LaReserve

[Hawaiidan]

Quick question. I don't eat beef, chicken or pork but I do eat fish. Do they accommodate for those that don't eat meat in La Reserve or should I just skip that course, which would be fine. Thanks!

 

I understand your desire and based on that I would total avoid the expense and lack of choices when you only wil get 2 at most dishes you can eat out of 7,, You meny will run the gamete of the traditional cuisine a fish a beef, poultry course The kitchen is working hard to produce , in tempo and sequence that menu. Its not a short order option. The Sous chef would not allow his brigade to loose focus nor would the Chef. I trained in a similiar kitcken/staff conditions and menu production for a party of 26, and no way will a good chef sacrifice the meals of 25 for 1. . Many kitchens in quality restaurants simply will say no ..its not worth the disruption to them.... and it is, while it seems simple enven trivial to you...it is not to the kitchen..its big time porblems

 

In esence your asking for something the kitchen in not organized , manned or designed to do in such a circumstance...sorry. Its a play, theater, you cant rearrange the acts to suit a specific taste Not all restaurants facilities and venues can serve everyone's special wants...

 

If they were able to offer an option it would be 1, 2 at the most and that will be just cranked out with nowhere near the quality or presentation on the menu for the night.

 

These exceptions if they would even do them, en masse, would ALL be from the main dining room kitchen. OR STEAM table.. You would be paying $100-150 pp more for nothing more than MDR/Terrace cafe food horribly mismatched. and just timing it to get it to you from the opposite end of the ship a nightmare for you the waiters and the chefs...

The Wine parings too will all be way off for you.... miss matched and not complementary to your food or setting.

 

Honestly the best palce for you to go is The buffet wher you can pick and choose and get exactly and spenf the money a Rodier Crystal cham....

What is it that drives you or compels you to go to a place that is serving things you wont want while paying top dollar to do so? Only you must decide what that was...and re think it I terrible waste of time and money

Edited August 5, 2016 by Hawaiidan

[JMBobB]

As posted above SWMbI and I have done

La Reserve 3 times before. She happens to be gluten intolerant. Our TA always includes this fact in making our cruise reservations. We also follow up by contacting the ships dietary to remind them of this fact. We receive the MDR menus the prior. And relevant to this discussion La Reserve always alters one or two of the entree items for her, always close to and equally delicious. One of the La Reserve staff always quietly informs her which items have been altered/substututed for her dietary restriction. I suspect that our butler (who escorts her to the venue) informs the head waiter of her attire because they have never asked who is whom once at table. Plus two of our La Reserve evenings have been on the second night of the cruise.

 

JMBobB

[Hawaiidan]

Dan is being overdramatic again and showing his lack of palate! There are no 80 or below wines offered during a meal.:rolleyes: He is correct one won't see Parker 95+ wines, but most all the wines are 88-93 pointers.

 

I have enjoyed wonderful Barolo, Brunello, and white (Montrachet) and red Burgs at the dinners. Wine quality varies between the three dinner options, but all serve at least the quality of wines I've noted above! ;)

 

88 to 89, last I checked (and I ran it past a CPA) does seem to be in the range of 80 ....could it be that why they call it Eighty Eight or Eighty nine...? and even hats subjunctive due to to the ships celler

I only drink the tried and true... White Satin from Gallo when I have my Cheetos and a delicate prime cut of Spam. ...but only when Beenie Weenies are not available....

[auldlassie]

We are foodies and wine lovers and I totally agree with Hawaiidan's take on the food and wine at La Reserve. I would say he is bang on about the details and wine ratings. Go for the social aspects. Charming, fun and engaging atmosphere. Food and wine good but not great. Even the better wines are far too young and, incidentally, the sommelier there agreed with me on that. Even told me a little secret about their selection in that regard, but my lips have to be sealed in case I want to go back :)

[pinotlover]

auldlassie;

 

Yes, yes, I have a 1500+ plus bottle cellar with about 100 of those being BdMs and Barolo. I never drink Brunello, from my cellar, less than 10 years old. So what?, Oceania can't serve Brunello less than 10 year old also! Where are you going to find that? Bern's Steakhouse in Tampa, and at what price? The wine would be more than the entire experience in La Reserve. I agree that La Reserve serves young red wines but that doesn't make them rated in the 70s! They are just younger than I would normally drink. Here is a clue for you. How old is Oceania? If O didn't serve Brunellos or Barolos less than 10 years old, that means they would have to had purchased them prior to 06! The O ships, with La Reserve, weren't added to the fleet for another 5-6 years after that!

