Will HAL follow Celebrity and install separate suite class dining rooms on its ships

[Viesczy]

My thoughts are this, it wouldn't impact my decision to or not to sail HAL.

 

We all have a choice to make with how to nor not to spend.

 

If person A sees the perks of a suite package & purchases the package, awesome for them and for the line!

 

If person B see the perks and elects to not purchase the package, awesome for them and the line!

 

Personally, I'd not buy the suite package if it was even $1 more, it isn't about the $ either as we can afford it. Now why wouldn't I?

 

I completely hate being waited on or having things done for me/to me. It makes me feel dependent on someone, I hate that feeling. If there's something I can do for myself, I will do it and not be a burden/nuisance.

[kazu]

My thoughts are this, it wouldn't impact my decision to or not to sail HAL.

 

We all have a choice to make with how to nor not to spend.

 

If person A sees the perks of a suite package & purchases the package, awesome for them and for the line!

 

If person B see the perks and elects to not purchase the package, awesome for them and the line!

 

Personally, I'd not buy the suite package if it was even $1 more, it isn't about the $ either as we can afford it. Now why wouldn't I?

 

I completely hate being waited on or having things done for me/to me. It makes me feel dependent on someone, I hate that feeling. If there's something I can do for myself, I will do it and not be a burden/nuisance.

 

Good post - everyone is free to choose and awesome for them no matter what they choose ;)

 

Just to clarify though - There is no "waiting on" when you are in a Suite. There are no butlers. If you need something or want to reserve something - you have the concierge if you are in the N.S. Or P.S. The concierge simply replaces the front desk, PG desk, shore excursion desk, etc.

 

It's really no different other than the fact that you have a "one stop shop" for a multitude of things ;)

[SilvertoGold]

Instead of arguing about the principles of this issue, let's look at some real numbers and see how they compare.

 

HAL has the Eurodam leaving Dec 3rd for a 7-day Western Caribbean run. Mid-ship Neptune Suite is currently priced at $3,118 (all prices are CAD).

 

X has the Reflection leaving Dec 3rd for a 7-day Western Caribbean also. It's Celebrity Suite at 394 sq.ft is currently priced at $9,078. For the square footage of a comparable Neptune Suite, you would have to select the Royal Suite at 590 sq.ft. The Royal Suite offers more amenities than a Neptune on HAL, but it is currently priced at $12,178.

 

I do not believe that most of those sailing in HAL's Neptune Suites would be more than willing to pay 3 or 4 times their current ticket price in order to dine in their own private restaurant. And, I am willing to bet that HAL recognized it also - otherwise, it would have happened.

 

I can't see how this is a fair comparison. For deciding right now what you wish to book, this is a useful comparison, but not for basic comparison of suites on different lines. There are too many variables.

 

Basically you need to know how many of each suite are on each ship, how many are available at this time. Fewer will book up faster, more will book up more slowly. This affects pricing.

 

What prices did each sell at in the beginning? Higher pricing may have resulted in selling fewer of these suites, so there could be a lot to get sold and the pricing may have decreased. Same with lower pricing: one ship may have sold very well and now there are few left so up goes the pricing.

[cruisemom42]

Go into any large hotel and see the different levelsof dining..from bar food through to coffee shops and a fine dining room. Same with rooms..standard to suites.

 

Choice and having options serves to enhance our travel experiences not detract from them.

 

But in hotels, those different levels of dining are available to all who are willing to pay the bill. That's the equivalent of the specialty restaurants now, and I am (grudgingly) fine with that. But what doesn't seem fair is adding restaurants that are not available to all guests who are willing to pay a fee to dine there.

 

If Holland does implement suites dining, and, I think they will, to enhance their competitiveness and increase revenue, then the only option for those who prefer a "classless experience" will be Carnival. The major competitors (Royal, Princess, Celebrity) have already done so.

 

Luckily, there are still smaller and specialty lines that do not offer suite dining.

[RocketMan275]

But in hotels, those different levels of dining are available to all who are willing to pay the bill. That's the equivalent of the specialty restaurants now, and I am (grudgingly) fine with that. But what doesn't seem fair is adding restaurants that are not available to all guests who are willing to pay a fee to dine there.

