Cut off when obviously intoxicated

[sfaaa]

What an ignorant comment.

 

You clearly have no idea how to party. Your own loss.

[nissach]

There are enough rules already. Drink responsibly... That onus is on each of us and watch out for those we are traveling with and for ourselves. The mindset we can get out of control and it is someone else's responsibility to protect us is an illusion anyways.

 

Exactly! Be responsible for yourself and your choice to drink excessively.

[declansdad]

Actually, yours is the ignorant comment! Ever heard of sarcasm?

 

 

What in that post indicated it was sarcasm? The opening comment in that post is typical of people who trash Carnival.

[declansdad]

You clearly have no idea how to party. Your own loss.

 

 

How do you figure that?

[Out to sea!]

Exactly! Be responsible for yourself and your choice to drink excessively.

 

I would be happy letting people accept responsibility for their actions and let them drink as much as they want as long as when one of the drunks fall overboard we don't waste anyone one else's time/money/energy looking for them.

[Out to sea!]

You clearly have no idea how to party. Your own loss.

 

So someone needs to be stupid/pass out drunk to "know how to party"?

[chengkp75]

Only if they are part of the crew and their shift, on the bridge, starts in 30 minutes.:eek:

 

LOL. But just to clarify for those who don't know, and contrary to the "Confidential" cruise books written more than a few years ago, all crew members are subject to random alcohol testing, and cannot blow more than a 0.04. Bridge and Engine room watchstanding officers have a zero tolerance for alcohol, for the duration of their time onboard. Typically, the top 5 officers and staff (Captain, Staff Captain, Chief Engineer, Staff (or Assistant) Chief Engineer, and Hotel Director) will also have zero tolerance, so at those meet and greets, they will have club soda or ginger ale.

[chengkp75]

I think that making a comparison between land-based bars and cruise bars is inaccurate. At a land-based bar, the server has to assume that the patron may be driving home, and thus should cut off a passenger that has over-indulged. But on a ship, no one has to drive home. Two different worlds IMO.

 

I agree that the comparison to land based bars is inaccurate, but not because of the driving home situation, but because of laws, which is what declansdad is pointing out. In the US, it is complicated by each state, and in some cases, counties and cities having their own liquor laws, so people's experiences will vary by region.

 

In many areas, the main reason to cut off a person is the fact that the law prohibits any bar to have someone who is visibly intoxicated sitting in the bar. The bar can lose its liquor license, hence its source of revenue, for this.

 

In other areas, bars are held accountable for whatever a patron does after leaving the bar, whether visibly intoxicated or not, and not just driving. If a person goes home, falls asleep in bed, and drowns in vomit, the bar can be held responsible for the death.

 

Again, this all varies by locale. Since the ships are flagged in the Bahamas, they must follow Bahamian law while at sea. In US ports, they must follow the local liquor laws, which is why there is limited quantities and types of liquor sold while docked in Texas, for example. Carnival does hold the right to withhold service (of any kind) to any passenger, at the Captain's discretion. So, it is up to each individual Captain, within corporate guidelines, to allow or withhold service to a passenger.

 

Sad to say, but in the absence of any law, no bar is going to assume the moral responsibility of denying service to someone, when that service is the source of revenue for the enterprise.

[cutiepiefred]

they wont cut you off, witnessed this on one 2nd cruise same drunk guy at the bar everyday, he would sleep on the bar stool or lounger next to the bar then would wake up and order more. he was there allday everyday, they actually would clean the deck around him. I woud not want to have his bar tab.

[K.T.B.]

Actually, yours is the ignorant comment! Ever heard of sarcasm?

 

Have you heard that there are various types of sarcasm? There's sarcasm when not being entirely serious and joking around (:p), and then there's sarcasm while being serious and attempting to "prove a point by belittling others" ( :rolleyes: ).

 

That comment came across as the latter.

[declansdad]

I agree that the comparison to land based bars is inaccurate, but not because of the driving home situation, but because of laws, which is what declansdad is pointing out. In the US, it is complicated by each state, and in some cases, counties and cities having their own liquor laws, so people's experiences will vary by region.

 

In many areas, the main reason to cut off a person is the fact that the law prohibits any bar to have someone who is visibly intoxicated sitting in the bar. The bar can lose its liquor license, hence its source of revenue, for this.

 

In other areas, bars are held accountable for whatever a patron does after leaving the bar, whether visibly intoxicated or not, and not just driving. If a person goes home, falls asleep in bed, and drowns in vomit, the bar can be held responsible for the death.