 

Just for the record, the somms on O are sommelier by job title only, not because they know squat about wines or took and passed the course! I can make that complaint, but at the end of the day the wines in La Reserve are not 75- 80 rated wines, even if a bit of infanticide did occur. At least they know enough to give those babies a good decant, which many restaurants can't seem to do!

 

Enjoy the food, enjoy the wine, enjoy the experience and company. Wine Spectator is not putting its name behind these events because O is serving plonk and mediocre food! 75-80 rated wines by WS and most other professional rating organizations indicate mediocre wines with flaws. Get a grip!

[auldlassie]

Pinotlover,

 

I will not enter into a point by point debate with you here. That is not the raison d'etre of this thread. I will re-iterate that I agree wholeheartedly with Hawaiidan's estimation of the wines and the food served there and that I am perfectly entitled to say so.

 

The wines I was served on my two La Reserve dinners were not of the points range I would have expected from the Oceania "hype" -and no matter what age they were served, they never would be. They varied between good to average. Not plonk, but not very special. Also, it is relatively simple to buy properly cellared older wines, as I am sure you know. If Oceania choose to serve wines to young to be particularly enjoyable, it has no bearing on the date they were established as a cruise line. The sommelier - the head sommelier on the ship, who was there for some reason unbeknown to me - disparage the sommeliers entirely, though you do - knows they should not have been served so young. Serving older wines than they did WAS their actual original intention, but for reasons I won't go into, it didn't work out as they planned.

 

Now, I suggest you take your little upset to a quiet room and you become the one who tries to "get a grip". We are both entitled to post our opinions of La Reserve here, but rudeness is not appropriate and does not become you.

[pinotlover]

auldlassie;

 

Sorry, if I came across rude.

 

I was just reacting to the claim that the wines served are in the 75-80 range. Wine ratings have meanings. 75-79 Mediocre, drinkable but with flaws. That is an entirely different rating than wines rated 80-85 or 85-89, no less wines rate 90 and above.

 

A young wine may not be flawed, just to young to be enjoyed by most. Still doesn't make it technically a 75, just to young. However, all that is opinion and some of the whacky reviews given wines on Cellartracker displays a lot of that. There one can find a reviewer rating a Chat. Marguax a 70 when everyone else is giving it a 95+. We all get to state our opinion, and am sorry for my rudeness.:o

[kazu]

<snip> I suspect that our butler (who escorts her to the venue) informs the head waiter of her attire because they have never asked who is whom once at table. Plus two of our La Reserve evenings have been on the second night of the cruise.

 

JMBobB

 

<snip>

 

My suggestion would be to reserve your chosen menu soon after you pay your full fare to insure you will get the one you want.

 

If you have a penthouse or higher suite, your butler will advise you as to when he will arrive to escort you to the pre-dinner festivities.

 

Oh, and I seriously suggest wearing something expandible. :eek:

 

L'Chaim!

 

JMBobB

 

Sailed in November, 2015. We had La Reserve booked and chose the most expensive one.

 

Our butler never escorted us nor offered to, nor advised on it so please don't count on that. I knew to go early from reading here ;) thank you all :)

 

La Reserve is a nice venue. Most of the food was good - one thing over cooked, but it was only one thing and we enjoyed the meal very much.

 

I recommend booking as soon as it becomes available if it is of interest and definitely go early for the pre-dinner drinks, meet some of your table companions and enjoy :)

[Hawaiidan]

Thanks Auldlass....and

Pintlover... a comment I think WS raitings are pure BS as it is a group of guys whith a vested interest in their magazine and selling ad space.. I prefer Parker and that crowd who sell nothing and to who you subscribe for their honest evaluation.

I think a 75 to 80 wine is nice not something poor. but averade and I think the wine served in La reserve is nice wine, To me 85-94 is very good and and 95+ is excellent 60 and below is poor in my judgment. I hold by my feeling that La Reserve wines are in the average nice wine range, not above average or outstanding.

 

I think 90% of the people who go to La reserve dont have a clue about cuisine and wine and go with what they are told about what they are drinking or eating...

 

As any serious wine person knows wine is a product of quality grapes, blends and then relies on age and stability Stability for the microbes and tannens and sugars to properly interact. This requires a controlled environment, free from light radiation, heat, vibration and an even humidity. Red wines are much more sensitive than White due to acid/tannin in the mix

Even if O has a perfect temp/light cellar ...its on a friggen ship. A nice wine will soon rapidly begin to degrade from the constant motion or the sea. Soooo you may get a 90 and a few months its a 79.75 from the 24/7 agitation.