 

Suites dining would be available to all who are willing to pay the fare for a suite.

[cruisemom42]

Suites dining would be available to all who are willing to pay the fare for a suite.

 

There are some who might be willing but not able.

[RocketMan275]

Suites dining would be available to all who are willing to pay the fare for a suite.

 

There are some who might be willing but not able.

 

Are you saying that nothing should be offered unless all are able to pay for it?

[cruisemom42]

Are you saying that nothing should be offered unless all are able to pay for it?

 

Of course not. But what you said is incorrect.

 

Clearly it is ferociously important to you that HAL offer this suite dining room. Just as equally I do not like the idea. Perhaps you just do not have the long term history that I do where cruising was more of a community activity and everyone was in it together.

 

I find it sad that people such as myself would miss the opportunity to dine and converse with - let's say someone like Kazu, who I'd imagine would have a few interesting tales to tell - because we would largely be in different areas of the ship. In short I find Dining (with a capital D) on a cruise ship to be about more than just the food.

Edited August 9, 2016 by cruisemom42

[DaveOKC]

Of course not. But what you said is incorrect.

 

Clearly it is ferociously important to you that HAL offer this suite dining room. Just as equally I do not like the idea. Perhaps you just do not have the long term history that I do where cruising was more of a community activity and everyone was in it together.

 

I find it sad that people such as myself would miss the opportunity to dine and converse with - let's say someone like Kazu, who I'd imagine would have a few interesting tales to tell - because we would largely be in different areas of the ship. In short I find Dining (with a capital D) on a cruise ship to be about more than just the food.

 

Good point. I love meeting people onboard from all walks of life and all places in the world. We can all learn so much from others and their experiences.

[VioletHorse]

Not a reasonable comparison. For example, A Royal Suite on Celebrity includes: (I've deleted those items that are fairly common to X and HAL).

 

*Personal butler service 24/7 for assistance with unpacking, in-suite lunch and dinner, espresso and cappuccino

*Dedicated private restaurant, Luminae, reserved exclusively for all Suite Class guests

*Unlimited dining in all specialty restaurants including lunch, dinner, and one Champagne High Tea

*Complimentary Premium Beverage Package for all guests in suite. Minors will automatically receive a Premium-Non-Alcoholic Beverage Package

*Complimentary unlimited Internet access

*Stateroom setup of one bottle of vodka and one bottle of scotch or gin with mixers, a choice of spirits and wine)

*Reserved theatre seating on Evening Chic nights

*Private veranda with whirlpool and lounge seating

*Complimentary laundry service twice per cruise

*Daily Delectables rotation of savory and sweet snacks

* Champagne High Tea available on select ships and itineraries.

 

Probably a better comparison would be to add half the cost of a Pinnacle Grill dinner each night of the cruise, say ~$20 PP. For a seven day cruise, add $150 PP.

 

I say half the cost since the room could be used for other functions except during dinner. Also, the menu probably wouldn't be equivalent to the Pinnacle Grill either.

 

These are all excellent points. I'll add that HAL actually does not have a stateroom category the equivalent of a Royal Suite, which essentially is a mini penthouse suite. It's larger than a Neptune since Celebrity lists the room size separately from the balcony. The Royal Suite measures 538 sq ft, with the balcony adding another 195 sq ft for a total of 733 sq ft. There is a hot tub on the balcony, along with lounge chairs and dining table with chairs. The RS has a separate bedroom, with living room and dining room, and 2 entertainment centers, one in the bedroom and the other in the living room. The Neptune Suite largest measurement is 590 sq ft including the balcony and it's just an oversized bedroom with a bit of additional furniture.

 

A more balanced comparison would be to compare a Neptune Suite to a Celebrity Suite which measures 467 sq ft for the cabin and another 85 sq ft for the balcony for a total of 552 sq ft. The Celebrity Suite still has a separate bedroom area and 2 entertainment centers and lots of other amenities including a butler.

 

We'd met a couple on one of our cruises who had the Royal Suite and they invited us to their room for a tour. Wow! It was a beautifully decorated apartment with many high end finishes and decorator touches.

