrity Silhouette in 2013 and exactly a year later in 2014, I did notice some cutbacks, HOWEVER the cruise experience was just as good, if not better.

 

Some of these visible cutbacks were:

1. Fewer activity staff (4 in 2013, cut down to 2 in 2014) - However they worked really hard and ensured that we had a great time.

2. Chocolates on the pillows - In 2013, there was a different flavor every night, in 2014, it was a standard (but really tasty) plain milk Belgian chocolate.

3. No grand buffet in the MDR on the last sea day (although I'm sure that there were other reasons apart from cost to cut this down)

4. No chocolate covered strawberries in the room (Maybe because in 2014 we were not in a balcony room?)

 

However, the rest of the stuff was excellent:

1. The food in the windjammer and MDR were brilliant.

2. The burgers (veg, beef and turkey) at the Mast Grill were yet offered (we love Celebrity over Royal because of these burgers)

3. The service was outstanding.

4. Have you ever seen a Hotel Director on his feet chatting with passengers for hours on end asking if there was anything else his team could do to make things even better? Fabulous service

 

We all should be quite glad if celebrity can make a few changes and reduce costs (hopefully some of it will be passed on to us too). As many have said, it is a business at the end of the day, and if they manage to give us such amazing holiday experiences and memories, they do deserve to make some money as well.

 

Having said that, I must say that some of the new prices are just way up there. 2015 Scandinavian cruises for close to $3000 pp (Balcony) is just not affordable (for me).

[buzzybuzzbuzz]

There is definitely a drop in standards, we are just back from Eclipse and the cleaning standard was way below our last X trip.

 

In the Oceanview there was food debris gathered on the window frames, many times during Breakfast and Lunch there was insufficient cutlery.

 

On at least half the number of days on my pervious trip there was cleaning crew with paint brushes, cleaning the picture frames and kickboards. We didn't see that once this trip.

 

On 4 or 5 occasions I saw a senior housekeeping officer call someone to clean the lifts, again I have never seen that before.

 

The off-white chairs in the Martini Bar looked positively grubby.

 

The Cruise Director was awful as well, not a patch on Sue Denning or Alejandro.

 

I thoroughly enjoyed my cruise and the staff worked so hard, but if they are stretched too far something has to give. It is little surprise that Noro etc.. is on the increase.

 

I am looking at other lines for my next trip.

 

But let us not kid ourselves standards are slipping.

Edited July 25, 2014 by buzzybuzzbuzz

[terrierjohn]

If they continue cutting corners they won't appeal to passengers.

That leads to not making money. It is an issue.

 

-Marisa

Which particular corners would you be referring to?

[Orator]

Having cruised on Celebrity Silhouette in 2013 and exactly a year later in 2014, I did notice some cutbacks, HOWEVER the cruise experience was just as good, if not better.

 

Some of these visible cutbacks were:

1. Fewer activity staff (4 in 2013, cut down to 2 in 2014) - However they worked really hard and ensured that we had a great time.

2. Chocolates on the pillows - In 2013, there was a different flavor every night, in 2014, it was a standard (but really tasty) plain milk Belgian chocolate.

3. No grand buffet in the MDR on the last sea day (although I'm sure that there were other reasons apart from cost to cut this down)

4. No chocolate covered strawberries in the room (Maybe because in 2014 we were not in a balcony room

Having said that, I must say that some of the new prices are just way up there. 2015 Scandinavian cruises for close to $3000 pp (Balcony) is just not affordable (for me).

 

The cutbacks you mention are all positives to me:

1. I don't participate in the organized activities so the cutbacks don't affect me. Other staff have been given the opportunity to earn more $$$ by filling in.

2. Diabetic, so shouldn't be tempted by the chocolate.

3. Found Grand Buffet to be overly crowed. Saw lots of rudeness. Had health concerns.

4. I've been in AQ to Suites and don't remember ever receiving chocolate covered strawberries unless someone sent them as a gift.

 

We all look for and value different things. The cutbacks that matter most to me have been the reductions in Housekeeping staff. The Housekeepers are now required to handle more cabins and this has slowed service. Same is true with servers in the MDR.

The bottom line is that it's the bottom line. The ships sail full and Celebrity knows that if one customer leaves another will be there to take their place. The new cruiser will probably spend more and increase the bottom line.

RCL stock has hit a new high today.

Edited July 25, 2014 by Orator

[Quo Vadis?]

The new cruiser will probably spend more and increase the bottom line.

 

Celebrity has been increasing my bottom line for several years now. ;)

[Orator]

Celebrity has been increasing my bottom line for several years now. ;)

 

Here as well.

[Ma Bell]

The cutbacks you mention are all positives to me:

1. I don't participate in the organized activities so the cutbacks don't affect me. Other staff have been given the opportunity to earn more $$$ by filling in.

2. Diabetic, so shouldn't be tempted by the chocolate.

3. Found Grand Buffet to be overly crowed. Saw lots of rudeness. Had health concerns.

4. I've been in AQ to Suites and don't remember ever receiving chocolate covered strawberries unless someone sent them as a gift.