This is why you dont see any real older or premium wines on the ship and why they would not waste money on making a great wine turn poor... So a 85 when it leaves the vintner, may well become a 78 after a few weeks on the ship or so on ... Yea hey have an Opus... but I doubt it is what the quality of one ashore.

Heck, I know that even flying a wine for 4 or 5 hours can reek havoc on it...

It is thus that on board a ship, most all wines will not be anything near what some tasting panel ashore at the vintner raited them

[auldlassie]

Thanks Pinotlover, it was nice of you to post that and I appreciate it.

[JMBobB]

Our butler never escorted us nor offered to, nor advised on it so please don't count on that. I knew to go early from reading here ;) thank you all :)

 

I am seriously surprised that your butler did not know/confirm your La Reserve evening. Our first such evening (Riviera) our butler obviously checked the L_R listings after he had introduced himself the first afternoon. He got back to us first thing the next morning to inform us that our dinner would begin at 7 p.m. and that he would be at our stateroom door 15 minutes prior to "Escort Madame and me to the L_R venue." On our second and 3rd experiences (Riviera & Marina) our butler confirmed our L_R reservations and indicated that he would present himself to escort us at a specific time in order to allow us time to socialize with others prior to the time for dinner.

 

So I kind of wonder if your butler on that occasion might have been so buried in the number of staterooms he covered for that event that he appeared at your door after you had left to go upstairs?

 

Sad that you missed the service. It may feel a bit silly to do this but it is definitely an attempt to provide a classy service to the ship's passengers who pay for the wine pairing experience.

 

I'm also saddened at the back and forth above regarding the quality of wines and/or food at these events. While I'm not a wine snob :D I do know what I like. And SWMbI and moi have been trekking rather frequently to the Napa and Sonoma Valleys often enough over the last 40 years to have at least a minimal palate as to what constitutes a decent vintage. Considering that more and more wineries both domestic and foreign are creating their wines to be drunk much earlier than used to be recommended I note the squabbling over wines served 'too young' :eek: as more than a bit over the top 'me alude sods.' :p

 

So just choose, go, eat, drink and be merry with your fellow imbibers/diners. It's a really great experience any way you define it.

 

JMBobB

 

B.S. Just remember I warned y'all about the insidious capacity of some of your fellow trenchermen to invade yore space and become disgustingly good friends in the process! :)

 

Ooh-ooh-ooh: On two occasions when we were invited to special meals hosted by ship's officers our butler made special effort to inform us that he would be present to escort SWMbI to said meals. He didn't mention moi for some reason. Wonder why...

Edited August 7, 2016 by JMBobB

[avalong]

Would this experience be worth it if you don't drink wine?

[Silver Sweethearts]

Would this experience be worth it if you don't drink wine?

 

The quote below from Oceania's website uses the word "pairing" four times, so we would have to say the occasion is best meant for food and wine both:

 

"Perfect Pairings -

This may be the most inspired pairing ever. Oceania Cruises brings you the brilliant union of La Reserve and Wine Spectator, the foremost magazine for wine connoisseurs. The resulting La Reserve by Wine Spectator offers not only wine seminars and vintage tastings but also gourmet dinners pairing fine wines with delectable courses such as Stuffed Brioche with Duck Foie Gras and Truffle Jelly, Grilled Turban of Wild Salmon and Turbot with Seaweed Vegetable Casserole, and 72-Hour Slow Braised Short Rib with Gnocchi au Jus. Even the most devout epicureans will enhance their appreciation of fine dining at its best with these perfect pairings."

[Mura]

Most CC participants seem to feel La Reserve isn't worth it if you won't drink the wines, but I disagree. I think you could well appreciate the meal even if you don't imbibe. Maybe you could negotiate a lower price if you promise not to drink any wine. (Worth a try!)

 

Now, for the poster who only eats fish and inquired about La Reserve -- I would agree that for someone who won't be able to eat most of the courses, no, it isn't worth it.

 

Mura

[Paulchili]

Would this experience be worth it if you don't drink wine?

 

IMO, only if you have extra OBC that you cannot (or wish not to) spend elsewhere.

The food is wonderful but not worth the money on a ship where excellent food is available elsewhere for free.

Then again it may be worth it for a foodie that would pay a similar price for an 1 to 2 star Michelin restaurant on land (which this probably could be - according to my nephew who is a trained chef in LA)).

JMO

Edited August 8, 2016 by Paulchili

[Wendy The Wanderer]

Hmm, I just noticed this thread. We did La Reserve on Riviera a couple of years ago and loved it. And the wines were great.

 

But so was the dinner, so I would say that the meal would be memorable, with or without wine. But that would depend on how much value you put on food.

[rloke]

The food was pretty average stuff, however "presented " with a little more panache and flair than in the main dining.

