Kevin Sheehan Resigns

[Uniall]

For starters, NCLH closed down 3.17% on Friday, not 6% as you've stated in your posts.

 

More importantly, the "personal reasons" explanation was not from an unnamed source, but rather from a conversation by a Wells Fargo analyst with Frank Del Rio and CFO Wendy Beck: "Following a conversation with Del Rio and Beck, Wells Fargo said..." http://www.seatrade-insider.com/news/news-headlines/wells-fargo-asks-what-is-going-on-at-norwegian.html

 

Finally, if Sheehan's departure was related to something that could be expected to impact NCLH's earnings, then NCLH is obligated to provide an explanation. If Sheehan's departure occurred because he just wanted to leave (for whatever reason...health...wanted to spend more time with his family...found a good fishing hole...) and there's no anticipated impact on earnings they don't have to say anything...because there is nothing of financial relevance to say.

 

The day of the resignation announcement, NCL's stock initially dropped 6% (it eventually closed down 3%) which prompted Jaime Katz (MorningStar Mutual Fund) to ask unamed sources: "Why" and was told personal reasons. The next day Wells Fargo Securities followed up and asked DelRio & Beck and was told personal reasons. These questions were asked because of the NCL stock held by these investment houses. As I've said before, the answer "personal reasons" is so meaningless that it is a non answer. So, the question why is still unanswered. Your conclusion that the non answer removes any issue of adverse impact on NCL financial (or operational?) condition is illogical and fallacious. You can't prove a positive with a negative.

[njhorseman]

The day of the resignation announcement, NCL's stock initially dropped 6% (it eventually closed down 3%) which prompted Jaime Katz (MorningStar Mutual Fund) to ask unamed sources: "Why" and was told personal reasons. The next day Wells Fargo Securities followed up and asked DelRio & Beck and was told personal reasons. These questions were asked because of the NCL stock held by these investment houses. As I've said before, the answer "personal reasons" is so meaningless that it is a non answer. So, the question why is still unanswered.Your conclusion that the non answer removes any issue of adverse impact on NCL financial (or operational?) condition is illogical and fallacious. You can't prove a positive with a negative.

 

Please explain to me how the resignation, regardless of reason, can be converted to something that projects an effect on future earnings? Unless he resigned or was fired for something that is going to show up on the balance sheet, who cares what the reason is? They have the obligation to report events that potentially affect earnings, such as the Insignia fire. They're not required to provide anything that doesn't have a quantifiable impact on earnings just for the purpose of satisfying anyone's curiosity. If you assume they're fulfilling their fiduciary obligation to report anything that affects earnings, then the "personal reasons" explanation is sufficient. The problem is that you're assuming they're hiding something from investors, without any evidence of that having occurred. Basically, you're calling Del Rio and Beck liars because in your mind they haven't reported a material fact...when there's not one iota of evidence that a material fact exists.

Edited January 11, 2015 by njhorseman

[sjbdtz]

The day of the resignation announcement, NCL's stock initially dropped 6% (it eventually closed down 3%) which prompted Jaime Katz (MorningStar Mutual Fund) to ask unamed sources: "Why" and was told personal reasons. The next day Wells Fargo Securities followed up and asked DelRio & Beck and was told personal reasons. These questions were asked because of the NCL stock held by these investment houses. As I've said before, the answer "personal reasons" is so meaningless that it is a non answer. So, the question why is still unanswered. Your conclusion that the non answer removes any issue of adverse impact on NCL financial (or operational?) condition is illogical and fallacious. You can't prove a positive with a negative.

 

 

a) How do you know the motivations of Wells Fargo AND the Morningstar fund?

 

b) It certainly seems reasonable that while he was on vacation with his family, the rumoured health issue may have proven likely to demand his full-time attention and so he submitted his resignation.

 

c) It's your opinion that the answer "personal reasons" is meaningless. In my opinion, "personal reasons" means "none of your business, it's unrelated to the company's operations".

 

 

Since NCLH in its current incarnation was only just formed, and since one of the principal players Del Rio is simply re-focussing, I'm unconcerned. The only thing which needs to happen next is to find someone for COO of Oceania while Del Rio oversees NCLH.

