New proposed Flordia law regarding Vaccination checks.

[BlerkOne]

1 hour ago, florida eagle said:

You can give up your wealth for their cause and then leave to live somewhere else. The world whether you and I like it is about conquering. You from your posts seem to have a good life from it. Enjoying all the comforts that life can afford you. Cruises are enjoyed by many who like to take many. The people employed on ships from the far east are very intelligent. With many more so then many people who are cruising. The accident of birth engenders the ugly American. Guilt without giving it up is nothing.

I think I'll stay a while. Someone has to be the voice of reason.

[hurricane0226]

yeah right

[Buckeyefrank100]

16 hours ago, BlerkOne said:

It cannot prevent a business from requiring it, or make extra hoops necessary for the unvaccinated.

 

My business, my rules unless a protected class.

We (for once) generally agree on this topic, but there is some significant debate as to whether it is legal for a business to require employees or customers to take the vaccine.  There's actually some precedent that prohibits the requirement.  But of course, this is 2021 and in the US, the law doesn't matter anymore.

[Buckeyefrank100]

On 4/23/2021 at 2:03 PM, BlerkOne said:

Would you agree that with freedom comes responsibility? There are a number of ways to help mitigate the virus - e.g.vaccines,  masks, social distancing, etc. It is everyone's responsibility to reduce the spread of the virus with a best effort, not disdain. It seems the conservatives say they will have no part of any of it. That won't get the job done, and sure seems like shirking responsibility. Freedom without responsibility is adolescence. Adults need to take responsibility.

 

To think politicians, any of them, don't listen to their sponsors at least as much as to their constituents is naive.

The problem with your statement is that this vaccine isn't a flu shot.  It doesn't have a proven track record over 75 years.  It is literally a new vaccine with a new technology and hasn't even been approved by the FDA.  It is an experimental vaccine that (at best) has unproven safety record.  For the mass media and government to push this vaccine is unprofessional.  I can't find it now, but there's an official website tracking the side effects of the vaccines and there are a lot, including potential deaths, spontaneous abortions, etc.  I took the 1st dose, but not the 2nd because between those dates, I personally know 2 people who died suspiciously after receiving their shots who were healthy.  My daughter is not taking it because no studies have shown it's not dangerous to future pregnancies.

 

And one just needs to look at Wuhan China.  Ask yourself why they are literally back to normal.  They went through a hellish 9 months, but now they are fine....

[jfunk138]

1 hour ago, Buckeyefrank100 said:

I can't find it now, but there's an official website tracking the side effects of the vaccines and there are a lot, including potential deaths, spontaneous abortions, etc. 

That website is VAERS:

https://vaers.hhs.gov/data.html

There are already thousands of adverse events reported and there is a long lag time between report and when they become searchable in this system, so you are only seeing what has been reported through ~March.

[Buckeyefrank100]

11 minutes ago, jfunk138 said:

That website is VAERS:

https://vaers.hhs.gov/data.html

There are already thousands of adverse events reported and there is a long lag time between report and when they become searchable in this system, so you are only seeing what has been reported through ~March.

Thank you for that.  Exactly what I was referring to. 

 

[florida eagle]

12 hours ago, BlerkOne said:

I think I'll stay a while. Someone has to be the voice of reason.

Understandable. You got yours. Its others that need to pay the price for all the bad things that happen.

[Jobeth66]

37 minutes ago, jfunk138 said:

That website is VAERS:

https://vaers.hhs.gov/data.html

There are already thousands of adverse events reported and there is a long lag time between report and when they become searchable in this system, so you are only seeing what has been reported through ~March.

 

Big caveat with VAERS - anyone can report anything, at any time.  There's no way to know if it was linked to any specific vaccine or not.  People report things years after they happen.  People report things like headaches or body aches that may be totally unrelated.  So take anything you see on VAERS with a huge pile of salt.

[Buckeyefrank100]

8 minutes ago, Jobeth66 said:

 

Big caveat with VAERS - anyone can report anything, at any time.  There's no way to know if it was linked to any specific vaccine or not.  People report things years after they happen.  People report things like headaches or body aches that may be totally unrelated.  So take anything you see on VAERS with a huge pile of salt.

Point taken, but honestly how many people know of the VAERS website for submission of side effects.  I'd be willing to bet the skew is heavily towards unreported side effects as opposed to the other way around.

[jfunk138]

21 minutes ago, Buckeyefrank100 said:

Point taken, but honestly how many people know of the VAERS website for submission of side effects.  I'd be willing to bet the skew is heavily towards unreported side effects as opposed to the other way around.

When you file a VAERS report there are numerous reminders that filing false information is a federal crime and there is an entire federal agency that will hunt you down if they suspect you are submitting false information. 

For this reason, you are definitely correct that underreporting is an issue.  A person who is not certain their blood clots were related to the vaccine might be very hesitant to face the scrutiny of federal inspectors.

[cruisingguy007]

4 hours ago, Buckeyefrank100 said:

We (for once) generally agree on this topic, but there is some significant debate as to whether it is legal for a business to require employees or customers to take the vaccine.  There's actually some precedent that prohibits the requirement.  But of course, this is 2021 and in the US, the law doesn't matter anymore.

Just saw this this morning, two examples, one a school (no vaccines allowed), one a hospital (vaccine required).