The wine like wise rather un-remarkable but nice, nothing outstanding..no Parker 95+ but rather solid 75-80 stuff.

 

Just trying to learn more about wine tasting here....we attended the connoisseur dinner but definitely no connoisseur...

 

We thought that the Octavius Amarone, Shafer Chardonnay and the Marquis de la Tourette Hermitage to be pretty good. Personally, IMHO, I would regard these to be much higher than ratings of 75-80 (even under the stricter, unbiased RP ratings).

 

Regardless of the ratings though, the Amarone did pair very well with the Kobe beef and so did the Chardonnay with the butter-poached Brittany blue lobster.

[Hawaiidan]

Just trying to learn more about wine tasting here....we attended the connoisseur dinner but definitely no connoisseur...

 

We thought that the Octavius Amarone, Shafer Chardonnay and the Marquis de la Tourette Hermitage to be pretty good. Personally, IMHO, I would regard these to be much higher than ratings of 75-80 (even under the stricter, unbiased RP ratings).

 

Regardless of the ratings though, the Amarone did pair very well with the Kobe beef and so did the Chardonnay with the butter-poached Brittany blue lobster.

 

I know Schafer...their Merlots are famous, the whites/chards not so much.

To me the 75-80 are Nice wines, not remarkable, 80-90 very good 90-96 extremely good and 97+ exceptional. The Schafer hilside merlot 2012 was a 98 .....

But your totally fine with evaluating the wines as you see fit. Wine is to enjoy not to worship. It is you who decides the merit and enjoyability of what ever wine they consume..... no more no less

 

I dont consider La Reserve to be in the Michelin Star class....maybe the cross forks, but no stars That said, it may knock your taste buds for a loop if you have never had stuff like this. Like wine...you can set the bar yourself and grade it to your experience. One person wrote it , to him, was possibly the finest restaurant in the world, and the finest he had ever had.

Was it?

 

It was to him and that sports fans is really all that counts Jean Shephard, the humorist, once wrote of his father in Indiana " The Old man said everyone really only likes meat and potatoes and they only eat other stuff to impress each other ! Maybe he was right?

[Hawaiidan]

Just trying to learn more about wine tasting here....we attended the connoisseur dinner but definitely no connoisseur...

 

We thought that the Octavius Amarone, Shafer Chardonnay and the Marquis de la Tourette Hermitage to be pretty good. Personally, IMHO, I would regard these to be much higher than ratings of 75-80 (even under the stricter, unbiased RP ratings).

 

Regardless of the ratings though, the Amarone did pair very well with the Kobe beef and so did the Chardonnay with the butter-poached Brittany blue lobster.

 

I know Schafer...their Merlots are famous, the whites/chards not so much.

To me the 75-80 are Nice wines, not remarkable, 80-90 very good 90-96 extremely good and 97+ exceptional. The Schafer hilside merlot 2012 was a 98 .....

But your totally fine with evaluating the wines as you see fit. Wine is to enjoy not to worship. It is you who decides the merit and enjoyability of what ever wine they consume..... no more no less

 

I dont consider La Reserve to be in the Michelin Star class....maybe the cross forks, but no stars That said, it may knock your taste buds for a loop if you have never had stuff like this. Like wine...you can set the bar yourself and grade it to your experience. One person wrote it , to him, was possibly the finest restaurant in the world, and the finest he had ever had.

Was it?

 

It was to him and that sports fans is really all that counts Jean Shephard, the humorist, once wrote of his father in Indiana " The Old man said everyone really only likes meat and potatoes and they only eat other stuff to impress each other ! Maybe he was right?

[Paulchili]

On that same cruise that ended in Copenhagen, my nephew "the chef" scored a lunch at Noma 90 days previous to our visit (for many years rated as #1 restaurant in the world) and a dinner at Geranium (the only Michelin 3 star in Copenhagen). At Noma he exhibited so much interest and knowledge in their food and presentation that he was invited into the kitchen after lunch by the staff.

I trust his judgment about quality of :D

Edited August 9, 2016 by Paulchili

[Hawaiidan]

On that same cruise that ended in Copenhagen, my nephew "the chef" scored a lunch at Noma 90 days previous to our visit (for many years rated as #1 restaurant in the world) and a dinner at Geranium (the only Michelin 3 star in Copenhagen). At Noma he exhibited so much interest and knowledge in their food and presentation that he was invited into the kitchen after lunch by the staff.

I trust his judgment about quality of :D

 

Thats a great experience for your nephew to have had, On the other hand I have proff training and been invited by Thomas Keller into the French Laundry kitchen ( mich 3 star) . All very nice for both of us.