 

 

 

All I suggested in my prior posts is that there's nothing to suggest this is NOT just personal.... if my partner suddenly found he had cancer with a limited prognosis, I'm not sure I'd want to continue working full-time in a different city, either. And it would be a total surprise to my employer.

 

What's so hard to 'get' about that?

 

 

As for Limerick, I look forward to returning there during our next visit to Ireland before the maiden Escape TA in October this year. Having however never been to Durty Nelly's, what is it that you like about it? Maybe we'll pay a visit.

 

 

Stephen

 

.

[LHT28]

a)

The only thing which needs to happen next is to find someone for COO of Oceania while Del Rio oversees NCLH.

 

Jason Montague is the President & COO of PCH which oversees Oceania & Regent

Nothing has changed there

[Uniall]

Please explain to me how the resignation, regardless of reason, can be converted to something that projects an effect on future earnings? Unless he resigned or was fired for something that is going to show up on the balance sheet, who cares what the reason is? They have the obligation to report events that potentially affect earnings, such as the Insignia fire. They're not required to provide anything that doesn't have a quantifiable impact on earnings just for the purpose of satisfying anyone's curiosity. If you assume they're fulfilling their fiduciary obligation to report anything that affects earnings, then the "personal reasons" explanation is sufficient. The problem is that you're assuming they're hiding something from investors, without any evidence of that having occurred. Basically, you're calling Del Rio and Beck liars because in your mind they haven't reported a material fact...when there's not one iota of evidence that a material fact exists.

 

New Jersey Horseman

 

The last time we posted on the same thread you seemed to make it personal and could not agree to disagree.

This appears to be Deja Vu all over again.

 

I am not motivated by idle curiosity the way Jersey Shore and Jersey houswive fans follow their celebrities and life style idols.

 

As a loyal NCL investor and client who spends 50K+ on cruises annually, I want to know why a perfectly matched mangement team put together to operate a perfectly built organization fell apart in one month. The answers to that question could have a dramatic affect on NCL, it's product and stock value.

 

I don't assume that silence proves a breach of fiduciary duty to investors at all. But, I think investors and clients deserve more than the non answer (personal reasons) to the questions and these matters should not be dark secrets decided behind closed doors.

 

It may well be that Kevin Sheehan decided to retire to his second home in Ireland, not far from my maternal relatives.

That would be wonderful and I'd envy him for it.

But, I'd like to know because I believe The Sheehan, DelRio & Madsen team was ready to lead a 24 ship NCL, Regent & Oceania Cruise Line up against the the RCI and Carnival Combines for my benefit and the industy's benefit.

 

I've been a life long Chicago Bears fan. I want to know how and why MY BEARS were allowed to go from the heights to the depths in 15 years. And, I want to know hows and whys of present decisions that are being made to rebuild the franchise from the bottom up.

 

I feel the same way about my NCL.

If you don't agree, that's fine, but you don't have to be disagreeable.

 

Maybe I'll change my User Name to something more akin to yours,

 

Uniall aka ILlawman

Edited January 11, 2015 by Uniall

[Uniall]

a) How do you know the motivations of Wells Fargo AND the Morningstar fund?

 

b) It certainly seems reasonable that while he was on vacation with his family, the rumoured health issue may have proven likely to demand his full-time attention and so he submitted his resignation.

 

c) It's your opinion that the answer "personal reasons" is meaningless. In my opinion, "personal reasons" means "none of your business, it's unrelated to the company's operations".

 

 

Since NCLH in its current incarnation was only just formed, and since one of the principal players Del Rio is simply re-focussing, I'm unconcerned. The only thing which needs to happen next is to find someone for COO of Oceania while Del Rio oversees NCLH.

 

 

 

All I suggested in my prior posts is that there's nothing to suggest this is NOT just personal.... if my partner suddenly found he had cancer with a limited prognosis, I'm not sure I'd want to continue working full-time in a different city, either. And it would be a total surprise to my employer.

 

What's so hard to 'get' about that?

 

 

As for Limerick, I look forward to returning there during our next visit to Ireland before the maiden Escape TA in October this year. Having however never been to Durty Nelly's, what is it that you like about it? Maybe we'll pay a visit.

 

 

Stephen

 

.

 

Stephen

 

Most of my reply to New Jersey Horseman is applicable as a reply to your post as well.