 

We all look for and value different things. The cutbacks that matter most to me have been the reductions in Housekeeping staff. The Housekeepers are now required to handle more cabins and this has slowed service. Same is true with servers in the MDR.

The bottom line is that it's the bottom line. The ships sail full and Celebrity knows that if one customer leaves another will be there to take their place. The new cruiser will probably spend more and increase the bottom line.

RCL stock has hit a new high today.

 

So as long as they don't cut things that you care about it's OK? I guess I have a different philosophy. Let's face it, you and I are going to be treated well regardless of what goes on. I, on the other hand, care about the total experience for everyone. In the end it will affect all of us.

 

I don't know how you can't think that service is probably the most important aspect of what made Celebrity great. If they don't use some of these increased profits to keep their standards high, they will lose their base and they will be just another average cruise line fighting for the same customers as all the others. For years, when someone asked me which cruise line they should choose, I could always highly recommend Celebrity. Is it going to get to the point where I have to say it doesn't matter because they're all the same?

[Orator]

So as long as they don't cut things that you care about it's OK? I guess I have a different philosophy. Let's face it, you and I are going to be treated well regardless of what goes on. I, on the other hand, care about the total experience for everyone. In the end it will affect all of us.

 

I don't know how you can't think that service is probably the most important aspect of what made Celebrity great. If they don't use some of these increased profits to keep their standards high, they will lose their base and they will be just another average cruise line fighting for the same customers as all the others. For years, when someone asked me which cruise line they should choose, I could always highly recommend Celebrity. Is it going to get to the point where I have to say it doesn't matter because they're all the same?

 

I DO think that service is the most important aspect. That's why I said that cuts in Housekeeping and MDR staff is important to me. Truth, as I see it, is that they are not interested in their old base. All indications are that they are trying to create a new base. High margin passengers and a younger demographic are the foundation of the new base. Some ideas will work, some won't. I'm certain that the bean counters have calculated what they might lose and what they might gain. The potential gain in margins outweighed the risk of losing a significant number of loyal customers. I know that we do get treated quite well. I believe our treatment is primarily the result of long, positive relationships with the fine people on the ships.

[Dr. Cocktail]

I DO think that service is the most important aspect. That's why I said that cuts in Housekeeping and MDR staff is important to me. Truth, as I see it, is that they are not interested in their old base. All indications are that they are trying to create a new base. High margin passengers and a younger demographic are the foundation of the new base. Some ideas will work, some won't. I'm certain that the bean counters have calculated what they might lose and what they might gain. The potential gain in margins outweighed the risk of losing a significant number of loyal customers. I know that we do get treated quite well. I believe our treatment is primarily the result of long, positive relationships with the fine people on the ships.

 

I am actually responding to both Orator and Ma Bell:

 

After 32 Celebrity cruises and 245 days on board, my partner and I said "farewell" last year. I am interested to read both of your comments as while you are trying to remain positive and have an obvious deep seated loyalty, there appears to be some nagging suspicions.

 

Ma Bell: Basically yes, they're all the same. How could they not be? Most of the major lines charge the same rates for the same itineraries. In fact, the newer the ship, the less that you are able to provide as you are still paying off the cost of said fabulous ship! You just have to pick an itinerary that you want and look at the pros and cons of each line for the particular date.

 

Orator: I would have agreed with your statement about service until our final Celebrity cruise on Summit. The less said about Celebrity's response to our situation the better - I don't feel like being attacked for my experience. Your previous cruises mean nothing when things go off the rails.

 

Both Ma Bell and Orator are where we were two years ago .... hoping for the best, fearing the worst and holding a steady course.

 

Unfortunately, the industry can no longer provide what we were used to on Celebrity for the price that we paid. It is a business as others have stated and the cruise lines have to make money. A lot of people are really unrealistic about what a quality product costs. Look at what a night at a comparable land based resort costs - say a Fairmont or Marriott and we have been getting away with murder.

 

I have been somewhat intrigued by the moaning and groaning by the Celebrity Loyalists about the product, not because I disagree with them but because I do. If they dislike it as much as I did, take the initiative and leave. Then again, I was willing to pay for a better product whereas most are not.

 

I have really enjoyed my subsequent cruises on Oceania and surprisingly LOVED my cruises in The Haven on NCL.

[wallie5446]

Truth, as I see it, is that they are not interested in their old base. All indications are that they are trying to create a new base. High margin passengers and a younger demographic are the foundation of the new base.

 

This was not the demographic invited to the Dallas Celebrity function last spring. The mix was 50/50 RCCL Crown & Anchor, and Celebrity Captain Club. Very few Diamond or Elite, most Emerald and Select, and the average age looked to be 50+. The walkers and scooters out numbered the families with children.

 

Now this said, our DD who is 31 got invited, she is Select, has 7 sailings, I have not looked to see her conversion points. Did more in her age group get invited and not show? No way to know. But those that did were our age. It was evident they were trying to reach out to customers with 4,5,6 cruises, and keep them coming back.