However, both of us have opinions on food... they are personal and unique to ourselves. We have defined what we think is perfection and adhere to our beliefs... Great, so we are perhaps more sensitive/judgmental than the average person...

But.... the same can be said of every single poster here, who also held feelings of their own as to what was great and what was not. They are them and we are us. and we all see things slightly different

Thus every judgment, from passenger to poster to professional critic remain their own personal judgment.. and if your afraid to trust your judgment then ....you can subscribe to another that you wish. Moral, dont be afraid to judge for yourself according to your feelings. not mine or any other...

[kazu]

I am seriously surprised that your butler did not know/confirm your La Reserve evening. Our first such evening (Riviera) our butler obviously checked the L_R listings after he had introduced himself the first afternoon. He got back to us first thing the next morning to inform us that our dinner would begin at 7 p.m. and that he would be at our stateroom door 15 minutes prior to "Escort Madame and me to the L_R venue." On our second and 3rd experiences (Riviera & Marina) our butler confirmed our L_R reservations and indicated that he would present himself to escort us at a specific time in order to allow us time to socialize with others prior to the time for dinner.

 

So I kind of wonder if your butler on that occasion might have been so buried in the number of staterooms he covered for that event that he appeared at your door after you had left to go upstairs?

 

Sad that you missed the service. It may feel a bit silly to do this but it is definitely an attempt to provide a classy service to the ship's passengers who pay for the wine pairing experience.

 

I'm also saddened at the back and forth above regarding the quality of wines and/or food at these events. While I'm not a wine snob :D I do know what I like. And SWMbI and moi have been trekking rather frequently to the Napa and Sonoma Valleys often enough over the last 40 years to have at least a minimal palate as to what constitutes a decent vintage. Considering that more and more wineries both domestic and foreign are creating their wines to be drunk much earlier than used to be recommended I note the squabbling over wines served 'too young' :eek: as more than a bit over the top 'me alude sods.' :p

 

So just choose, go, eat, drink and be merry with your fellow imbibers/diners. It's a really great experience any way you define it.

 

JMBobB

 

B.S. Just remember I warned y'all about the insidious capacity of some of your fellow trenchermen to invade yore space and become disgustingly good friends in the process! :)

 

Ooh-ooh-ooh: On two occasions when we were invited to special meals hosted by ship's officers our butler made special effort to inform us that he would be present to escort SWMbI to said meals. He didn't mention moi for some reason. Wonder why...

 

We were on Riviera too. There are only 24 people at La Reserve (normally 12 cabins assuming couples go) and our butler only had two of the relevant cabins to the best of my knowledge. Neither of us were accompanied nor given the offer. (They were regular "O" cruisers while we were newbies and ended up beside each other)

 

Our butler was a "nice" person but I suspect he was a bit lack lustre in doing what butlers do ;)

 

In any case, we had a nice time and enjoyed it and, as I said, thankfully from reading here we knew to go at the right time to meet our fellow diners and enjoy a little taste and a drink:)

Edited August 9, 2016 by kazu

[avalong]

Hmm, I just noticed this thread. We did La Reserve on Riviera a couple of years ago and loved it. And the wines were great.

 

But so was the dinner, so I would say that the meal would be memorable, with or without wine. But that would depend on how much value you put on food.

 

I'm a minor foodie! But I have to say, if the conversation around the table centers on wine in the way that this thread has, I'd be put to sleep. No offense, but the grading of wine is a bit tedious for the non-aficionado. To each his own.

[pinotlover]

Ipoh;

 

You are correct, the Shafer Chardonnay is indeed very nice. It regularly receives a 93-94 from Wine Spectator. This score is, by the way, higher that what the Shafer Merlot receives. A nice merlot with scores around 91-93, but not as consistently high as their Chard.

 

I believe the Shafer wine that HawaiiDan was referring the is the Shafer Hillside Select which does indeed regularly receives 97-98 scores. However, that wine is a Cabernet Savignon not a Merlot :rolleyes:, as well as their Shafer Stags Leap District, both highly rated cabs. Not sure Dan knows the difference between merlots and cabs, but he has his own rating system though! :D

 

We were served the Shafer Chard during our last La Reserve dinner at it is excellent - 93+ :p

[wally_bushy]

I'm a minor foodie! But I have to say, if the conversation around the table centers on wine in the way that this thread has, I'd be put to sleep. No offense, but the grading of wine is a bit tedious for the non-aficionado. To each his own.

 

Well said. Most of us enjoy the event for what it is. Others enjoy the backward and forwarding of how much they know about "stuff" most of us don't care about.

Each to their own.:)