Cruising in 2021

[susiesan]

39 minutes ago, Paulchili said:

You may very well be killing someone. You may be asymptomatic or have mild symptoms but you can certainly pass it to others who may suffer terribly or even die.

Asymptomatic carriers are the most dangerous ones because they infect others without even knowing it; at least one would hope that a symptomatic person would be responsible enough to self-isolate.

Every person on the planet MAY be an asymptomatic carrier, we will never know. Maybe my sneezing and coughing aren't from seasonal allergies, maybe I am infected and have mild symptoms. I will never know. Maybe I already had covid-19, I will never know. 

 

I have a business to run, I have things to do around my house, I have shopping that needs to be done, I have dogs that need to be walked, and I have vacations that need to be taken. My life is not over. My state Missouri is opening back up May 1 and I can't wait to go back to my gym, restaurants, and other activities of a normal life. When your state California opens up, feel free to stay at home if you want to so as to avoid all the asymptomatic carriers you could come into contact with. No one will force you to go out in public or ever take a cruise or vacation again. You do what is best for you and your circumstances. I hope someday you will be able to venture out when you get over your fear, but this virus is likely here to stay throughout the planet. It may never be eradicated and there may never be a vaccine that is 100% effective against it. Life goes on for as long as we have to live. We will all die someday.

[pinotlover]

18 hours ago, clo said:

Right, it's a vacation. Nothing more than that. And, yeah, a carrier. Maybe bring it home to my grands? Or anyone else. I consider it foolish and irresponsible. Self-serving. Sorry. Argue against that if you can...but you can't.

What if we self quarantine for 14 days upon our return? Sounds more attractive to many of us that the 18 months+ of self quarantine some here are suggesting.

 

If some choose to self quarantine for 12-18 months, or even more, that may be a very logical discussion for them and their individual health conditions. 
 

Suggesting that the vast majority is going to stay isolated awaiting their “ all safe” alarm might be naive. Life is a hodgepodge of risk and reward decisions. Each of us will make those final decisions based upon our own prospects. Please, hunker and stay self isolated indefinitely if you believe that is the best option for You. Don’t blast people that don’t believe it’s best for them. 

[pinotlover]

As I reported last month, the interviewees on Bloomberg TV said that the then markets were priced at the economy reopening around May 1. If not, be prepared for a second 7,000-10,000 point drop.

 

Hope everyone used the “ dead cat” bounce, in the last couple of weeks, to liquidate stock holdings! Here it comes! 
 

Perhaps we need a new thread entitled:

 

Will You be cruising with a 10,000 Dow?

 

Hunkering comes with a cost!

Edited April 21, 2020 by pinotlover

[Paulchili]

15 minutes ago, susiesan said:

I have a business to run, I have things to do around my house, I have shopping that needs to be done, I have dogs that need to be walked, and I have vacations that need to be taken.

I can see how all but one of those things "need to be done" - nobody needs a cruise or vacation. You may want a cruise but you don't need a cruise - at least not until it's safer.

That said, we all make choices and then have to live by them. Stay safe.

[susiesan]

Just now, Paulchili said:

I can see how all but one of those things "need to be done" - nobody needs a cruise or vacation. You may want a cruise but you don't need a cruise - at least not until it's safer.

That said, we all make choices and then have to live by them. Stay safe.

Maybe you don't need a vacation since you are retired but I do. For my own mental health and well being, i need to get away every 6 months at the least. In my opinion, it is safe to cruise now, obviously you don't agree. It may never be safe for you if you have medical issues. 

[LJRVancouver]

7 minutes ago, susiesan said:

Maybe you don't need a vacation since you are retired but I do. For my own mental health and well being, i need to get away every 6 months at the least. In my opinion, it is safe to cruise now, obviously you don't agree. It may never be safe for you if you have medical issues. 

My husband and I travel generally 10 to 20 weeks a year so travel is a large part of our lives. However there are times when we must sacrifice our personal freedoms for what is best for society. As Governor Cuomo said "this is not about me but about we"

[pinotlover]

Six months of hunkering until it’s safe, maybe 12-18! Just imagine how long those soup lines are going to be with everyone ensuring safe distancing! 

[Paulchili]

33 minutes ago, pinotlover said:

Just imagine how long those soup lines are going to be with everyone ensuring safe distancing! 

I think this is still better than refrigerator trucks filled with dead bodies because the morgues can no longer accept any more;

or having to dig huge ditches filled with hundreds of dead bodies being covered up - looks very middle ages to me.

Edited April 21, 2020 by Paulchili

[Jancruz]

1 hour ago, CanEcosse said:

You may choose to cruise, the cruise line may choose to sail but that does not mean that countries have to let you ashore. Can you imagine a country that has worked incredibly hard to get things under control then allowing ships of 500-5000 passengers to dock and come ashore without a whole bunch of severe restrictions and criteria? This may take a long while and require long term demonstrated vaccine success.