 

But, in the interests of community and good will I'll try to briefly respond to your specific questions.

a) Wells Fargo Investments & Morningstar Mutual Fund were concerned enough by the out of the blue management team break up to worry about their house and client investments in NCL. They also were motivated to stop the downward market price for the same reasons. Therefore, they would not want to make any public statements which would adversely affect the stock value.

 

b) I agree with you that his Thanksgiving, Christmas, New Year vacation would be the perfect time for Kevin to consider his options. By the by, this issue of "health problems" keeps popping up. I don't know of anyone who has reported that to be a fact but only as a rumor or possiblity. The only time I've run accross it, there was an offhand remark "mabe he has health problems." If you have seen something more concrete, I'd like to see that.

 

c) If you agree that breaking up the management team of Sheehan, DelRio & Masden could have a negative impact on NCL, then I believe "none of your business" is an appropriate answer to investors and/or loyal customers. If you disagree that the management change will not have a negative impact, then I agree with you 100%.

 

Finally, and most importantly, Durty Nelly's Pub is the 2nd oldest continuously operating Pub in Ireland. It was established in 1610.

The oldest Pub is the Brazenhead Pub in Dublin and opened in 1198.

They both provide, great drinks, good food, wonderful music and Great Craic' (Irish word for witty conversation, good fun and happy times)

Over the years, I have spent enough money at these two establishments, when visiting the "Holy Ground" that I could have paid off my mortgage instead.

Edited January 11, 2015 by Uniall

[NLH Arizona]

Corporate profits up, passenger satisfaction way down. I don't own NCL stock and never will. I cruise for enjoyment.

 

If you are a shareholder things are not screwed up. If you are a passenger, they are.

This passenger doesn't feel things are screwed up. I think you are speaking for yourself, but not the majority of NCL customers.

[njhorseman]

New Jersey Horseman

 

The last time we posted on the same thread you seemed to make it personal and could not agree to disagree.

This appears to be Deja Vu all over again.

 

I am not motivated by idle curiosity the way Jersey Shore and Jersey houswive fans follow their celebrities and life style idols.

 

...Maybe I'll change my User Name to something more akin to yours,

 

Uniall aka ILlawman

 

If you want to know why I might take what you say personally, I suggest you read your own words, cited above.

 

They're offensive, a personal attack, and have nothing to do with the topic under discussion.

 

In contrast, I've only attacked your arguments, not you as an individual...and I have no idea what prior thread you're referring to.

Edited January 12, 2015 by njhorseman

[Love my butler]

This passenger doesn't feel things are screwed up. I think you are speaking for yourself, but not the majority of NCL customers.

 

I speak no more for the majority of NCL cruisers than you do. Let's make that very clear. I think you are speaking for yourself.

[Love my butler]

Your satisfaction may be way down but i am sure the data that they have in the board room shows different (and is much more comprehensive than anything either one of us is likely to see).

 

Don't confuse customer satisfaction with corporate profit. They are very different.

[Love my butler]

I own NCL stock and am really happy, I cruise on NCL and am really happy. Sorry you're not - have you thought about renting an RV and cruising the highways since you're always so unhappy with NCL?

 

No I have not. Great idea. Are you available to drive the RV for me? No reason to be sorry for me. I do real well, even without NCL stock...

[sparks1093]

Don't confuse customer satisfaction with corporate profit. They are very different.

 

Yes, they are two different things and as I said I am sure that the board room has every customer satisfaction number they need to show that customer's are satisfied with the product. In short, your claim that customer satisfaction is way down is only based on your experience and is not based on any concrete evidence. Based on the limited evidence that I've seen (the reviews here on CC) Customer satisfaction has been pretty consistent at 70% across the fleet since I started cruising (which was pre-Sheehan), so I haven't seen customer service going way down.

 

(And in the FWIW department many of the negative reviews that I have read focus on the Freestyle concept and the reviewer's dissatisfaction with it. I doubt that NCL is going to change Freestyle to make the small percentage that don't like it happy.)

[Uniall]

It seems to me that in the modern cruise industry guest satisfaction, customer relations, corporate image, public transparancy and profitability are all conected over the long haul.