 

Now they have made the changes to Michaels for the loooooong term CC members like yourself, ( aint no way a younger demographic can get enough cruises in to join ya'll ) and those in upper suites.

 

As the best Chef to put together a menu for a cruise always said, " the proof is in the pudding". So if Miami is marketing to younger people, they forgot to tell the Reps out in the trenches.

[Orator]

I am actually responding to both Orator and Ma Bell:

 

After 32 Celebrity cruises and 245 days on board, my partner and I said "farewell" last year. I am interested to read both of your comments as while you are trying to remain positive and have an obvious deep seated loyalty, there appears to be some nagging suspicions.

 

Ma Bell: Basically yes, they're all the same. How could they not be? Most of the major lines charge the same rates for the same itineraries. In fact, the newer the ship, the less that you are able to provide as you are still paying off the cost of said fabulous ship! You just have to pick an itinerary that you want and look at the pros and cons of each line for the particular date.

 

Orator: I would have agreed with your statement about service until our final Celebrity cruise on Summit. The less said about Celebrity's response to our situation the better - I don't feel like being attacked for my experience. Your previous cruises mean nothing when things go off the rails.

 

Both Ma Bell and Orator are where we were two years ago .... hoping for the best, fearing the worst and holding a steady course.

 

Unfortunately, the industry can no longer provide what we were used to on Celebrity for the price that we paid. It is a business as others have stated and the cruise lines have to make money. A lot of people are really unrealistic about what a quality product costs. Look at what a night at a comparable land based resort costs - say a Fairmont or Marriott and we have been getting away with murder.

 

I have been somewhat intrigued by the moaning and groaning by the Celebrity Loyalists about the product, not because I disagree with them but because I do. If they dislike it as much as I did, take the initiative and leave. Then again, I was willing to pay for a better product whereas most are not.

 

I have really enjoyed my subsequent cruises on Oceania and surprisingly LOVED my cruises in The Haven on NCL.

 

The cuts in Housekeeping and Waiters has been most noticable to me. These are the people who are most in contact with passengers and can create a favorable or unfavorable impression. I don't know your particular situation! but it must have been very serious for you to give up a line you enjoyed. I really understand if you needed to deal with some of the people onshore. I got to the point with some of them that I never wanted to hear: "we appreciate your Loyalty." I was very close to jumping ship, but decided in the end that a few undertrained people wouldn't influence my onboard experiences. Toured Oceania Riveria and my DW just thought it was too small. I must say that service from Celebrity onshore has improved greatly since I became Zenith. Obviously they don't have the time or resources to give all what I get in terms of service, but they should surely try. Hope you enjoy your future cruises whatever line you cruise.

[cpj]

When it comes to the younger crowd,the ones I talk to they want nothing to do with Celebrity and Princess and Holland America. They like the Rccl ships the NCL ships and Carnival. And a lot of them like all incusive places like I did when I was younger. They dont want to be around the old people which includes me by the way. When I took my children and grand kids on a cruise it was RCCL freedom of the seas. When I brought up Celebrity they laugh at me and said they would be bored. Disney was another they wanted to do but since I was paying RCCL was a lot cheaper. If Celebrity really wants younger customers they going to have to add more bells and whistles.

[Ma Bell]

My kids and grand kids have really enjoyed their Celebrity cruises.

[Orator]

I was on a August Mediterrian cruise where there were 400+ people under 18. Guess that some of them might have enjoyed the experience. At least they appeared to be having fun.

[farmermd]

THe cutbacks affect the overall cruise experience. We notice and enjoy the small things - ice & water in the room, a single rose or carnation in the bathroom or on the dining room table, the different flavors of chocolate on the pillow, the welcome aboard champagne. We also love the big things - the sea day brunch, the live band on the pool deck, the orchestra and the dozen singers and dancers for the production shows, the pianist or acapella group in the lounges before dinner, the excellent service overall. Take all of this away and it feels like a Carnival or NCL cruise. I've always wondered why the pricing for Celebrity was so affordable for the product we were receiving. Now, not so much as these things are reduced or taken away. I don't buy a Cadillac expecting the features of a Ford.

 

And for those that say there will be passengers to replace those of us that chose to leave, don't count on that. I have read numerous articles stating the cruise execs are concerned with the number of new berths that have/will come on line in the coming years and how they are going to fill them.

 

Having said all of that, and after more than 15 cruises with Celebrity, we have been considering alternatives lately - luxury lines or all inclusive resorts or 'build your own' vacations to other parts of the world.

[cpj]

I was on a August Mediterrian cruise where there were 400+ people under 18. Guess that some of them might have enjoyed the experience. At least they appeared to be having fun.

Im sure they were having fun. I gave my kids a choice and they pick RCCL,that all Im saying if I would have took Celebrity Im sure they would have had a good time also. I still think the younger crowd want more to do then what Celebrity offers.

[Orator]

Im sure they were having fun. I gave my kids a choice and they pick RCCL,that all Im saying if I would have took Celebrity Im sure they would have had a good time also. I still think the younger crowd want more to do then what Celebrity offers.

 

My grand kids would most certainly prefer Disney and I hope to be able to take them.