Do you really think Oceania will cruise knowingly to countries that will not let them in..I give them a lot more credit for being smarter than that..

Jancruz1

[Paulchili]

57 minutes ago, pinotlover said:

Six months of hunkering until it’s safe, maybe 12-18!

It doesn't have to be 12-18 months if everyone followed the same rules.

No other country in the world has had to hunker down for that long to get an upper hand on this virus - but then again they all played by the same rules based on science. Think of S. Korean Taiwan, or even CHINA!

Edited April 21, 2020 by Paulchili

[Petoonya]

1 hour ago, susiesan said:

 Life goes on for as long as we have to live. We will all die someday.

Susie, I was cold for months to the idea of the contagion of COVID-19 back in Feb, so I'm probably not one to speak. But I'm going to  anyway!

I'm appalled by your contentions. Nothing as certain as death and taxes but I don't want to be responsible for another's death. It's why as a society we must push for rigorous testing. If you're OK with dying a vicious, ugly and lonely death feel free. If you're OK with having your heart and kidneys permanently damaged and visit the dialysis machine a few times a week, go ahead. But don't spread your potential infection to those who can least afford to suffer through it.

 

If Missouri is opening up May 1 it's news to me. Your governor actually said on 4/15 that he was going with a "phased in" approach. Also said that 40-50,000 COVID-19 tests a DAY would be required before opening while at today's rate it is only 3000 a day! Sounds quite wise of your guv. Let me know if I'm wrong about what Gov. Parson said. I'm glad to be corrected, even if I disagree.

 

So a lot of luck going to the gym in a couple weeks.

 

https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2020/04/15/835308140/missouri-gov-mike-parson-on-opening-state-businesses-and-voting-by-mail

Edited April 21, 2020 by Petoonya

[Shawnino]

Sadly the news channels are being fear merchants on this one. It's in the economic self-interest but it's too bad. Impeachment is over, most people won't follow politics until a couple weeks before the election, if at all. So before the virus, the only thing they had between the impeachment and the election was a shot at some hurricanes. Keeping the fear up on the virus gets ratings, which makes ads more expensive.

 

Politicians are getting co-opted because they love to spend money. There's only two things in politics. The first is money. I can't remember the other thing.

 

Sweden and Iceland never locked down. Somehow, in a shock to cable news, not everyone there is dead.

Denmark, Germany, and Austria are opening back up.

Italy, which tried a lockdown that only bought massive death, is starting to open up. 

These aren't third-world ratholes with tinpot dictators-for-life. They have scientists just like we do.

Rather than pander to the fear merchants, they're  asking people to behave and get on with life.

It'd be great if we could do the same, but I won't hold my breath.

And parts of our economy, like the travel industry, will never return.

[Paulchili]

17 minutes ago, Shawnino said:

Sweden and Iceland never locked down. Somehow, in a shock to cable news, not everyone there is dead.

Well, not yet. Congratulations to Sweden - this article and chart shows just how great they are doing compared to their neighbors with opposite strategies (sarcasm emoji):

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/sweden-coronavirus-deaths-lockdown-social-distancing-denmark-finland-norway-a9470771.html

Would you rather live in Sweden or Finland/Norway/Denmark at the moment?

Edited April 21, 2020 by Paulchili

[sunlover12]

7 minutes ago, Shawnino said:

 

Sweden and Iceland never locked down. Somehow, in a shock to cable news, not everyone there is dead.

Sweden might be regretting that decision. They have nearly 10 times as many deaths as other Scandinavian countries.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/sweden-nearly-10-times-number-210442597.html

Regarding the OP, we have a South Pacific cruise on the Regatta planned for March 2021.  We've never been there and have been wanting to take that cruise for a long time. Who knows if it will be safe to cruise then or if French Polynesia will be accepting cruise ships.   We're hoping for the best and will just have to wait and see. 

[LHT28]

according to this map  the place to be  is Nunavut

https://www.ctvnews.ca/health/coronavirus/tracking-every-case-of-covid-19-in-canada-1.4852102

 

I saw on the news Copenhagen is reopening Tivoli Gardens

[Paulchili]

5 minutes ago, LHT28 said:

according to this map  the place to be  is Nunavut

https://www.ctvnews.ca/health/coronavirus/tracking-every-case-of-covid-19-in-canada-1.4852102

 

I am moving there next week. 😀 Oh, I forgot - the borders are closed.

I like their country's leader better as well.

Edited April 21, 2020 by Paulchili

[LHT28]

1 minute ago, Paulchili said:

I am moving there next week. 😀 Oh, I forgot - the borders are closed.

I like their country's leader better as well.