Edited January 12, 2015 by Uniall

[WildcatRock]

No I have not. Great idea. Are you available to drive the RV for me? No reason to be sorry for me. I do real well, even without NCL stock...

 

I'd love to! But alas, it probably wouldn't work out - you'll most likely not like my driving and will reduce how much you pay me for gas. Happy NCL sailings!!

[CruisinMaterial]

Did Carnival cheapen the brand Holland or Princess?

 

Yes it did! I started cruising on Princess and when Carnival took over and the transaction finalized while I was ON a cruise, the changes were immediate from where we docked to harder sales pushing. When I returned to Princess for the final time in 2009 the brand image had changed quite a bit. Yes, the ships were the same and the crew was still friendly but everything was an up-charge just like what Norwegian had instituted. There was a pub lunch for an up-charge, the main menus in the dining room were scaled way back like most lines had done. The vibe felt very different and the entertainment area should have strengthened with having Carnival as the spearhead (to get better acts) but it was weakened and sadly disappointing.

 

That's when I switched completely to Norwegian.

[yukongold]

Del Rio's actually has a better ring to it than O'Sheehan's

:)

 

I agree... del Rio has a certain panache!

[CruisinMaterial]

There was nothing wrong with Blue Lagoon on the older ships or its menu. The name change wasn’t needed. Possibly the décor update to make it more of a dining destination to relieve the main dining rooms from the lines which happen at peak times? However, on some of the ships it could’ve been spent better sound proofing the “new” Spinnakers Lounges which are directly beneath passenger cabins.

 

I’m looking forward to the changes the new leadership brings. It seems like Norwegian in the past few years, especially with new ships, has gone head-to-head with Carnival’s Carnival brand. It was never like that before and I hope del Rio changes it and brings it back up to the level of where Royal Caribbean is.

[sjbdtz]

Stephen

 

Most of my reply to New Jersey Horseman is applicable as a reply to your post as well.

 

But, in the interests of community and good will I'll try to briefly respond to your specific questions.

a) Wells Fargo Investments & Morningstar Mutual Fund were concerned enough by the out of the blue management team break up to worry about their house and client investments in NCL. They also were motivated to stop the downward market price for the same reasons. Therefore, they would not want to make any public statements which would adversely affect the stock value.

 

b) I agree with you that his Thanksgiving, Christmas, New Year vacation would be the perfect time for Kevin to consider his options. By the by, this issue of "health problems" keeps popping up. I don't know of anyone who has reported that to be a fact but only as a rumor or possiblity. The only time I've run accross it, there was an offhand remark "mabe he has health problems." If you have seen something more concrete, I'd like to see that.

 

c) If you agree that breaking up the management team of Sheehan, DelRio & Masden could have a negative impact on NCL, then I believe "none of your business" is an appropriate answer to investors and/or loyal customers. If you disagree that the management change will not have a negative impact, then I agree with you 100%.

 

Finally, and most importantly, Durty Nelly's Pub is the 2nd oldest continuously operating Pub in Ireland. It was established in 1610.

The oldest Pub is the Brazenhead Pub in Dublin and opened in 1198.

They both provide, great drinks, good food, wonderful music and Great Craic' (Irish word for witty conversation, good fun and happy times)

Over the years, I have spent enough money at these two establishments, when visiting the "Holy Ground" that I could have paid off my mortgage instead.

 

A couple of people on Facebook responded to the article saying that there is a rumor going around that a health issue within his family played a part in the decision.

 

Of course that's a rumor but you never know, it could be.

 

 

Hi John,

 

Thanks for the info on Durty Nelly's. We've eaten (and drunken...) at Brazen Head, but my family's from Monaghan so Limerick's a bit more off the beaten path for us....but we're going in October, so we'll make a point of stopping-in.

 

 

The 2nd quote above is where health was mentioned. Not KS's health...but the health of somebody close to him.

 

 

On the investment side, surely Apollo, and other majority holders (including KS himself) would have the same vested interest in keep share price up, yet they didn't feel the need to elaborate. That's why I questioned your associating motive. Morningstar & WF are analysts who get paid to provide the most transparency possible to their subscribers / investors. They don't get paid specifically to move the markets by themselves.