 

Again, this all varies by locale. Since the ships are flagged in the Bahamas, they must follow Bahamian law while at sea. In US ports, they must follow the local liquor laws, which is why there is limited quantities and types of liquor sold while docked in Texas, for example. Carnival does hold the right to withhold service (of any kind) to any passenger, at the Captain's discretion. So, it is up to each individual Captain, within corporate guidelines, to allow or withhold service to a passenger.

 

Sad to say, but in the absence of any law, no bar is going to assume the moral responsibility of denying service to someone, when that service is the source of revenue for the enterprise.

 

 

This is from an article released in 2012

 

Cruise Lines can be held liable for over-serving alcohol to cruise passengers

Florida's Third District Court of Appeals decided in a landmark case in 2004, that cruise lines can be held liable for over-serving their passengers to the point of intoxication if they sustain injuries caused by their alcohol-related impairment. In Hall v. Royal Caribbean Cruises, Judge Schwartz reversed the lower court's decision ruling that the defendant cruise line has an established duty to exercise reasonable care for the safety of its passengers, a duty couched in general maritime law.

 

http://www.cruiseshiplawyersblog.com/2012/02/liability-of-cruise-line-for-serving-alcohol-to-cruise-passengers.html

 

It would seem to me that they are not so different but you can also find examples of where the courts decline to allow the use of a dram shop laws. Certainly a confusing issue.

[chengkp75]

This is from an article released in 2012

 

 

 

http://www.cruiseshiplawyersblog.com/2012/02/liability-of-cruise-line-for-serving-alcohol-to-cruise-passengers.html

 

It would seem to me that they are not so different but you can also find examples of where the courts decline to allow the use of a dram shop laws. Certainly a confusing issue.

 

Absolutely, the confusion over jurisdiction over foreign flag ships is rampant. I have not seen that case (I don't study much case law), but the mention of physical protection of the passenger is what is covered in international maritime law, and the judge does not apply any US case law to the decision. This is the difference between applying any country's dram shop law, and maritime law. As I stated, dram shop laws can only be applied while the ship is docked or within 2 miles (IIRC) of shore. Most of the cruise line's ticket contracts state that they can withhold service if the passenger poses a risk to the health and safety of themselves or others. So, the guy passed out at the bar becomes a gray area, since in his condition he poses no threat of injury (except maybe falling off the stool), and he is under constant surveillance.

[skyeman27]

Not drunk is he, who from the floor

 

Can rise again and drink some more

 

Drunk is he who prostrate lies

 

Who can neither drink nor rise

[sjn911]

Not drunk is he, who from the floor

 

Can rise again and drink some more

 

Drunk is he who prostrate lies

 

Who can neither drink nor rise

 

LOL...

 

Glad to see the law end of it posted..thanks all...quite a deal.

[oneillcd73]

I used to become resentful and belligerent whenever someone would cut me off, kick me out of somewhere, arrest me or do anything that would interrupt my drinking. Now that I'm 5 years sober I'm pretty sure some of these people probably saved my life or somebody else's at some point. I'm actually surprised it didn't happen more often. I don't remember most of my drinking as I was a blackout fall down sort of drunk, but I'm told by others it was usually not a very pretty sight.

[MrsPhoenix91]

I used to become resentful and belligerent whenever someone would cut me off, kick me out of somewhere, arrest me or do anything that would interrupt my drinking. Now that I'm 5 years sober I'm pretty sure some of these people probably saved my life or somebody else's at some point. I'm actually surprised it didn't happen more often. I don't remember most of my drinking as I was a blackout fall down sort of drunk, but I'm told by others it was usually not a very pretty sight.

 

oneillcd73: Congratulations on your sobriety!

[Babycat]

Congratulations. That's great!

[MistyRo76]

Years back in my heavier partying days - we had a large group on the 4 night to Key West/Cozumel. This was an itinerary with the ship staying in Cozumel until 10PM. We started the day doing an all-inclusive at Playa Mia so of course the drinking were flowing there. Then our group headed back to the Pier and spent a couple of hours at Senior Frogs. Needless to say we were all feeling pretty good! :)

 

One of the guys in our group got very intoxicated at Senior Frogs. I think it was a combination of being in the sun all day and some strong drinks at the bar. He went from a little tipsy to very drunk pretty quick! Several members of our group walked him back to the ship and made sure that he got to his room. Once he was soundly sleeping in his cabin, they left him and the rest of us enjoyed the deck party. We didn't see him again until late the following day - well into our last sea day on the ship. He felt pretty rough and didn't even try to purchase another drink until after dinner. When he tried to buy a drink, the bartender handed him a note and said that he needed to go to the Purser's Desk as his card was not working properly. The purser's desk escorted him to security where he was told that because of how intoxicated he was when he boarded the ship in Cozumel, they had deactivated his card to ensure that he didn't drink anymore. They were really cool about it...just seemed to be watching out for his safety and well-being and they promptly reactivated his card and sent him on his way. This is the only experience I've had with anyone being cut off. But I thought it was handled well. Certainly others in my friend's shoes wouldn't have just gone to bed...but would have tried to continue drinking.

