Jezzer7190 Posted June 3, 2016 #1 Share Posted June 3, 2016 I've been told by a few crew members that a lot (if not most) of the onboard automatic tips are not reaching their pockets at all. P & O have introduced a "Graduated Tips" system which means that if a cabin steward or waiter does not attain EXCELLENT on virtually all their feedback forms completed by us passengers then their tips are withheld. For example, if a cabin steward gets 18 of his cabins marking her/him as EXCELLENT and the 19th cabin marks her/him as FAIR then she/he will not get any of the tips that have been authorised on her/his passengers' onboard accounts. It's unclear as to where this money is going, with one crew member saying that she thought it was being distributed to those staff who did attain EXCELLENT by all their passengers. Crew members who have told passengers about the system have been systematically sought out by P & O and dismissed. I thought it only fair to share this information and if you're in doubt as to the authenticity of the facts see here http://www.dailyecho.co.uk/news/9683493.Row_over_tips_on_cruise_ships/?ref=rss I suggest at the very least we all start to give cash tips wherever possible in future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PORT ROYAL Posted June 3, 2016 #2 Share Posted June 3, 2016 I've been told by a few crew members that a lot (if not most) of the onboard automatic tips are not reaching their pockets at all. P & O have introduced a "Graduated Tips" system which means that if a cabin steward or waiter does not attain EXCELLENT on virtually all their feedback forms completed by us passengers then their tips are withheld. For example, if a cabin steward gets 18 of his cabins marking her/him as EXCELLENT and the 19th cabin marks her/him as FAIR then she/he will not get any of the tips that have been authorised on her/his passengers' onboard accounts. It's unclear as to where this money is going, with one crew member saying that she thought it was being distributed to those staff who did attain EXCELLENT by all their passengers. Crew members who have told passengers about the system have been systematically sought out by P & O and dismissed. I thought it only fair to share this information and if you're in doubt as to the authenticity of the facts see here http://www.dailyecho.co.uk/news/9683493.Row_over_tips_on_cruise_ships/?ref=rss I suggest at the very least we all start to give cash tips wherever possible in future. This old nut again? Dejavu? :eek: For the last time.... Leave the automatic tip in full and tip heavily with cash for excellent service...;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bee-ess Posted June 3, 2016 #3 Share Posted June 3, 2016 (edited) Here we go again-I think this is an old article, Carol Marlow has not been at P&O for a while. Edited June 3, 2016 by bee-ess Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davecttr Posted June 3, 2016 #4 Share Posted June 3, 2016 Old and incorrect news and the last thing we want is yet another argument over tipping :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
insanemagnet Posted June 3, 2016 #5 Share Posted June 3, 2016 Old and incorrect news and the last thing we want is yet another argument over tipping Or do you mean service charges. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jezzer7190 Posted June 3, 2016 Author #6 Share Posted June 3, 2016 I've not posted on this type of website before so am not sure where to find the old discussions referred to - can you tell me please? The article may be old but the facts have been confirmed to me a few weeks ago by numerous crew. As for tipping twice that's just either people with money to burn or just stupid. Why give enormous tips if they aren't even getting to the people who have served you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adammara Posted June 3, 2016 #7 Share Posted June 3, 2016 The article is over 4 years old! If it is that bad on P&O, why do we see crew returning year after year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scriv Posted June 3, 2016 #8 Share Posted June 3, 2016 (edited) This article you link to for 'the facts' is years old..... Edited June 3, 2016 by Scriv Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
balf Posted June 3, 2016 #9 Share Posted June 3, 2016 IF what the member of staff told the OP is true this must be the stupidest idea yet. The system of having a charge that can easily be avoided, so meaning many do just do that is pretty stupid as well. The "just pay them and extra as well" is just what P&O are looking for. Add them to the price. Next subject? David. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
molecrochip Posted June 3, 2016 #10 Share Posted June 3, 2016 I checked with reception on this point and was told that all tips go directly to the staff members - I was also given a split per £5. Additionally, I was told that staff get to keep all cash tips, although some teams choose to pool them. I was very specifically told that it's not true that cash tips must be handed in if auto tip is nil. This was on Britannia in March Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
