Celebrity cancels all 2021 Asian Cruises

[Hlitner]

I just noticed that Celebrity Cruises has cancelled all of its 2021 Asian cruises (there were two ships involved) because of all the uncertainty involving COVID.  I guess Celebrity deserves some kudos for making this more now rather then waiting until the last minute.  This has us wondering what HAL will do with the 2020-21 Noordam cruises which are scheduled to begin on Decmber 20 and continue into April.

 

Hank

[iancal]

I suspect that Celebrity (and other cruise lines) is  privy to information that is not available to the general public.  There must be a very good business reason why Celebrity are taking the lead and cancelling these cruises. 

 

Good to see Celebrity showing some respect towards their customers instead of leaving cruises on the board until the last minute and then cancelling. 

 

Wish other cruise lines would do the same.

Edited October 8, 2020 by iancal

[bennybear]

We were supposed to be on a French Polynesia Cruise today,   When Princess cancelled it in early May it seemed very early.  Turns out they made the right decision.  I doubt they are really privy to more info,  just had to make  a good business decision.  

[drowelf]

We are supposed to be on the Noordam for 28 Days in February/March. We are leaning heavily to cancel ourselves before HAL does. Just not ready to travel that far each way (24-36 hours) in close proximity to other folks on an airplane. We will not cruise again until a vaccine is ready available and proven to be effective. 

[KirkNC]

That’s quite a statement by them on their expectations of what 2021 will be like.  We have already canceled our first half of 2021 cruises and I am afraid the second half may go the same way.  The ships may sail but the experience may resemble a day care more then a cruise.

[AtlantaCruiser72]

To clarify the OP - Celebrity did not cancel ALL 2021 Asia and Australia Sailings, rather they cancelled those departing through May 2021.  The fall 2021 season is still planned and bookable.  A bit pendantic I know, but let's be accurate.

 

I expect Princess and Holland America to do something similar sooner rather than later.  It has been quite some time since they announced the global suspensions through 12/15/20, and they extended their pause further out than their peers when they made that announcement.  I foresee the next few announcements (now that the 2021 ship shuffle seems complete) of a "pause" to be destination/ship specific rather than full fleet.  I think we can look for that to happen late this month or early next month once there is more clarity from the CDC on whether the no-sail order will be extended beyond 10/31/20

Edited October 8, 2020 by AtlantaCruiser72

[iancal]

That is only part of the equation.  The other part is destinations.  People expect to have ports to go to.    Sovereign nations decide that for themselves.

 

 Even if cruises we operating from Florida what sovereign Caribbean island nation in their right mind would accept or risk  a cruise ship in the middle of a pandemic outbreak  from a country that has the absolute worst record in the world when it comes to fighting covid?

 

No different that some countries in Europe, Asia, and Africa. who have banned travelers and cruise ships from certain countries in Europe that  have an abysmal record of fighting and containing covid.

 

Australia and NZ shut down cruising early.  They shut down all activities early.  The tourist industry did not have a say.  Compare their results to those countries that have absolutely no co-ordinated approach to fighting covid let alone containing it.   In Canada there is enormous public support for closing the borders, closing the ports, and keeping them closed until the situation improves.   Our elected representatives who do not follow the advice and guidance of our public health specialists do so at the own peril in the next election.

 

Did we trust or listen to the tobacco industry when they said cigarettes did not cause cancer or did we listen to our health experts?   Did we trust the automobile industry when they said seat belts were not necessary and did not save lives.  Or did we trust our transportation safety experts?

Edited October 9, 2020 by iancal

[Hlitner]

4 hours ago, iancal said:

That is only part of the equation.  The other part is destinations.  People expect to have ports to go to.    Sovereign nations decide that for themselves.

 

 Even if cruises we operating from Florida what sovereign Caribbean island nation in their right mind would accept or risk  a cruise ship in the middle of a pandemic outbreak  from a country that has the absolute worst record in the world when it comes to fighting covid?

 

No different that some countries in Europe, Asia, and Africa. who have banned travelers and cruise ships from certain countries in Europe that  have an abysmal record of fighting and containing covid.