 

HAL really needs to keep pace with the competition to offer more to their suite passengers, and if it's a separate dining room with exclusive menu, they should do it sooner than later. Once they lose passengers to another cruise line it will be next to impossible to get them back.

 

Pay more ... get more!

[RocketMan275]

Of course not. But what you said is incorrect.

 

Are you saying my statement "Suites dining would be available to all who are willing to pay the fare for a suite." was incorrect because there might be those who would be "willing" but are not financially "able"? If that is to be relevant, then why shouldn't all on-board activities be limited to those that all would be able to pay for?

 

Clearly it is ferociously important to you that HAL offer this suite dining room. Just as equally I do not like the idea. Perhaps you just do not have the long term history that I do where cruising was more of a community activity and everyone was in it together.

 

There are approximately 36 suites on Eurodam. Why would removing 72 passengers to other dining facilities significantly affect the community spirit? How would you even notice?

 

Has the provision of a suites only breakfast in the Pinnacle Grill adversely affected the community spirit on Holland?

 

I find it sad that people such as myself would miss the opportunity to dine and converse with - let's say someone like Kazu, who I'd imagine would have a few interesting tales to tell - because we would largely be in different areas of the ship. In short I find Dining (with a capital D) on a cruise ship to be about more than just the food.

 

Under the current system, anyone who you might want to converse with could be at another table or dine at a different time. Suites dining won't affect the fact that you can only be seated at one table with the same number of people. Unless you wish to argue that those in suites have better tales to tell, then suites dining shouldn't affect your dining experience.

[kazu]

Of course not. But what you said is incorrect.

 

Clearly it is ferociously important to you that HAL offer this suite dining room. Just as equally I do not like the idea. Perhaps you just do not have the long term history that I do where cruising was more of a community activity and everyone was in it together.

 

I find it sad that people such as myself would miss the opportunity to dine and converse with - let's say someone like Kazu, who I'd imagine would have a few interesting tales to tell - because we would largely be in different areas of the ship. In short I find Dining (with a capital D) on a cruise ship to be about more than just the food.

 

 

How very kind of you :o

I would very much enjoy dining with you too cruisemom. I imagine you have more interesting tales than I. And I love history :). It's why I keep returning to Europe :)

[cbr663]

...

 

A more balanced comparison would be to compare a Neptune Suite to a Celebrity Suite which measures 467 sq ft for the cabin and another 85 sq ft for the balcony for a total of 552 sq ft. The Celebrity Suite still has a separate bedroom area and 2 entertainment centers and lots of other amenities including a butler...

 

HAL really needs to keep pace with the competition to offer more to their suite passengers, and if it's a separate dining room with exclusive menu, they should do it sooner than later. Once they lose passengers to another cruise line it will be next to impossible to get them back.

 

Pay more ... get more!

 

Had you actually read my post on the comparison between HAL and X, you would have discovered that my first example on X was in fact the Celebrity Suite at 3 times the cost of a Neptune on HAL.

 

As I stated in my post, the Royal Suite is more comparable in size and does have more amenities. It is 4 times the cost.

 

My point is this thread is for of those writing, as you did, "pay more...get more". But no one has stated that they are willing to pay 300% or 400% more on HAL. It is clear that those sailing on the competition and enjoying a private dining room pay substantially more than those sailing on HAL.

 

It is, as @dakrewser stated that most don't want to actually pay any more than they are paying now on HAL. They just want more, more, more.

[RocketMan275]

 

My point is this thread is for of those writing, as you did, "pay more...get more". But no one has stated that they are willing to pay 300% or 400% more on HAL. It is clear that those sailing on the competition and enjoying a private dining room pay substantially more than those sailing on HAL.

 

That's a combination of a red herring and a strawman argument. No one is advocating paying 4 times the current price of a Neptune suite for suites dining room. The absolute upper limit on the fare increase would only be proportional to a the cost of dining every night in the Pinnacle Grill. Probably only half of that.

[RocketMan275]

I find it sad that people such as myself would miss the opportunity to dine and converse with - let's say someone like Kazu, who I'd imagine would have a few interesting tales to tell - because we would largely be in different areas of the ship. In short I find Dining (with a capital D) on a cruise ship to be about more than just the food.