balf Posted June 4, 2016 #11 Share Posted June 4, 2016 I checked with reception on this point and was told that all tips go directly to the staff members - I was also given a split per £5. Additionally, I was told that staff get to keep all cash tips, although some teams choose to pool them. I was very specifically told that it's not true that cash tips must be handed in if auto tip is nil. This was on Britannia in March Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Which pretty well contradicts all the other theories we get here. It's obvious what's going on. Tell loads of different stories so every one is completely confused and likely finishes up shouting at each other. P&O could publish a full, and I mean really full explanation of the tipping system. Till then confusion will continue to reign. David. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jezzer7190 Posted June 4, 2016 Author #12 Share Posted June 4, 2016 The article is over 4 years old! If it is that bad on P&O, why do we see crew returning year after year? Yes the article is old but I assume that is when P & O made the announcement of the change. Since then it seems no newspaper has reported on the system, it doesn't mean it isn't correct in 2016. I can't believe somone like Watchdog or other TV programme hasn't done an in depth investigation; I wish they would. As for crew returning year after year, I would assume that even with no tips their wages are still more than they could get at home. I agree that it should be built into the price then we all (crew and passengers) can be happy in knowing exactly where they stand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kruzseeka Posted June 4, 2016 #13 Share Posted June 4, 2016 Yes the article is old but I assume that is when P & O made the announcement of the change. Since then it seems no newspaper has reported on the system, it doesn't mean it isn't correct in 2016. I can't believe somone like Watchdog or other TV programme hasn't done an in depth investigation; I wish they would. As for crew returning year after year, I would assume that even with no tips their wages are still more than they could get at home. I agree that it should be built into the price then we all (crew and passengers) can be happy in knowing exactly where they stand. I do agree with you - I would much prefer it was built into the price and no potential to remove it. I too am amazed there hasn't been an exposé across the industry - cruising is so popular these days there must be many people who share our interest in really understanding how it all works. And regarding clarity, if it is as fair to the crew as the company professes, they would surely have no qualms about declaring the facts as of 2016. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the english lady Posted June 4, 2016 #14 Share Posted June 4, 2016 What a big fuss over what is a small amount. The American lines have much higher amounts. Why are people not querying how that is split..etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HikingPete Posted June 4, 2016 #15 Share Posted June 4, 2016 I doubt it's quite as bad as the echo makes out. It makes sense for more of the gratuities to go to people who are doing the best job. If part of the metric they use for front of house staff is customer feedback, then so be it. They probably have other metrics in place too, for people working behind the scenes. I very much doubt it's a situation where if you don't get treated excellent on everything you get nothing. There would be a mutiny! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kruzseeka Posted June 4, 2016 #16 Share Posted June 4, 2016 What a big fuss over what is a small amount. The American lines have much higher amounts. Why are people not querying how that is split..etc I would like to know that too - as I said, an exposé across the industry would be very interesting. For me though it's not the amount I'm querying but the principle of whether it finds its way to those I, perhaps naively, assumed benefited from my auto grats. We do tip personally as well just to be sure those who serve us directly get something from us.......... though whether they have to declare it, relinquish it.... who knows? But that's what I'd like to know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrianI Posted June 4, 2016 #17 Share Posted June 4, 2016 P&O state that 100% of the tips is paid to the crew. https://ask.pocruise...-board/gratuity There is another bonus scheme that P&O operate based on the guests questionnaire which may pay zero on poor reports. This maybe confusing the issue and is the reason he the staff ask you to mark them as excellent. Brian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
balf Posted June 4, 2016 #18 Share Posted June 4, 2016 I think it's more likely they want to be taken on again after the end of their contract. David. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baronoli Posted June 5, 2016 #19 Share Posted June 5, 2016 Probably been answered a thousand times - can I just pay cash in hand to my stewards and waiters? My dad always used to do this when I cruised with him as a kid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