 

 

I think there's a 4th negative hidden somewhere in your answer "c)", and I think you're positing that breaking up this management "team" which has been in place for just a few months, is likely to impact NCLH in the long run. I don't agree with that assumption, and I'm fairly certain it won't affect NCL itself, at all.

 

 

Stephen

 

.

[Uniall]

Hi John,

 

Thanks for the info on Durty Nelly's. We've eaten (and drunken...) at Brazen Head, but my family's from Monaghan so Limerick's a bit more off the beaten path for us....but we're going in October, so we'll make a point of stopping-in.

 

 

The 2nd quote above is where health was mentioned. Not KS's health...but the health of somebody close to him.

 

 

On the investment side, surely Apollo, and other majority holders (including KS himself) would have the same vested interest in keep share price up, yet they didn't feel the need to elaborate. That's why I questioned your associating motive. Morningstar & WF are analysts who get paid to provide the most transparency possible to their subscribers / investors. They don't get paid specifically to move the markets by themselves.

 

 

I think there's a 4th negative hidden somewhere in your answer "c)", and I think you're positing that breaking up this management "team" which has been in place for just a few months, is likely to impact NCLH in the long run. I don't agree with that assumption, and I'm fairly certain it won't affect NCL itself, at all.

 

 

Stephen

 

.

 

I'm sure you will enjoy Durty Nelly's. It's has great sing song. It started out as a tavern to serve the troops garrisoned in Bunratty Castle, 200 meters accross the bridge. On one occasion, we were there on a 4 of July and they ended the night's music with God Bless America instead of the customary "Soldiers' Song" of Eire. After closing, they will direct you to the, by invite only, after hours pub at the Bunratty Inn (400 meters) on the far side of the castle for more sing song, poetry, and craic'.

 

You're quite right, I got caught up in double negatives and I'm having serious problems with CC software (e.g. I'm unabel to: increase size, use bold, underline, use color, italics) and have to work around using a two step process to edit. Below is a re-write :

 

c) If you believe breaking up the management team of Sheehan, DelRio & Masden WILL have a negative impact on NCL, then I believe "none of your business" is NOT an appropriate answer to investors and/or loyal customers. If you believe the management change WILL NOT have a negative impact, then I agree with you 100%.

 

John

PS

My mother's family are in the adjacent County Tipperary.

Edited January 12, 2015 by Uniall

[buckirj1]

I wish Kevin O well. He was by far the most approachable cruise executive, at least during my era of cruising. I'm trying to be positive about the future of NCL, but I'm another one of those cruisers who don't want NCL to become "upscale." I'm not looking for piss-elegance; just a comfortable cruise vacation, same as I've always received on NCL.

[ohioNCLcruiser]

And with this announcement Andy Stuart realizes he has reached his personal career ceiling at NCL....

[Beaver1975]

And with this announcement Andy Stuart realizes he has reached his personal career ceiling at NCL....

 

Not a bad ceiling for a guy who I believe started out as a waiter aboard a cruise ship.

[Uniall]

Not a bad ceiling for a guy who I believe started out as a waiter aboard a cruise ship.

 

I never heard about Andy being a waiter but I have been informed he was the office Manager when NCL opened a London office several decades ago.

 

I believe his staff included now senior Hotel Director, Armando and senior Concierges, Ruth & Carlos.

[CruisinMaterial]

And with this announcement Andy Stuart realizes he has reached his personal career ceiling at NCL....

 

Andy Stuart is an amazing man. I like where he is at in NCL and hope he continues to thrive in that position. Now with Camille gone from NCL, it’s just him as a one man show and both of them combined had become the face of NCL to travel agents and the traveling public at trade shows and the like. While it seems like he might have been snuffed by not getting the CEO of NCLH, I really think he’s better off not being in that title and I don’t mean that in anyway against him. NCLH is going through a huge change and if the shareholders don’t like what happens, the new guy will be chewed up and spit out (and that goes for NCL’s new CEO as well).

[Jantoo]

I wish Kevin Sheehan all the best. He is a true gentleman. Mr. Sheehan attended the Cruise Critic Meet and Greet on the the NCL Sun two years back. He was on his way to Columbia and was on the ship for part of our trip. He was at the breakfast buffet the next day. He warmly approached and spoke to my husband and me. It was a small gesture that was much appreciated.