 

Misty

[sjn911]

Congrats to those needing sobriety and doing it and sharing here; true meaningful insights...

 

There is not one of us here on earth that does not have some things to fix and improve upon IMHO....some things are easier than others...

 

Weight and drinking...really hard...for most...

 

Reducing in Montana....LOL...reducing was my grandpa's term bothering my dear Mom...she is helping me with it from other side now...anyways truly appreciate your comments all in sobriety... and kudos..sarah

Edited March 23, 2015 by sjn911

[eponym]

LOL. But just to clarify for those who don't know, and contrary to the "Confidential" cruise books written more than a few years ago, all crew members are subject to random alcohol testing, and cannot blow more than a 0.04. Bridge and Engine room watchstanding officers have a zero tolerance for alcohol, for the duration of their time onboard. Typically, the top 5 officers and staff (Captain, Staff Captain, Chief Engineer, Staff (or Assistant) Chief Engineer, and Hotel Director) will also have zero tolerance, so at those meet and greets, they will have club soda or ginger ale.

 

I have had wine with them at the Captain's table.

[eponym]

How does someone passing out and not bothering anyone have any negative impact on you and your associates? You do have the option of looking at something else instead of the drunk sleeping his booze off by the pool, don't you?

 

There is always a rare exception, and I guess you found it.

[chengkp75]

I have had wine with them at the Captain's table.

 

I can speak with confidence about NCL's policy, having been subject to it myself, and friends in the industry tell me most lines are similar. While the zero tolerance may be company specific (but I believe it is becoming more and more common), the 0.04 is an international standard for all crew.

[jimbo5544]

I can speak with confidence about NCL's policy, having been subject to it myself, and friends in the industry tell me most lines are similar. While the zero tolerance may be company specific (but I believe it is becoming more and more common), the 0.04 is an international standard for all crew.

 

I agree, I even think there was an older thread where someone posted something "official" from Carnival about the 0.04 being the standards for crew.

[elliair]

You're correct, it could be any of the situations you mentioned, but in this case we were by the pool all day and watched him purchase his own drinks and get more and more intoxicated. So in this case not an assumption.

 

Bartenders don't care about his drunkenness, all they see is that 15% tip. No bartender is going to cut off their nose to spite their face. They figure security will step in if the person gets out of hand. It's not always about alcohol that someone jumps overboard. Depression and illness are a couple of reasons. Premeditated suicide. We don't know what's going on in a persons life that they would do such a thing. All I know is that they are at peace and I can sympathize with their situation. I've dealt with 2 suicides in our family within the past year, so I know what I am talking about.

[aubreyc1988]

Thanks!! Haha, SUPER upset is an understatement. :mad: I was really grumpy the rest of the cruise but still tried to make the best of it. I could still drink in our ports all except Half Moon Cay since it's run by Carnival and you use your S&S card to buy drinks there, not cash. It's good to know I'm not alone or the only one to have that problem. I feel so bad for that lady as I know how it feels. Was she ok after her trip and fall? I hope she didn't hurt herself. I hate those things!! Yes, I think the other poster is right, they are called Thresholds. I however, just call them annoying. What ship were you on by the way? Just wondering if all Ship Security staff are a**holes who don't bother to check first or if it's just the Splendor.

 

But WHY do they just cut people off and don't bother to check to see if they're really drunk or not? And then let people who really are drunk just keep drinking? Makes no sense to me. :confused:

 

Wow, thats nuts - I was born with a poorly developed vestibular system, which affects my balance and coordination, so I can see something like this happening to me, as I cannot walk in a straight line SOBER!

 

I can drink a lot and would hate to be cut off. Whenever I've reached my limit, I just get sleepy and go to bed. It's my vacation, and it's my responsibility to know when to stop, not the crew. But if they are going to cut people off, they should breathalyze them first and make sure they ARE drunk and not just clumsy.