balf Posted June 5, 2016 #20 Share Posted June 5, 2016 Probably been answered a thousand times - can I just pay cash in hand to my stewards and waiters? My dad always used to do this when I cruised with him as a kid. Yes of course you can. They are your tips so you can do as you wish with them. David. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare Presto2 Posted June 5, 2016 #21 Share Posted June 5, 2016 Probably been answered a thousand times - can I just pay cash in hand to my stewards and waiters? My dad always used to do this when I cruised with him as a kid. Do you mean for tips or just to pay up? If it is tips - definitely. Re just to pay - I have no idea and a good question Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dsrdsrdsr Posted June 5, 2016 #22 Share Posted June 5, 2016 Which pretty well contradicts all the other theories we get here. It's obvious what's going on. Tell loads of different stories so every one is completely confused and likely finishes up shouting at each other. P&O could publish a full, and I mean really full explanation of the tipping system. Till then confusion will continue to reign. David. P&O have produced a really full explanation of the tipping system. They tell you how much the recommended tip is, they add it to your account, they pay it to the stated staff. How much more information do you need? There isn't any doubt about what the system is. The only doubt is that a number of people appear to believe that P&O run a systematic conspiracy to defraud thousands of staff, with dozens if not hundreds of conspirators running the fraud, and at the same time committing a very serious (punishable by jail) breach of fiduciary trust. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the english lady Posted June 6, 2016 #23 Share Posted June 6, 2016 P&O have produced a really full explanation of the tipping system. They tell you how much the recommended tip is, they add it to your account, they pay it to the stated staff. How much more information do you need? There isn't any doubt about what the system is. The only doubt is that a number of people appear to believe that P&O run a systematic conspiracy to defraud thousands of staff, with dozens if not hundreds of conspirators running the fraud, and at the same time committing a very serious (punishable by jail) breach of fiduciary trust. Well I have to say I agree with you. We leave auto tips on. We are polite to all the crew. We talk to them in the corridors as we wander around. If the crew did not like how things stand I am sure they would not work for Pando. What I cannot understand is how people complain about the service charge system, complain about getting on board, complain about getting off at the end, complain about the bits inbetween, but still keep on booking cruises with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scriv Posted June 6, 2016 #24 Share Posted June 6, 2016 Funny thing is that after reading complaint after complaint about P&O I was kind of dreading my recent cruise fearing it would be full of moaners. Do you know what? I did not encounter one single moaner in the whole 7 days..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
insanemagnet Posted June 6, 2016 #25 Share Posted June 6, 2016 P&O have produced a really full explanation of the tipping system. They tell you how much the recommended tip is, they add it to your account, they pay it to the stated staff. P&O tell you what they will automatically add to your account for a Service Charge, not a tip. A Service Charge is an amount that is charged for the standard service. A tip is an amount that is offered on receipt of service that was above expectation. P&O simply say that all of the Service Charge goes to the staff, which of course it would if it pays their wages. Many employers operate pay systems that reward employees for performance. Few companies make public the details of the scheme to outsiders, and P&O is no different. From P&O's simple statement there is no link between the amount you pay and the people that serve you. In respect of freedom dining and the buffet how could there be. Therefore it is logical that at least part, if not all, of the Service Charge ends up in a single pot with everyone else's Service Charge to be divided up according to the remuneration scheme. It is not logical this is done on a cruise by cruise basis (what do you do with cruises that span a pay period, etc) and is it even logical to do it on a ship by ship basis. At the end of the day, the link between what anyone pays as a Service Charge and what the staff receives is virtually non existent. Far more important will be what the passenger reports on their feedback questionnaire, as that will be linked to the reward system. And on that point, isn't P&O stuck in the 1970's giving out one feedback questionnaire per cabin, with the expectation that all occupants of the cabin have a single view (or at least told they have). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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