 

Australia and NZ shut down cruising early.  They shut down all activities early.  The tourist industry did not have a say.  Compare their results to those countries that have absolutely no co-ordinated approach to fighting covid let alone containing it.   In Canada there is enormous public support for closing the borders, closing the ports, and keeping them closed until the situation improves.   Our elected representatives who do not follow the advice and guidance of our public health specialists do so at the own peril in the next election.

 

Did we trust or listen to the tobacco industry when they said cigarettes did not cause cancer or did we listen to our health experts?   Did we trust the automobile industry when they said seat belts were not necessary and did not save lives.  Or did we trust our transportation safety experts?

You are frightening me.  I guess you could say that in my other life (before retirement) I was an "expert" on our healthcare insurance system and made decisions, on a daily basis, that had a major impact on some lives.  To think that the country would follow my advice or those like me!  OMG...even DW does not always want to follow my advice :).

 

So here is the problem with the public.  Many folks have become complacent and the word "expert" gets tossed around like a dodge ball in a playground game.  In government nearly everyone is an "expert" and at times it becomes amusing.  The first time I testified in Federal Court as an expert on healthcare finance I was surprised to be accepted (by all parties) as an "expert witness."   Consider that many weather forecasters are "experts" and routinely wrong (wouldn't you like to have a surgeon who was wrong 40% of the time?).  Many of the "experts" that told us of the coming ice age back in 70s were telling us about global warming less then a decade later.  

 

In the case of COVID the same "experts" who told us back in Feb/March not to wear masks because they were dangerous now tell us to wear masks.  Some of these folks also told us back in Feb (including Dr Fauci) that we did not have to be concerned with the Wuhan Virus (which is what it was called before politics got involved) because it did not spread between humans.  On Jan 21, 2020, when talking about the Wuhan Virus on Newsmax, Dr. Fauci said:

“But, this not a major threat for the people of the United States, and this is not something that the citizens of the United States right now should be worried about.”

 

Obviously things did change as did the opinions of many "experts.  

 

But my issue is not about the experts but about the fact that  we now have national policy (and local policy) dictated by "experts" without much debate or due process.   Just consider that in one city (New York) there will likely be over 15,000 restaurants permanently driven out of business by "experts" and local politicians.  Those businesses have no recourse, no appeal rights, etc.  And what makes it even crazier is when their own politicians admit that this is just a precaution to prevent something that might happen.  Kind of like locking you up in prison because you "might" murder somebody.

 

So now, cruise ships cannot operate from US Ports because of what "might" happen.  Unlike most governmental decisions the COVID related decisions are being made without any due process, public hearings, etc.  A few months ago I posted a challenge here on CC.  I asked if anyone can point me to a scientific study indicating that COVID can be spread via buffets.   So far nobody has been able to come up with any study that supports closing buffets.   Many COVID related decisions are based on speculation.  So the thousands of NYC restaurants that have been driven out of business ruining hundreds of thousands of lives was done on "speculation."  

 

Consider this.  The 1974 Safety of Life at Sea (SOLAS) Convention which governs maritime operations/safety around the world was adopted after years of research, hearings, compromise, etc.  But the 2020 COVID shut down was done in a matter of days with no research, studies, debate, discussion, etc.  It may well be that when the industry is allowed to restart operations there still will have been no hearings, major discussions, etc.   

 

While most folks would not dispute the wisdom of shutting down cruise operations last March, there sure would be a lot of dispute about a handful of bureaucrats and politicians keeping that industry shut down for 9 + months without hearings, due process, etc.

 

Hank

 

 

[Stateroom_Sailor]

It is sad to see the Asian capacity reduced to one ship, the Noordam.  We were suppose to sailed the transpacific on Westerdam, before the pandemic hit.  Like Celebrity, the TP port offerings are too minimal now, where we'll have to look elsewhere.  The circle Japan itineraries still look attractive. 

[bennybear]

37 minutes ago, Stateroom_Sailor said:

It is sad to see the Asian capacity reduced to one ship, the Noordam.  We were suppose to sailed the transpacific on Westerdam, before the pandemic hit.  Like Celebrity, the TP port offerings are too minimal now, where we'll have to look elsewhere.  The circle Japan itineraries still look attractive. 