 

I'd like to clarify something. Wife and I find the current situation in the MDR to be less than appealing. We find the MDR to be too loud, too crowded, and the dining experience to be grossly overrated. We do not like tables that have no privacy. Neither of us hear well enough to converse across the table. Consequently, we rarely utilize the MDR.

 

A smaller and quieter facility with a better menu might cause us to change our minds. Until that is an option, we will use the specialty restaurants, our balcony, or, even, the Lido.

[kazu]

 

 

 

<snip> There are approximately 36 suites on Eurodam. Why would removing 72 passengers to other dining facilities significantly affect the community spirit? How would you even notice?

 

 

Eurodam has only 36 suites? I think you are in huge error here. It's not the Prinsendam nor an S & R ship. I just did a quick count and you are way off base, sorry. The suites total much more than that on this ship (and most of the larger ones).

 

How many is irrelevant. Who you want to eat with was the point being made and I am sure the suites would have the option. But since it's all hypothetical, there's not much point in worrying about it. HAL doesn't change overnight - LOL.

[AZNative2000]

A few cruises back, we met a couple who had created the "X Suite" meal experience on their own even before "X"did.

 

On a shore excursion, we learned these two had and would continue to eat every meal in the Pinnacle Grill. They were in a Neptune Suite so could have their breakfasts there and chose to eat each lunch and dinner as well. He explained that on day one, he met with the Maitre D and selected a table (booth) and arranged that they would have it exclusively. They ate early so they were always the first to arrive each lunchtime and evening.

 

We joined them for dinner that night and the staff brought a chair so we could fit four into their booth. The waitstaff knew their names and everything they wanted and treated us like family. They'd had the same waiter and assistants every night and the Maitre D came over twice to see all was well. The meal came complete with a few pleasant surprises from the staff like multiple desserts because the waiter thought we should "try something" we didn't order. In all, a very pleasant evening.

 

For the 10 day cruise, this arrangement probably cost that couple about $600-$700 extra above the cost of their suite (not counting the wine or the generous tips they left).

 

So, while I wouldn't eat in the same place every night of a cruise, there are many ways to cruise "as you wish".

 

Cheers!

 

[iancal]

It is unclear to me why one would be concerned or even care about what cruise offering another customer decides to select. As long as we are happy with our choice we don't really care about who bought what...insides, suites, owners suite, where they dine, etc. We do not care what they paid vis a vis our fare or what some other cruise line charges. It is not even noise level to us.

 

If we are not happy we simply make a decision to avoid the ship or the line in the future. We understand the the ship offerings are geared to many tastes, preferences, and budgets. Why so much concern over what someone else buys or where they choose to dine? It has zero impact on us or our enjoyment of the cruise.

Edited August 10, 2016 by iancal

[ellieanne]

It is unclear to me why one would be concerned or even care about what cruise offering another customer decides to select. As long as we are happy with our choice we don't really care about who bought what...insides, suites, owners suite, where they dine, etc. We do not care what they paid vis a vis our fare or what some other cruise line charges. It is not even noise level to us.

 

If we are not happy we simply make a decision to avoid the ship or the line in the future. We understand the the ship offerings are geared to many tastes, preferences, and budgets. Why so much concern over what someone else buys or where they choose to dine? It has zero impact on us or our enjoyment of the cruise.

 

But if the suite-only space is carved out of space that is currently available for everyone in any cabin to use, it can, and most likely, will, have an impact on the enjoyment of the cruise. I don't care if suite passengers have their own space, but I don't want to have to sacrifice currently available public space for them to do so.

 

It's not even a case of pay more, get more; it's pay more, take more.

 

The attitude of some suite passengers is they do not care what happens to everyone else on board, so long as the suites have more, larger, and better space, food and service. And as one of the "little people" in steerage, BY CHOICE, I do care about what happens to suite passengers when it impacts my cruise enjoyment. And having space taken from me will impact my cruise.

[RocketMan275]

Eurodam has only 36 suites? I think you are in huge error here. It's not the Prinsendam nor an S & R ship. I just did a quick count and you are way off base, sorry. The suites total much more than that on this ship (and most of the larger ones).

 

How many is irrelevant. Who you want to eat with was the point being made and I am sure the suites would have the option. But since it's all hypothetical, there's not much point in worrying about it. HAL doesn't change overnight - LOL.