 

School: https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/miami-private-school-won-t-employ-teachers-who-get-covid-n1265462

 

Hospital: https://www.abc57.com/news/a-texas-hospital-system-will-require-employees-to-get-the-covid-19-vaccine-and-could-fire-them-if-they-dont-comply

 

I have also read a hospital in another state doing the same and it was announced that many colleges will require them as well. That said, I don't know if this will hold up in court but the ball is certainly rolling on mandatory vs exclusion. It will be interesting to see how this all shakes out in the end.  

[BlerkOne]

3 hours ago, florida eagle said:

Understandable. You got yours. Its others that need to pay the price for all the bad things that happen.

You're beginning to sound like a liberal.

[BlerkOne]

2 hours ago, Buckeyefrank100 said:

Point taken, but honestly how many people know of the VAERS website for submission of side effects.  I'd be willing to bet the skew is heavily towards unreported side effects as opposed to the other way around.

The trials identify many side effects. I'm willing to be we already knew what most of them would be.

[Buckeyefrank100]

33 minutes ago, BlerkOne said:

The trials identify many side effects. I'm willing to be we already knew what most of them would be.

possible death.....spontaneous abortion of pregnancy.....  I don't really care about arm soreness or an arm rash, but death, blood clots..  those will make me think twice.  We can't forget that this is an experimental vaccine and the technology it's based on is experimental as well.  We have no idea what the long term effects of this vaccine are.  The one thing that continues to change is "science".  Scientists in the 50s claimed that cigarette smoking was fine for us..... look where that go us.

[Stallion]

Also in the 1950s Dr Jonas Salk told us we needed to have the polio vaccine which eradicated one of the most pernicious diseases in history

[florida eagle]

1 hour ago, BlerkOne said:

You're beginning to sound like a liberal.

You know yourself very well then. Live far from the trouble but promote thy concern for the downtrodden who have been wronged to soothe your Progressive Socialist views as you live through the maximum Capitalist ways. 

[BlerkOne]

8 minutes ago, florida eagle said:

You know yourself very well then. Live far from the trouble but promote thy concern for the downtrodden who have been wronged to soothe your Progressive Socialist views as you live through the maximum Capitalist ways. 

No, that is not at all me. But better democratic socialist than fascist. I'm a proud supporter in several ways of several groups that likely give you nightmares.

[BlerkOne]

1 hour ago, Buckeyefrank100 said:

possible death.....spontaneous abortion of pregnancy..... 

I think you will find the virus is a much greater risk of causing those and more.

[BlerkOne]

"The bottom line is clear: If you're vaccinated, you can do more things, more safely, both outdoors as well as indoors,"

[ontheweb]

1 hour ago, Stallion said:

Also in the 1950s Dr Jonas Salk told us we needed to have the polio vaccine which eradicated one of the most pernicious diseases in history

Alas, those were different times.

 

For one thing, no one was spreading the lie that polio was a hoax.

[florida eagle]

40 minutes ago, BlerkOne said:

No, that is not at all me. But better democratic socialist than fascist. I'm a proud supporter in several ways of several groups that likely give you nightmares.

I know what fascists are. You are one of them. Packaged as a Progressive Socialist who cares for all. But you come first in that order with your Alinsky tactics. 

[cruisingguy007]

48 minutes ago, BlerkOne said:

"The bottom line is clear: If you're vaccinated, you can do more things, more safely, both outdoors as well as indoors,"

According to Newton, this also hold true for those who are unvaccinated as well. As the vaccinated get more freedoms, so too do the unvaccinated. The whole green card scheme that Israel has will never fly here in the USA.  

[TNcruising02]

1 hour ago, ontheweb said:

Alas, those were different times.

 

For one thing, no one was spreading the lie that polio was a hoax.

Geez.  I do not think most people believe covid is a hoax.  They can just reasonably determine their risk level based on facts.  It is a fact that younger people do not have the same reactions as older people with certain health issues.  My son was able to keep working out and working from home the entire time he had covid.  He never feared covid, nor should he have had an unreasonable fear based on the media coverage trying to convince people they would drop dead.

Covid is not a big deal to the majority of people who get it.  Therefore, it's not the black death that many others want people to believe.

Edited April 27, 2021 by TNcruising02

[ontheweb]

21 minutes ago, TNcruising02 said:

Geez.  I do not think most people believe covid is a hoax.  They can just reasonably determine their risk level based on facts.  It is a fact that younger people do not have the same reactions as older people with certain health issues.  My son was able to keep working out and working from home the entire time he had covid.  He never feared covid, nor should he have had an unreasonable fear based on the media coverage trying to convince people they would drop dead.

Covid is not a big deal to the majority of people who get it.  Therefore, it's not the black death that many others want people to believe.

If they only knew that in India, I'm sure they would take great comfort.

 

Bodies pile up as Covid overwhelms India (msn.com)

[TNcruising02]

5 minutes ago, ontheweb said:

If they only knew that in India, I'm sure they would take great comfort.

 

Bodies pile up as Covid overwhelms India (msn.com)

Yes, people have died of covid.  However, they have been mostly in an older high risk group.  If a person isn't in that group, there are plenty of ways to survive covid here in the US.  There are even good treatments for people who get severely sick.  Covid isn't a death sentence for the average person who is not high risk.  The media made people hysterical when all that had to be done was for the high risk people to isolate.

"About 8 in 10 deaths have been among people 65 and older, according to the latest demographic data available from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC)."
 

Edited April 27, 2021 by TNcruising02