As far as I recall it has only been one HAL ship.  Volendam. Then Westerdam.  Hopefully Noordam

[Hlitner]

3 hours ago, Stateroom_Sailor said:

It is sad to see the Asian capacity reduced to one ship, the Noordam.  We were suppose to sailed the transpacific on Westerdam, before the pandemic hit.  Like Celebrity, the TP port offerings are too minimal now, where we'll have to look elsewhere.  The circle Japan itineraries still look attractive. 

What makes you think that the Noordam will ever get to Japan?  Currently, Japan has some of the toughest rules when it comes to welcoming tourists.  Does anyone believe that Japan is going to magically welcome the Noordam in a few months?  I suspect that the Japanese government is going to focus on how they can host the Olympics in a COVID world and allowing cruise ships will not help that effort.

 

We were booked on an April 2020 Westy cruise out of Yokohoma.   In mid February (before HAL had cancelled any our Westerdam cruise) the Japanese government announced that they were cancelling all the activities associated with the Emperor's birthday.  As soon as I heard that news I told DW that there would be no cruises to a Japanese port this year.  It took HAL nearly 2 weeks to cancel our cruise (this happened at the end of February) but we all know that HAL does not move fast.  Now we have a similar situation nearly 8 months later.  HAL still has Asian cruises (on the Noordam) scheduled to commence in about 10 weeks.  But none of the ports have given any indication that they will allow cruise ships and many of the ports will not even allow  most Americans to arrive via air (China, Japan, Hong Kong, Singapore, Thailand, etc.).  In the last couple of weeks COVID cases are again on the rise in the USA.   Does anyone other then the HAL suits believe that Asian countries are going to welcome Americans (and other cruisers) in the next few months?  

 

Hank

 

 

[Stateroom_Sailor]

2 hours ago, Hlitner said:

What makes you think that the Noordam will ever get to Japan?  Currently, Japan has some of the toughest rules when it comes to welcoming tourists.  Does anyone believe that Japan is going to magically welcome the Noordam in a few months?  I suspect that the Japanese government is going to focus on how they can host the Olympics in a COVID world and allowing cruise ships will not help that effort.

 

 

To give contact, I've been looking at the transpacific cruises during the winter 2021/2022 season.  Will Noordam ever make it to Japan?  Eventually, or it will be another ship in the fleet.

 

6 hours ago, bennybear said:

As far as I recall it has only been one HAL ship.  Volendam. Then Westerdam.  Hopefully Noordam

 

I thought more ships crossed from Vancouver to Japan, but perhaps they went on to Singapore, Dubai, or Australia.

[ABoatNerd]

Hlinter, thank you for sharing your excellent common sense opinion on the context of the shutdowns. I thought your reference to the buffet protocol particularily interesting.

 

I totally concur. Your wisdom is sorely needed these days.

[kazu]

4 hours ago, Stateroom_Sailor said:

 

I thought more ships crossed from Vancouver to Japan, but perhaps they went on to Singapore, Dubai, or Australia.

 

You are correct.  Our Transpacific and Asian cruise that we would have been on this year was on the Noordam.  Embarkation for the crossing was Vancouver.

[bennybear]

9 hours ago, kazu said:

 

You are correct.  Our Transpacific and Asian cruise that we would have been on this year was on the Noordam.  Embarkation for the crossing was Vancouver.

The Vancouver to Japan cruise ship has done Singapore. Hong Kong China and Japan as well as ports in between.  But as  far as I can remember there has only been one ship a year doing Asia on Hal from Vancouver.  I think those going To Australia have different routes.  

Edited October 10, 2020 by bennybear

[Hlitner]

On our Noordam Roll Call, another CC poster was nice enough to post the following link about tourism in Japan:

https://www.travelcaffeine.com/when-will-japan-reopen-allow-foreign-tourists/

 

The Noordam is scheduled to return to Japan in February and that is just not going to happen.  In fact, if you read the linked article it does not even mention anything about the resumption of cruises to and in Japan as it is obviously a much lower priority then normal tourism and the upcoming summer Olympics.  I still remain convinced that HAL will need to cancel their entire 2021 Asian cruise calendar because of continuing port restrictions.