 

Thank you for pointing out my counting error. Instead of 36 suites, there are 62 (PH, SA, SB, SC). Instead of 72 suites passengers, there are 124.

 

I should have said: "Why would removing 124 passengers to other dining facilities significantly affect the community spirit? How would you even notice?" Whether that error significantly changes my point is a matter of opinion.

[iancal]

It is really sraitghtforward. If it concerns you that a private suite only dining area is carved out of a public area on a ship then simply select anther ship or cruise line. Cruise lines are in business to maximize profits for their shareholders. They act accordingly. There are lots of choice out there....vote with your feet and with your wallet. As an aside, we typically pass on anthing higher than a verandah.

Edited August 10, 2016 by iancal

[kazu]

it is really sraitghtforward. If it concerns you that a private suite only dining area is carved out of a public area on a ship then simply select anther ship or cruise line. Cruise lines are in business to maximize profits for their shareholders. They act accordingly. There are lots of choice out there....vote with your feet and with your wallet. As an aside, we typically pass on anthing higher than a verandah.

+1. :)

[avian777]

Thank you for pointing out my counting error. Instead of 36 suites, there are 62 (PH, SA, SB, SC). Instead of 72 suites passengers, there are 124.

 

I should have said: "Why would removing 124 passengers to other dining facilities significantly affect the community spirit? How would you even notice?" Whether that error significantly changes my point is a matter of opinion.

 

Spot on!

[Responder]

We've been sailing HAL for years. It is one of the more civilized lines around.

 

Over the last year or so, we thought we would try Celebrity and NCL because they had the private areas.

 

After trying both and paying dearly for the same size suites not in the private plan, we will do a major pass on this concept.

Those two lines are the equivalent of a zoo. If not for the private area, we would have abandonded ship immediately. The food on the NCL Haven was quite good as was the service and Aqua on Celebrity was good as well, but having to pay many, many dollars to be isolated out of necessity didn't make any sense for us. The MDR on both ships was not to be believed in terms of dining, and the buffet areas were horrible, both for food and atmosphere.

 

The included concierge was a nice touch, except that there was nothing else on either ship that we would have wanted to attend or visit or needed to have a priority, as the crowds and drunken revelry was incredibly disturbing.

 

We are now looking forward to sailing on our Dec 2016 Nieuw Amsterdam cruise with our three granddaughters and family, which we insisted going with HAL, for the reasons cited above.

 

Perhaps we are wrong, as those two lines consistently fill 4000+ passenger ships all year.

[Sonora5]

We have enjoyed the "suite Life" on NCL, Hal and Celebrity. The special dining options can be nice, but we by no means use them exclusively. On NCL one of the specialty restaurants is dedicated to suite occupants for breakfast and lunch. This works ok for breakfast. Mr. S is a slow riser in the morning so most of the time we get room service for breakfast. When we do go to the suite restaurant, it has a nice but limited buffet and the same menu every day. Same for lunch. For lunch this can be really boring.

 

On Celebrity we had a Royal Suite. We really didn't like the 2-room configuration. Although smaller, we prefer the Neptune on HAL. For the way we travel it works better. We were also very disappointed in the hot tub on the deck on Celebrity. It was filthy, the water came out of the jets yellow, and the butler pretty much refused to do anything about it. He also made long distance calls from our cabin. We complained but I am not sure the bill was even adjusted.

 

HAL has a great product with the Neptune Lounge. We try to get a cabin close to it. We think this is much better than having a butler bring around snacks every day. NCL and Celebrity do not have this.

 

We have been in the Haven on NCL once. It was nice but the dedicated dining room had the same issue-no change in the menu. The 2 bedroom suite we were in only had a 2 person dining table. We really had to scrunch in when we invited friends to dinner in our suite. It was nicely served by the butler, but the room service waiters on HAL do a good job also.

 

So be careful what you wish for HAL suite people! I think HAL has a good product now. Our big problem with HAL is the s-word. Mr. S cannot be around s-ing due to a medical condition, so we are keeping our fingers crossed for our HAL cruise this fall that it won't be a problem. Love to use the balcony, but it is not possible if there are s-ers close by.