LOL

 You can have him 😁

[Paulchili]

1 minute ago, LHT28 said:

LOL

 You can have him 😁

I'll take him considering what I have. 😀

[Ace4th]

On 4/20/2020 at 11:58 AM, Jancruz said:

I was thinking about it and was wondering if anyone will cruise before there is a vaccine..I know I would anyone else??

Jancruz1

I wouldn't worry about a vaccine,  just as I won't need a vaccine to go to a play or concert.

We are due to sail on June 7 from Barcelona to Athens -- I'm sure that trip will be cancelled and that itinerary is not offered in 2021.  I find it concerning that Oceania is among a very short list (6) that have not updated their cancellation list -- all, but these 6 have cancelled all sailings until June 11 or later.    My preference is to still go on the trip (3 weeks with pre/post stays) - but it won't happen - Oceania just won't tell me yet it won't happen.  I won't be interested in Future Cruise Credit.  

 

Doubt we will do much (if any) cruising in the future - we go occasionally and I like it - Husband is not crazy about sea days.  He actually picked this particular Cruise because it was port intensive, we had heard great things about Oceania and were going to stay in Athens for a week after the cruise in a friend's apartment.  There will be (from all I've read) extra constraints on those 70+ .  I expect we will go back to the ways we usually travel - which is rent a house for a month and explore.

[pinotlover]

2 hours ago, Jancruz said:

Do you really think Oceania will cruise knowingly to countries that will not let them in..I give them a lot more credit for being smarter than that..

Jancruz1

Jan;

 

May I totally agree with you, yet ask a follow on. Take my Oceania November cruise from Istanbul to Dubai for example. Let’s say that all is a go on that cruise EXCEPT Jordan and Egypt. What happens then? Three additional days in Israel or elsewhere, or three more sea days? That would make a total of 9 sea days on a 20 day cruise, in which We have no interest, plus going to Petra was one of our big draws for this cruise. 
 

We are still planning on making this cruise. PIF date is late June. I hope the stars are aligned! 🙏

[Shawnino]

Sweden are satisfied with how things are going by accounts from across the spectrum:

Bloomberg (centre-right pro-business media outlet based in NYC):

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-04-19/sweden-says-controversial-covid-19-strategy-is-proving-effective

Guardian (leftist paper based in UK):

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2020/apr/21/sweden-plans-to-kick-off-top-football-division-on-14-june-with-fans-in-stadiums

 

Paranoia will destroy ya.

[Paulchili]

1 hour ago, Shawnino said:

Sweden are satisfied with how things are going by accounts from across the spectrum:

Bloomberg (centre-right pro-business media outlet based in NYC):

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-04-19/sweden-says-controversial-covid-19-strategy-is-proving-effective

Guardian (leftist paper based in UK):

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2020/apr/21/sweden-plans-to-kick-off-top-football-division-on-14-june-with-fans-in-stadiums

 

Paranoia will destroy ya.

If the Swedes are happy then I am happy for them.

Our WH is also very happy with the way things are going here - we've always wanted to be leaders of the world and now we are undisputed #1 in the entire world

Paranoia is not fun but it rarely kills one; COVID has killed 177,000+ people so far and is far from being over.

Edited April 22, 2020 by Paulchili

[Petoonya]

Jan,

I'm not a person with any business acumen (but excellent at starting IVs). As long as Pinotlover is asking a question I'll toss one your way too. Know that you're a busy lady. Betting one my fellow posters with business insight will have the obvious answer that escapes me.

 

If cruise lines are cash poor why are there no two or three day 2021-2022 sales. Wouldn't even a 5% reduction off everything attract a little attention?

[clo]

6 hours ago, pinotlover said:

What if we self quarantine for 14 days upon our return? Sounds more attractive to many of us that the 18 months+ of self quarantine some here are suggesting.

 

Second of all, unless one is retired or a resident of Australia taking an additional two weeks off work is unlikely to happen. 

 

But first of all, there's a huge difference between not going on a cruise until there's a vaccine and self-isolating for 12-18 months. Once restrictions are lifted we'll travel but not on cruise ships. As many others have said being quarantined on a cruise ship for two weeks would be a nightmare. There are scads of wonderful ways to travel that don't require a ship. I still believe that there's a specific risk or two - getting it or giving it to someone - that a cruise environment is going to exacerbate. 

[clo]

1 hour ago, Shawnino said:

Sweden are satisfied with how things are going by accounts from across the spectrum:

Bloomberg (centre-right pro-business media outlet based in NYC):

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-04-19/sweden-says-controversial-covid-19-strategy-is-proving-effective

Guardian (leftist paper based in UK):

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2020/apr/21/sweden-plans-to-kick-off-top-football-division-on-14-june-with-fans-in-stadiums

 

Paranoia will destroy ya.

Here's some current info on Sweden:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidnikel/2020/04/21/sweden-600000-coronavirus-infections-in-stockholm-by-may-1-model-estimates/#6b59fd6d78d6