 

Hank

 

 

[AtlantaCruiser72]

1 hour ago, Hlitner said:

On our Noordam Roll Call, another CC poster was nice enough to post the following link about tourism in Japan:

https://www.travelcaffeine.com/when-will-japan-reopen-allow-foreign-tourists/

 

The Noordam is scheduled to return to Japan in February and that is just not going to happen.  In fact, if you read the linked article it does not even mention anything about the resumption of cruises to and in Japan as it is obviously a much lower priority then normal tourism and the upcoming summer Olympics.  I still remain convinced that HAL will need to cancel their entire 2021 Asian cruise calendar because of continuing port restrictions.

 

Hank

 

 

 

Agree - I think Asia, South America and Australia/NZ sailings through Spring 2021 will be in the next "update" on suspensions, which I think will be announced concurrent with an announcement of whether the CDC extends their No-Sail order for US cruises beyond October 31 and how that affects operations beyond December 15th.  While they are not specifically dependent on the CDC to operate in those regions I think that HAL (and Princess) are both waiting and will each make one announcement taking them at least until mid January or mid February by the middle of November (definitely post election).

 

Fall 2021 thorough Spring 2022 Asia, South America and Australia/NZ cruises will remain on the schedule until AT LEAST mid-summer of 2021 as we get more clarity on the future of the cruise industry 

[bennybear]

And I am seriously wondering about Europe spring 2021,  now that Canadians also are not allowed by the EU.  Without Americans or Canadians not sure they will sail,  unless things improve drastically.   

[AtlantaCruiser72]

7 minutes ago, bennybear said:

And I am seriously wondering about Europe spring 2021,  now that Canadians also are not allowed by the EU.  Without Americans or Canadians not sure they will sail,  unless things improve drastically.   

 

I think there is a chance that some European sailings will take place, on select ships from select ports with either UK or EU guests only.  That is if the UK/EU can get their #s down prior to the start of the European season.  There's still a LOT that can happen between now and late April / Early May when the bulk of the seasonal European sailings typically start up

[Hlitner]

We recently heard from friends that were booked on the Azamara Pursuit April 11 cruise (from Yokohama) that Azamara has cancelled all their Asian cruises and will not use the Pursuit until its May season in Greece.  I think this might make HAL about the last person standing as far as spring 2021 Asian cruises.  Given that Japan is still not talking about any cruises in their country I think the Noordam will soon have a major schedule change.

 

Hank

[kelmac]

Hey Cruisers,

We were booked on the Celebrity Millennium (Tokyo back to Vancouver) this coming spring and it was cancelled.  Because of this, we then cancelled the Noordam (28 days), which was just before the Millennium cruise, and had to move a big chunk of FCC to another HAL cruise next fall.  This is the third group of cruises we have cancelled since our March cancellation of the Koningsdam.  

Some day we will cruise again?

 

Kel

[Aquahound]

3 minutes ago, kelmac said:

Hey Cruisers,

We were booked on the Celebrity Millennium (Tokyo back to Vancouver) this coming spring and it was cancelled.  Because of this, we then cancelled the Noordam (28 days), which was just before the Millennium cruise, and had to move a big chunk of FCC to another HAL cruise next fall.  This is the third group of cruises we have cancelled since our March cancellation of the Koningsdam.  

Some day we will cruise again?

 

Kel

 

Kel, I noticed you were also on my Quantum roll call for May.  Did you cancel that one as well?  I'm still booked for now but every day, I get more and more pessimistic on it actually happening.  

[kelmac]

2 minutes ago, Aquahound said:

 

Kel, I noticed you were also on my Quantum roll call for May.  Did you cancel that one as well?  I'm still booked for now but every day, I get more and more pessimistic on it actually happening.  

Hey Paul,

I agree 100%.  We've not cancelled yet, but things don't look good at this point.  I've cancelled so many flights, hotels and cruises, that I'm in no rush any more.  I don't think I would board a ship without a required vaccine and pre-cruise testing.  

We have two fall (2021) cruises and two spring (2022) cruises and that seems like a distant hope.

 

Hang in there,

Kel😁